Boges Posted January 29 Report Share Posted January 29 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/medical-assistance-in-dying-mental-illness-delay-1.7098313 Quote The federal government has announced it is seeking another pause on medical assistance in dying (MAID) provisions that would cover those suffering solely from mental illnesses. This is the second time the government has sought to delay the expansion of MAID since the Superior Court of Quebec struck down the government's original 2016 MAID legislation because it was limited to those whose deaths were "reasonably foreseeable." Health Minister Mark Holland and Justice Minister Arif Virani made the announcement Monday outside the House of Commons. Holland said Canada's health system is still "not ready" for the MAID expansion. I honestly don't know how something like this can really be on the table. Do we really care about treating Mental Health if we allow people to off themselves? I've heard of people trying to apply to MAID because they can't afford a certain standard of living. IMHO MAID should only be maid available to spare someone suffering from a terminal disease. Otherwise, you can off yourself. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 29 Report Share Posted January 29 The best thing about the proposal to make MAID available for mental illness is that it's apparently caused more people to take it more seriously as a medical issue in need of better funding for treatment. As someone who has family members with depression and schizophrenia I'm grateful for this development. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeitgeist Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 How interesting. Maybe Canadian leaders are starting to think about whether MAID signifies a devaluing of human life and a failure of our healthcare system after all the bad international press on the dystopian sharp rise in medically-assisted suicide. I hope so, but I’m not convinced. This is a “pause”. The godless apparatchiks in Post-National State will likely have another go at expanding MAID soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 12 hours ago, eyeball said: The best thing about the proposal to make MAID available for mental illness is that it's apparently caused more people to take it more seriously as a medical issue in need of better funding for treatment. As someone who has family members with depression and schizophrenia I'm grateful for this development. That would be awesome if it were true. It has made "people" more aware of the need, but I haven't heard it yet coming from government. There are always some groups pushing for reforms of course. Mental health treatment needs to be provided to the same level as physical health care. Although Canada's health care is certainly not a good example of a system that works and truly benefits its tax-paying citizens. Rather, as the government would say, "Let them have Death." That is far more economical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 (edited) "Medical assistance in dying could reduce annual health care spending across Canada by between $34.7 million and $138.8 million, exceeding the $1.5–$14.8 million in direct costs associated with its implementation." Which works out to about $268 per procedure. Now that, is economical. And that's the true motivation. .... Final end-stage of unfettered liberalism - the Death Cult reveals itself. Edited January 30 by OftenWrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeitgeist Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 MAID is the opposite of healthcare. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 42 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said: MAID is the opposite of healthcare. Medicine has its limitations. Keeping a terminally ill patient in pain just because you can and against their will isn't health care either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeitgeist Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 (edited) 3 hours ago, Aristides said: Medicine has its limitations. Keeping a terminally ill patient in pain just because you can and against their will isn't health care either. No one is “keeping anyone in pain”. Pain can be alleviated. Medical treatment didn’t cause the pain. Stop playing word games to justify doctors helping to kill people. Lost healthcare in a lost country. Edited January 30 by Zeitgeist 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 (edited) 4 hours ago, Aristides said: Medicine has its limitations. Keeping a terminally ill patient in pain just because you can and against their will isn't health care either. So you think humans can play God? Isn't that what the Nazis thought they could do? The healthcare system doesn't "keep a terminally ill patient in pain". They provide medical and pharmaceutical care. You are making up false scenarios to try to boost your argument. Edited January 30 by blackbird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 2 minutes ago, blackbird said: So you think humans can play God? Isn't that what the Nazis thought they could do? Do you think humans should have control over their own lives or is that your job? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 1 minute ago, Aristides said: Do you think humans should have control over their own lives or is that your job? It's not my job to end other people's lives. Only God has the right to do that. What gives you right to end other people's lives? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 A man by the name of Law in Canada is possibly being charged for sending suicide drugs to people in the mail. What is the difference between this and medical assistance in dying? Seems much the same. His name is ironic since it by law that we have MAID now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 4 hours ago, Aristides said: Medicine has its limitations. Keeping a terminally ill patient in pain just because you can and against their will isn't health care either. The healthcare system doesn't "keep a terminally ill patient in pain". They provide end of life care including pharmaceutical care. You are making up false scenarios to try to boost your argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeBeard Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 19 minutes ago, blackbird said: So you think humans can play God? We do all the time. Do you take antibiotics, or is that thwarting God’s will? Shouldn’t you die a “natural death like God intended”? 16 minutes ago, blackbird said: What gives you right to end other people's lives? The individual decides when it’s their time. No one gets to decide for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 7 minutes ago, TreeBeard said: We do all the time. Do you take antibiotics, or is that thwarting God’s will? Shouldn’t you die a “natural death like God intended”? The individual decides when it’s their time. No one gets to decide for them. If you're mentally ill, are you competent to make that decision? We don't hold many criminals guilty of their crimes because their mental illness makes it hard for them to know right from wrong.... we're going to let these people decide? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 31 minutes ago, blackbird said: The healthcare system doesn't "keep a terminally ill patient in pain". They provide end of life care including pharmaceutical care. You are making up false scenarios to try to boost your argument. Yes terminally ill people who have to be kept drugged out their minds to control pain. That isn’t health care it’s a science experiment. How long can we keep this guy ticking until he croaks. No thanks, I’ll make my own decisions if it comes to that. 40 minutes ago, blackbird said: It's not my job to end other people's lives. Only God has the right to do that. What gives you right to end other people's lives? Does God also decide to keep them alive by medical interventions they don’t want? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 5 hours ago, Aristides said: Medicine has its limitations. Keeping a terminally ill patient in pain just because you can and against their will isn't health care either. This is about extending MAID to people who are in mental distress, mentally ill, not medicine and the terminally ill. Get the topic right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 28 minutes ago, Aristides said: Does God also decide to keep them alive by medical interventions they don’t want? You are playing word games constantly. Nobody is forced to receive palliative care against their will. They can choose to die naturally. That is not the same as murder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 (edited) 55 minutes ago, TreeBeard said: The individual decides when it’s their time. No one gets to decide for them When it's your son who's depressed or strung out on dope and decide they want to end it, you wouldn't sing the same song. The main concern is that we want to help those in emotional distress, or those who need financial assistance, not give them state-sanctioned suicide because it's the easy, inexpensive way out. There needs to be a threshold for making the decision. People who are depressed can change and find a meaningful life again. This isn't about terminal illness. But as usual you people, two of you in particular, don't get it. oh well 🤷♂️ Edited January 30 by OftenWrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeBeard Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 8 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: There needs to be a threshold for making the decision. I don’t disagree. They still need to have the mental capacity to make the decision. That’s probably why this is delayed. It will be tough to get it as good as possible. 12 minutes ago, blackbird said: They can choose to die naturally. Thats right! There’s a choice! Now you are catching on. Choice is good, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 5 minutes ago, TreeBeard said: I don’t disagree. They still need to have the mental capacity to make the decision. That’s probably why this is delayed. It will be tough to get it as good as possible. Thats right! There’s a choice! Now you are catching on. Choice is good, right? Die naturally is not MAID. If nature takes its course, that is not the same as choosing medically-assisted death, which is killing. You can just allow God to take you when your time comes. There is no right to choose to be killed. That is against God's will in the Bible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeBeard Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 6 minutes ago, blackbird said: Die naturally is not MAID. If nature takes its course, that is not the same as choosing medically-assisted death, which is killing. You can just allow God to take you when your time comes. There is no right to choose to be killed. That is against God's will in the Bible. Why do you take antibiotics to stave off natural death when that’s what God intended for you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admined Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 Quote The federal government has announced it is seeking another pause... I'd love to know what changed their minds. I mean, they've always known that extending MAID to the mentally ill would be both controversial and legally problematic. Is this an "I-can't-believe-the-latest-polls" thing? The least likely possibility is that they're having difficultly putting extra "safeguards" in place. I'm not convinced they were interested in safeguards from the start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 1 hour ago, OftenWrong said: This is about extending MAID to people who are in mental distress, mentally ill, not medicine and the terminally ill. Get the topic right. I was responding to a post that said MAID isn't health care. In some cases it can be. I agree that granting it to the mentally ill is problematic. I really don't know what to make of it. 54 minutes ago, blackbird said: Die naturally is not MAID. If nature takes its course, that is not the same as choosing medically-assisted death, which is killing. You can just allow God to take you when your time comes. There is no right to choose to be killed. That is against God's will in the Bible. So you are against life saving surgeries and all the other medical procedures that delay a natural death. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 16 minutes ago, admined said: I'd love to know what changed their minds. I mean, they've always known that extending MAID to the mentally ill would be both controversial and legally problematic. Is this an "I-can't-believe-the-latest-polls" thing? Perhaps a polls thing, but I'm guessing they've worded something in their proposed legislation that makes it legally challengable. Maybe the part that allows minors to elect to off themselves without parental permission or even awareness. That would be them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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