Emergency Act commission

[WestCanMan]

On 10/17/2022 at 1:52 PM, TreeBeard said:

So, not lifelong. 

Yes, lifelong.

You don't have to get re-elected, re-appointed or re-anythinged. 

How is that not lifelong? Patrick Brazeau was appointed at 38 and he can cost forever now. 

Do you need to keep working past 75 when you get the huge pension after only a few years of service?

 

 

[WestCanMan]

18 hours ago, myata said:

That is a weakest form of checks and it's far from functional. 

I agree the Senate is basically useless, but in this one instance, it was.

[Dougie93]

4 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I agree the Senate is basically useless, but in this one instance, it was.

during the protest, while the Liberals were committing ignominious treason

I was doing my duty of course, attempting to contact my MP & MLA

those filthy disgusting cowards, sycophants, cronies & traitors could not be reached by any means

they were literally in hiding

so as a last resort, I attempted to contact the Senate

the only office which answered my call, was the Speaker of the Senate's office

and they were ultra professional

I gave my name, rank, service number & post numerals

they recognized me as a decorated Canadian veteran

they showed me the utmost deference

they recorded my statement word for word, reading it back to me

swore on the Crown of Canada that it would be passed to the Speaker

then thanked me for my service

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

I am not defending anything. No one is downplaying anything.

No, I do not see any infringement. A public health crisis was managed as best as the authority could and , blaming Trudeau, you know that is incorrect. The lock downs and so much more were provincially established. Employers were also culpable in their actions to protect their employees from health issues. Your one sides approch is what is wrong with you and a few others on this forum.

The truckers on wellington street shit on their own beds. The real truckers kept on trucking. No rose coloured glasses are needed to know that the huge majority of truckers did just fine and did not make asses of themselves and did not have to be accosted through the EMA.

Now, the inquiry is going on and the witnesses, from all sides, including your hero lich and whatshisname get to say their piece.

You have been nowhere, except in front of your keyboard and screen and have done nothing except whine on a public forum .

Yours, and a few other criticisms are long and tired by now but, the topic is the public inquiry going on right now.

Many truckers and protesters were vaccinated.  It’s about our rights and stopping government overreach.  I’ve been on the other side of the argument and weighed both sides.  You don’t remove critical rights and compromise so many people’s livelihoods and mental health to fight a disease for which, by February, people had many means of protecting themselves.  Never again, or rather, if this is the way of Canada’s future, I want out.  

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

I am not defending anything. No one is downplaying anything.

What a liar. Almost all of your posts here say that "It's no big deal", "it's an insignificant blip from the past", "the truckers deserved everything that happened to them", etc.

You couldn't be a better useful idiot for Trudeau and his fascist policies if he paid you.

Quote

No, I do not see any infringement. A public health crisis was managed as best as the authority could and , blaming Trudeau, you know that is incorrect.

Uhhh, wtf?

He started off the pandemic by saying that he didn't think that covid would really affect Canadians, he backed all of the WHO's patently idiotic assumptions, he gave away all of our PPE to China for nothing, he bet on the sinovax and put Canada at the bottom of the list for the pseudovax- then he had to poach 1.9 million pseudovaccines from the 3rd world charity pool to get us going.

He thought that blocking travel from China was bad, when covid was only in China, so he let people come all the way from Wuhan to eat in restaurants here, go to movies and sporting events, etc. Only a week after he stopped travellers from China from wandering freely here he shut down our whole country. Canadians couldn't even go to public parks. 

Then he banned travel from India during the Delta wave because suddenly it wasn't racist anymore.

Trudeau was an absolute idiot at every stage of the game. He didn't do a single thing right. He even opted for fascism over science. That's not a good look.

Quote

The lock downs and so much more were provincially established.

The federal gov't and their lapdog media did everything they could to get covid here, and then after we understood what covid really was, they hyped the fear and went fascist on us. 

Provincial gov'ts had no choice but to follow the M's fear. Governments who held out were excoriated by the "free" press. Not following suit was like saying "vote libtard".

Quote

Employers were also culpable in their actions to protect their employees from health issues. Your one sides approch is what is wrong with you and a few others on this forum.

No, employers were backed by the gov't if they chose to discriminate against anti-Pseudovaxxers.

Quote

The truckers on wellington street shit on their own beds. The real truckers kept on trucking. No rose coloured glasses are needed to know that the huge majority of truckers did just fine and did not make asses of themselves and did not have to be accosted through the EMA.

You just said that you weren't defending or downplaying anything, remember?

Quote

Now, the inquiry is going on and the witnesses, from all sides, including your hero lich and whatshisname get to say their piece.

Now the inquiry is being steered by Trudeau's hand-picked toady.

Quote

You have been nowhere, except in front of your keyboard and screen and have done nothing except whine on a public forum .

You were supporting fascism on a public forum. Most would argue that's worse.

[Zeitgeist]

Canada’s constitution has proven to be weak, with too many means of suspending rights, which are fewer than the Americans have, especially when it comes to property and free speech.  The compelled speech law in Canada, the imposition of the Emergencies Act to circumvent due process and basically give police a free pass to beat up protesters and designate areas no-go zones where rights don’t exist, the grotesque pride of a government that maintains unnecessary mandates and backstops them with violence… There’s so much more I can say here.

I remember people on this forum literally being afraid to criticize government because they thought Canada had become totalitarian.  With the freezing of bank accounts, government smearing of a large chunk of the population, and imposition of digital vax passes (ArriveCAN), yes there’s much government overreach and totalitarian behaviour here.  I don’t know how anyone can give all this a pass.  It’s hard not to see blind idiocy, yet the media headlines generally supported the government, and the population follows suit.  The inquiry is weighted in Liberal favour by its members.

Again though, there’s too much complaisance and uncritical thinking to correct course.  The Conservatives are always at risk of imitating the Liberals.  That’s why I’m looking at property in the US and renewing my British passport.  Canada is a loony left quasi-dictatorship.  Take Cuba and add Disney identity politics activism and you get an approximation.  

Edited October 18, 2022 by Zeitgeist

[herbie]

OMG look who's talking.

So name even ONE mandate Trudeau ordered. Other than the feds closing the border to the unvaxxed, which any federal gov't has every right to do. So how the hell did that affect rights of people who are here? Huh? How?

And 'many' truckers didn't get vaxxed, almost all of them did, 90%+ by their own records. A motley collection of idiots with various gripes got together on the whole thing, it's over and the vast majority is sick of hearing people still whining about it.

350 trucks a day roll out of this town and they got their jab because some logging companies and mills wouldn't let them onto sites without it. ONE truck showed for the local protest, just one. Who was vaxxed but being pissed off about it and Trudeau had SFA to do with it.

So quit the usual lie, deny, deflect and lie some more BS and cough up just HOW your rights were denied

[Zeitgeist]

2 minutes ago, herbie said:

OMG look who's talking.

So name even ONE mandate Trudeau ordered. Other than the feds closing the border to the unvaxxed, which any federal gov't has every right to do. So how the hell did that affect rights of people who are here? Huh? How?

And 'many' truckers didn't get vaxxed, almost all of them did, 90%+ by their own records. A motley collection of idiots with various gripes got together on the whole thing, it's over and the vast majority is sick of hearing people still whining about it.

350 trucks a day roll out of this town and they got their jab because some logging companies and mills wouldn't let them onto sites without it. ONE truck showed for the local protest, just one. Who was vaxxed but being pissed off about it and Trudeau had SFA to do with it.

So quit the usual lie, deny, deflect and lie some more BS and cough up just HOW your rights were denied

The vax mandate on truckers was federal.  

[herbie]

Oh FFS how thick can one possibly be? The 'mandate' was on the border so it applied to international truckers who crossed the border too. They told them there was no special exemption for them, and that was that. The ones who wanted their job got a jab, the few who's whiney personal 'religion' was more important than their job didn't.

And your job isn't a right.

[myata]

8 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Yes they can do that, but what are the consequences for abuses that took place during the Act and the inappropriate use of the Act?  A conversation with various people involved that ends without consequence or directives to remediate the misuse?

Exactly. The system was designed, from day one with two prime objectives: first, that there will be no real accountability and responsibility for public administrations, ever, in any meaningful form (talk show decorations and adornment doesn't count for anything real and meaningful, obviously). And the second objective, that this status quo could not be changed ever, if such accountability was desired by the society (that in its current state is far from a fact). Here, the red face or the blue one, oh you want a new party good luck with that (Green, PPC).

And that is of course a blueprint for a tight and painful social dead end at some point. Because the system doesn't want to change, abhors any meaningful change, avoids it, creates diversions and imitations, useless talk forever, anything - and when it's actually needed forgot anything about how to think, design and execute it. As just seen - but looking, even experiencing does not equal understanding.

[myata]

36 minutes ago, myata said:

The system was designed, from day one with two prime objectives:

OK three, correction, the third being grotesque privilege and entitlement, inflated out of all reasonable bounds and proportions, zero checks, no commonsense, outrageous allowances, benefits, pensions only for keeping the status quo intact out of pockets of peasants and trickle from selling supposedly, public natural endowment but look, who's looking?

Edited October 19, 2022 by myata

[ExFlyer]

13 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

What a liar. Almost all of your posts here say that "It's no big deal", "it's an insignificant blip from the past", "the truckers deserved everything that happened to them", etc.

You couldn't be a better useful idiot for Trudeau and his fascist policies if he paid you.

Uhhh, wtf?

He started off the pandemic by saying that he didn't think that covid would really affect Canadians, he backed all of the WHO's patently idiotic assumptions, he gave away all of our PPE to China for nothing, he bet on the sinovax and put Canada at the bottom of the list for the pseudovax- then he had to poach 1.9 million pseudovaccines from the 3rd world charity pool to get us going.

He thought that blocking travel from China was bad, when covid was only in China, so he let people come all the way from Wuhan to eat in restaurants here, go to movies and sporting events, etc. Only a week after he stopped travellers from China from wandering freely here he shut down our whole country. Canadians couldn't even go to public parks. 

Then he banned travel from India during the Delta wave because suddenly it wasn't racist anymore.

Trudeau was an absolute idiot at every stage of the game. He didn't do a single thing right. He even opted for fascism over science. That's not a good look.

The federal gov't and their lapdog media did everything they could to get covid here, and then after we understood what covid really was, they hyped the fear and went fascist on us. 

Provincial gov'ts had no choice but to follow the M's fear. Governments who held out were excoriated by the "free" press. Not following suit was like saying "vote libtard".

No, employers were backed by the gov't if they chose to discriminate against anti-Pseudovaxxers.

You just said that you weren't defending or downplaying anything, remember?

Now the inquiry is being steered by Trudeau's hand-picked toady.

You were supporting fascism on a public forum. Most would argue that's worse.

Not lying. The debacle was and is only a blip in history.

"He" said "didn't think that covid would really affect Canadians,"??  What BS is that LOL

Provincial health authorities decided what to do in their own provinces... period.

Employers made choices to protect their own employees, period.

I am not defending, just stating facts, not emotions.

6 weeks of testimony by dozens of witnesses are being steered by Trudeau? Are you saying the witnesses are all pro government??

I support fascism??? You just banter and throw out undefined insults... again LOL

 

 

 

 

 

[ExFlyer]

13 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Many truckers and protesters were vaccinated.  It’s about our rights and stopping government overreach.  I’ve been on the other side of the argument and weighed both sides.  You don’t remove critical rights and compromise so many people’s livelihoods and mental health to fight a disease for which, by February, people had many means of protecting themselves.  Never again, or rather, if this is the way of Canada’s future, I want out.  

You are correct and they were the ones that came out on  the weekend and left to go back to work.

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

You are correct and they were the ones that came out on  the weekend and left to go back to work.

Not really.  Some truckers are independent, which means that they own their own rigs and contract out to companies.  They can give up jobs and money to support a cause.  You really don’t account for the large number of protesters who were vaccinated and were not truckers but saw the arbitrariness and overreach.  I attended the protests one day and what I saw was a total contradiction of what was presented by CBC and CTV.  It was multi-racial, peaceful, festive, and many of the protesters were people I’d consider left-leaning on abortion.  “My body, my choice” signs were everywhere.  Farmers were there.  Civil liberties groups, Eastern Europeans, and intellectuals were there talking feverishly.  Many people commented on the atmosphere feeling like communist crackdowns in former Eastern Block countries.

Also, people often did have to compromise because they have mouths to feed and can’t afford to lose their jobs.  The government put people under immense pressure to comply with unnecessary mandates.

Your take on the protests is quite superficial.  I also laugh when I hear how Ottawans were inconvenienced when I think about the violence and vandalizing protests we’ve seen among other activist groups in the past.  The fact that Trudeau didn’t meet with them and disparaged them, painting them as white supremacists and misogynists with “unacceptable views” was so divisive.

I don’t care what you moral cowards think anymore.  I see you as the reason why totalitarianism takes hold.  It’s the “I was following orders” mentality.  Wimpville.  

Edited October 19, 2022 by Zeitgeist

[Zeitgeist]

9 hours ago, myata said:

Exactly. The system was designed, from day one with two prime objectives: first, that there will be no real accountability and responsibility for public administrations, ever, in any meaningful form (talk show decorations and adornment doesn't count for anything real and meaningful, obviously). And the second objective, that this status quo could not be changed ever, if such accountability was desired by the society (that in its current state is far from a fact). Here, the red face or the blue one, oh you want a new party good luck with that (Green, PPC).

And that is of course a blueprint for a tight and painful social dead end at some point. Because the system doesn't want to change, abhors any meaningful change, avoids it, creates diversions and imitations, useless talk forever, anything - and when it's actually needed forgot anything about how to think, design and execute it. As just seen - but looking, even experiencing does not equal understanding.

Again, that’s why we’re supposed to have Charter protections of rights, but we’ve learned that those are pretty suggestions, easily ignored by governments and swept away by the courts without much reason.  The media always complies because rocking boats might prevent the government grants from flowing.  

[ExFlyer]

17 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Again, that’s why we’re supposed to have Charter protections of rights, but we’ve learned that those are pretty suggestions, easily ignored by governments and swept away by the courts without much reason.  The media always complies because rocking boats might prevent the government grants from flowing.  

Charter protection rights?

Which were breached?? I keep asking you and you deflect and/or cannot answer LOL

[ExFlyer]

23 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Not really.  Some truckers are independent, which means that they own their own rigs and contract out to companies.  They can give up jobs and money to support a cause.  You really don’t account for the large number of protesters who were vaccinated and were not truckers but saw the arbitrariness and overreach.  I attended the protests one day and what I saw was a total contradiction of what was presented by CBC and CTV.  It was multi-racial, peaceful, festive, and many of the protesters were people I’d consider left-leaning on abortion.  “My body, my choice” signs were everywhere.  Farmers were there.  Civil liberties groups, Eastern Europeans, and intellectuals were there talking feverishly.  Many people commented on the atmosphere feeling like communist crackdowns in former Eastern Block countries.

Also, people often did have to compromise because they have mouths to feed and can’t afford to lose their jobs.  The government put people under immense pressure to comply with unnecessary mandates.

Your take on the protests is quite superficial.  I also laugh when I hear how Ottawans were inconvenienced when I think about the violence and vandalizing protests we’ve seen among other activist groups in the past.  The fact that Trudeau didn’t meet with them and disparaged them, painting them as white supremacists and misogynists with “unacceptable views” was so divisive.

I don’t care what you moral cowards think anymore.  I see you as the reason why totalitarianism takes hold.  It’s the “I was following orders” mentality.  Wimpville.  

One day?? LOL. Good one. The debacle lasted 21 days.

What violence and vandalizing protests among other activists groups? Name them.You are making shit up again.

The next 6 weeks will have anyone that wants to have their say about what happened. No facebook or tictok or youtube snippets but real sworn testimony.

I think some of you are afraid of the real truth from the under oath witness.

[Zeitgeist]

6 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

One day?? LOL. Good one. The debacle lasted 21 days.

What violence and vandalizing protests among other activists groups? Name them.You are making shit up again.

The next 6 weeks will have anyone that wants to have their say about what happened. No facebook or tictok or youtube snippets but real sworn testimony.

I think some of you are afraid of the real truth from the under oath witness.

I can’t stomach your ignorance and denial.  You’re right, there have never been violent protests or protests with vandalism in Canada (sarcasm).  

[ExFlyer]

27 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I can’t stomach your ignorance and denial.  You’re right, there have never been violent protests or protests with vandalism in Canada (sarcasm).  

All I do is ask you simple questions.

What charter rights were breached and what violent protests in Ottawa that you allude to and all you can com back with is insults.

I think the "ignorance and denial" is all on you bud LOL

Waiting for an answer.....and waiting....and waiting...........

 

The inquiry will have it's say. All the witnesses will have their say, from all sides

65 witnesses set to testify at inquiry into use of Emergencies Act

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/public-inquiry-emergencies-act-witness-list-1.6612455

Edited October 19, 2022 by ExFlyer

[ExFlyer]

15 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

The vax mandate on truckers was federal.  

Incorrect.

The mandate was for border crossing, anybody crossing the border.  It was also a US mandate to get into the US.

Edited October 19, 2022 by ExFlyer

[myata]

58 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Again, that’s why we’re supposed to have Charter protections of rights, but we’ve learned that those are pretty suggestions, easily ignored by governments and swept away by the courts without much reason.

Paper is never any real protection. So many people stumbled on this obvious fact over millennia. At best, a dream and wishful thinking. More sinister, a smokescreen, deception.

[ExFlyer]

1 minute ago, myata said:

Paper is never any real protection. So many people stumbled on this obvious fact over millennia. At best, a dream and wishful thinking. More sinister, a smokescreen, deception.

Ahh, so it is "dream and wishful thinking" that was breached but not the charter??

Now that explains all of you LOL

[WestCanMan]

4 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

Not lying. The debacle was and is only a blip in history.

"He" said "didn't think that covid would really affect Canadians,"??  What BS is that LOL

Provincial health authorities decided what to do in their own provinces... period.

Employers made choices to protect their own employees, period.

I am not defending, just stating facts, not emotions.

6 weeks of testimony by dozens of witnesses are being steered by Trudeau? Are you saying the witnesses are all pro government??

I support fascism??? You just banter and throw out undefined insults... again LOL

Yes, you do support fascism, in the exact same way that people in Germany supported it in 1935. They were stupid, what's your excuse?

[Zeitgeist]

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

Incorrect.

The mandate was for border crossing, anybody crossing the border.  It was also a US mandate to get into the US.

Canada’s border is federal jurisdiction.  

[Goddess]

From the hearings yesterday, it still seems to me that it is mostly trivial complaints and often exaggerated.

The Hotel Laurier testified that they had a broken sprinkler on premises and that fire trucks could not get to them.

Turned out this was false testimony. A truck WAS sent out and arrived with no issues. A broken sprinkler is a common occurrence and is never treated as an emergency and multiple fire trucks are never sent for such a minor issue.