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13 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Ironically, it is YOU who is calling for destruction ^HERE.

You're completely high, of course, as calling for the destruction of destructive agendas and policies is the best thinking that is available. ;)

Leftism is a cancer. 

Edited by Deluge
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51 minutes ago, myata said:

There are many facets of this problem, but all seem to be somehow related to binary mentality. You either have to love the thing, absolutely adore it and unconditionally or hate it. Mass marketing maybe, culture and media all bought into and propagating this unnatural super- and over emotionality. Job and money above all, the second aspect; nothing else seems to be more important; even if its for the love and family, still has to be job job job and stuff stuff stuff, somehow. And the politics of course. Binary politics don't help the problem one single bit. It just makes no sense in the modern world. Problems are complex, multifaceted and with many causes and just to approach understanding them one would need input from many sides. Somehow we cannot seem to get it.

Ever heard of the KISS method of doing things?

Its true because when you over complicate things...things tend to go sideways.

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29 minutes ago, robosmith said:

You mean the best "thinking" YOU HAVE. LMAO

Ya know robo-bot...today I've been extolling the virtues of cooperation and compromise. But with you, neither exist. Thus IMO...you are disqualified from any sensible discussion.

Have a warm and fuzzy weekend.

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1 minute ago, Nationalist said:

Ya know robo-bot...today I've been extolling the virtues of cooperation and compromise. But with you, neither exist. Thus IMO...you are disqualified from any sensible discussion.

Have a warm and fuzzy weekend.

You know Gnat-man, you're barking up the wrong tree while giving a pass to the guy calling for DESTRUCTION of the left.

Typical tribalism on YOUR PART. AKA, not making any sense.

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1 minute ago, robosmith said:

You know Gnat-man, you're barking up the wrong tree while giving a pass to the guy calling for DESTRUCTION of the left.

Typical tribalism on YOUR PART. AKA, not making any sense.

You mean this?

Quote

calling for the destruction of destructive agendas and policies is the best thinking that is available.

I agree with this. Destructive agendas are worth destroying.

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13 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

You mean this?

I agree with this. Destructive agendas are worth destroying.

No, I mean THIS:

2 hours ago, Deluge said:

Without even a discussion.

Leftism is about destruction, and ONLY destruction - it needs to go away. 

 

 

16 minutes ago, robosmith said:

You know Gnat-man, you're barking up the wrong tree while giving a pass to the guy calling for DESTRUCTION of the left.

Typical tribalism on YOUR PART. AKA, not making any sense.

Of course, "Leftism" is NOT about destruction, and ONLY destruction. AKA you are aiding and abetting a LIE.

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16 minutes ago, Deluge said:

Of course it is. Pick something about leftism that you believe in and we'll go over it. ;) 

OK, SNAP. Supplemental nutrition is NOT in any way "destruction." It is all about saving HEALTH and LIVES.

Quote

CalFresh is also known as the federal Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP). CalFresh is a program for low-income families and individuals that meet certain income guidelines. CalFresh benefits help supplement your food budget and allow families and individuals to buy nutritious food. 

If you OPPOSE it, you're supporting destruction of the lives of the downtrodden, including KIDS.

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44 minutes ago, Deluge said:

Vermin calling normal people "gnat-man" is part of the destructive thinking I've been telling you rodents about. 

You have nowhere to go but back to the sewers. ;)

Of course you invoke YOUR TRIBALISM to attack me while giving a pass to Gnat-man's use of "robo-bot."

Trolling is routine on HIS and YOUR PART. What goes around, comes around.

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6 hours ago, Nationalist said:

You don't know the Communist Manifesto and the parallels to current Liberal positions?

Sure ya do...

The Manifesto is not 'liberal'.  It doesn't reflect Consumer Culture but a Europe that was in shock from the industrial revolution.  I'm not sure where you got that piece but it seems to just be an attempt to make centre-leftish parties appear to be close to Communism.  It's a non-starter for me, sorry.  Every bit as rabble-rousing and emotional as the original tract. 

Edited to add: People are already trying to say that the problem is with the 'other' side or that certain parties should be banned etc.  Maybe that's a valid opinion, I don't know, but it's not helpful to the discussion here bc there's nothing to add.

While those opinions aren't exactly nonsense, I don't see the point in adding to those branches of the discussion here.

Edited by Michael Hardner
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4 hours ago, Deluge said:

No tribalism over here. Just good ol' fashioned American thinking. 

Shouting brainlessly for whatever next lie comes out of the Lying Clown's mouth without bothering to remember or understand? Some thinking, there. American, in the best traditions? Hope not.

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Nomination of Trump, if it happens, would really be a defining moment for the Republican party. It would signify a final and irrevocable loss of responsibility before the society, and rationality itself. Collective insanity can and did happen, and happens routinely in human groups. Sane and conscious individuals cannot stay there: it never worked and from the history we know very well that whatever the role, the price will be the loss of personal integrity at the absolute minimum. Participation in collective insanity can never be explained or justified. You can and should step aside, it is the only sane, responsible and conscientious choice.

Edited by myata
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2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Republicans who vote for Trump.

Nominating presidential candidate is a responsibility to the society. Citizens place trust in the parties to nominate candidates of personal integrity and responsibility. A failure of this magnitude would be catastrophic for the party and a grave danger for the democracy, not in the least due to peculiarities of the binary system.

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4 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:


Edited to add: People are already trying to say that the problem is with the 'other' side or that certain parties should be banned etc.  Maybe that's a valid opinion, I don't know, but it's not helpful to the discussion here bc there's nothing to add.

 

I know you're trying to be somewhat diplomatic here for the sake of productive conversation, but there's something happening in this thread that is worth observing. 

Rather early on I laid blame for the size of the divide and the rancor at the feet of the Republicans. I do think one side (the other) has lost its way, lost its foundation, fallen into extremism triggered by a 'cult of personality' moment, prone to purity tests and absolutism. Their only platform today seems to be spite. I also said that the Republicans would have to make hard choices and corrective action to appeal to moderates and independents and avoid an unrecoverable downward spiral. I said all of this because I believe it to be objectively true. I'm not a rabid partisan. I'm a registered independent, but I do have eyes to see, ears to hear--and something useful between the ears.

Now, what's noteworthy is that I don't think "the other side" even necessarily disagrees. Some of them set out to prove me right, as they do every day on this forum. Leftism is a cancer. Leftism is all about destruction. Democrats (or Demonrats ?) hate America. Democrats intend to destroy America. Democrats are the pedophiles, groomers, and Nazis. Democrats are communists. Democrats are the worst people to ever walk the Earth, and so on.  -- Mitch McConnel is a RINO. Mike Pence should be hanged as a traitor. FOX news has gone woke, switch to OAN.

^^This is not how one goes about refuting accusations of extremism, cultishness and unreasonable demands for purity and subservience to an individual. 

I say again, this is not a "both sides" issue. They need to do the work fix their shit to be of any value to America.

 

One final thought. What's the biggest point of disagreement between the two parties right now? The thing sucking up ALL the political energy? The battle line that cannot be crossed? ---- Oh yeah, it's that one of the parties has decided that in a representative democracy the votes are now irrelevant, and that it's perfectly legal for the Vice President of the party in power to simply choose that the party should stay in power. Many of them want to execute the Vice President who disagreed with that proposition. And they are unbelievably angry that the rest of us who think that proposition is both crazy and illegal and want to hold legally accountable those who attempted to perpetrate such a scheme. That's how far it's gone, to the point where they will fight tooth and nail to argue that the President doesn't need to be elected.

^^This also is not how one goes about refuting accusations of extremism, cultishness and unreasonable demands for purity and subservience to an individual. 

I'm not wrong, folks. This is not a "both sides" issue. Something has fundamentally broken on the Republican side of the aisle. We could go into lots of theories about how it broke, but it's definitely broken. And a good chunk of the party--the "normal" Republicans-- know that it's broken, but have no idea how to fix it. And worse, they have perverse motivation not to fix it, as they need to cater to those broken voters to be competitive in elections. They need to cut their losses. Like a bad marriage, that relationship is never going to get better. It's best to pull the band aid off, move on and start rebuilding your life.

Then we can get back to civil antagonism and disagreements about policy. 

 

Edited by Hodad
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2 hours ago, -TSS- said:

US-politics is mostly about competing who loves Israel the most. No difference between the two parties on that issue.

Thanks for letting everybody here know that you’re a Jew-hating bigot. 
 

Cause we all watch the political debates and we see the campaign ads, and the candidates rarely mention Israel at all, but you anti-Semites see nothing but your hatred.  

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