Andrew Scheer unveils climate plan promising green technology

[SpankyMcFarland]

To my surprise, NP columnist John Ivison reviewed Scheer’s ‘plan’ fairly caustically. Here’s a line he quoted from Edmund Burke:

Quote

“Nobody made a greater mistake than he who did nothing because he could only do a little.”
 

 

 

 

[Dougie93]

Scheer is an idiot just like the rest of the Cucks, pandering to Liberals and the media, they should grow a spine and speak the truth, which is that climate change ranks tenth on voters lists of concerns, voters don't want to pay anything for it, nobody cares except Liberal elitists who are never going to vote for the Tories, they should do as Trump did and say the plan is to pull out of the Paris Climate Change Targets, because they are bullshit and leftists are climate mobster utopian kooks, which is why conservatives don't want to do anything about it at all.

 

[OftenWrong]

10 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

To my surprise, NP columnist John Ivison reviewed Scheer’s ‘plan’ fairly caustically. Here’s a line he quoted from Edmund Burke:

That's nice, but it's just a quote. Things need to be thought out critically, not by platitudes. For example we can waste billions to achieve only a small improvement, or choose not to do that, figure out a more effective way to solve the problem with the same money. I think that approach is at least is worthy of consideration.

[SpankyMcFarland]

3 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

That's nice, but it's just a quote. Things need to be thought out critically, not by platitudes. For example we can waste billions to achieve only a small improvement, or choose not to do that, figure out a more effective way to solve the problem with the same money. I think that approach is at least is worthy of consideration.

What would you suggest? Scheer’s proposal isn’t serious at all. It’s merely window dressing, designed to give a fig leaf to Conservative candidates in the next election so they can say their party has a plan before they run away. Even National Post columnists can see through it:

Quote

https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/john-ivison-conservative-climate-plan-gives-voters-what-they-say-they-want-expressions-of-concern-with-no-actual-cost

Quote

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/andrew-coyne-conservative-climate-change-plan-is-really-more-of-a-prop

 

 

 

 

Edited June 22, 2019 by SpankyMcFarland

[Michael Hardner]

42 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

What would you suggest? Scheer’s proposal isn’t serious at all. It’s merely window dressing, designed to give a fig leaf to Conservative candidates in the next election so they can say their party has a plan before they run away. Even National Post columnists can see through it: 

And as predicted the fire-in-their-eyes types are actually PISSED at this non-plan because it pledges to hit the Paris targets !    

I love the right - it tries to tie hillbillies and money-suited lobbyists with a big bow !  Kind of like how the left tries to do it with manual workers and tweed-suited academics

 

[taxme]

19 hours ago, eyeball said:

True of Rex too.  He's also completely ignored the fact that burning Tar Sands oil, the filthiest and most CO2 laden oil on the planet, will release 22 billion tons of CO2. That's just from currently recoverable stocks and figuring out how to extract and burn the rest will release another 240 billion.

That impact to global warming is one fuck of a lot than what's being advertised.  Notwithstanding that Canadian oil companies are vastly underreporting their refining and processing emissions to a dog's breakfast of incompetent federal and provincial regulators that are probably looking the other way in any case.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/tar-sands-and-keystone-xl-pipeline-impact-on-global-warming/

https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/oilsands-carbon-emissions-study-1.5106809

https://globalnews.ca/news/4176459/pollution-from-canadian-refineries-an-embarrassment-compared-to-u-s/

 

Why don't you go to China and India and try to get them to go for your climate bull chit? Canadians have done their fair share and enough already of this constant so called climate change bull chit. Canadians are paying through the nose to try and save the planet. I pay more for my gas in BC thanks to the leftist liberal  NDP socialist greenies and their climate crap that are making me pay $1.40 a liter at the gas pumps here in BC. At one time it was up to $1.70 a liter. All I get these days from the leftist liberals and socialists and their core supporters the leftist lieberal Canadian media party(CTV/CBC/Global)these days is their all about the climate change, sex perversions, refugees and racism nonsense.

This is what happens when the normal and decent and moral people of Canada allows those misfits mentioned above to take over and are allowed to spread their lying bull chit. Over sixty years ago all that bs mentioned did not exist at all and we did not fight with one another over who one voted for like we are doing and seeing today. You voted for whoever and all was well. Now thanks to liberalism and socialism we are all fighting among ourselves over who one voted for and it is getting worse. Now straight white conservative Christians are being denied their right to their right of freedom of speech by those commie lieberals and socialists and media. They are the enemy along with the commie media party who we the conservative people have to watch out for and fear. They are out to shut us down and throw us in their gulag. Scheer is liberal lite and he will be no different to Trudeau and his leftist liberal policies.  

[taxme]

12 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

Scheer is an idiot just like the rest of the Cucks, pandering to Liberals and the media, they should grow a spine and speak the truth, which is that climate change ranks tenth on voters lists of concerns, voters don't want to pay anything for it, nobody cares except Liberal elitists who are never going to vote for the Tories, they should do as Trump did and say the plan is to pull out of the Paris Climate Change Targets, because they are bullshit and leftists are climate mobster utopian kooks, which is why conservatives don't want to do anything about it at all.

 

The one politician that will take on all this climate bull chit and the Paris Accord and dump it in the garbage where it belongs is Maxine Bernier of the People's Party of Canada. Maxine is a real and true conservative, something some of the leftist liberal ilks here are totally afraid of. Even as I speak the leftist liberal media will be trying their darndest in to trying to find something on Bernier to try and make him look like he is just another one of those white supremacists and racists conservatives out there. Just wait and see.

When Bernier starts to become a threat to the liberal elite establishment the attacks and smears will begin. Even Scheer will get in on the action and will attack Bernier. Why Scheer seems to feel that he has to suck up to the liberal establishment and their green climate nonsense is beyond me because the lieberal establishment will always be Scheers enemy no matter what because he calls himself a conservative. Conservatism is the enemy of liberalism. 

Scheer should be like Trump. Talk and act like a real and true conservative and dam with the leftist liberal commies and their lies and bull chit that they will throw at him. Trump loves it and enjoys stepping on their bs every day. If Scheer has a  clean background there is nothing they could do to him to try and make him look bad. Even if Scheer does have a green policy the liberals will still attack his policy as impossible to achieve. Scheer will never get any credit from those lying liberal commies. All Scheer has done to himself now is that he has sold his soul to the liberal devil. Aw well, it's too late for him and the liberal conservative party to be able to save their soul now. What an idiot he is is right. He blew it for the conservative party. 

[Zeitgeist]

There actually is substance to the plan because it does involve a cap on large emitters and incentivizes green tech through tax breaks.  It’s not terrible.  Does it go far enough?  No, but part of the plan is to encourage other countries to get on board and trade emissions reductions between countries.

Again, it’s only through regional planning, building codes, and regulation that people will change the way they live.  Green tech must be incorporated into the way we build.  Housing concentrations must make decent mass transit viable to get people to choose to use it instead of vehicles.  Raw nature and farmlands have to be close to development to offset the carbon footprint.  Gas prices are already high and auto companies are committing to building EV’s.  On the other hand you can’t simply take away people’s choice to live in a big house or buy a large vehicle.  Those lifestyles have to be part of the mix, but people will have to pay for them.  Their supply will naturally dwindle over time as demand for land and resources rises.  We don’t have to throw carbon taxes on top.  The pain is coming and the challenge will be keeping the cost of living down.  

Edited June 23, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Army Guy]

Why don't Canadians just come to their senses....Climate change is real, OK thats a fact... but average Canadian don't give a rats ass, yes they talk the good talk, even debate it here on the forums, but what are they willing to do about it, ....the liberal plans is garbage, the Cons plan is garbage, NDP plan is better, but still lacks any real vision, and the greens plan, turn the lights out by 2030, not happening ,so whats left, and the PPC plan is they don't believe in climate change, well atleast they have not blown smoke up your arse…..But hey Canada has declared a national emergence on the climate...But the plans don't reflect any emergence do they ?....Maybe it's just me....

So here we are with no plan thats going to do anything , or make a difference in regards to the world stage....and we still talk about this shit hoping one day someone with some leadership and determination, will step forward with a brand new plan.....that day is not going to happen until we have 10 feet of water in our living rooms and it's to late....Eyeball will have to find a taller tree, and you true believers will have to tread water, And still you  people are going to vote on party lines, because thats what you do...your are afraid of change and when it comes down to it, your are not afraid of treading water.....how many will vote with this issue in mind ? how many thinks it is a waste of good oxygen talking about it  because it will not make a difference ? 

Edited June 23, 2019 by Army Guy

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Army Guy said:

how many thinks it is a waste of good oxygen talking about it  because it will not make a difference ? 

Not you obviously or you would have shut up by now....please.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Army Guy said:

Why don't Canadians just come to their senses....Climate change is real, OK thats a fact... but average Canadian don't give a rats ass, yes they talk the good talk, even debate it here on the forums, but what are they willing to do about it, ....the liberal plans is garbage, the Cons plan is garbage, NDP plan is better, but still lacks any real vision, and the greens plan, turn the lights out by 2030, not happening ,so whats left, and the PPC plan is they don't believe in climate change, well atleast they have not blown smoke up your arse…..But hey Canada has declared a national emergence on the climate...But the plans don't reflect any emergence do they ?....Maybe it's just me....

So here we are with no plan thats going to do anything , or make a difference in regards to the world stage....and we still talk about this shit hoping one day someone with some leadership and determination, will step forward with a brand new plan.....that day is not going to happen until we have 10 feet of water in our living rooms and it's to late....Eyeball will have to find a taller tree, and you true believers will have to tread water, And still you  people are going to vote on party lines, because thats what you do...your are afraid of change and when it comes down to it, your are not afraid of treading water.....how many will vote with this issue in mind ? how many thinks it is a waste of good oxygen talking about it  because it will not make a difference ? 

Absolutely.  Climate Change isn't stopping, and any efforts we make without getting the rest of the world to join in won't make the blindest bit of difference.

But people like to think they are making a difference, so if they catch a bus tomorrow instead of taking the car, let them feel good about themselves.  It won't last.

[Ell]

Stifling the Canadian Economy will not help control or impact the Climate.  It will only help other countries get ahead of us and produce more pollution.  If you want real results then as a good example you only need to look at Technology Advancements and the sharing of knowledge such as Sask Power Coal Carbon Capture Technology shared with a host of major polluters in other countries such as China, USA, etc.  Because of the scope of this beneficial knowledge sharing and Tech Advancements making it feasible again, that has a real positive and lasting impact for the environment.

[SpankyMcFarland]

It's a joke, guys, just going through the motions. What it does signal is that even the Conservatives have to feign seriousness on this issue now. 

Edited July 26, 2019 by SpankyMcFarland

[Ell]

Politics and the fight for World Economical dominance of course is making this a joke.  No foreign country should be dictating to us in Canada what or especially how we fight any impacts on the climate.  We do have alot of forests that use C02 and our fresh water reserves are second to none.  We use clean technology in the production of fuel.  We are leaders in the Tech advances of that.  We share the information so others can use it which is contributing more than any nation on earth.  We do not need to punish our own people as the Liberals are doing.  Time for them to go.

[Michael Hardner]

Weird logic.  An international treaty signed on by 196 countries is a 'foreign country dictating to us' ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Agreement

Here's the list:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_parties_to_the_Paris_Agreement

I feel like 90% of the debate around here is feeding information to people who are uninformed.

[Ell]

Not weird logic at all.  When the Elite (Liberals) and corporations can hide their fortunes across borders without real accountabilities to their country of origin, then yes, those foreign countries along with the Liberal Elites drain the rightful wealth, fabric, and structure from the country they should be responsible to.

[Argus]

On 6/21/2019 at 11:31 PM, SpankyMcFarland said:

To my surprise, NP columnist John Ivison reviewed Scheer’s ‘plan’ fairly caustically.

Ivison is only nominally a conservative. In fact, you will find no difference between his social views and that of the NDP. The same could be said for Coyne. There are no social conservatives in mainstream Canadian media as far as I'm aware.

[Argus]

On 6/22/2019 at 1:16 PM, SpankyMcFarland said:

What would you suggest? Scheer’s proposal isn’t serious at all. It’s merely window dressing, designed to give a fig leaf to Conservative candidates in the next election so they can say their party has a plan before they run away.

So just like the Liberals' non-plan, then?

[Michael Hardner]

2 hours ago, Ell said:

Not weird logic at all.  When the Elite (Liberals) and corporations can hide their fortunes across borders without real accountabilities to their country of origin, then yes, those foreign countries along with the Liberal Elites drain the rightful wealth, fabric, and structure from the country they should be responsible to.

So ... how does that relate to " No foreign country should be dictating to us in Canada what or especially how we fight any impacts on the climate. "

The elites are draining Canada but not the other countries that signed on ?  Or... it's NOT foreign countries doing it but these "elites" you speak of ?  These elites - are the just "the wealthy" ?  If so, Scheer wants to fund green technology - are they in on that too ?  

Please map out the conspiracy as though I will be believing your post, thanks.

[cannuck]

On 6/20/2019 at 7:32 PM, Zeitgeist said:

I think the best climate change measures are ones that achieve other important goals at the same time.  That way it can receive the widest public support, even among climate change deniers. For example, building faster, more frequent, and more widely available mass transport would improve business productivity and quality of life for most Canadians.  Imagine having fast electrified rail within a 20 minute walk or bus ride of most Canadian residents.  Imagine high speed rail in the Quebec-Windsor corridor that could move people between Toronto and Montreal in well under three hours. What about Calgary to Edmonton?  Plan communities that provide concentrations of population that make rail networks economically viable and that incorporate their own carbon sinks (forests/marshes/ponds). Incorporating affordable and sensible green tech in the building code will immediately create a mass market for green tech manufacturers that doesn’t require ridiculous subsidies and carbon taxes.  Air and water quality are important to all Canadians.  Some greenhouse gases are also pollutants.  Focus on reducing those.  

You are doing EXACTLY what I expect government and the citizenry at large seems to think is moving "forward" in resource and environmental management should be:  you want to find "greener" ways of doing exactly the same thing - i..e. what the left accuses the "right" (as if there was such a thing in Canada).  This is EXACTLY what Neil Austin accused Scheer of in the opening post - just the mindless Liberal/liberal interpretation of how to continue unsustainable lifestyles.

Cities here are designed for personal transportation, adapted (poorly) for mass transit, but the real question is WTF are we doing moving millions of people every day probably two hours on the average to and from work??  We can only do such idiotic things because we live in a country with massive amounts of resources we have exploited (really, WASTED) to build a lifestyle that is ultra-energy and resource wasteful.

The term "virtue signalling" precisely fits this kind of BS.  So, you suppose parking your Escalade and taking a Prius from Barry to Toronto every day and then out to the Muskoka cottage for the weekend is really the answer????   IF (and that is a BIG IF) your job is really necessary, you simply need to live a short walk or bicycle ride from it.  In greater detail: we really need to consider EVERY job and question weather it creates wealth and contributes to society or if it is simply an element of waste (and I would guess 2/3 fall under the latter) and simply stop doing them.  It is really simple, for instance, to stop buying shit that has been built on one side of the globe and shipped half way around the world because it is cheaper than making it here.  In stead, we need to return to making ONE good thing that will last at least a lifetime, instead of consuming hundreds of pieces of crap that all require resources to be shipped one way and product back the other, over, and over and over.

Then, of course, there is the heard of elephants in the corner of the room. We simply can not continue the rate of population growth we have over the last century.  Very few people in the "environmental movement" have the brains or the balls to address this - which is the REAL problem.

https://www.google.com/search?q=world+population+historical+graph&rlz=1C1GCEA_enCA752CA752&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=iYteHE3FRTDeYM%3A%2CIhFQCKVy7G06BM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kS-sOAGfVtGQDE0pEFJAbo7Ab1VPA&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiUnPzTo9jjAhVbLs0KHWThDlYQ9QEwAHoECAkQAw#imgrc=z-XE6EEzEZ9aoM:&vet=1

[dialamah]

2 hours ago, Ell said:

Not weird logic at all.  When the Elite (Liberals) and corporations can hide their fortunes across borders without real accountabilities to their country of origin, then yes, those foreign countries along with the Liberal Elites drain the rightful wealth, fabric, and structure from the country they should be responsible to.

So .. no conservatives hide their fortunes across borders without accountability?  Is that what you are trying to claim?

[eyeball]

8 hours ago, Ell said:

We use clean technology in the production of fuel.  We are leaders in the Tech advances of that.  We share the information so others can use it which is contributing more than any nation on earth.

Our production emissions mean nothing when producing the most CO2 laden oil on the planet.

Canada is effectively pretending there is no difference between producing Tar Sands oil and burning Tar Sandsoil. Like asbestos, we're not responsible for it once it's sold. Like China's attitude with regards to fentanyl, how we use it is our problem not theirs.

Edited July 28, 2019 by eyeball

[Zeitgeist]

28 minutes ago, cannuck said:

You are doing EXACTLY what I expect government and the citizenry at large seems to think is moving "forward" in resource and environmental management should be:  you want to find "greener" ways of doing exactly the same thing - i..e. what the left accuses the "right" (as if there was such a thing in Canada).  This is EXACTLY what Neil Austin accused Scheer of in the opening post - just the mindless Liberal/liberal interpretation of how to continue unsustainable lifestyles.

Cities here are designed for personal transportation, adapted (poorly) for mass transit, but the real question is WTF are we doing moving millions of people every day probably two hours on the average to and from work??  We can only do such idiotic things because we live in a country with massive amounts of resources we have exploited (really, WASTED) to build a lifestyle that is ultra-energy and resource wasteful.

The term "virtue signalling" precisely fits this kind of BS.  So, you suppose parking your Escalade and taking a Prius from Barry to Toronto every day and then out to the Muskoka cottage for the weekend is really the answer????   IF (and that is a BIG IF) your job is really necessary, you simply need to live a short walk or bicycle ride from it.  In greater detail: we really need to consider EVERY job and question weather it creates wealth and contributes to society or if it is simply an element of waste (and I would guess 2/3 fall under the latter) and simply stop doing them.  It is really simple, for instance, to stop buying shit that has been built on one side of the globe and shipped half way around the world because it is cheaper than making it here.  In stead, we need to return to making ONE good thing that will last at least a lifetime, instead of consuming hundreds of pieces of crap that all require resources to be shipped one way and product back the other, over, and over and over.

Then, of course, there is the heard of elephants in the corner of the room. We simply can not continue the rate of population growth we have over the last century.  Very few people in the "environmental movement" have the brains or the balls to address this - which is the REAL problem.

https://www.google.com/search?q=world+population+historical+graph&rlz=1C1GCEA_enCA752CA752&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=iYteHE3FRTDeYM%3A%2CIhFQCKVy7G06BM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kS-sOAGfVtGQDE0pEFJAbo7Ab1VPA&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiUnPzTo9jjAhVbLs0KHWThDlYQ9QEwAHoECAkQAw#imgrc=z-XE6EEzEZ9aoM:&vet=1

Why do you assume I support driving big gas guzzlers long distances when my post explains how important decent public transportation is to both reducing greenhouse gas emissions and improving quality of life?  What’s more, since it improves commute times, business productivity, and quality of life, it’s likely to get support from both the left and the right.  My point is simply to start with initiatives that will get the widest public support and give the biggest bang for the buck.  It’s why Doug Ford’s Ontario Line is perhaps his greatest (only?) redeeming quality in terms of public support.  

Edited July 28, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[cannuck]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Why do you assume I support driving big gas guzzlers long distances when my post explains how important decent public transportation is to both reducing greenhouse gas emissions and improving quality of life?  What’s more, since it improves commute times, business productivity, and quality of life, it’s likely to get support from both the left and the right.  My point is simply to start with initiatives that will get the widest public support and give the biggest bang for the buck.  It’s why Doug Ford’s Ontario Line is perhaps his greatest (only?) redeeming quality in terms of public support.  

You just demonstrated my point about virtue signaling.  You are willing to give up your Escalade or your Prius for a communter train (which even if the power it uses comes from a generator that runs on unicorn farts still puts out CO2), but there is no way in hell you are willing to change anything substantial in your life - which IMHO at the top of the list means commuting at all.

[taxme]

1 hour ago, cannuck said:

You just demonstrated my point about virtue signaling.  You are willing to give up your Escalade or your Prius for a communter train (which even if the power it uses comes from a generator that runs on unicorn farts still puts out CO2), but there is no way in hell you are willing to change anything substantial in your life - which IMHO at the top of the list means commuting at all.

Those people who are so against greenhouse emissions and are against global warming are the last ones that will ever want to give up their greenhouse emissions lifestyle. This country is so full of hypocrites who believe that you should do as they say and not as they do. If they have a vehicle well sell it and take the bus, otherwise quit with your double standards. I am getting so sick and tired of those people who will not practice what they like to preach. 

Scheer sure does sound like a liberal, eh? So, I wonder what the cost will be for Scheers green technology plan to be implemented? A couple of billion of taxpayer's tax dollars? The government is the biggest contributor to greenhouse gases. I guess that his plan will be to downsize the government as much as possible and take many of those big government gas guzzlers off the road, right? Ya sure. Chuckle-chuckle. All politicians like to pretend that they are for fighting global warming but in reality they appear to really not give a chit. They just want we the sheeple to give up our lifestyle so they can continue theirs. A bunch of bloody hypocrites.