Did Democrats Sabotage Minerals Deal Just Before Oval Office Meeting?

[Barquentine]

3 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Of course I know. And Trump even touched on that in the meeting.

I'm just asking myata if he knows (I thought that seemed clear), but it's obvious that he doesn't. 

If that's true, I apologize.

[User]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

There aren't going to be any reparations anyways because it was never really a war of aggression: it has always been a proxy war, instigated by the US.

It has always been a war of aggression. You are just making excuses for Russia and pushing their lies and propaganda. 

[User]

1 hour ago, herbie said:

Democrats didn't do anything at all. Not even condemn the disgusting blackmail idea of the idea.

The Mango Mor0n managed to destroy it single handed by not controlling his obnoxious fat mouth. No help needed, not even JD Vance jumping in to ensure it failed.

To the point of this thread, Democrats did meet with Zelensky and one of them posted a photo and a message that would leave us to question just exactly what they were telling him. 

 

[Aristides]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

There aren't going to be any reparations anyways because it was never really a war of aggression: it has always been a proxy war, instigated by the US. The US orchestrated the Euromaidan protests, decided Ukraine's President and top prosecutor, backed Ukraine's attacks against their ethnic-Russian minority population, and kept pushing the Ukraine-in -NATO dagger at Russia's throat. 

And the UN General Assembly can never cram that BS down Russia's throat either because they have all the BRICS support, with no less than 2 vetoes among them. 

Russia invaded Ukraine. Regardless of how many times you repeat that bullshit, it was still Russia that invaded Ukraine. 

A little country of 38 million hasn't fought what was the second most powerful country in the world to a standstill for three years because the US made them. Jezus some people are thick.

Edited March 2, 2025 by Aristides

[gatomontes99]

What is it they say on the murder dramas? Did they have the means, motive and opportunity?

 

[WestCanMan]

12 minutes ago, Aristides said:

Russia invaded Ukraine. Regardless of how many times you repeat that bullshit, it was still Russia that invaded Ukraine. 

Again: would the US invade Canada if we were saying that we were going to sign a "defence" pact with Russia, China, Iran and NoKo? 

The answer is "OH HELL YEAH!" Never forget that.

Quote

A little country of 38 million hasn't fought what was the second most powerful country in the world to a standstill for three years because the US made them.

The US didn't make "them" do it. They got Zelensky to do it. 

Biden & Co dangled the carrot of "You get to end up being the bigshot who stood up to Russia and won the seemingly impossible fight, and you'll be rich", and Zelensky fell for it like a leftard cultist watching CNN.

Now the rug has just been pulled out from under him. Trump's not playing that game. 

Whether this was planned among the GOP and Dems - ie Trump along with Biden's handlers - is pure speculation. Maybe Trump just arrived on the scene and saw an opportunity to steal more than just Canada, Greenland, the Panama Canal, and Gaza. Either way, if Trump gets his way, at the end of the day...

The US gets:

1. a bunch of valuable minerals, like $500B worth
2. they got to see a bunch of Russians get killed
3. they got to raise the value of the weapons that they sell abroad
4. the Russians' weapons that compete with theirs lost value
5. no US soldiers died

Ukraine gets:

1. generational trauma
2. the loss of 30,000 sq km
3. the loss of Crimea, about 10,000 sq km more
4. the loss of $500B worth of minerals to the US
5. the loss of all the oil and minerals and agriculture and manufacturing in Eastern Ukraine
6. tens of thousands of dead men, women and children
7. hundreds of thousands of amputees, burn victims, blind and deaf

Russia gets:

1. tens of thousands of dead soldiers
2. they used up a lot of old munitions and tanks
3. they lost some modern weapons, munitions and vehicles
4. the weapons they sell abroad lost value
5. they get Crimea and all the oil resources it has access to
6. they get the smoking hole formerly known as the Donbas and all the natural resources there

Zelensky gets:

1. to look like a stooge
2. gobs of money that ordinary Ukrainians won't touch in twenty generations
3. a dose of Polonium at some point. 

Peons like us get to fight about who got what and why in political forums. None of us really know. None of us have the real answers (aside from when we just saw mom and dad fighting in the WH) so none of us are right. But we're still alive, and we still dislike the other side. 

[User]

1 minute ago, WestCanMan said:

The answer is "OH HELL YEAH!" Never forget that.

Um, no. That is not the answer at all. That is just pure silly speculation on your part... to again, justify Russia invading. 

2 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Biden & Co dangled the carrot of "You get to end up being the bigshot who stood up to Russia and won the seemingly impossible fight, and you'll be rich", and Zelensky fell for it like a leftard cultist watching CNN.

This is just you making stuff up. 

 

[suds]

2 hours ago, myata said:

Just look how the twisty boneless tongue twists it: he isn't blaming anybody: ostensibly but it's the guest who should apologize, not the host who invited him in his home then showed utmost and disgusting disrespect and absence of civility and courtesy.

I tried to make myself clear on why Zelenski should apologize. There's also an old saying about not shitting in someone else's house.

Edited March 2, 2025 by suds

[CdnFox]

6 hours ago, User said:

Nope... what? Your statement about Trump negotiating the minerals deal has nothing to do with what Democrats were doing in this meeting. 

This was a picture posted by Democrat Senator Murphy with the message from Democrat Senator Murphy. 

The taploid trash did not do anything more than post this Op/Ed sharing that information. 

Once again, you can't argue the facts, so you just play the dishonest game of attacking the source. 

I can't find a single corroborating news story or announcement anywhere. I'm starting to wonder if that really happened 

Have any of the other new Sources either left or right commented on this? If there was a meeting and an announcement that indicated that somehow the democrats had told zelensky to do anything you would think it would be picked up by mediasources on both sides  

[suds]

8 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

I can't find a single corroborating news story or announcement anywhere. I'm starting to wonder if that really happened 

Have any of the other new Sources either left or right commented on this? If there was a meeting and an announcement that indicated that somehow the democrats had told zelensky to do anything you would think it would be picked up by mediasources on both sides  

I doubt anyone knows for sure.  But Lindsay Graham claims he told Zalensky before the meeting at the Oval Office.... 'Don't fall for the bait'. Whatever that meant.

[User]

25 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

I can't find a single corroborating news story or announcement anywhere. I'm starting to wonder if that really happened 

Have any of the other new Sources either left or right commented on this? If there was a meeting and an announcement that indicated that somehow the democrats had told zelensky to do anything you would think it would be picked up by mediasources on both sides  

The picture and announcement to social media came from Senator Murphy who was there. 
 

Are you saying he is a lair and fabricated the photo? 
 

 

[eyeball]

7 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

And until they do, leftards can't acknowledge a shred of it.

Why would anyone acknowledge the credibility of anyone who subscribes to 9/11 conspiracy theories?

Yeah, that is like asking you when you stopped beating your wife but sometimes it really is what it really is.

[robosmith]

8 hours ago, suds said:

Things are beginning to make a bit more sense now. So this meeting in the Oval Office with the press and television crews present was a lead up to the signing of the 'minerals deal' which was to take place shortly after a question and answer period. That was supposed to be it as everything was agreed on beforehand. It was understood that any security commitments to Ukraine would be discussed later as they also involved Nato, and Europe (in particular U.K. and France). And In Lindsay Graham's own words it turned out to be a disaster. Maybe the meeting should have been cut a lot shorter. I can understand emotions running a little high on everyone's part, but there was nothing nefarious about it, what happened, happened. If I was Zelenski I'd apologize and arrange another meeting simply because Ukraine in my opinion has the most to lose. To be clear though, I'm not blaming either Zelenski or Trump for the disengagement.

Trump laid into Zelenskyy merely for the MORTAL SIN of criticizing Putin, something Trump cannot countenance.

Not because it's not true, but because Trump is kissing Putin's ass to get a deal for HIMSELF.

8 hours ago, herbie said:

Democrats didn't do anything at all. Not even condemn the disgusting blackmail idea of the idea.

The Mango Mor0n managed to destroy it single handed by not controlling his obnoxious fat mouth. No help needed, not even JD Vance jumping in to ensure it failed.

Trump got exactly what he wanted, which was to blow up the deal and make a big show of it for Putin.

[robosmith]

8 hours ago, suds said:

I agree that when J.D. jumped in everything started going downhill. On the other hand maybe everyone should have just stuck to the script. Or had the deal signing first and then the question and answer period afterwards.

The deal blew apart earlier when Trump laid into Zelenskyy for criticizing Putin.

[robosmith]

7 hours ago, West said:

 

Well we know that thugs are threatening journalists who are critical of the Ukraine..

You don't "know" anything by listening to LYING RepubliCON Congress members.

[BeaverFever]

11 hours ago, User said:

This doesn't look good. The American people deserve to know exactly what Democrats were telling Zelensky in this meeting. 

 

“Just finished a meeting with President Zelensky here in Washington. He confirmed that the Ukrainian people will not support a fake peace agreement where Putin gets everything he wants and there are no security arrangements for Ukraine,” Murphy’s office posted on X at 11:15 a.m. Friday.

He attached a picture of Zelensky at a conference table, with Murphy seated on the opposite side."

https://nypost.com/2025/03/01/opinion/dems-lead-zelensky-ukraine-off-a-cliff-with-pressure-to-reject-mineral-deal/?fbclid=IwY2xjawIxcHxleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHVWRB5sF93SCaVTDjV-j3Xsau9XIPsw7Wr8gS-g1z9A-CFs6M2T6_j4ejA_aem_6FQBadyyvpTD45qv1rGu1w

Except that Zelensky had already said many times publicly he couldn’t accept a deal with no security guarantees. Plus why would Z be taking orders from Democrats who aren’t in power over Trump who clearly is in power 

[suds]

8 minutes ago, robosmith said:

The deal blew apart earlier when Trump laid into Zelenskyy for criticizing Putin.

In my opinion the deal blew apart when the press started asking questions about security guarantees which really had nothing to do with the minerals deal they were there to sign.  If I were the Democrats and wanted to sabotage the deal, I'd approach someone from the press (friendly to the party) to ask questions that would get the two at each others throats.   When Lindsay Graham advised Zalenski 'don't take the bait', he was referring to not getting into an argument with Trump. And since Trump was dealing with both Putin and Zelenski it might be a bit useful if he was seen as a somewhat neutral actor.

[CdnFox]

5 hours ago, suds said:

I doubt anyone knows for sure.  But Lindsay Graham claims he told Zalensky before the meeting at the Oval Office.... 'Don't fall for the bait'. Whatever that meant.

  it would be inappropriate for anyone including republicans never mind democrats to discuss negotiations while the government is in the process of finalizing a deal on something like that.

But it doesn't sound like there were any significant conversations that likely would have changed anyone's mind. This went off the rails because two strong-willed people but it heads and trump somehow managed to lose control of the situation in his own white house which is thoroughly embarrassing. Of course it was egged on by trump's recent statements that zelensky is a dictator and so on and so forth as well which doesn't help these negotiations

At this point both of them should appoint someone to complete the negotiations, hammer things out and I get it signed quietly. Then once it's signed they can both get together shake hands and wave it around if they want.

[robosmith]

1 hour ago, suds said:

In my opinion the deal blew apart when the press started asking questions about security guarantees which really had nothing to do with the minerals deal they were there to sign.  If I were the Democrats and wanted to sabotage the deal, I'd approach someone from the press (friendly to the party) to ask questions that would get the two at each others throats.   When Lindsay Graham advised Zalenski 'don't take the bait', he was referring to not getting into an argument with Trump. And since Trump was dealing with both Putin and Zelenski it might be a bit useful if he was seen as a somewhat neutral actor.

Trump wasn't neutral. He LIED about Zelenskyy to please Putin.

[Scott75]

5 hours ago, robosmith said:

Trump wasn't neutral. He LIED about Zelenskyy to please Putin.

What do you believe he lied about?

[Nationalist]

38 minutes ago, Scott75 said:

What do you believe he lied about?

Like almost all those who profess to want war, they are nothing but keyboard warriors who would never go to battle themselves. 

'Ukraine must fight to the end! We must finance that!'

But do any of them ever say they'd go fight along side the Ukrainians? Not a one.

'But Churchill...Chamberlain!'

Yet...wasn't it the Russians who sacrificed millions in order to split the German forces?

'Putin will invade all of Europe!'

This is silly. The only reason Russia would invade past Ukraine, is if NATO attacked Russia first. But without this limp excuse, there's no good way to justify the continuance of the war.

'You're a PUTIN PUPPET!'

No. I'm a peace and prosperity puppet. Not a cowardly keyboard warrior and death-monger.

Edited March 3, 2025 by Nationalist

[Barquentine]

Curious to know just how much Russian oligarchs, maybe even Putin himself, have invested in Trump companies. Little Eric let the cat out of the bag a few years ago and Trump is looking more and more like he's beholden to Putin for something. MRGA!

[Nationalist]

20 minutes ago, Barquentine said:

Curious to know just how much Russian oligarchs, maybe even Putin himself, have invested in Trump companies. Little Eric let the cat out of the bag a few years ago and Trump is looking more and more like he's beholden to Putin for something. MRGA!

Curious to know just how much Brandon and NATO have invested in Comic-Boy? How many millions in his personal accounts? How many houses in Florida and other warm places? How many Parisian shopping sprees?

Comic-Boy is bought and paid for. In Europe they call him The Green Shirt. I call him a bought and paid for traitorous little sh1t.

[User]

9 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

Except that Zelensky had already said many times publicly he couldn’t accept a deal with no security guarantees. Plus why would Z be taking orders from Democrats who aren’t in power over Trump who clearly is in power 

Then what was he even doing here?

No one said he was "taking orders" from the Democrats. This is the game you play to avoid actually addressing the point here. 

[Scott75]

1 hour ago, Nationalist said:

Like almost all those who profess to want war, they are nothing but keyboard warriors who would never go to battle themselves. 

'Ukraine must fight to the end! We must finance that!'

But do any of them ever say they'd go fight along side the Ukrainians? Not a one.

'But Churchill...Chamberlain!'

Yet...wasn't it the Russians who sacrificed millions in order to split the German forces?

'Putin will invade all of Europe!'

This is silly. The only reason Russia would invade past Ukraine, is if NATO attacked Russia first. But without this limp excuse, there's no good way to justify the continuance of the war.

'You're a PUTIN PUPPET!'

I don't know if some here would or would not go into battle themselves, but it doesn't change the fact that it'd be a dumb idea even if they would. As I've pointed out, it was the west which has consistently provoked Russia for years in Ukraine, while Russia fruitlessly tried to find some diplomatic solution. People say that Putijn is bad and all that, and perhaps he is in some ways, but when it comes to Ukraine, he tried for 8 years to find a diplomatic solution and by the end of those years, I think he made it quite clear what made him finally go to war in Ukraine. In the speech he gave on February 24, 2022, the day he started his military operation in Ukraine, which even he has begun to call a war, he said this amoung other things:

**

This brings me to the situation in Donbass. We can see that the forces that staged the coup in Ukraine in 2014 have seized power, are keeping it with the help of ornamental election procedures and have abandoned the path of a peaceful conflict settlement. For eight years, for eight endless years we have been doing everything possible to settle the situation by peaceful political means. Everything was in vain.

As I said in my previous address, you cannot look without compassion at what is happening there. It became impossible to tolerate it. We had to stop that atrocity, that genocide of the millions of people who live there and who pinned their hopes on Russia, on all of us. It is their aspirations, the feelings and pain of these people that were the main motivating force behind our decision to recognise the independence of the Donbass people’s republics.

I would like to additionally emphasise the following. Focused on their own goals, the leading NATO countries are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine, those who will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia.

They will undoubtedly try to bring war to Crimea just as they have done in Donbass, to kill innocent people just as members of the punitive units of Ukrainian nationalists and Hitler’s accomplices did during the Great Patriotic War.

**

Source:

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/transcripts/statements/67843

Putin doesn't mention the fact that about a week before this speech, the Ukrainian military had once again begun a military assault on the Donbass region. I'm not sure why he didn't do this, but former Swiss Intelligence Officer Jacques Baud presents clear evidence that this was in fact happening in an article I believe you've seen before. For anyone else reading this who hasn't seen it, it's here: 

https://scheerpost.com/2022/04/09/former-nato-military-analyst-blows-the-whistle-on-wests-ukraine-invasion-narrative/

In summary, Putin tried diplomacy for years and realized that the west just pretended to play along in order to further build up Ukraine's military. Former German Chancellor Angela Merkel admitted as much soon after Russia's military operation began:

https://www.donbass-insider.com/2022/12/10/angela-merkel-admits-that-the-minsk-agreements-were-only-signed-to-give-ukraine-time/

I think in the days leading up to his military operation in Ukraine, he realized that diplomacy just wasn't enough, or at least not the kind that only involved words. Aggressive negotiations were necessary.

Edited March 3, 2025 by Scott75