Why socialized health care is a failed public service in Canada.

[blackbird]

Unless you are one of ones who have no serious medical problems yet and don't need a health care system YET, then you might say the system is fine.  That is not the case for millions of Canadians.

"A large and increasing number of people across Canada do not have a regular family doctor, creating a significant gap in primary care. Having a consistent primary care provider is crucial because they are the main person who helps manage your overall health, offers preventative advice, and refers you to specialists when necessary.

Without this important connection, many people must rely on crowded walk-in clinics or even hospital emergency rooms for basic care, which is not the right place for non-urgent issues. This overuse of emergency rooms adds more stress and longer waits for people who actually need urgent, life-saving help.

Provinces are trying new programs to connect people with a provider, but the demand still far outweighs the number of professionals available. This ongoing shortage is breaking down the foundation of preventative and continuous health management in our communities.

The growing crisis of long waiting periods

Canadians are facing unacceptably long waits for many necessary medical procedures and consultations, which is a major problem in the system. When a person needs a knee replacement or a specialist’s opinion on a serious condition, waiting many months, or even over a year, has become a regular occurrence.

These significant delays can cause people’s health issues to get worse while they wait, turning manageable problems into much more serious conditions, and sometimes requiring a hospital visit for something that could have been dealt with sooner.

Furthermore, the long waiting periods are not just for non-emergency surgeries; they are also affecting the time it takes to get essential diagnostic scans like MRIs and CTs, which are critical for finding illnesses early. The wait times are a clear sign that the system is struggling to deliver timely care, which is the very essence of quality healthcare.

Overcrowded emergency departments becoming the default

Emergency departments (ERs) in hospitals across the country are often dangerously overcrowded, leading to extremely long wait times for treatment. Because so many people lack a family doctor, or cannot get a timely appointment, the ER becomes their only option for care, even for minor illnesses or prescription refills.

This situation creates a severe strain on hospital staff and resources, as the ERs are forced to handle cases that should be managed elsewhere in the community. When a person with a broken leg or a heart condition has to wait hours in the hallway to be seen, it shows the system is failing its most vulnerable patients.

Nurse and doctor burnout and workforce fatigue

Healthcare professionals, especially nurses and doctors, are reporting very high levels of burnout and exhaustion due to the non-stop pressure of the system. The ongoing staffing shortages mean that those who remain must work longer hours and handle heavier workloads, which makes it hard to maintain a healthy work-life balance.

Many experienced nurses are choosing to retire early or are leaving public hospitals to work for private agencies, which often pay better and offer more flexible schedules. This drain of skilled workers puts even more stress on the staff who stay behind, creating a harmful cycle of overworked professionals and reduced quality of care.

The well-being of the healthcare workforce is directly linked to the well-being of the patients they serve, and right now, the staff are struggling significantly.

Challenges in keeping and attracting rural healthcare workers

It is becoming incredibly difficult to recruit and keep doctors, nurses, and other health professionals in Canada’s rural and remote communities. Healthcare workers often prefer to practice in large cities where there are more resources, better access to specialized equipment, and greater opportunities for their family.

This leaves small towns and northern areas with a critical lack of service, forcing residents to travel long distances, sometimes in poor weather conditions, to get even basic medical care. In some small towns, the local ER might close down temporarily because no one is available to staff it, making a bad situation worse. New programs are needed to encourage more professionals to move to and stay in these underserved regions by offering better support and incentives.

Fragmented care between provinces and territories

The fact that healthcare is managed by each province and territory means the system is not a seamless one, which creates problems for patients moving across the country.

A person who moves from Alberta to Ontario, for example, might find it hard to transfer their health records or quickly find a new family doctor because of differing provincial systems. This lack of a unified national approach to licensing also sometimes makes it harder for doctors and nurses to work across provincial borders, even when one region desperately needs staff.

While the fundamental principle of universal access is national, the delivery of care is quite scattered, and this fragmentation prevents the system from being as efficient and coordinated as it could be for all Canadians.

The need for better mental health services integration

Access to proper mental health and addiction services is often disconnected from the rest of the physical healthcare system, making it hard for people to get the comprehensive help they need.

While the need for mental health support is greater than ever, getting timely appointments with psychologists, psychiatrists, or counselors through the public system can involve very long waits. Many people must pay for these services privately because the public coverage is limited, creating an unfair barrier for those with lower incomes.

True health means caring for both the mind and the body, and the current system needs to do a much better job of bringing these two aspects of care together seamlessly in local clinics and hospitals.

Delays in adopting new medical technology

Canada’s healthcare system can be slow to bring in and widely use modern digital tools and technology that could make care more efficient. While other countries are quickly moving to advanced electronic health records that easily share information, Canada still struggles with outdated systems where patient files are often paper-based or stuck in local hospital databases.

This slow adoption of technology means doctors waste valuable time searching for information, referrals get delayed, and there are sometimes medical errors because a professional doesn’t have a patient’s full history. Investing in and standardizing modern digital tools across all provinces would be a huge step toward improving efficiency and patient safety.

Increasing burden of an aging population

Canada’s population is getting older, which is placing an ever-growing demand on healthcare services and resources, particularly in areas like long-term care and home care. As people live longer, they tend to have more chronic, long-term conditions like diabetes, heart disease, or Alzheimer’s, which require frequent monitoring and complex care.

The number of hospital beds and specialized staff needed to support this aging population is not keeping up with the increase in demand. This pressure is felt in hospitals, which struggle to move elderly patients out of acute care beds and into appropriate long-term care homes or home-care programs, causing bottlenecks that ripple through the entire system.

Inadequate infrastructure and capital spending

Many hospitals and medical facilities across the country are operating with aging buildings and outdated equipment that need urgent modernization and repair. Delays in spending money on new infrastructure mean that some medical buildings are less efficient, harder to keep clean, and struggle to manage the flow of current patient volumes.

For example, some hospitals might have fewer isolation rooms than necessary, or their operating rooms are not equipped with the most up-to-date technology for complex surgeries. Governments need to make significant, long-term financial commitments to update this physical infrastructure to ensure that healthcare professionals can work in safe, modern environments and deliver care effectively.

Gaps in pharmacare and drug coverage

While most hospital and doctor services are publicly covered, the cost of prescription medications is often not fully included in the public system, leaving many Canadians to pay out-of-pocket.

This gap in drug coverage means that people without a private insurance plan, or those on fixed incomes, may struggle to afford the necessary medicine to treat their conditions. When people cannot afford their prescriptions, they often skip doses or do not fill them at all, which leads to their health getting worse and sometimes results in more expensive hospital visits down the road.

The truth about “free healthcare”: Canadian taxes vs. U.S. bills

Image credit: Hush Naidoo Jade Photography / Unsplash

The truth about “free healthcare”: Canadian taxes vs. U.S. bills

This article appeared first on Mastermind Quotes."

Canadian healthcare is no longer the envy of the world

Some lefties and liberals like to point a finger at those who question the Canadian system and make a false claim that we want the American system.  That is nothing but a big lefty lie. 

We should be looking at the various European systems such as Germany's.  They appear to be functioning much better.  They may be more of a combination of public and private in a way that guarantees everyone good service.  But Canada is in a difficult position to get out of because of our federal system with provinces having the basic jurisdiction over health care.  And there are so many different conflicting voices and no coherent way to find a path to change.  I am not sure Canada will be able to overcome the problems under the existing political system.  That is tragic for millions of Canadians who now suffer and die in the faulty system.  

I think it would take strong leadership from the top to lead Canada to a way to change.   I don't see that happening now.

Another thing is the person at the top of the health care system in a province is the Minister of Health.  That person is a politician and operates according to the politics of his or her party.  Yet the minister is the one who is under tremendous pressure to do certain things or solve various problems within the system.  This in itself is a problem.   The minister is always caught between a rock and a hard place.  As a result of this system, it is almost impossible to be proactive.  Most decisions seem to be a reaction to another crisis here or there across the province.  That means the system is seriously failing and the minister spends his/her time trying to put out fires here and there.

Edited October 31, 2025 by blackbird

[John Stone]

3 hours ago, blackbird said:

Unless you are one of ones who have no serious medical problems yet and don't need a health care system YET, then you might say the system is fine.  That is not the case for millions of Canadians.

"A large and increasing number of people across Canada do not have a regular family doctor, creating a significant gap in primary care. Having a consistent primary care provider is crucial because they are the main person who helps manage your overall health, offers preventative advice, and refers you to specialists when necessary.

Without this important connection, many people must rely on crowded walk-in clinics or even hospital emergency rooms for basic care, which is not the right place for non-urgent issues. This overuse of emergency rooms adds more stress and longer waits for people who actually need urgent, life-saving help.

Provinces are trying new programs to connect people with a provider, but the demand still far outweighs the number of professionals available. This ongoing shortage is breaking down the foundation of preventative and continuous health management in our communities.

The growing crisis of long waiting periods

Canadians are facing unacceptably long waits for many necessary medical procedures and consultations, which is a major problem in the system. When a person needs a knee replacement or a specialist’s opinion on a serious condition, waiting many months, or even over a year, has become a regular occurrence.

These significant delays can cause people’s health issues to get worse while they wait, turning manageable problems into much more serious conditions, and sometimes requiring a hospital visit for something that could have been dealt with sooner.

Furthermore, the long waiting periods are not just for non-emergency surgeries; they are also affecting the time it takes to get essential diagnostic scans like MRIs and CTs, which are critical for finding illnesses early. The wait times are a clear sign that the system is struggling to deliver timely care, which is the very essence of quality healthcare.

Overcrowded emergency departments becoming the default

Emergency departments (ERs) in hospitals across the country are often dangerously overcrowded, leading to extremely long wait times for treatment. Because so many people lack a family doctor, or cannot get a timely appointment, the ER becomes their only option for care, even for minor illnesses or prescription refills.

This situation creates a severe strain on hospital staff and resources, as the ERs are forced to handle cases that should be managed elsewhere in the community. When a person with a broken leg or a heart condition has to wait hours in the hallway to be seen, it shows the system is failing its most vulnerable patients.

Nurse and doctor burnout and workforce fatigue

Healthcare professionals, especially nurses and doctors, are reporting very high levels of burnout and exhaustion due to the non-stop pressure of the system. The ongoing staffing shortages mean that those who remain must work longer hours and handle heavier workloads, which makes it hard to maintain a healthy work-life balance.

Many experienced nurses are choosing to retire early or are leaving public hospitals to work for private agencies, which often pay better and offer more flexible schedules. This drain of skilled workers puts even more stress on the staff who stay behind, creating a harmful cycle of overworked professionals and reduced quality of care.

The well-being of the healthcare workforce is directly linked to the well-being of the patients they serve, and right now, the staff are struggling significantly.

Challenges in keeping and attracting rural healthcare workers

It is becoming incredibly difficult to recruit and keep doctors, nurses, and other health professionals in Canada’s rural and remote communities. Healthcare workers often prefer to practice in large cities where there are more resources, better access to specialized equipment, and greater opportunities for their family.

This leaves small towns and northern areas with a critical lack of service, forcing residents to travel long distances, sometimes in poor weather conditions, to get even basic medical care. In some small towns, the local ER might close down temporarily because no one is available to staff it, making a bad situation worse. New programs are needed to encourage more professionals to move to and stay in these underserved regions by offering better support and incentives.

Fragmented care between provinces and territories

The fact that healthcare is managed by each province and territory means the system is not a seamless one, which creates problems for patients moving across the country.

A person who moves from Alberta to Ontario, for example, might find it hard to transfer their health records or quickly find a new family doctor because of differing provincial systems. This lack of a unified national approach to licensing also sometimes makes it harder for doctors and nurses to work across provincial borders, even when one region desperately needs staff.

While the fundamental principle of universal access is national, the delivery of care is quite scattered, and this fragmentation prevents the system from being as efficient and coordinated as it could be for all Canadians.

The need for better mental health services integration

Access to proper mental health and addiction services is often disconnected from the rest of the physical healthcare system, making it hard for people to get the comprehensive help they need.

While the need for mental health support is greater than ever, getting timely appointments with psychologists, psychiatrists, or counselors through the public system can involve very long waits. Many people must pay for these services privately because the public coverage is limited, creating an unfair barrier for those with lower incomes.

True health means caring for both the mind and the body, and the current system needs to do a much better job of bringing these two aspects of care together seamlessly in local clinics and hospitals.

Delays in adopting new medical technology

Canada’s healthcare system can be slow to bring in and widely use modern digital tools and technology that could make care more efficient. While other countries are quickly moving to advanced electronic health records that easily share information, Canada still struggles with outdated systems where patient files are often paper-based or stuck in local hospital databases.

This slow adoption of technology means doctors waste valuable time searching for information, referrals get delayed, and there are sometimes medical errors because a professional doesn’t have a patient’s full history. Investing in and standardizing modern digital tools across all provinces would be a huge step toward improving efficiency and patient safety.

Increasing burden of an aging population

Canada’s population is getting older, which is placing an ever-growing demand on healthcare services and resources, particularly in areas like long-term care and home care. As people live longer, they tend to have more chronic, long-term conditions like diabetes, heart disease, or Alzheimer’s, which require frequent monitoring and complex care.

The number of hospital beds and specialized staff needed to support this aging population is not keeping up with the increase in demand. This pressure is felt in hospitals, which struggle to move elderly patients out of acute care beds and into appropriate long-term care homes or home-care programs, causing bottlenecks that ripple through the entire system.

Inadequate infrastructure and capital spending

Many hospitals and medical facilities across the country are operating with aging buildings and outdated equipment that need urgent modernization and repair. Delays in spending money on new infrastructure mean that some medical buildings are less efficient, harder to keep clean, and struggle to manage the flow of current patient volumes.

For example, some hospitals might have fewer isolation rooms than necessary, or their operating rooms are not equipped with the most up-to-date technology for complex surgeries. Governments need to make significant, long-term financial commitments to update this physical infrastructure to ensure that healthcare professionals can work in safe, modern environments and deliver care effectively.

Gaps in pharmacare and drug coverage

While most hospital and doctor services are publicly covered, the cost of prescription medications is often not fully included in the public system, leaving many Canadians to pay out-of-pocket.

This gap in drug coverage means that people without a private insurance plan, or those on fixed incomes, may struggle to afford the necessary medicine to treat their conditions. When people cannot afford their prescriptions, they often skip doses or do not fill them at all, which leads to their health getting worse and sometimes results in more expensive hospital visits down the road.

The truth about “free healthcare”: Canadian taxes vs. U.S. bills

Image credit: Hush Naidoo Jade Photography / Unsplash

The truth about “free healthcare”: Canadian taxes vs. U.S. bills

This article appeared first on Mastermind Quotes."

Canadian healthcare is no longer the envy of the world

Some lefties and liberals like to point a finger at those who question the Canadian system and make a false claim that we want the American system.  That is nothing but a big lefty lie. 

We should be looking at the various European systems such as Germany's.  They appear to be functioning much better.  They may be more of a combination of public and private in a way that guarantees everyone good service.  But Canada is in a difficult position to get out of because of our federal system with provinces having the basic jurisdiction over health care.  And there are so many different conflicting voices and no coherent way to find a path to change.  I am not sure Canada will be able to overcome the problems under the existing political system.  That is tragic for millions of Canadians who now suffer and die in the faulty system.  

I think it would take strong leadership from the top to lead Canada to a way to change.   I don't see that happening now.

Another thing is the person at the top of the health care system in a province is the Minister of Health.  That person is a politician and operates according to the politics of his or her party.  Yet the minister is the one who is under tremendous pressure to do certain things or solve various problems within the system.  This in itself is a problem.   The minister is always caught between a rock and a hard place.  As a result of this system, it is almost impossible to be proactive.  Most decisions seem to be a reaction to another crisis here or there across the province.  That means the system is seriously failing and the minister spends his/her time trying to put out fires here and there.

laughable to think Justin was aiming for 500K immigrants/year? OMG, what a fool. 

[taxme]

3 hours ago, blackbird said:

Unless you are one of ones who have no serious medical problems yet and don't need a health care system YET, then you might say the system is fine.  That is not the case for millions of Canadians.

"A large and increasing number of people across Canada do not have a regular family doctor, creating a significant gap in primary care. Having a consistent primary care provider is crucial because they are the main person who helps manage your overall health, offers preventative advice, and refers you to specialists when necessary.

Without this important connection, many people must rely on crowded walk-in clinics or even hospital emergency rooms for basic care, which is not the right place for non-urgent issues. This overuse of emergency rooms adds more stress and longer waits for people who actually need urgent, life-saving help.

Provinces are trying new programs to connect people with a provider, but the demand still far outweighs the number of professionals available. This ongoing shortage is breaking down the foundation of preventative and continuous health management in our communities.

The growing crisis of long waiting periods

Canadians are facing unacceptably long waits for many necessary medical procedures and consultations, which is a major problem in the system. When a person needs a knee replacement or a specialist’s opinion on a serious condition, waiting many months, or even over a year, has become a regular occurrence.

These significant delays can cause people’s health issues to get worse while they wait, turning manageable problems into much more serious conditions, and sometimes requiring a hospital visit for something that could have been dealt with sooner.

Furthermore, the long waiting periods are not just for non-emergency surgeries; they are also affecting the time it takes to get essential diagnostic scans like MRIs and CTs, which are critical for finding illnesses early. The wait times are a clear sign that the system is struggling to deliver timely care, which is the very essence of quality healthcare.

Overcrowded emergency departments becoming the default

Emergency departments (ERs) in hospitals across the country are often dangerously overcrowded, leading to extremely long wait times for treatment. Because so many people lack a family doctor, or cannot get a timely appointment, the ER becomes their only option for care, even for minor illnesses or prescription refills.

This situation creates a severe strain on hospital staff and resources, as the ERs are forced to handle cases that should be managed elsewhere in the community. When a person with a broken leg or a heart condition has to wait hours in the hallway to be seen, it shows the system is failing its most vulnerable patients.

Nurse and doctor burnout and workforce fatigue

Healthcare professionals, especially nurses and doctors, are reporting very high levels of burnout and exhaustion due to the non-stop pressure of the system. The ongoing staffing shortages mean that those who remain must work longer hours and handle heavier workloads, which makes it hard to maintain a healthy work-life balance.

Many experienced nurses are choosing to retire early or are leaving public hospitals to work for private agencies, which often pay better and offer more flexible schedules. This drain of skilled workers puts even more stress on the staff who stay behind, creating a harmful cycle of overworked professionals and reduced quality of care.

The well-being of the healthcare workforce is directly linked to the well-being of the patients they serve, and right now, the staff are struggling significantly.

Challenges in keeping and attracting rural healthcare workers

It is becoming incredibly difficult to recruit and keep doctors, nurses, and other health professionals in Canada’s rural and remote communities. Healthcare workers often prefer to practice in large cities where there are more resources, better access to specialized equipment, and greater opportunities for their family.

This leaves small towns and northern areas with a critical lack of service, forcing residents to travel long distances, sometimes in poor weather conditions, to get even basic medical care. In some small towns, the local ER might close down temporarily because no one is available to staff it, making a bad situation worse. New programs are needed to encourage more professionals to move to and stay in these underserved regions by offering better support and incentives.

Fragmented care between provinces and territories

The fact that healthcare is managed by each province and territory means the system is not a seamless one, which creates problems for patients moving across the country.

A person who moves from Alberta to Ontario, for example, might find it hard to transfer their health records or quickly find a new family doctor because of differing provincial systems. This lack of a unified national approach to licensing also sometimes makes it harder for doctors and nurses to work across provincial borders, even when one region desperately needs staff.

While the fundamental principle of universal access is national, the delivery of care is quite scattered, and this fragmentation prevents the system from being as efficient and coordinated as it could be for all Canadians.

The need for better mental health services integration

Access to proper mental health and addiction services is often disconnected from the rest of the physical healthcare system, making it hard for people to get the comprehensive help they need.

While the need for mental health support is greater than ever, getting timely appointments with psychologists, psychiatrists, or counselors through the public system can involve very long waits. Many people must pay for these services privately because the public coverage is limited, creating an unfair barrier for those with lower incomes.

True health means caring for both the mind and the body, and the current system needs to do a much better job of bringing these two aspects of care together seamlessly in local clinics and hospitals.

Delays in adopting new medical technology

Canada’s healthcare system can be slow to bring in and widely use modern digital tools and technology that could make care more efficient. While other countries are quickly moving to advanced electronic health records that easily share information, Canada still struggles with outdated systems where patient files are often paper-based or stuck in local hospital databases.

This slow adoption of technology means doctors waste valuable time searching for information, referrals get delayed, and there are sometimes medical errors because a professional doesn’t have a patient’s full history. Investing in and standardizing modern digital tools across all provinces would be a huge step toward improving efficiency and patient safety.

Increasing burden of an aging population

Canada’s population is getting older, which is placing an ever-growing demand on healthcare services and resources, particularly in areas like long-term care and home care. As people live longer, they tend to have more chronic, long-term conditions like diabetes, heart disease, or Alzheimer’s, which require frequent monitoring and complex care.

The number of hospital beds and specialized staff needed to support this aging population is not keeping up with the increase in demand. This pressure is felt in hospitals, which struggle to move elderly patients out of acute care beds and into appropriate long-term care homes or home-care programs, causing bottlenecks that ripple through the entire system.

Inadequate infrastructure and capital spending

Many hospitals and medical facilities across the country are operating with aging buildings and outdated equipment that need urgent modernization and repair. Delays in spending money on new infrastructure mean that some medical buildings are less efficient, harder to keep clean, and struggle to manage the flow of current patient volumes.

For example, some hospitals might have fewer isolation rooms than necessary, or their operating rooms are not equipped with the most up-to-date technology for complex surgeries. Governments need to make significant, long-term financial commitments to update this physical infrastructure to ensure that healthcare professionals can work in safe, modern environments and deliver care effectively.

Gaps in pharmacare and drug coverage

While most hospital and doctor services are publicly covered, the cost of prescription medications is often not fully included in the public system, leaving many Canadians to pay out-of-pocket.

This gap in drug coverage means that people without a private insurance plan, or those on fixed incomes, may struggle to afford the necessary medicine to treat their conditions. When people cannot afford their prescriptions, they often skip doses or do not fill them at all, which leads to their health getting worse and sometimes results in more expensive hospital visits down the road.

The truth about “free healthcare”: Canadian taxes vs. U.S. bills

Image credit: Hush Naidoo Jade Photography / Unsplash

The truth about “free healthcare”: Canadian taxes vs. U.S. bills

This article appeared first on Mastermind Quotes."

Canadian healthcare is no longer the envy of the world

Some lefties and liberals like to point a finger at those who question the Canadian system and make a false claim that we want the American system.  That is nothing but a big lefty lie. 

We should be looking at the various European systems such as Germany's.  They appear to be functioning much better.  They may be more of a combination of public and private in a way that guarantees everyone good service.  But Canada is in a difficult position to get out of because of our federal system with provinces having the basic jurisdiction over health care.  And there are so many different conflicting voices and no coherent way to find a path to change.  I am not sure Canada will be able to overcome the problems under the existing political system.  That is tragic for millions of Canadians who now suffer and die in the faulty system.  

I think it would take strong leadership from the top to lead Canada to a way to change.   I don't see that happening now.

Another thing is the person at the top of the health care system in a province is the Minister of Health.  That person is a politician and operates according to the politics of his or her party.  Yet the minister is the one who is under tremendous pressure to do certain things or solve various problems within the system.  This in itself is a problem.   The minister is always caught between a rock and a hard place.  As a result of this system, it is almost impossible to be proactive.  Most decisions seem to be a reaction to another crisis here or there across the province.  That means the system is seriously failing and the minister spends his/her time trying to put out fires here and there.

The problem with our health care system is that we have way too many simple minded people always running to see a doctor when they cut their finger or have an headache. Why do the doctors see a patient who has a small problem and wants that patient to come back and see him in a week. The patient may not need to go see the doctor but many fools will. The doctors make money every time they see a patient even if it means that the patient does not need not see the doctor again if all is well. 

And one of the biggest problems with our health care system is that we are taking in way too many new immigrants by the hundreds of thousands just about every year that will now and are using the health care system and not paying for their health care service or into our health care system.

I blame a lot of our health problems on our politicians with all of the unneeded and unwanted legal and illegal new immigrants coming to Canada by the hundreds of thousands every year. Our health care will not get any better if we keep dumping thousands of people from around the world who do get help from our health care system when needed. 

It is massive immigration that is killing everything in Canada today. It needs to end if we want to be able to try and get things back to normal. It is time for a moratorium on immigration. Just my opinion of course. 

 

[taxme]

18 minutes ago, John Stone said:

laughable to think Justin was aiming for 500K immigrants/year? OMG, what a fool. 

In the past ten years Turdeau has brought in around 3 to 4 million or more of new legal and illegal immigrants into Canada and who have nowhere to go and no housing or jobs waiting for them. This had nothing to try and help the rest of the 3rd world at all, but more to do with trying to flood Canada with cheap 3rd world labor and IMHO to try and make white people a minority in Canada. That is just my belief and opinion. 😇

[herbie]

Give it up with your Americanized vocabulary. It is Public Health care, if every country in the world uses it except the USA then let them continue to fool their citizens by portraying it as a socialist horror.

It isn't, can't be classified as such and sure as hell shouldn't be handed over to the free market. What's next that's socialist? Fire Dept? Police? Pensions? 

Not denying some fixes are needed, but giving in to the populist concept that smashing things = fixing things is beyond stupidity.
 

[bush_cheney2004]

"Public Health Care" is Canadian vocabulary for wait listing:

Quote

AI Overview

 

The phrase "access to wait list is not access to health care" is

a critique of Canada's publicly funded system, highlighting that a long wait time for a public healthcare appointment is not the same as having access to timely medical care.

 

It stems from a 2005 Supreme Court of Canada ruling, where Chief Justice Beverley McLachlin stated, "Access to a waiting list is not access to health care," pointing out that these waits can cause unnecessary suffering and contravene Charter rights. 

 

[Army Guy]

3 hours ago, herbie said:

Give it up with your Americanized vocabulary. It is Public Health care, if every country in the world uses it except the USA then let them continue to fool their citizens by portraying it as a socialist horror.

It isn't, can't be classified as such and sure as hell shouldn't be handed over to the free market. What's next that's socialist? Fire Dept? Police? Pensions? 

Not denying some fixes are needed, but giving in to the populist concept that smashing things = fixing things is beyond stupidity.
 

Considered that most of the country was built upon the free market, why would handing overt our health care system to the free market be a bad thing, it is not that the federal/ provincial  government has long a history of running things smoothly and efficiently, LOL....I think the majority on this board would agree the feds / provincial governments could not organize a gang bang at a .....house...most of our federal/ provincial departments are fully engulfed in flames, this year alone 6 people have died in NB waiting rooms...waiting for to be seen by a doctor, with patients in beds  lined up in the hallways, if that is your idea of good health care your wrong....  It is not some fixes, it is major fixes...

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Chief Justice Beverley McLachlin stated, "Access to a waiting list is not access to health care," pointing out that these waits can cause unnecessary suffering and contravene Charter rights. 

According to Herbie, the free market should never have anything to do with it.  It doesn't matter if the system is failing and millions can't get a doctor or proper care.  He is scared to death of trying something new like one of the models in Europe which have mixed systems.

It would be necessary to mix some private care with the public care in a way that fixes all the problems we presently have, but that is anathema to socialists like herbie.  The system will continue to get worse because ideologues put their ideology above everything else.  It is impossible to fix the present failed system without a major change is thinking.

So what is your solution is fixing a failing system herbie?   I know, you just don't care as long as it remains 100% socialist and under the control of unions.   What a disaster!

4 hours ago, herbie said:

sure as hell shouldn't be handed over to the free market.

[August1991]

8 hours ago, blackbird said:

Unless you are one of ones who have no serious medical problems yet and don't need a health care system YET, then you might say the system is fine.  That is not the case for millions of Canadians.

...

I disagree.

Our Canadian health system works.

[blackbird]

1 minute ago, August1991 said:

I disagree.

Our Canadian health system works.

Get real!  Millions of Canadians would strongly disagree with you.  Google and see all the serious problems with the health care system.  For starters millions of Canadians don't even have a family doctor and ERs are closing regularly in different towns.  Thousands die every year on long waiting lists.  Rural areas can't even get enough doctors.

[August1991]

1 minute ago, blackbird said:

Get real!  Millions of Canadians would strongly disagree with you.  Google and see all the serious problems with the health care system.  For starters millions of Canadians don't even have a family doctor and ERs are closing regularly in different towns.  Thousands die every year on long waiting lists.  Rural areas can't even get enough doctors.

For critical measures, it works.

Even for old-people measures, Canada's system works.

===

Health care is hard. It's existential.

[August1991]

Note to Americans: Our Canadian health system is provincial.

 

[blackbird]

38 minutes ago, August1991 said:

For critical measures, it works.

Even for old-people measures, Canada's system works.

I don't think you know what you're talking about.   I and my family have had personal negative experiences that seriously affected our lives, which I won't go into here.

 

 

[TreeBeard]

Longest copy/paste yet! 
Congratulations?  

Did anyone actually read @blackbird’s post?  Be honest  

 

[blackbird]

The long OP just shows there is a long list of problems with the public health care system.  

It is wise to know what is going on in this country with the health care system.  Hopefully someday enough people will demand something be done to fix it.

[herbie]

17 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Considered that most of the country was built upon the free market, why would handing overt our health care system to the free market be a bad thing

HTG that point is not even relevant. Seriously, if you can't figure out why privatizing health care is a bad thing, you're beyond discussing the issue with,

4 hours ago, blackbird said:

The long OP just shows there is a long list of problems with the public health care system.

HTG do you think there's anyone at all that doesn't know that? So offer ways to fix it rather than the one with more problems than all others.

[Army Guy]

3 minutes ago, herbie said:

HTG that point is not even relevant. Seriously, if you can't figure out why privatizing health care is a bad thing, you're beyond discussing the issue with,

HTG do you think there's anyone at all that doesn't know that? So offer ways to fix it rather than the one with more problems than all others.

It is relevant....when the feds and provincial government have cocked up the entire system by under funding it, like most governmental departments...IF they cant run it so it works , get out of the way....and let someone else run it...Private health care works as well , you get what you pay for....let our government run it ands you have people dying in the waiting rooms. Pay for private health care and you get in to see people the same day, and not have to wait for 18 plus hours...

[eyeball]

20 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

"Public Health Care" is Canadian vocabulary for wait listing:

Depends on what you're waiting for I guess, if it's your last dying breath...

Countries ranked by life expectancy (2025)Countries ranked by life expectancy (2025)

https://www.worldometers.info/demographics/life-expectancy/

We're 16 on the list... America is 48.

Health outcome report card

I note we're already on par with Germany, the country the OP seems to be suggesting we emulate. There's certainly room for improvement and Germany pioneered the business of public health insurance in 1883.

AI Overview

Germany's healthcare system is largely managed by powerful self-governing bodies of payers and providers, under the general legal framework set by the Federal Ministry of Health.

This powerful self-governance thing is definitely something I'd like to to explore for our system.

[bush_cheney2004]

2 minutes ago, eyeball said:

...I note we're already on par with Germany, the country the OP seems to be suggesting we emulate. There's certainly room for improvement and Germany pioneered the business of public health insurance in 1883.

 

 

Well, at least some Canadians are smart enough to stop making myopic health care comparisons to the United States.   Patriotically suffering on a wait list must be a Canadian value, and that's fine for those who want it.

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, herbie said:

HTG that point is not even relevant. Seriously, if you can't figure out why privatizing health care is a bad thing, you're beyond discussing the issue with,

HTG do you think there's anyone at all that doesn't know that? So offer ways to fix it rather than the one with more problems than all others.

I suggested ways such as looking at the systems in Europe and see how they're run.   Our system is a failure and we need to accept that fact and change it.  But that could only be done by the powers that be at the central command structure, that is, the federal government in conjunction with the provinces.

It takes leadership but we don't have it.  Show me any sign that the leadership is willing to change the system and I'll believe it.   Our system in Canada is actually made up of 12 systems in 10 provinces and two territories.  That will be hard to get them to change.  It would take strong leadership.

Edited November 1, 2025 by blackbird

[Legato]

Health care some good, some not so good

Last September was admitted to hospital with a ruptured appendix. From the arrival time to the diagnosis time was 13 hours. Waited approx. 8 hours to see a doctor who sent me for a C.T Scan to see what's up.

From arrival to "emergency" surgery was 15 hours.

In hospital for 12 days with severe infection. 2days in intensive care, the rest in a normal ward.

The good.....after care was excellent.

The bad..... diagnosis took far to long. I explained to about 5 different medical staff the classis symptoms of appendicitis, none fully listened.

[eyeball]

19 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Our system in Canada is actually made up of 12 systems in 10 provinces and two territories.  That will be hard to get them to change.  It would take strong leadership.

Not to mention decades... they'd have to amend our constitution. Hardly worth thinking about.

Oh well, if Alberta gets it's way we may have to start acting like a country anyway so...

Remember how everyone on the right would get all freaked out over the word reset? That seems downright quaint these days.

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, Legato said:

Health care some good, some not so good

Last September was admitted to hospital with a ruptured appendix. From the arrival time to the diagnosis time was 13 hours. Waited approx. 8 hours to see a doctor who sent me for a C.T Scan to see what's up.

From arrival to "emergency" surgery was 15 hours.

In hospital for 12 days with severe infection. 2days in intensive care, the rest in a normal ward.

The good.....after care was excellent.

The bad..... diagnosis took far to long. I explained to about 5 different medical staff the classis symptoms of appendicitis, none fully listened.

I went through a similar experience but not exactly the same.   I went to the ER with pain in my lower right side and the ER doctor sent me home and told me to come back the next morning, I think because the lab was closed during the night or weekend. (small town) When I went back the next morning the surgeon was there.  He did some test and told me I needed an appendectomy quickly and he booked me into the operating room within a few hours and I had it removed.  Fortunately I didn't get infection and it went smoothly.  He was a very good surgeon.   I told the other doctor some time later she shouldn't have sent me home.  Perhaps she should have called someone in to the lab or whatever it takes to diagnose my pain.  Could have been dangerous to send me home without treating it.

Edited November 1, 2025 by blackbird

[cannuck]

I have a fair bit of experience on the policy side, a bit on administrative and recently added some experience as a patient.  My overall take is that what we do isn't anywhere near what should be and can be done.  It is fixable, but needs to be a genuine national priority to get it done.

To start with: what we are mostly referring to is not "health care" but what we long ago coined the phrase "sick care" to describe and separate out the functions.  I say that because most of what we refer to does not kick in until you are sick or injured. There is another full set of functions comprised of those things that are preventative or prophylactic. From that most important point of reference, always use the old saw: "you get what you pay for" because that almost 100% determines what happens. From those two divisions add a third for things that are elective such as cosmetic surgery and sports medicine (the latter an extremely complicated matter as it has one foot in health care and one in sick care).  That is also a dividing line that needs to apply to pharmaceuticals - many of which are clearly elective vs. required (or actually effective).

I could write a book on this subject, so to avoid going down that road, let me just hit on the high points.

As has been pointed out, the mish-mash of provincial systems vs. lack of a functional national system is way up near top of the screw-up list.  But it gets into a Federal/Provincial jurisdiction battle that nobody is going to win with our partisan system.  Since we don't even know how to effectively deliver service we are a long way from being able to administer the process, never mind legislate and regulate effectively.  One of the first things we need to understand and come to consensus on is that both health care and sick care should be publicly funded, but NOT restricted to public delivery.  I will now go down the forbidden path and raise the US system up from its death bed.  A significant portion (I am guessing around 1/3) of the US population does enjoy publicly funded sick care - under medicare, medicaid, veterens and public employment benefits.  But: what takes the wealthiest country way down the list are the big 3 bad actors:  Insurance, legal and pharma.  Those 3 players dominate the US and spill over into our coupled economy and culture (but my thanks to the orange guy for helping define the border).  Until we remove them from the equation on our side of the border we are destined to go right down the same drain.   How do we fix this?  ALL THREE need to be 100% publicly funded.  Yeah, I know, that's pretty radical, but so are the problems.

We are coming very close on the insurance side, we just need this to be either federal or in some perfect world seamless provincial system.  No Canadian while in Canada should ever have to pay for health care or sick care outside of electives.  And that should include physical, mental, vision and dental.  Instead of giving hundreds of billions in grants and subsidies to big business - where the kickbacks can flow freely back to political and bureaucrat back pockets (don't kid yourself, that is absolutely how it works) put the money into the PEOPLE who have to pay the taxes, deliver the services, raise their families, etc. from which we all benefit.

Service delivery is a very different thing.  We have wait lists mostly because we have public monopolies on service delivery.  Private and public delivery can and should co-exist, but one should never have any exclusivity over the other. The legal business should never be able to profit from sick care or health care.  THAT, along with insurance and pharma is what makes sick care costly and health care near impossible in the current model in North America (much less so in Mexico).  Yes, the effing ambulance chasers should be reduced to their appropriate role as civil servants.  Big pharma needs no explanation.  They have literally invaded and taken over how all sick care is taught and delivered and often block how health care is blocked  or never even gets out of the gate.  Either get them under control and force the truth to be taught or take the whole mess under federal administration.  Yes, we already have a model that works (VIDO) as a nucleus to develop if and when needed.

Then there is the health care side.  Simple things that teach lifestyle essentials such as nutrition and exercise should be fully government funded - even things such as exercise classes and many physical sports activities.  Nutrition is IMHO by far the big one - as I discovered while having some medical adventures and sitting down with my best bud's wife (who teaches integrative medicine).  Big pharma and big food almost completely obliterate any scrap of factual information trickling down into our daily lives.  And that path runs right through our secondary and post secondary educational institutions.

[I am Groot]

On 10/31/2025 at 2:47 PM, John Stone said:

laughable to think Justin was aiming for 500K immigrants/year? OMG, what a fool. 

We're STILL aiming for 400k a year. And we've still got millions of foreigners in the country, many of whom shouldn't be here.

And among them are all those 'asylum' claimants. Nearly 200k last year. If we don't do something to address the lure that is drawing people from around the world to come here to claim asylum, the majority of our immigrants will soon be unskilled migrants we never chose and who, in many cases, we can't even identify. 

Edited November 3, 2025 by I am Groot