West Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/canada-s-long-awaited-online-harms-bill-is-coming-here-s-what-we-know-1.6781605 This is being introduced today. Free speech vs curtailed speech debate. What constitutes as "hate speech"? After doing alot of reading of posts on X specifically related to sexual assault, I can see the benefit of such a bill so long as it's restrained Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 I think it could have been broken up into different parts. The sexual assault, revenge porn etc stuff I doubt anyone would disagree with. The free speech and the criminalization of "hate speech" (whatever it means) is something that I think deserves more debate and clarification. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, Moonbox said: I think it could have been broken up into different parts. The sexual assault, revenge porn etc stuff I doubt anyone would disagree with. The free speech and the criminalization of "hate speech" (whatever it means) is something that I think deserves more debate and clarification. This is agree with. 1. Revenge porn/child exploitation/statements instructing a child to go and kill themselves etc should be off limits. 2. Misgendering I've seen classified as "hate speech" Certainly has to be a balance between obvious malicious attempts to harm which should be discouraged, perhaps even outlawed, and allowing room to debate without fear of the government showing up at your doorstep. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbie Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, Moonbox said: criminalization of "hate speech" (whatever it means) If you're confused by what that is, look it up. Somewhere other than on this forum.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 23 minutes ago, herbie said: If you're confused by what that is, look it up. Somewhere other than on this forum.... There's so many facts on this forum, it's just hard to keep up sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 46 minutes ago, herbie said: If you're confused by what that is, look it up. Somewhere other than on this forum.... I have. It's vague. Strictly interpreted, it'd be frightening if it was enforced. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Fines up to 20,000 bucks. And they get to decide what's 'hate' or not. The authoritarian left will love it, but its pretty horrible. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, CdnFox said: Fines up to 20,000 bucks. And they get to decide what's 'hate' or not. The authoritarian left will love it, but its pretty horrible. Thought I read it was up to LIFE imprisonment. Yep. New Liberal 'online harms' bill to make online hate punishable up to life in prison Never mind being worried about age verification for online porn. If this shit passes, some of you people better cut and run... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 23 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: Thought I read it was up to LIFE imprisonment. Yep. New Liberal 'online harms' bill to make online hate punishable up to life in prison Never mind being worried about age verification for online porn. If this shit passes, some of you people better cut and run... Yeah - i'm SURE we'll hear all those who suggested that not allowing children to watch oorn was evil now immediately condemn the libs and dips for this with even greater fervor. C'mon Guys - lets hear that Fervor!! (Will you crickets PLEASE shut up, i can't hear the fervor over your racket!!!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 6 hours ago, OftenWrong said: If this shit passes, some of you people better cut and run... I'd just move to Hong Kong permanently with the wife. If am going to have my rights stripped which I can easily survive with, I can't do so in good consciences, with crackheads left right and out of control crime. So, a thug can steal my car and get slapped on the wrists and I could get life for posting his picture and calling him a b**** and questioning his manhood? Yeah, okay. I am all for laws that protect against actual crime. Vagueness that leaves doors open for abuse, not so much. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Let's recall that in this country there's a giant, huge risk to any broad and strict legislation: a near-total absence of accountability and extremely inefficient legal system. So, in the essence: an absence of a competent; trusted and impartial arbiter. It means the the criteria cannot be abstract and verbal ("hate speech"), they have to by physical: a demonstrable harm, or immediate and real possibility of it, resulting directly from the posted statement. No harm, the law cannot be applied because its objective aim is to prevent harm to individuals and not, to define legal and allowed versus illegal topics of a discourse. If the free speech is still a right here, not just a meaningless relic, decoration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuebecOverCanada Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 15 hours ago, Moonbox said: I think it could have been broken up into different parts. The sexual assault, revenge porn etc stuff I doubt anyone would disagree with. The free speech and the criminalization of "hate speech" (whatever it means) is something that I think deserves more debate and clarification. When you see how these laws have been applied in some European countries, I fear it might be abused. If you don't recall the Switzerland example, here is the thread I made back in October 2023, when a polemicist had a 60-day prison sentence for calling an activist a 'fat lesbian'. The same mentality that was at play to imprison someone calling a 'fat lesbian' is at play here in Canada. Our government literally said that you could have a sentence up to life in prison for hate speech online if the bill goes through. Sadly, the LPC and the Conservatives are two sides of the same coin. Both want more regulation on the Internet, more surveillance and make it harder to criticize the government online with anonymity. But the fact that it was proposed to have a sentence up to life in prison for 'hate speech' is incredible. Even child rapists don't do that time after being prosecuted. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 12 hours ago, CdnFox said: Yeah - i'm SURE we'll hear all those who suggested that not allowing children to watch oorn was evil now immediately condemn the libs and dips for this with even greater fervor. C'mon Guys - lets hear that Fervor!! (Will you crickets PLEASE shut up, i can't hear the fervor over your racket!!!) Now now, we can be more discerning than that. Hatred towards trannies and the differently-gendered, not ok. Hatred towards white colonialists and the jews- ok! Ok! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 minute ago, OftenWrong said: Now now, we can be more discerning than that. Hatred towards trannies and the differently-gendered, not ok. Hatred towards white colonialists and the jews- ok! Ok! What if it was a colonial trannie? (and why am i suddenly picturing Starbuck in drag?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 14 minutes ago, CdnFox said: What if it was a colonial trannie? (and why am i suddenly picturing Starbuck in drag?) 🤯 You want these people to have a mental breakdown, or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 40 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: 🤯 You want these people to have a mental breakdown, or something? I think technically it can't 'break down' if it was never working in the first place 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougie93 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 15 hours ago, OftenWrong said: Thought I read it was up to LIFE imprisonment. Yep. New Liberal 'online harms' bill to make online hate punishable up to life in prison Never mind being worried about age verification for online porn. If this shit passes, some of you people better cut and run... life imprisonment for thought crime this is lawmaking straight out of a Communist dictatorship from behind the Iron Curtain it seems that we actually lost the Cold War after all 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 39 minutes ago, Dougie93 said: it seems that we actually lost the Cold War after all We asked for it to happen, willingly inviting the Marxists to take over our culture, without even firing a shot. Luke 23 29-30 Revelation 6 15-17 Check-mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougie93 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 minute ago, OftenWrong said: We asked for it to happen, willingly inviting the Marxists to take over our culture, without even firing a shot. Luke 23 29-30 Revelation 6 15-17 Check-mate. I can't say I never thought I'd see the day since I have been predicting this outcome for years now none the less, it is chilling, to see the country once called "Canada" descend into totalitarianism, nary a shot fired, and with the majority of the population in favour of it God save us 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougie93 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, OftenWrong said: We asked for it to happen can you imagine all those boys who died in the flower of their youth ? from Vimy Ridge to Juno Beach just to prevent this outcome all that is swept away, at the stroke of a pen by some utterly pathetic, cowardly, disgusting future generation of totalitarian brainwashed lunatics that broke faith, tho poppies grow in Flanders Fields it's unbearable 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 3 hours ago, Dougie93 said: none the less, it is chilling, to see the country once called "Canada" descend into totalitarianism, nary a shot fired, and with the majority of the population in favour of it "The tools of conquest do not necessarily come with bombs and explosions and fallout. "There are weapons that are simply thoughts, attitudes, prejudices - to be found only in the minds of men. "For the record, prejudices can kill and suspicion can destroy, and a thoughtless, frightened search for a scapegoat has a fallout all of its own for the children...the children yet unborn." -Rod Serling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 On 2/27/2024 at 12:48 AM, OftenWrong said: Thought I read it was up to LIFE imprisonment. Yep. New Liberal 'online harms' bill to make online hate punishable up to life in prison Never mind being worried about age verification for online porn. If this shit passes, some of you people better cut and run... Tough on crime only for "online hate". What a joke of a government. Liberals have the political priorities of a 2nd year university student. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougie93 Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 On 2/27/2024 at 9:54 AM, QuebecOverCanada said: When you see how these laws have been applied in some European countries, I fear it might be abused. well, first the lunatic left came out and demanded that anyone who denies that Canada committed "genocide" against the "indigenous" is in fact a "Holocaust Denier" who deserves to be in prison then the government said that they were going bring down legislation to deal with that "crime" next thing you know, being an "Indigenous Holocaust Denier" warrants a maximum sentence of life in prison what could possibly go wrong ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 7 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said: Tough on crime only for "online hate". What a joke of a government. Liberals have the political priorities of a 2nd year university student. But same day bail for repeat violent offenders. We certainly have our priorities figured out don't we. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeitgeist Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 (edited) Canada needs a constitutional revamp or we simply need something more like the Bill of Rights. Our government is out of control trying to find behind the scenes dictatorial methods of erasing opposition. This bill doesn’t require proof beyond a reasonable doubt to substantiate hate. It doesn’t require courts, but rather the ideologically driven “Human Rights Tribunal”, which is something out of the French Revolution. Such proceedings would be hidden from public scrutiny, Speech is not violence, period. Yes inciting violence is not okay, along with physical threats, harassment, and extortion, but these things must be dealt with proportionally and transparently. There was a time when most people understood that even hateful speech must be protected because the definitions and interpretations of hate would inevitably be subject to bias and overreach. Hate speech shouldn’t be banned unless you want to remove free speech. You can’t have the latter without accepting that the former can occur. That doesn’t mean that privately owned sites, institutions, etc., can’t have codes of conduct. Even those are difficult to manage. You can see where all this is going. Whatever the leadership decides are unacceptable views will be penalized. Honest to God, Canadians better wake up come election time. Let’s hope the Senate bails us out of this nightmare legislation. https://nationalpost.com/opinion/terry-glavin-under-liberal-hate-speech-bill-trudeau-would-be-guilty-of-vilifying-catholics/wcm/8594d577-d73e-4126-8b4e-66801b1e68cd/amp/ Edited February 29 by Zeitgeist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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