Battery plant liberals gave 15 billion dollars to "in order to create jobs" can use Temporary Foreign Workers.

[CdnFox]

https://archive.ph/GgCKp

Union, politicians raising concerns that government-supported Stellantis-LG battery plant will use temporary foreign workers

 

At least one of the jobs advertised by Jeil Special — on the federal government’s JobBank.ca website — has received a Labour Market Impact Assessment, meaning it can be filled by a temporary foreign worker.

In a joint statement, the federal and provincial governments said the plant would “create and secure thousands of good-paying auto jobs and tens of thousands of indirect jobs across Canada.”

But as construction progresses, questions are being raised about who will take advantage of these promised job opportunities.

In recent weeks, postings for jobs are showing up for positions at an unspecified battery plant in Windsor. The poster, Jeil Special Canada, doesn’t have much in the way of an online presence.

Its website is a blog with only one post. A phone call to the listed address wasn’t answered on Wednesday, and the number’s voicemail wasn’t set up. The listed location is an office building in an industrial part of Windsor, and the jeilspecialcanada.com domain was only created in April, according to a search on GoDaddy.com.

before they can legally hire a temporary foreign worker, with applicants having to show that they can’t find Canadian workers to fill the role.

The specific duties of this job — dubbed an “operations manager – administrative services” — are fairly broad. They include directing and advising “staff engaged in providing records management, security, finance, purchasing, human resources or other administrative services,”

 

 

So - this is how that works.  They post a vague job in as few places as possible and then claim nobody who applied was qualified  and bring in temp foreign workers.

Justin promised 15 BILLION DOLLARS in cash and tax cuts (yes it's both) and forgot to make sure to include a clause that required canadian workers.

 

Some people ask  "how can PP do a better job than Justin?"   HOW COULD HE NOT?!?!  A magic 8-ball is more likely to be a better leader than this dolt.

 

[Moonbox]

This is actually something people should be talking about.  

Forget, for a second, that these massively subsidized corpo investments almost always fail to generate the returns the government hopes for/expects, now they're importing foreign workers to fill basic jobs in a depressed community?  

This is government incompetence on a colossal scale.  

[Jack9000]

doesn't sound promising see how it goes i guess.

[QuebecOverCanada]

This is a criminal enterprise. Scum.

[myata]

Well we have RCMP that just can't be sure can he do anything at all, or just about and courts that will take about two decades to start the process. Make your bet, this is a G7 democracy, is it not?

[Legato]

8 minutes ago, myata said:

Well we have RCMP that just can't be sure can he do anything at all, or just about and courts that will take about two decades to start the process. Make your bet, this is a G7 democracy, is it not?

G7 is a major/minor chord in the key of C Major. As far a Canada is concerned it's become the minor part.

[Perspektiv]

I see this kind of stuff all the time. 

I had an employer sign us up for training to obtain a government grant. Got us all to sign up, as was "mandatory".

Got his money--we never got the training.

I truly don't blame the business for exploiting the loophole. I blame the government for putting one there, being aware, and retaining the status quo about it.

Why pay a local 28/H when I can pay a newcomer to Canada 17/H for the exact same job, that they will do like someone who has something to lose/prove. Meaning more hours, less regulation and far more workload for less.

Executives who can legally pull that off, gain a huge score in both productivity, as well as record profit margins.

They look like geniuses, whereas our head of state looks like they have no business running an economy.

 

 

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

This is actually something people should be talking about.  

Forget, for a second, that these massively subsidized corpo investments almost always fail to generate the returns the government hopes for/expects, now they're importing foreign workers to fill basic jobs in a depressed community?  

This is government incompetence on a colossal scale.  

A rare case where we can agree.  I'm not entirely opposed to gov'ts giving tax concessions to attract business.

Giving massive tax breaks AND giving billions of dollars - that's probably never going to pay off for canada.

But to do all that and then not even guarantee that it would be locals doing the work? That's just plain sloppy.

[TreeBeard]

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

I truly don't blame the business for exploiting the loophole.

Would you say the same thing about someone exploiting holes in the welfare system?

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

Executives who can legally pull that off, gain a huge score in both productivity, as well as record profit margins.

Is it legal to get a grant and not follow through on what the grant was for?

”we never got the training”

Why would that be something we should look up to as a “good executive”?

Edited November 21, 2023 by TreeBeard

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, TreeBeard said:

Would you say the same thing about someone exploiting holes in the welfare system?

Wouldn't you?  If a hole is there of course someone will exploit it.  It's up to the gov't to plug the holes and make sure it can't be exploited. 

Now i'm sure you'll say there's ALWAYS some way to expliot it, and that's why it's NOT A GREAT IDEA TO DO DEALS LIKE THIS GENERALLY.

Or to provide more social programs than necessary.

 

[Perspektiv]

1 hour ago, TreeBeard said:

Would you say the same thing about someone exploiting holes in the welfare system?

I know a few welfare frauds.

One of my relatives on my dad's side am estranged from, is one of them. Has 7 kids, and saw each as added welfare money.

Uses it to buy booze, and the scraps go to his family. He hustles relatives to get strip club money. Hence us being estranged. Kind of got old having a grown up gang banger hitting me up for cash, so they could mack on some b*****s.

They have no shame in their game. 

Personally, I have too much pride to do so, but if you make it easy to exploit, I don't blame the people who do.

Its sad, pathetic even but I don't blame the person  with a higher IQ who can find faults in a garbage system and use it for their benefit.

1 hour ago, TreeBeard said:

Is it legal to get a grant and not follow through on what the grant was for?

Not sure, I just know employers who do so. Tons of employers I have had have found loopholes and cheated the system.

I have worked for plenty.

1 hour ago, TreeBeard said:

Why would that be something we should look up to as a “good executive”?

Not sure I would look up to it, but if your bonus plays on numbers, I am just saying that I know tons of executives who knew the tricks of the trade to inflate your bill and look like you got a deal, to knowing how to manipulate taxes to get a much lesser penalty.

A lot of this stuff is illegal, but like the businesses I deal with who give me great deals if I pay cash knowing they won't claim it in taxes, I don't blame that business claiming far less revenues as a result.

This is how I see it.

If I could get away with getting taxed 5%, but if I did my taxes differently got 32%. Who in their right minds would want to go with the higher tax bracket if just as legal?

I contribute to my RRSPs along with a few other legal measures, to make my taxes as low as I possibly can.

I know a few loopholes so I use them. 

[Aristides]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/south-korea-battery-factory-trade-deal-1.7035141

[TreeBeard]

9 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

Personally, I have too much pride to do so, but if you make it easy to exploit, I don't blame the people who do.

 

10 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

I just know employers who do so. Tons of employers I have had have found loopholes and cheated the system.

I have worked for plenty.

“I have too much pride to cheat the welfare system”

and

”I profit from businesses who cheat the system, but gladly take the money without turning them in as frauds”.  
 

Is there not a double standard here?

[Perspektiv]

1 hour ago, TreeBeard said:

Is there not a double standard here?

How so?

Also, the second quote aren't my words. 

[Moonbox]

On 11/21/2023 at 12:38 PM, CdnFox said:

A rare case where we can agree.  I'm not entirely opposed to gov'ts giving tax concessions to attract business.

It usually depends on the size and the scale.  If a company is already already close to making a big investment and just needs a little help to get there, that's one thing, but when they're asking the government to drop its pants and bend over to even be in consideration, that's when the gov't should pass. 

On 11/21/2023 at 12:38 PM, CdnFox said:

But to do all that and then not even guarantee that it would be locals doing the work? That's just plain sloppy.

It's gross, but that's how our governments end up doing things.  It was never really about doing something that would be good for Canada long-term.  It was about having something big and public that you could pretend was a win for the voters - vague and lofty promises about Canada becoming a huge battery hub etc.  That'd be great, of course, but if the whole reason we're getting these "investments" is because we as taxpayers are paying for it in subsidies, and we're not even getting the jobs that it was presumably supposed to create, then we got fleeced...again.  

[eyeball]

On 11/21/2023 at 7:49 AM, Moonbox said:

This is actually something people should be talking about.  

Forget, for a second, that these massively subsidized corpo investments almost always fail to generate the returns the government hopes for/expects, now they're importing foreign workers to fill basic jobs in a depressed community?  

This is government incompetence on a colossal scale.  

Or it's a sign of successful corporate influence.  It seems to me savvy investors will buy stock in a corporation that's good at this, not to mention in countries that are amenable to it.

[Michael Hardner]

Nobody has pointed out the response, whether it's accurate or not: these people are imported for start-up/training type work, executing on proprietary knowledge etc.

I am not defending or attacking the plan, just adding some messaging to help the discussion.

[Moonbox]

2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Nobody has pointed out the response, whether it's accurate or not: these people are imported for start-up/training type work, executing on proprietary knowledge etc.

Sounds smelly to me.  The plant is only supposed to be 2500 jobs, and it needs 1300 foreign temp workers to train them all?  I don't buy it.  

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

Or it's a sign of successful corporate influence.  It seems to me savvy investors will buy stock in a corporation that's good at this, not to mention in countries that are amenable to it.

There is a fine line between 'amenible'  and 'bent over'.

[eyeball]

3 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

There is a fine line between 'amenible'  and 'bent over'.

That's why they do all this stuff in-camera. You see?

No, you probably wouldn't even know where to look.

[CdnFox]

8 minutes ago, eyeball said:

That's why they do all this stuff in-camera. You see?

No, you probably wouldn't even know where to look.

Right - that's why i posted the article and pointed it out  

You find new and exciting ways to be dumb literally every day  

And as always - despte having the truth in front of you i'm sure you'll still want to vote liberal    proof that transparency doesn't always work it would seem.

[QuebecOverCanada]

18 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Sounds smelly to me.  The plant is only supposed to be 2500 jobs, and it needs 1300 foreign temp workers to train them all?  I don't buy it.  

If it were like a few dozens for training or for very specialized temporary gigs, OK.

But like you mentioned... half of the jobs going to foreigners with our taxes? This is straight up a hold up.

[eyeball]

24 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Right - that's why i posted the article and pointed it out   

Yes well, show us the discussions that led to this and you might have something worth discussing. Simply pooing on Trudeau for the sake of boosting Pee Pee is easy.

On 11/19/2023 at 4:49 PM, CdnFox said:

Some people ask  "how can PP do a better job than Justin?"   HOW COULD HE NOT?!?!  A magic 8-ball is more likely to be a better leader than this dolt.

I'd like to know why and how PP will be immune or resistant to the concession seeking corporate influence that is apparently how business is normally conducted in Ottawa and other political capitals in Canada. Its been like this for decades and decades now

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

Yes well, show us the discussions that led to this and you might have something worth discussing. Simply pooing on Trudeau for the sake of boosting Pee Pee is easy.

 

ROFLMAO -  aww muffin, are you disappointed your guy Justin is looking bad again?

And i actually posted the article leading up to this when the plant was first announced.  All of this has been public and we've discussed it. And it's really got nothing to do with PP.  So once again - swing and a miss and liberal voters have been informed but  apparently ones like you are STILL willing to give him a pass.

I guess it must be hard to be a liberal these days. No wonder you try to deny it so hard.  

 

[BeaverFever]

Pierre Poilievre’s fearmongering on NextStar moves the Tories in the wrong direction
 

Back before Canada’s Conservatives started to tread down the path toward protectionism, one of their last acts in government was to sign a free-trade deal with South Korea.

The Canada-Korea Free Trade Agreement that prime minister Stephen Harper’s government negotiated in 2014 promised tariff-free access to a fast-growing Asian economy for Canadian exporters. The deal nevertheless faced stiff opposition from Canada’s auto sector, which feared that more imported Hyundai and Kia cars would mean fewer jobs at assembly plants here.

In truth, Canada had little choice but to conclude such a pact after the United States had entered into a free-trade deal with South Korea in 2011. That deal had left Canadian companies at a disadvantage. Our exports to Korea fell sharply in 2012 and 2013.

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“This agreement is a great deal for both our countries,” Mr. Harper insisted in announcing the Canada-Korea agreement in early 2014. “It will create jobs and opportunities for Canadians today, and just as importantly, for generations that follow.”

Since then, two-way trade between Canada and South Korea has more than doubled, to almost $22-billion in 2022. Canadian exports to South Korea soared from $3.5-billion in 2013 to $8.7-billion last year. Trade with South Korea has also taken on critical importance as part of Ottawa’s new Indo-Pacific strategy and efforts to “de-risk” economic relations with China.

Flash forward almost a decade to an apparently amnesiac Pierre Poilievre’s tantrum about the South Korean workers coming here to install equipment at the NextStar electric-battery plant that Stellantis and South Korea’s LG Energy Solution are building in Windsor, Ont.

Now Conservative Leader, Mr. Poilievre was a member of the government that signed the free-trade deal with South Korea, and even served as employment minister when it took effect in 2015. He of all people should know what is in it, including provisions that enable “contract service providers” from each country to work in the other on a temporary basis.

Most of the hundreds of workers that NextStar intends to bring in from South Korea will do so under these provisions, which exempt them from having to obtain a work permit. A smaller number are expected to come as temporary foreign workers, as long as NextStar can prove that Canadians could not perform their jobs. Since the South Korean workers will be coming to install proprietary technology that belongs to LG Energy Solution, that should not be a problem.

These workers will only be here for a matter of months. The plant could not be built without them, or at least not in time for battery production to be up and running by 2025. They will not “steal” jobs from Canadian construction workers nor occupy any of the 2,500 permanent jobs that Stellantis says the plant will create.

Mr. Poilievre has nevertheless worked himself into a tizzy about their arrival, even suggesting that Canadian taxpayers are footing the bill for their paycheques. “I love South Korea, wonderful country,” he quipped this week. “But they don’t fund jobs for Canadians and we shouldn’t fund jobs for their workers.”

Except that the $15-billion in production subsidies that the federal and the Ontario governments have promised to NextStar are only to start flowing once the plant begins to make batteries – or well after most of the South Korean workers have returned home. Ottawa and Queen’s Park have also promised $1-billion to NextStar to support the plant’s construction, which will provide jobs for more than 2,000 Canadian construction workers.

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There are good reasons to question whether the massive subsidies that the federal, Ontario and Quebec governments have promised to Stellantis, Volkswagen and Northvolt to build electric-vehicle batteries in this country are worthwhile investments. But the fact that all three plants will need to bring in foreign workers to install proprietary equipment is not one of them. Without such workers, these plants simply could not be built here. It is as plain as that.

The success or failure of Canada’s experiment in battery production will only be determined in the course of time. The Parliamentary Budget Officer estimatesthat it will take 23 years for Ottawa and Queen’s Park to break even on their investment in the NextStar plant alone.

Mr. Poilievre has not said he opposes subsidizing these battery makers. Rather, he is seeking to rile up working-class voters by falsely suggesting foreigners might be stealing their jobs.

As with his fictitious claim that the updated Canada-Ukraine trade agreement includes a carbon tax – a claim he is using as a pretext for opposing the deal – Mr. Poilievre has again shown he is willing to turn his back on the free-trade ethos his party once championed to score political points and scare voters. As such, he is taking the Tories in precisely the wrong direction.

 

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-pierre-poilievres-fearmongering-on-nextstar-moves-the-tories-in-the/?login=true