America under President Trump

[Argus]

16 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

This was true long before Trump ever became president.   See "Obama".

Oh you won't get any argument from me that Obama's foreign policy sucked. But that's hardly an excuse for Trump, whose policy has been even worse.

[Argus]

15 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

You're the one who made the claim that Clinton was such a great guy, you're the one who needs to back it up.

What I said was he'd worked hard to help people, as opposed to Donald Trump, who doesn't care about people because he's a sociopath.

15 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/so-you-think-you-know-donald-trump/ Suck it down, Argus

Jesus God you're pathetic. A couple of examples of him making like the big man to pretty girls and you think that makes him a great guy? How many examples of his bullying, nastiness, cheating and crudity do you ignore?

15 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

You could take that whole list of accomplishments (which aren't charitable btw,

Oh, you want charitable!? Well, first of all you can't compare the charity of a guy who was middle class most of his life with a guy who's daddy gave him hundreds of millions of dollars. But even in terms of charity Trump has been a suck and blow liar. He often proclaims how generous he is but he's given virtually nothing to charity. His own charitable fund was shut down by the state after it mostly spent other people's money on things like buying a painting of Trump for his own golf club, or repairing a fountain outside his own building. Trump's charitable action is best described by an article some years ago about a big charitable fund raiser in Manhattan. Trump showed up at the party, marched up onto the stage to take his place with the big donors - even though he hadn't given a cent. When he was spoken to he promised a check would be sent. He spent an hour or two basking in the praise given to the people who actually HAD given money, then went home. No check was ever sent.

Trump is a braggart, a liar, and a general, all around dirtbag.

15 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Russian collusion is dead and buried Argus. Give it up. All that's left is tracking the dept of the FBI malfeasance.

Russia, according to US intelligence, is still working hard on behalf of Donald Trump. Because they think it's a great investment to have their major enemy ruled by a fat, ignorant old man suffering dementia.

But I know that won't matter to  you. You're a wide-eyed cult member who worships Trump and will ignore all his failings until your dying day.

 

[Argus]

15 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Oops, I forgot to destroy some more of your idiocy.

I don'[t think someone who drools every time he talks can speak credibly about destroying anyone's idiocy. Take some medicine and get your own under control first.

 

Edited February 21, 2020 by Argus

[bush_cheney2004]

30 minutes ago, Argus said:

Oh you won't get any argument from me that Obama's foreign policy sucked. But that's hardly an excuse for Trump, whose policy has been even worse.

 

Trump's foreign policy is consistent with his America First ideology, as advertised during the 2016 presidential campaign, be it China, Iran, Israel, European Union, NATO, Japan, Koreas, etc.   Trump's first approach was to unravel all things Obama.

Trade policy has been married to and leveraged by defence commitments for the deadbeats.   Failed policies of the past have been replaced with different approaches that may or may not succeed.    The wealthy EU should be able to defend itself without American occupation and excess.

Also, no new wars, unlike Bush #41, Clinton, Bush #43, and Obama.

Changes to the status quo will often look like chaos.

 

 

 

Edited February 21, 2020 by bush_cheney2004

[Argus]

3 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Trump's foreign policy is consistent with his America First ideology,

No it's not. The US has worked consistently for the last century or more to use its foreign policy to enrich itself through obtaining raw resources and to block competitors and enemies from expanding both economically and militarily. None of that was for any purpose other than "American first". Trump has largely abandoned all of that, giving the Chinese, in particular, free reign to grab and lock up resources and control of resource rich countries. US allies weren't there because the US was nice, but because it helped the US in its international efforts. Now Trump has largely abandoned those allies, letting the Chinese and Russians move in, in many cases, to pick them up. Trump's policy could be better described as America Alone.

By the time you get a president who isn't suffering from dementia and start looking around you're going to find America's influence and power in the world greatly diminished, with few ways of getting it back short of the outright use of American military forces.

 

[bush_cheney2004]

1 minute ago, Argus said:

No it's not. The US has worked consistently for the last century or more to use its foreign policy to enrich itself through obtaining raw resources and to block competitors and enemies from expanding both economically and militarily. None of that was for any purpose other than "American first". Trump has largely abandoned all of that, giving the Chinese, in particular, free reign to grab and lock up resources and control of resource rich countries.

 

No, the U.S. is now the #1 petroleum producer in the world, importing far less oil.   China is picking up America's scraps.

 

Quote

US allies weren't there because the US was nice, but because it helped the US in its international efforts. Now Trump has largely abandoned those allies, letting the Chinese and Russians move in, in many cases, to pick them up. Trump's policy could be better described as America Alone.

 

As designed....because deadbeat allies are worthless if they cannot carry their weight, or refuse to do so.    The world did nothing about Russia in Georgia or Ukraine, long before Trump.   So now Trump is suppose to be the guy to reverse the trend ?   

America is not the world police any more....get use to it.

 

Quote

By the time you get a president who isn't suffering from dementia and start looking around you're going to find America's influence and power in the world greatly diminished, with few ways of getting it back short of the outright use of American military forces.

 

That's fine by me...America is broke and can't afford to be world's protector of the "post WW2 order".

 

 

 

[Shady]

15 minutes ago, Argus said:

No it's not. The US has worked consistently for the last century or more to use its foreign policy to enrich itself through obtaining raw resources and to block competitors and enemies from expanding both economically and militarily.

Not necessarily true.  What raw resources did America receive from the Korean War?  Or the Vietnam War?  Or either war with Iraq?  Or it's regime change in Libya?

[Shady]

22 minutes ago, Argus said:

No it's not. The US has worked consistently for the last century or more to use its foreign policy to enrich itself through obtaining raw resources and to block competitors and enemies

Or it's actions in Kosovo?

[bush_cheney2004]

President Trump is on a roll:

 

Quote

Sixty-three percent of Americans now approve of the way Trump is handling the economy, up six points from the prior reading in November. It is the highest economic approval rating not only for Trump, but for any president since George W. Bush enjoyed stratospheric job approval ratings in the first few months after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/284156/trump-job-approval-personal-best.aspx

 

[WestCanMan]

40 minutes ago, Argus said:

What I said was he'd worked hard to help people, as opposed to Donald Trump, who doesn't care about people because he's a sociopath.

Jesus God you're pathetic. A couple of examples of him making like the big man to pretty girls and you think that makes him a great guy? How many examples of his bullying, nastiness, cheating and crudity do you ignore?

Oh, you want charitable!? Well, first of all you can't compare the charity of a guy who was middle class most of his life with a guy who's daddy gave him hundreds of millions of dollars. But even in terms of charity Trump has been a suck and blow liar. He often proclaims how generous he is but he's given virtually nothing to charity. His own charitable fund was shut down by the state after it mostly spent other people's money on things like buying a painting of Trump for his own golf club, or repairing a fountain outside his own building. Trump's charitable action is best described by an article some years ago about a big charitable fund raiser in Manhattan. Trump showed up at the party, marched up onto the stage to take his place with the big donors - even though he hadn't given a cent. When he was spoken to he promised a check would be sent. He spent an hour or two basking in the praise given to the people who actually HAD given money, then went home. No check was ever sent.

Trump is a braggart, a liar, and a general, all around dirtbag.

Russia, according to US intelligence, is still working hard on behalf of Donald Trump. Because they think it's a great investment to have their major enemy ruled by a fat, ignorant old man suffering dementia.

But I know that won't matter to  you. You're a wide-eyed cult member who worships Trump and will ignore all his failings until your dying day.

 

Clinton was an actual criminal, guilty of actual felonies while in office, and he was a serial scumbag who preyed on several of his female employees. Then he and his wife punched down at them from their public bully pulpit and got them harassed and threatened by members of the Democrat party.

Google Clinton Foundation Haiti if you want to know how much of a joke a chartitable foundation can be, or see who their awesome donors are, and how those sketchy losers suddenly stopped donating when the Clintons left the WH or when Hillary lost the 2016 election. 

Russia, according to US intelligence, sent out ads against both political parties to sow discord. You and the Dems went for it hook, line and sinker. If anyone is doing Putin's bidding it's the Dems, crooked FBI agents, and you. To put it in Lenin's terms, you're playing the part of the useful idiot.

The dementia comment is simply proof of astonishing ignorance. If you knew anything about dementia, you'd know that no one with dementia could talk to a large crowd for an hour plus and remain coherent. A better example of someone in the early stages of dementia is Joe Biden, who frequently says that he's in the wrong state, gives incoherent answers, or gets partway through a sentence and forgets what he was talking about.

I don't worship Trump. I just can't stand all the lying and hyperbole about him.

I don't think that Trump should have been able to win an election after his comment, that everyone in America saw, about how "Meghan Kelly had blood coming from her eyes and her... whatever". But he was up against Hillary, and if there's one thing I know, it's that Hillary Clinton is the last person on earth that I'd put in a position of power. I knew that the momet I saw her speech when Bill finally admitted his affair. She's a snake. I also know that Trump is a far better President than Obama was, and GWBush as well. I also know that Russia had no reason to favour Trump over a Dem, after the Russians just waltzed into Crimea and then attacked the Ukraine while OBAMA DID NOOOOOTHINNGGG. Just like he did in Benghazi. Nothing. No military aid, no dire warnings, didn't do a single damn thing to show that America had a spine. If Putin could have gotten Obama a 3rd term he would have put everything he had into it.

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, Argus said:

I don'[t think someone who drools every time he talks can speak credibly about destroying anyone's idiocy. Take some medicine and get your own under control first.

 

Sorry if you're butthurt, but you did say a lot of things which were hilariously wrong.

[BubberMiley]

3 hours ago, Shady said:

You haven't been a party to the conversation so far, so you're really not up to speed on the situation.  It's nice to see you back though.  Did you have a nervous breakdown after Trump wasn't impeached?

I haven't gone anywhere. I do try to avoid talking to desperate Trumpers who have lost their self-respect though. All they can do now is insult because they realize how pathetic they have become.

Now stick to the topic, not the posters.

[Argus]

2 hours ago, Shady said:

Not necessarily true.  What raw resources did America receive from the Korean War?  Or the Vietnam War?  Or either war with Iraq?  Or it's regime change in Libya?

Korea and Vietnam was about blocking its enemies. I'm not ultimately sure what provoked them to take their eye off the ball in Afghanistan and go for Iraq other than Iraq was a pain in the ass for a long while, as was Libya. They might have had ambitions of turning it into a democracy which would be grateful to them, and become a reliable client state - an Arab version of Israel, say, to inspire the rest of the Arab world, but they screwed it up, and now Iran has more influence there than the US.

[Argus]

2 hours ago, Shady said:

Or it's actions in Kosovo?

The US is, or at least was the world's largest land of multinational conglomerates. They all function best in an environment which is secure. US interests are served by having as much of the world as possible in the "pro America democracy" camp. With the fall of Yugoslavia, the US saw its interests as ensuring that part of the world became pro-American, rather than going back into the Russian orbit, and certainly did not welcome the downfall into the place becoming a failed state. Failed states are never good for business and produce terrorists and other problems.

I'm not saying the US hasn't ever shown any sign of wanting to help other countries. But it's overriding concern, like everyone else, is in defending its own interests.

[Shady]

55 minutes ago, BubberMiley said:

I haven't gone anywhere. I do try to avoid talking to desperate Trumpers who have lost their self-respect though. All they can do now is insult because they realize how pathetic they have become.

Now stick to the topic, not the posters.

We can agree to disagree.

[Argus]

2 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

President Trump is on a roll:

 

 

You know as well as I do that Donald Trump hasn't done a single thing to inspire or advance or improve the US economy. It's doubtful Trump could even understand a bar chart, much less an economic report. The only major economic initiative his administration has undertaken so far is the big tax cuts which have hugely increased the US deficit. And those tax cuts weren't his idea nor crafted by the administration. Congress put them together. Anything else you might mention in the way of cutting regulations was again done by either congress, or the administration overseen by Mike Pence.

While Trump was playing golf, or tweeting insults at actresses from his toilet.

 

[bush_cheney2004]

Just now, Argus said:

You know as well as I do that Donald Trump hasn't done a single thing to inspire or advance or improve the US economy. It's doubtful Trump could even understand a bar chart, much less an economic report. The only major economic initiative his administration has undertaken so far is the big tax cuts which have hugely increased the US deficit. And those tax cuts weren't his idea nor crafted by the administration. Congress put them together. Anything else you might mention in the way of cutting regulations was again done by either congress, or the administration overseen by Mike Pence.

 

The Trump administration tax policies have also repatriated $1 TRILLION in cash:

Quote

U.S. Companies' Repatriated Cash Hits $1 Trillion Under Tax Law

 

Spending causes deficits, not tax cuts, which were also implemented by Bush #43 and retained by Obama.

[Argus]

Just now, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

The Trump administration tax policies have also repatriated $1 TRILLION in cash:

Most of which went in stock buybacks. The wealthy thank him.

Just now, bush_cheney2004 said:

Spending causes deficits, not tax cuts, which were also implemented by Bush #43 and retained by Obama.

No. That's just not true. Spending and revenue are opposite sides of the same coin. Having more taxes can cut deficits just like cutting taxes can increase them. Of course, if you can cut spending enough that will balance the budget, but the Republicans have shown no sign of being able to do that. And despite their constant musing about huge cuts to medicare, medicaid and social security, they know damned well they'd be thrown out of office if they tried.

[bush_cheney2004]

20 minutes ago, Argus said:

 With the fall of Yugoslavia, the US saw its interests as ensuring that part of the world became pro-American, rather than going back into the Russian orbit, and certainly did not welcome the downfall into the place becoming a failed state. Failed states are never good for business and produce terrorists and other problems.

 

Many American business sectors are doing very well thank-you very much, better than in many other nations.   Wages are growing and manufacturing jobs have increased far more than under Obama.

Edited February 21, 2020 by bush_cheney2004

[bush_cheney2004]

3 minutes ago, Argus said:

Most of which went in stock buybacks. The wealthy thank him.

No. That's just not true. Spending and revenue are opposite sides of the same coin. Having more taxes can cut deficits just like cutting taxes can increase them. Of course, if you can cut spending enough that will balance the budget, but the Republicans have shown no sign of being able to do that. And despite their constant musing about huge cuts to medicare, medicaid and social security, they know damned well they'd be thrown out of office if they tried.

 

Absolutely true...spending directly causes deficits.   And the two previous presidents most certainly did implement and retain tax cuts....fact.

And you want America to continue deficit spending to protect the post WW2 order...because Canada and others sure as hell can't/won't do it.

Spend your own money....not ours.

[Argus]

10 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Many American business sectors are doing very well thank-you very much, better than in many other nations.   Wages are growing and manufacturing jobs have increased far more than under Obama.

That's nice. Can you point me to anything Donald Trump has done which makes him responsible for this?

[Argus]

8 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Absolutely true...spending directly causes deficits.   And the two previous presidents most certainly did implement and retain tax cuts....fact.

And you want America to continue deficit spending to protect the post WW2 order...because Canada and others sure as hell can't/won't do it.

Spend your own money....not ours.

There's no evidence the US is cutting spending on anything. It's rising deficits over the years have been almost entirely due to tax cuts. The budget was balanced during the Clinton Administration, and there was much talk about how long it would take to pay down the debt. Then came Republican tax cuts, one after another after another.

When you say America is broke, you can thank the Republicans for that.

[bush_cheney2004]

3 minutes ago, Argus said:

That's nice. Can you point me to anything Donald Trump has done which makes him responsible for this?

 

Sure...tax cuts...trade war...deregulation...leaving TPP...repatriation...etc.

[bush_cheney2004]

5 minutes ago, Argus said:

There's no evidence the US is cutting spending on anything. It's rising deficits over the years have been almost entirely due to tax cuts.

 

Wrong...the U.S. would still have deficits without tax cuts.   Budgets are not balanced.

Deficits are caused by SPENDING.

[DogOnPorch]

35 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Wrong...the U.S. would still have deficits without tax cuts.   Budgets are not balanced.

Deficits are caused by SPENDING.

 

Not to mention the US National Debt is more than just crazy ass government spending. Credit card debt to the latest attack submarines....it's EVERYTHING.

I assume you were paid well and got a good pension from the USN...and you spend that money at the local supermarket, theater, etc. Well...besides shore leave...heh. 'Round and 'round the money goes...