Complicit in War Crimes

[WestCanMan]

50 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Another poser:

The Muslims ruled southern Europe for 800 years or so in the middle ages.

What was it about the religions that changed since then... since the assumption is that religion is the cause of prosperity?

I would submit that it's military capability, and technology that decides who wins.

Good topic though...

I would argue that the gradual shifting away from religious rule has caused prosperity.

Christian values allowed for that to happen. 

Most people in North America don't even know what apostasy means, because it's a Christianity-based society, so apostasy is not a big deal here (unless you're a muslim). muslims here still get killed for committing apostasy, but non-muslims don't get killed for "committing apostasy" anywhere. 

[I am Groot]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

I'm going to stop you right there. 

You were saying our ability to grow to what we are today. Had nothing to do with our, and by that I mean the West, military ability? 

There was a time when Europe was fragmented and vulnerable to attack by Muslims (who did so repeatedly). There are stories of how British fishermen were afraid to put to sea because of the rampaging slave ships from the Barbary Coast swarming all around the island and attacking boats and villages.

Then European statelets, principalities and kingdoms began to amalgamate into larger states with larger armies - and navies. These were standing armies of professionals, which was not what they had before. Add in that more and more Europeans were becoming literate, and that inquiring culture, and they began to adopt new ideas and techniques. They read about how armies fared elsewhere, about the ways they won and lost. They became more expert at how to make war.

Islam, where the printing press was banned, stayed ignorant. Moreover, their armies, even today, suck because the Islamic world is still of a tribal mentality. They don't function well as a singular body because of that, corruption, and incompetence (rulers appoint and promote loyalists as generals, not competent people)

[WestCanMan]

7 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

The comparison isn't really apt.

Not sure why down-arrow boy targeted your posts there. There was nothing controversial or questionable there...

[I am Groot]

Just now, WestCanMan said:

Not sure why down-arrow boy targeted your posts there. There was nothing controversial or questionable there...

He does that to everyone, and every time he does that to me I downarrow one of his. He's in the midst of a hissy fit over it for some reason. You can see him freaking out in the status section.

[WestCanMan]

6 minutes ago, Gaétan said:

The mounted police should expel cia agents who meddle in our affairs in Canada, as well as Israeli agents.

Expelling people who meddle in our affairs in Canada would include expelling muslims who preach quotes from the Hadiths about genocide against Jews.

Are you sure that you want to do that? 

We would also have to expel muslims who committed terrorist attacks against Canada, because - by definition - terrorist attacks are political in nature. 

Do you really want to start deporting terrorists after the Liberals worked so hard to get them all here?

[WestCanMan]

19 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I think it's selective thinking to leave out exactly how we got to our place in history as being upwardly mobile, and having our values dominate the world. Ie. Military technology, just as when the Muslims defeated Europe in the middle ages, or when Rome dominated the world.

But it's a thread drift anyway....

I never talked about "how our values dominate the world" because that's neither here nor there.

We are in control of how WE behave, just like you are in control of how YOU behave. That's it. And it's our culture that is responsible for that. Our civilization grew to be tolerant and protective of women and children because of our Cristian heritage. 

Admit it, Michael. Learn it: "Our civilization remains tolerant to this day because of our Christian heritage."

Sure, we have been able to defend our culture to this point, from the outside, because our way of life dwarfs theirs in terms of maximizing human potential -> thereby increasing our military capabilities by leaps and bounds over cavemen, but it's not yet certain if our culture can survive islam's level evil from within. 

islam has a superpower, MH, and it's not to be taken lightly: islam is the best tool ever invented for controlling the most evil people in society. That's what mohammed did, and that's what powerful muslims still do today... They use the 10% of the most evil people in society to cow everyone else. It works in Iran, it works in Afghanistan, it works in Yemen, it works in Qatar, it works in most places. FYI no one loved the Taliban. The civilians just feared them, for very good reason. The Taliban will torture and kill women and children to get their way, and they will never apologize for that because they consider it their religious right/duty. 

We lock our most evil people up, MH, we don't use them as weapons to control our civilian population.  

People who prey on the weak here are punished, they don't get slaves and 2nd, 3rd and 4th wives.

We don't train our soldiers to torture and kill women and children. I was in the military myself and never got that kind of training: we train to fight against other men. Rather, to fight against professional soldiers, and not laymen. 

The whole "religion of peace" thing is absolute bullshit, Michael. Saying that is like using the "shoot for the stars, reach the moon" tactic. It challenges the naysayer to knock islam down from the top rank instead of acknowledges islam's true starting point, which is  right beside Naziism, and that's not an exaggeration at all. If you knew the history of islam you would know that it runs a parallel course to Naziism.

islam IS the religion of intolerance, genocide, misogyny, bigotry, etc. 

Just look at Pakistan: they've committed two genocides IN THE MILLIONS since WWII and they've always been widely respected and loved by the rest of the islamic world. Right on the very day they committed their first genocide they were establishing full diplomatic relations with every country in the ME. And FYI their creation was "the real Nabka". What happened in Palestine was a mini-nabka. More like a mini-mini-mini-mini-nabka by comparison. 

[Army Guy]

On 2/12/2026 at 11:31 AM, John Johnston said:

1948: During the Nakba, 75% of the Palestinian population were forced to leave their homes to make way for the state of Israel. Over 530 Palestinian villages were ethnically cleansed and more than 70 massacres were carried out. 1956: The UN condemned Israel for at tacking Syria in ‘flagrant violation’ of the agreed ceasefire.

1962: The UN said ‘the Israel attack [on Syria] of 16-17 March 1962 constitutes a flagrant violation’ (of UN Resolution 111) and Israel must ‘refrain from such action in the future’.

1966: Israel was again condemned by the UN for attacking its neighbours. In Resolution 228 the UN ‘censured’ Israel for Resolution 228 the UN ‘censured’ Israel for its military action ‘in violation of the United Nations charter’.

1982: During the Israeli attack on Lebanon, Israeli-supported militias of the Lebanese Forces entered the refugee camps of Sabra and Shatila and massacred up to 3,500 individuals, mostly Palestinians. Ariel Sharon individuals, mostly Palestinians. Ariel Sharon was found indirectly responsible for the war crime of genocide. Sharon was later elected Prime Minister from 2001 until 2006.

1996: Israel’s occupation of southern Lebanon continued with ongoing ill-treatment and murder of Lebanese civilians under occupation. In 1996 over 100 civilians under occupation. In 1996 over 100 men, women and children were deliberately killed by Israel when taking shelter at a UN compound in Qana. Israel’s occupation of southern Lebanon continued until 2000.

2006: Israel dropped white phosphorous on civilians in Gaza. The international community has condemned Israel’s use of community has condemned Israel’s use of white phosphorous as a war crime.

For starters. 

Thanks for the response, but do you have a source so we can put your remarks into context, i find there is always two sides to every coin....and these events did not happen in a vacuum.....You don't find the UN as a biased source of information...violations of UN resolutions are not war crimes...One can not be held indirectly responsible for war crimes, you are or your not guilty...The use of white phosphorus is not a war crime, unless it was deliberately used on civilians, for that to happen someone would have to admit it was intentional and not a accident....White phosphorous can be used as smoke to cover troop movement or to burn infra structure, getting it close enough to the objective can be tricky... 

 

[Gaétan]

13 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Expelling people who meddle in our affairs in Canada would include expelling muslims who preach quotes from the Hadiths about genocide against Jews.

Are you sure that you want to do that? 

We would also have to expel muslims who committed terrorist attacks against Canada, because - by definition - terrorist attacks are political in nature. 

Do you really want to start deporting terrorists after the Liberals worked so hard to get them all here?

I am talking about people like you who are paid to deny a genocide, not those who give a free opinion. People paid by foreign agencies, such as the cia, with the aim of subversion and lies should be sent back to their country, or if they are Canadian citizens, accused of treason. There are Canadian laws that allow prosecution or measures to be taken against individuals accused of subversion, false propaganda, or collaboration with foreign powers.

Edited February 18 by Gaétan

[Michael Hardner]

14 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I never talked about "how our values dominate the world" because that's neither here nor there.

We are in control of how WE behave, just like you are in control of how YOU behave. That's it. And it's our culture that is responsible for that. Our civilization grew to be tolerant and protective of women and children because of our Cristian heritage. 

Admit it, Michael. Learn it: "Our civilization remains tolerant to this day because of our Christian heritage."

Sure, we have been able to defend our culture to this point, from the outside, because our way of life dwarfs theirs in terms of maximizing human potential -> thereby increasing our military capabilities by leaps and bounds over cavemen, but it's not yet certain if our culture can survive islam's level evil from within. 

islam has a superpower, MH, and it's not to be taken lightly: islam is the best tool ever invented for controlling the most evil people in society. That's what mohammed did, and that's what powerful muslims still do today... They use the 10% of the most evil people in society to cow everyone else. It works in Iran, it works in Afghanistan, it works in Yemen, it works in Qatar, it works in most places. FYI no one loved the Taliban. The civilians just feared them, for very good reason. The Taliban will torture and kill women and children to get their way, and they will never apologize for that because they consider it their religious right/duty. 

We lock our most evil people up, MH, we don't use them as weapons to control our civilian population.  

People who prey on the weak here are punished, they don't get slaves and 2nd, 3rd and 4th wives.

We don't train our soldiers to torture and kill women and children. I was in the military myself and never got that kind of training: we train to fight against other men. Rather, to fight against professional soldiers, and not laymen. 

The whole "religion of peace" thing is absolute bullshit, Michael. Saying that is like using the "shoot for the stars, reach the moon" tactic. It challenges the naysayer to knock islam down from the top rank instead of acknowledges islam's true starting point, which is  right beside Naziism, and that's not an exaggeration at all. If you knew the history of islam you would know that it runs a parallel course to Naziism.

islam IS the religion of intolerance, genocide, misogyny, bigotry, etc. 

Just look at Pakistan: they've committed two genocides IN THE MILLIONS since WWII and they've always been widely respected and loved by the rest of the islamic world. Right on the very day they committed their first genocide they were establishing full diplomatic relations with every country in the ME. And FYI their creation was "the real Nabka". What happened in Palestine was a mini-nabka. More like a mini-mini-mini-mini-nabka by comparison. 

I never talked about "how our values dominate the world" because that's neither here nor there.

Ok, then, will you admit that everyone believes their values are superior to those of others then ?  If we're on the same page with that one then, yes, I believe "our" values are superior, and furthermore that my personal values are superior to others who are like me.  That's supposed to be how it works.  You see how others behave, you modify your behaviour to differentiate yourself and you go forward.

But if you believe the Western way is superior then one thing that differentiates it is the ability to sift through subjective perspectives and arrive at a clearer reality.  Another poster pointed out that the West has been a harbinger of science and that's another way of looking at it, arriving at the same conclusion.

As such, we can - apart from our own personal feelings and convictions - look at other cultures and see some advantages they have.  You have done so here.

I don't feel that these boards are best used to beat the drum about how great we are, because that doesn't communicate ideas as much as personal feelings.  Remember that facts don't care about those.

So I will occasionally point out the Chauvinism of cutting down other cultures occasionally but mostly quietly disagree, and more and more I just avoid such discussions.  There are just too many contradictions, and the conversations go nowhere.

Edited February 18 by Michael Hardner

[WestCanMan]

5 hours ago, Gaétan said:

I am talking about people like you who are paid to deny a genocide, not those who give a free opinion.

Deny a genocide?

Buddy, that's your superpower.

Palestine, less than 500 people shot by soldiers in 1948. 

Pakistan, more than 500,000 people hung, burned to death, chopped to death, and shot in 1947.

Which one was a genocide you worthless piece of shit? 

Edited February 18 by WestCanMan

[WestCanMan]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

I never talked about "how our values dominate the world" because that's neither here nor there.

Ok, then, will you admit that everyone believes their values are superior to those of others then ?  If we're on the same page with that one then, yes, I believe "our" values are superior, and furthermore that my personal values are superior to others who are like me.  That's supposed to be how it works.  You see how others behave, you modify your behaviour to differentiate yourself and you go forward.

If we believe that protecting women and children is virtuous then our culture is better than islam by light years. 

People who lie and gaslight to deceive Canadians about the evil nature of islam do not protect women and children, and therefor lack virtue. 

[Michael Hardner]

6 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

If we believe that protecting women and children is virtuous then our culture is better than islam by light years. 

People who lie and gaslight to deceive Canadians about the evil nature of islam do not protect women and children, and therefor lack virtue. 

These are the seeds for a much deeper discussion, one that we won't be having.

Here's an example of what we won't be discussing: You do realize that any fundamentalist religion regards the West as having a degraded view of women ?  Including Christian ?  People on these very boards, conservatives, decry the decline of our social sphere into hedonism and decadence.  

I'm sure your first reaction will be to come back to defend the West, but I'm not defending Islam nor criticizing the West.   I think that the conversation is just not worth having in this forum.

I feel that a blanket and binary moral assessment of an entire culture, philosophy, and approach to living that comprises billions of people over many centuries won't lead anywhere, much less to a conclusion.  So, for us at least, it is not worthwhile and wouldn't be enjoyable. 

Of course, I encourage all people to be proud of their own way of life, but don't try to use that pride as a building block to exploring everything else... is my advice.

 

 

[WestCanMan]

2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

These are the seeds for a much deeper discussion, one that we won't be having.

That's because it's fact-based, and damaging to false narratives that you hold dear.

Quote

You do realize that any fundamentalist religion regards the West as having a degraded view of women ?  Including Christian ?  People on these very boards, conservatives, decry the decline of our social sphere into hedonism and decadence.  

I personally decry the decline of our culture into decadence, but I don't beat women up or send them to jail when I don't like their clothes.

Not only that, our culture still protects them, instead of beating them up or putting them in jail.

Quote

I'm sure your first reaction will be to come back to defend the West,

No need. I'm not offended.

Quote

but I'm not defending Islam

You're failing to acknowledge the truth: you said that "there were seeds for a deeper discussion which we wouldn't be having" because you know that defence of islam as a decent culture is impossible. They're shit people, deep down where it really counts. 

Quote

I think that the conversation is just not worth having in this forum.

Again, you refuse to acknowledge things that go against the false narratives of leftist leaders.

Quote

I feel that a blanket and binary moral assessment of an entire culture, philosophy, and approach to living that comprises billions of people over many centuries won't lead anywhere, much less to a conclusion.  So, for us at least, it is not worthwhile and wouldn't be enjoyable. 

Pakistan killed almost a million people in 1947, by burning, hanging, clubbing, and chopping, and the whole muslim world accepted them with open arms later that day. 

Less than 500 muslims were killed a year later in Palestine, and instead of forgiving those 500 deaths that same day, like they did for Pakistan (twice now) they still want a genocide against 10M people in retaliation, 80 years later. 

Oh, and their prophet was also a pedophile who committed genocide. 

They're not good people, Mike. Not at all. You know that, but you're just too scared to say it. 

Quote

Of course, I encourage all people to be proud of their own way of life, but don't try to use that pride as a building block to exploring everything else... is my advice.

Of course you're on a soapbox when you should be apologizing or at least shutting your lying, weasel mouth, you f'ing degenerate wimp. 

[Michael Hardner]

29 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

1. That's because it's fact-based, and damaging to false narratives that you hold dear.

2. I don't beat women up or send them to jail when I don't like their clothes.

3.  They're not good people, Mike. Not at all. You know that, but you're just too scared to say it. 

Of course you're on a soapbox when you should be apologizing or at least shutting your lying, weasel mouth, you f'ing degenerate wimp. 

1. No - it's opinions.  The word "good" doesn't exist as a fact.  You bristle because I don't want to join in your carnival of logical mistakes.

2. That's not what I heard.

3. Sigh.  What did I say you'd do ?  Exactly what you did: Come in and defend the West and in addition you need to get all huffy with me,  and start throwing insults...   
 

It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it  - quote attributed to Aristotle

So... go read my last post again as to why I won't be trying to educate you on this from a foundation of reason and analysis.  You just want to fight about how great you are and puff up your ego.

As a result, you're in timeout ... again.  Try to enjoy your day despite this post. 

Edited February 18 by Michael Hardner

[WestCanMan]

Just now, Michael Hardner said:

1. No - it's opinions.  The word "good" doesn't exist as a fact.  You bristle because I don't want to join in your carnival of logical mistakes.

You can't discuss the facts, Mike. You're running away.

If it's possible to make a judgment call on Nazis, then it's possible to make the exact same call on muslims. 

Is it ok for me to say that MH thinks that Nazis are ok? 

Quote

2. That's not what I heard.

Then man up and tell me what you heard.

Quote

3. Sigh.  What did I say you'd do ?  Come in and defend the West and in addition you need to get all huffy with me,  and start throwing insults...

And I didn't defend the West, I said I was ok with your assessment.

I also never insulted you, just made objective observations. 

Quote

Read my last post again as to why I won't be trying to educate you on this from a foundation of reason.  

Running from a fact-based conversation isn't "educating".

[Gaétan]

 

The Radio‑Canada journalists should tell the Iranians that they’re targeting the aircraft carriers’ toilets, because the media told us there were waste‑related problems, but that they’re carrying out surgical strikes so that there are no casualties

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, Gaétan said:

 

The Radio‑Canada journalists should tell the Iranians that they’re targeting the aircraft carriers’ toilets, because the media told us there were waste‑related problems, but that they’re carrying out surgical strikes so that there are no casualties

????????

You really need to talk to your programmer about upgrading to the next version. You're glitching

[Gaétan]

Since the war against the Iranian people is intensifying, Radio‑Canada’s propaganda against them is intensifying as well. As the genocide begins, the public broadcaster will have more and more trouble finding Iranians with family in the country to film while celebrating. The broadcaster seems far more concerned about the price of oil — what kind of world are we living in? What are the babies supposed to eat? It doesn’t seem to bother them, since the broadcaster supports abortion. I complain about them often, but they get special treatment just like the prime ministe

[ExFlyer]

On 2/17/2026 at 5:47 PM, WestCanMan said:

Not sure why down-arrow boy targeted your posts there. There was nothing controversial or questionable there...

I Disagreed...

Again...it seems getting down arrows is traumatic for you LOL 

Instead of discussing...all your and  some others all contain insults...hence you get the little down arrows.

Sucks to be you LOL

Edited March 4 by ExFlyer

[ExFlyer]

On 2/17/2026 at 5:48 PM, I am Groot said:

He does that to everyone, and every time he does that to me I downarrow one of his. He's in the midst of a hissy fit over it for some reason. You can see him freaking out in the status section.

Disagree so...you get a down arrow.

Insult anyone and you get a down arrow.

I like the fact it upsets your sensibility LOL

You get what you deserve

Edited March 4 by ExFlyer

[Gaétan]

The NATO alliance, Canada, and Western media must learn the moral lesson of having contributed to the Palestinian genocide. And if they are to take any action in the Iranian conflict, it should be to prevent the genocide of that people. The United States is currently led by a president  psychopathic pyromaniac out of control, someone who should be receiving proper supervision in a medical setting

Edited March 10 by Gaétan

[Gaétan]

The fact that the American president is not the subject of an international arrest warrant is proof that the international court is corrupt and complicit in his crimes

[paxamericana]

2 hours ago, Gaétan said:

international arrest warrant is proof that the international court is

A toothless institution backed by American security guarantees? Sounds familiar doesn’t it?

Edited March 15 by paxamericana

[John Stone]

21 minutes ago, paxamericana said:

A toothless institution backed by American security guarantees? Sounds familiar doesn’t it?

The International Criminal Court has stood up on its back legs occasionally (lol)...........

to wit - On 17 March 2023, following an investigation of war crimes, crimes against humanity and genocide the ICC issued arrest warrants for Vladimir Putin - alleging responsibility for the war crime of unlawful deportation and transfer of children during the Russo-Ukraine war. 

[John Stone]

On 3/10/2026 at 7:31 AM, Gaétan said:

The NATO alliance, Canada, and Western media must learn the moral lesson of having contributed to the Palestinian genocide. And if they are to take any action in the Iranian conflict, it should be to prevent the genocide of that people. The United States is currently led by a president  psychopathic pyromaniac out of control, someone who should be receiving proper supervision in a medical setting

Canada recognizes the State of Palestine and offers our partnership in building the promise of a peaceful future for both the State of Palestine and the State of Israel. Canada does so as part of a co-ordinated international effort to preserve the possibility of a two-state solution / Gov of Canada. 

 

On Oct 7, 2023, Hamas  (Gov of Gaza) launched the deadliest attack in Israeli history, murdering nearly 1200 people and taking over 250 hostages (dead and  alive) marking a major escalation in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.