America Divided - I'm right, you're wrong

[Rebound]

2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Three examples from history.  That's how you make a point.

Watch for a response with some diminutive insult...

How many examples do we need?
Democracy is only about 250 years old.  There are probably more examples of failed democracy than successful democracy. France, 1789, failed. Chile failed. Mexico failed. The Philippines. I can go on and on.  If the Jan 6 insurrection resulted in Trump remaining President, then American democracy would have failed.  

Edited September 4, 2023 by Rebound

[robosmith]

9 hours ago, August1991 said:

Mob? MAGA cult?

I suggest that you look at how Rutherford Hayes became president.

=====

I suggest you make your point HERE IF you have one.

9 hours ago, August1991 said:

Some 70 million Americans voted for Donald Trump in November 2020. Trump wants to be a candidate in 2024.

No one is above the law. How many votes he got is irrelevant.

His own AG Barr says you're wrong about ex-POTUS getting ANY special treatment.

9 hours ago, August1991 said:

I am Canadian - a foreigner. We foreigners can all see that what Biden and the Democrats are doing is wrong. This is not the America I know.

You don't know America. The only reason that Nixon wasn't charged was the Ford pardon.

9 hours ago, August1991 said:

In Canada, a sitting federal PM could not have an Attorney-General put a leader of the Official Opposition in jail. Our House has a sword of distance.

A PM is NOT a President. Obviously. Do you have any idea how many European political leaders have been indicted?

And Biden did not tell Jack Smith whom to charge. The evidence guided Smith.

Anyone who incites violence to overturn an election belongs in jail. That is what Hitler did BEFORE he was elected the 2nd time.

[Michael Hardner]

33 minutes ago, Rebound said:

How many examples do we need?
Democracy is only about 250 years old.  There are probably more examples of failed democracy than successful democracy. France, 1789, failed. Chile failed. Mexico failed. The Philippines. I can go on and on.  If the Jan 6 insurrection resulted in Trump remaining President, then American democracy would have failed.  

Relevance, like oxygen...

[Rebound]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

Relevance, like oxygen...

WTF?  
I said that democracies are fragile. I proved that by giving many examples of failed democracies… and you say that’s irrelevant? Only irrelevant to someone who thinks irrationally.  

[reason10]

On 9/2/2023 at 12:52 AM, August1991 said:

This past summer, a foreigner, I travelled by train (Amtrak) from Chicago to Portland, Oregon. I stopped in Montana

I talked with many Americans.

You Americans are divided. Some of you openly hate Trump. Others shyly like the guy.

What else is new? Americans loved Kennedy, hated Nixon. Others loved Nixon, hated Kennedy. Oh, and Kennedy was shot by a communist.

Americans loved Carter, hated Reagan. MOST Americans loved Reagan and hated Carter.

That's the way it is in a free society, or at least the way it was before America turned into a Nazi shithole, where the opposing party LOCKS UP candidates from the opposing side.

[CdnFox]

13 hours ago, robosmith said:

Hitler was able to destroy democracy in Germany in less than a year after his 2nd election. That is very fragile.

It's not very fragile at all - sorry, but he did so with the willing support of the people.  And  you're suggesting that somehow all 'democracy' everywhere is exactly the same.  Democracy in Mondern day US is precisely the  same as ww2 germany.

Democracy is solid.  As long as the people want it.

[CdnFox]

8 hours ago, NYLefty said:

Making things up to divert from "Actual" facts and historical data makes you look,.. well in good ole NYinese "A Putz" ?

But nice try

Awww - couldn't actually refute it so you just went for the insults eh?  

Well i don't know if that makes you look like a 'putz', but you certainly look like a desperate uneducated loser - was that what you were going fro

It's been long noted that the nazi's were a form of market socialists, very close to what we consider democratic socialists today to be. They liked having a market economy but VERY strictly controlled by the gov't for the purpose of focusing it on what they percieved as the nation's best interests, and they controlled the population similarly to put forward what they considered to be a 'progressive' agenda with all the good moral things.  Today it's eat the rich and such - then it was lebenstraum. But - same model.

WHat did you THINK they were?

[Michael Hardner]

2 hours ago, Rebound said:

WTF?  
I said that democracies are fragile. I proved that by giving many examples of failed democracies… and you say that’s irrelevant? Only irrelevant to someone who thinks irrationally.  

Actually I said your post provided RELEVANCE, like needed oxygen.

The opposite of what you think.

[Rebound]

18 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Actually I said your post provided RELEVANCE, like needed oxygen.

The opposite of what you think.

Oops. My bad.

[Rebound]

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

It's not very fragile at all - sorry, but he did so with the willing support of the people.  And  you're suggesting that somehow all 'democracy' everywhere is exactly the same.  Democracy in Mondern day US is precisely the  same as ww2 germany.

Democracy is solid.  As long as the people want it.

Wrong. He was ELECTED with the support of the people but clearly he was not elected to become a fascist dictator who would kill six million Jews and launch a brutal war that would leave fifty million dead and all of Europe in tatters. 
 

Trump has made it crystal clear that if he gets in the White House again he will do all he can, legally and illegally, to stay in power and to use his power any way he wishes.  

[CdnFox]

14 minutes ago, Rebound said:

Wrong. He was ELECTED with the support of the people but clearly he was not elected to become a fascist dictator who would kill six million Jews and launch a brutal war that would leave fifty million dead and all of Europe in tatters.

Sorry - i'm right.  He took totalitarian powers with the support of the people.  Regardless of his agenda the people supported his suspending elections. Sorry kiddo.

Democracy was very new to Germany - and between the communists (who wanted to get rid of it) and the nazi's (who also said they wanted to get rid of it)  more than 50 percent of the people were against democracy. They did not see it as having produced good results. They wanted to go back to an imperial model.

So it wasn't democracy that was fragile - the people fully supported the idea of suspending it and going back to an imperial system as it had always been. He wasn't  a 'facist', he was an imperialist and a market socialist and believed in a common set of ethics for everyone and that the industry should be controlled to further the interests of society, which he believed lay in conquest.  And a LOT of people agreed with that. 

so yeah - they did vote for him to be an imperial leader and advance the countries interests. Sorry bout that.

Read your history before piping up.

[Rebound]

6 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Sorry - i'm right.  He took totalitarian powers with the support of the people.  Regardless of his agenda the people supported his suspending elections. Sorry kiddo.

Democracy was very new to Germany - and between the communists (who wanted to get rid of it) and the nazi's (who also said they wanted to get rid of it)  more than 50 percent of the people were against democracy. They did not see it as having produced good results. They wanted to go back to an imperial model.

So it wasn't democracy that was fragile - the people fully supported the idea of suspending it and going back to an imperial system as it had always been. He wasn't  a 'facist', he was an imperialist and a market socialist and believed in a common set of ethics for everyone and that the industry should be controlled to further the interests of society, which he believed lay in conquest.  And a LOT of people agreed with that. 

so yeah - they did vote for him to be an imperial leader and advance the countries interests. Sorry bout that.

Read your history before piping up.

The Nazis didn’t even get a majority. 

[robosmith]

10 hours ago, CdnFox said:

It's not very fragile at all - sorry, but he did so with the willing support of the people.  And  you're suggesting that somehow all 'democracy' everywhere is exactly the same.  Democracy in Mondern day US is precisely the  same as ww2 germany.

Democracy is solid.  As long as the people want it.

It wasn't "the people" who dismantled democracy in Germany, it was Hitler and the Nazis. Duh

Anyone with power who disagreed was murdered, including all those who opposed Hitler's rule.

[Deluge]

On 9/1/2023 at 10:52 PM, August1991 said:

This past summer, a foreigner, I travelled by train (Amtrak) from Chicago to Portland, Oregon. I stopped in Montana

I talked with many Americans.

You Americans are divided. Some of you openly hate Trump. Others shyly like the guy.

You haven't met very many Americans. 

[CdnFox]

10 hours ago, robosmith said:

It wasn't "the people" who dismantled democracy in Germany, it was Hitler and the Nazis. Duh

 

Of course it was.  And you're drooling again.

 The people were used to an imperial structure, and democracy had not worked out well for them in many people's minds.

Hitler could never have set it aside without the blessing of the people. 

[reason10]

16 hours ago, Rebound said:

The Nazis didn’t even get a majority. 

Not in Germany or in US in 2020. But a NAZI president is in the White House.

Seig heil, Fraulien.

14 hours ago, robosmith said:

It wasn't "the people" who dismantled democracy in Germany, it was Hitler and the Nazis. Duh

Anyone with power who disagreed was murdered, including all those who opposed Hitler's rule.

Kinda like what Unelected JOe and his DemoNazis want to do today.

[Rebound]

1 hour ago, reason10 said:

Not in Germany or in US in 2020. But a NAZI president is in the White House.

Seig heil, Fraulien.

Kinda like what Unelected JOe and his DemoNazis want to do today.

Find a good psychiatrist before it’s too late. 

[robosmith]

12 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Of course it was.  And you're drooling again.

 The people were used to an imperial structure, and democracy had not worked out well for them in many people's minds.

Hitler could never have set it aside without the blessing of the people. 

Sure he could and DID. All he had to do is kill any number of those who stood up to him and all the rest lost their nerve to oppose him.

You really have NO UNDERSTANDING about history nor how fascists consolidate their power. LMAO

8 hours ago, reason10 said:

Not in Germany or in US in 2020. But a NAZI president is in the White House.

Seig heil, Fraulien.

Kinda like what Unelected JOe and his DemoNazis want to do today.

You're delusional. Democrats are NOT fascists and never killed anyone to maintain their democratically elected positions in government.

[CdnFox]

10 hours ago, robosmith said:

Sure he could and DID.
 

Nope - he did not.  The people approved of it or it would never have happened.  Sorry.

 

Quote

You're delusional. Democrats are NOT fascists and never killed anyone to maintain their democratically elected positions in government.

Actually democrats have often behaved very much like the facists and nazis.  That's where we get the KKK, etc.  Nowadays they actively promote the use of actual violence as well as 'cancelling' where they ruin a person's life and career to suppress any position but their own.'

 

Lets look at the general definition:

A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, a capitalist economy subject to stringent governmental controls, violent suppression of the opposition, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.

 

So - not real;y a dicator per se - but certainly a handful of extreme leaders.  AND - centralization of authority? ABSOLUTELY. economy subject to stringent gov't control and taxes? Yup.  Violent supression of opposition? Oh hell yeah. belligerant nationalism and raceism?  They actually have an anti-nationalsm that is their version of nationalism (destroy all history) and racism is HUGE for the left.  White men are all evil.  black people are all repressed, Chinese are too successful and must be held back, etc.  Everything about them is race and gender - they're like super-bigots.

 So yeah - one could argue they are facistt. 

[August1991]

On 9/4/2023 at 12:01 PM, Rebound said:

How many examples do we need?
Democracy is only about 250 years old.  There are probably more examples of failed democracy than successful democracy. France, 1789, failed. Chile failed. Mexico failed. The Philippines. I can go on and on.  If the Jan 6 insurrection resulted in Trump remaining President, then American democracy would have failed.  

I disagree.

You compare your Civil War of 1861-64 with the events of 6 Jan 2021? You are wrong.

[August1991]

On 9/4/2023 at 12:18 PM, robosmith said:

'''

No one is above the law. How many votes he got is irrelevant.

...

I agree that no one is above the law. Votes irrelevant? I disagree. In a democracy, votes matter

Trump got many, many votes in 2020.  Everyone in the world can see this.

What the Democrats are doing now is Third World- in Canada, we don't do this.

 

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, August1991 said:

I agree that no one is above the law. Votes irrelevant? I disagree. In a democracy, votes matter

Trump got many, many votes in 2020.  Everyone in the world can see this.

What the Democrats are doing now is Third World- in Canada, we don't do this.

 

 

Oh rubbish, Trump is a third world wannabe.  He's just too crap to pull it off.

What the justice system is doing is just not letting him get away with it.  Trying anyway.

Laugh out loud at this:

5 minutes ago, August1991 said:

I agree that no one is above the law.

 

6 minutes ago, August1991 said:

What the Democrats are doing now is Third World

 

[Hodad]

1 hour ago, August1991 said:

I agree that no one is above the law. Votes irrelevant? I disagree. In a democracy, votes matter

Trump got many, many votes in 2020.  Everyone in the world can see this.

What the Democrats are doing now is Third World- in Canada, we don't do this.

 

 

In your view, how many votes does one require to achieve immunity from the law? How many to get a free pass on an attempted coup?

[August1991]

1 minute ago, Hodad said:

In your view, how many votes does one require to achieve immunity from the law? How many to get a free pass on an attempted coup?

God knows.

But as a foreigner - a Canadian, what the Democrats are doing now against Trump and the Proud Boys, it is Third World. The Democrats are using the power of the State against political opponents.

In Canada, we don't do this.

=====

During the FLQ crisis, even Trudeau Snr negotiated a deal with Cuba and its Expo 67 pavillion.

 

[CdnFox]

4 minutes ago, August1991 said:

In Canada, we don't do this

 

Umm - well..... **Cough(emergencyactvsbouncycastle)Cough**

 But generally no