bush_cheney2004 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 27 minutes ago, Omni said: They didn't just allude to it, they acted on it, which is why you now have a number of people badly injured in hospital, and a young woman dead. Canada acted on its racist and imperialist symbols over 150 years ago....just ask the "aboriginals".....except for the thousands who were killed. How can such symbols still be tolerated in Canada, even as more young "indigenous" women are killed today ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 24 minutes ago, Omni said: Someone really needs to explain "moral equivalency" to these people, Yes..."moral equivalency" means that Canadians only have to apologize for their hate crimes after the fact. Such a deal !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Canada acted on its racist and imperialist symbols over 150 years ago....just ask the "aboriginals".....except for the thousands who were killed. How can such symbols still be tolerated in Canada, even as more young "indigenous" women are killed today ? In the same vein that you should avoid the illegal war topic, likewise mistreatment of Native people. Check your history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 4 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Yes..."moral equivalency" means that Canadians only have to apologize for their hate crimes after the fact. Such a deal !! We work hard on not committing them. Muricans' use their first amendment to carry right along with them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 1 minute ago, Omni said: We work hard on not committing them. Muricans' use their first amendment to carry right along with them. Yeah...Canada works really really hard at apologizing after the fact, only to commit more crimes in the name of The Crown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 8 minutes ago, Omni said: In the same vein that you should avoid the illegal war topic, likewise mistreatment of Native people. Check your history. Quite to the contrary, I readily admit and acknowledge such policies in the United States, with no need to tear down statues or plaques. History is messy that way, even in smug Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 39 minutes ago, Omni said: Someone really needs to explain "moral equivalency" to these people, and the fallacy of the way they try to apply it. But I suppose if the POTUS doesn't get it, how could we expect the rank and file to. What does moral equivalency have to do with anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 "Moral equivalency" means that alt-left hate is better than alt-right hate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capricorn Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 28 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: History is messy that way, even in smug Canada. Absolutely. To wit Louis Riel. Quote Louis Riel, Métis leader, founder of Manitoba, central figure in the Red River and North-West resistances (born 22 October 1844 in Saint-Boniface, Red River Settlement; died 16 November 1885 in Regina, SK). Riel led two popular Métis governments, was central in bringing Manitoba into Confederation, and was executed for high treason for his role in the 1885 resistance to Canadian encroachment on Métis lands. Riel was initially dismissed as a rebel by Canadian historians, although many now sympathize with Riel as a Métis leader who fought to protect his people from the Canadian government. http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/louis-riel/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 How the peaceful alt-right marches, an eye-witness account. On Friday night, hundreds of white supremacists and neo-fascists had a torchlight march across the University of Virginia’s campus, a place to which they had not been invited. They openly chanted fascist slogans like “blood and soil” and “Jews will not replace us”. When they reached a much smaller group of counter-protesters gathered around a statue of Thomas Jefferson, they surrounded them, hurled verbal abuse and then commenced beating them with lit torches and fists, and using pepper spray on them. Some protesters told me they had been sprayed with lighter fluid while naked flames burned all around them. Some of the people trapped around the statue responded with fists and pepper spray, but their actions, and their posture, was entirely defensive from the start. The “alt-right”, on the other hand, came prepared for violence, and they were spoiling for it. That night, it was not the left that “came charging, with clubs in their hands”. Quite the contrary. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubbleGumYum Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 On 8/13/2017 at 10:59 AM, Michael Hardner said: What did the anti fascists do to warrant Trump's criticism? The fascists drove a car into the crowd. They've been causing havoc for well over a year now. Attacking innocent people with baseball bats, pipes, knives, bear mace, etc., destroying property, shutting down free speech, setting fires. Just earlier today I saw a photo of a "protestor" attacking someone with a homemade blowtorch. They're very violent, immoral people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 I don't think violence is a good way to counter fascists, but I also reject the idea that there is moral equivalence here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 ^Again with the moral equivalence. Can someone explain why this is relevant, apart from how the press want to use it against Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 The "anti-fascists" have murdered police officers, destroyed property, and illegally protested on interstate highways...all on Obama's watch, not Trump's. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 6 minutes ago, Hal 9000 said: ^Again with the moral equivalence. Can someone explain why this is relevant, apart from how the press want to use it against Trump. Seems leftists have an urge to equate everything to everything else. Apparently it's that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 13 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: I don't think violence is a good way to counter fascists, but I also reject the idea that there is moral equivalence here. I agree. Sort of. Nazis who want to kill Jews or expel non-Whites are on a considerably lower plateau than those committing relatively minor acts of violence AGAINST Nazis. That being said, these people are committing those acts of violence because they fiercely believe that offensive speech should not be permitted, that, in fact, offensive speech is actually violence. I don't say this is on the same moral level because these people are idiots who don't understand where such beliefs would lead. But such beliefs ARE dangerous, particularly since their intolerance extends well beyond actual real Nazis. Witness the brainless idiot who was quoted in a cite I posted earlier saying claiming that professor in Toronto who won't use made up gender pronouns is a fascist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 10 minutes ago, Hal 9000 said: ^Again with the moral equivalence. Can someone explain why this is relevant, apart from how the press want to use it against Trump. The leader has an obligation to unify. Giving any comfort to these groups does the opposite, leaving aside the political damage to his party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: The leader has an obligation to unify. Giving any comfort to these groups does the opposite, leaving aside the political damage to his party. First off, Trump never spoke to the issue of "moral equivalency", second, he did call out the KKK and Nazi groups - albeit, he didn't rush to judgement as we've seen other presidents do, and thirdly, Trump has no chance to unify - none! Why, because the press simply wont allow it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 30 minutes ago, Hal 9000 said: Why, because the press simply wont allow it. All he had to do was read from a script they gave him. He thinks he knows better, you see, because he's not a politician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 4 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: All he had to do was read from a script they gave him. He thinks he knows better, you see, because he's not a politician. His first tweets were fine, and his first remarks were fine too - considering what was known or unknown at that time. The speech he read was fine, but the press were even more outraged and insisted he "looked like a prisoner" reading the statements. Look, if any other person (especially a democrat) said what Trump said, the press would've been fine with the comments, but they weren't good enough, they weren't fast enough, they looked forced...so on and so on. If Trump says " I cant stand those scumbag Nazis, they should all die", the press would still call him a racist, but then they'd add that he is so disgraceful that he even turns on his own base in order to cozy up to democratic voters. The press would likely call him a fascist for taking free speech away from the Nazi's. Trump cant win with the press and we all know it. Until we can openly admit that the Antifa and BLM crowd for some...however small accountability for the events at Charlottesville, this will only get worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Hal 9000 said: If Trump says " I cant stand those scumbag Nazis, they should all die", the press would still call him a racist, but then they'd add that he is so disgraceful that he even turns on his own base in order to cozy up to democratic voters. The press would likely call him a fascist for taking free speech away from the Nazi's. Trump cant win with the press and we all know it. The only press that might remotely react like that would be Fox News. Quote Until we can openly admit that the Antifa and BLM crowd for some...however small accountability for the events at Charlottesville, this will only get worse. Not compared to how worse things are getting for a now badly rattled and apparently very un-united right-wing. Not even close. Edited August 18, 2017 by eyeball 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, eyeball said: The only press he couldn't win over with that would be Fox News. Not compared to how worse things are getting for a now badly rattled and apparently very un-united right. Not even close. Politicians and business CEO's are terrified of Antifa, and every honest person knows it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 2 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said: "Moral equivalency" means that alt-left hate is better than alt-right hate. Nope, it means a phony attempt to equate the two. Trump tried and failed miserably. So have you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 8 minutes ago, Omni said: Nope, it means a phony attempt to equate the two. Trump tried and failed miserably. So have you. Did he? I didn't hear anything from him on moral equivalency, neither did you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 Just now, Hal 9000 said: Did he? I didn't hear anything from him on moral equivalency, neither did you! Yes you did, a number of times. Apparently you don't comprehend the concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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