Ontario needs to invest in EVs as a realistic Option.

[Boges]

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

I can only speak for myself. My time is valuable to me. I will shell out the 70$ to ship something overnight if time sensitive, vs the cheaper option at 15$. 

Then don't go on Roadtrips. Fly! 

[Perspektiv]

32 minutes ago, Boges said:

Then don't go on Roadtrips. Fly! 

I always do. I do hope you appreciate the irony in suggesting a far more polluting option. 

My issue with the EV, is should I need to drive around, it makes the trip unenjoyable.

To me, cars should be built with high practicality. Mileage, consumption should be the most important factor.

Failure of which, is you building something solely to virtue signal in.

I get EVs to drive for my line of work all the time. 

I had gotten so many thumbs up of approval, even though they didn't realize how much I often would despise the lack of mileage I was getting. 

The annoyance of having to wait 20 minutes for enough of a charge to continue with with what am doing. How impractical that it is, for someone on the go.

The technology is almost there. Until then, at best, I feel hybrids are the go to for me, in my opinion.

[OftenWrong]

2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

This person is a giant waste of time, in a way that no other poster is.  They write elaborate posts flattering themselves and how they deal with the world then a few posts later they write a complete contradiction.  I went a long way down the rabbit hole trying to point this out - reasonably - to this person. 

A complete waste of time.

I was asking them to NOT use the term 'groomer', which is at best ambiguous.  "I respect people" yadda yadda ... narcissistic posts about how pragmatic they are, respectful, etc.... and then...

He announces out of nowhere he's blocking me.

Total dud.

I'm surprised at this because I have the opposite view. Not that I've read everything he said but certainly in this thread his views and contributions are informative.

Ok, maybe not as good as mine, but,   if no rules are being broken, no one is being personally offensive, then it's a matter of preference. Perhaps you just find his views dull and boring. But I've probably said similar things about you, once.

I seem to recall once saying you were a poster who "writes posts the way white bread tastes".

Now the irony is, you're one of the few that I bother to read and respond to. This is what we've come down to. 

I feel his selfish comments, whether sincere or not are representative of the attitude of many many people in this country and cannot be discounted.

The idea that we have to make these new EV's more reliable, affordable and appealing is a smart one, and the time is getting short. We have to be concerned about the cost, performance and that government intervention needs to be checked as they're sure to screw things up. As per usual.

This is a major change being proposed that affects many industries and the economy.

My argument is not against EV's in principle, but that we might end up screwing ourselves and further creating division in our society between the haves and have-nots.

That's why Boges likes them so much...

[OftenWrong]

4 hours ago, Boges said:

So you're going to drive 400 kms and not want to take a pee break or get food?

Are you suggesting we need to have government- mandated pee breaks?

[CdnFox]

6 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Are you suggesting we need to have government- mandated pee breaks?

I think he's suggesting you're a pregnant female.  Congrats by the way!

[Boges]

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

The technology is almost there. Until then, at best, I feel hybrids are the go to for me, in my opinion.

Again, I don't need to convince you. No one should be forced to get an EV at this stage, and no one is. 

But 300+ kms a charge on a tech that's only been around in any usable nature for what 5 years? That's pretty good IYAM. It'll get way better in the next 5. 

9 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Are you suggesting we need to have government- mandated pee breaks?

No, but if we're using Roadtrips as the main obstacle to EV adoption, it's pretty silly to say I won't accept all these benefits, because I may have to take an extra pee break on my annual road trip. 

Edited May 19, 2023 by Boges

[Michael Hardner]

58 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

 

1. I feel his selfish comments, whether sincere or not are representative of the attitude of many many people in this country and cannot be discounted.

2. The idea that we have to make these new EV's more reliable, affordable and appealing is a smart one, and the time is getting short. We have to be concerned about the cost, performance and that government intervention needs to be checked as they're sure to screw things up. As per usual. This is a major change being proposed that affects many industries and the economy.

3. My argument is not against EV's in principle, but that we might end up screwing ourselves and further creating division in our society between the haves and have-nots.

 

1. Maybe but I only deal with such people if I see they're redeemable.  That said, HE put me on Ignore.  Again - because I asked him to stop calling people 'groomers'.  Do you think it's normal to imply someone is a pedophile if you don't know them ?
2. Conservatives would trust the market.  Should trust it.  Is the market 'real' ?  No market is but given the constraints I think they can come up with something.
3. I think we can look at that but I have no strong opinions on EVs.  My passion is the health of the public sphere.

[OftenWrong]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

Do you think it's normal to imply someone is a pedophile if you don't know them ?

Possibly. Judging things is more of a conservative hallmark compared to liberal permissiveness.

Like my pappy used to say, "if it looks like poopoo and smells like poopoo, you doesn't have to taste it."

[Michael Hardner]

Just now, OftenWrong said:

1. Possibly. Judging things is more of a conservative hallmark compared to liberal permissiveness.

1. Sorry - it's possibly normal to imply someone is a pedophile ?  Would you do that in a civilized discussion ?

[OftenWrong]

2 hours ago, Boges said:

if we're using Roadtrips as the main obstacle to EV adoption, it's pretty silly to say I won't accept all these benefits, because I may have to take an extra pee break on my annual road trip. 

Well at least you are not overly concerned about the health of our kidneys. Maybe perspective prefers to use a pisss-jug to save time.

Man, you can't even say p i s s in this neo-leftist forum.

[OftenWrong]

3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. Sorry - it's possibly normal to imply someone is a pedophile ?  Would you do that in a civilized discussion ?

I've seen some images where a drag queen was brought into a classroom to do her thing. She gave one of the students a lap-dance. That image seemed inappropriate to me and I don't consider it part of a quality education.

I don't have a strong opinion about transvestites, but Drag Queens are not the same thing. In my opinion using these people to educate the young about sexual diversity does the transgender community a disservice, because they are not to be taken seriously.

In my opinion they are a vaudeville act that is for adult entertainment.

This thread is about cars here, so moving on.

[Michael Hardner]

12 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

1. I've seen some images where a drag queen was brought into a classroom to do her thing. She gave one of the students a lap-dance. That image seemed inappropriate to me and I don't consider it part of a quality education.

2. I don't have a strong opinion about transvestites, but Drag Queens are not the same thing. In my opinion using these people to educate the young about sexual diversity does the transgender community a disservice, because they are not to be taken seriously.

3. In my opinion they are a vaudeville act that is for adult entertainment. This thread is about cars here, so moving on.

1. Yeah, well that is clearly ridiculous and warrants an investigation.   
2. I think it's kind of like clown.  But I don't want clowns in school either...
3. I'm on 3 threads now so getting confused...

[herbie]

Michael Hardner si not judging. Perspective pretty much told us all his convenience is more important than anything else. The circular arguments are pretty clear indications he's made up his mind and that's all there is too it. A good conservative.

Kind of reminds me of how we're sitting at a park table munching burgers in a little hick town and watching them set up a charger at the gas station across the street. My friends turns and tells me he'd never buy an RV because there's nowhere to charge them up. Made up his mind from old information and that's all there was to it, even though he's looking right at one under construction in Butthole, BC.

Wanna go 5 hours nonstop? You've been able to do that since the Chevy Volts and Prius almost 15 years ago.

[Perspektiv]

4 hours ago, herbie said:

Perspective pretty much told us all his convenience is more important than anything else.

EVs don't make the top ten most popular vehicles sold in either the US or Canada. Why is that?

People want convenience over anything else, or there's a bit of everything that is considered prior to a purchase?

I personally look at reliability, MPG, value for my dollar, interior, handling and so on.

There isn't an EV that ticks every box. If I buy a Toyota Corolla, I know the vehicle will have a very high resale value. They are built like a tank, regarding the engine. Not so pretty, but if you want a bulletproof commuter car, there's a reason it sells so well.

Resale value factors high in my purchase, as well.

Reputation is the cornerstone of your success. Guess how many EV's factor into the top ten lowest depreciating vehicles on the market right now? Guess how many of these vehicles are top selling vehicles? Guess what list I looked at before buying my car?

I think you dismissing my posts because I "only care about convenience" (even though I've supported my argument), shows you clearly have nothing to bring to the debate.

Nobody in their right minds, are going to buy something as expensive as a vehicle, without doing a bit of research in thinking if it will tick all their boxes. Buying something to "save the planet", makes zero practical sense. Mocking someone for refusing to, is mocking someone for refusing to vaccinate, and feeling morally superior, even if this person masks up, and follows all other protocols.

"Yeah, but they aren't saving the planet as well as I am.."

You're essentially eluding to me buying a Dalmatian because many get returned (and its the morally superior thing to do), and I'm saying I won't get a dog until I make sure the breed, the temperament are a fit for my lifestyle.

If you're going to ridicule a post, make sure you bring something better to the table.

[herbie]

16 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

EVs don't make the top ten most popular vehicles sold in either the US or Canada. Why is that?

Which has what to do with promoting their use? Does that mean F150s are 'the best' vehicles on the planet because they're the #1 sellers?

Quit the circular path of repeating the same statements as if the sheer volume of repetition makes them true.

[Perspektiv]

6 minutes ago, herbie said:

Does that mean F150s are 'the best' vehicles on the planet because they're the #1 sellers?

No, it means ICE pickup trucks are the best pickup trucks on the planet because their data speaks to just that.

No EV pickup comes close, on resale value, performance and bang for buck. Find me one.

7 minutes ago, herbie said:

Which has what to do with promoting their use?

Virtue signaling am calling out. Nothing wrong with loving EVs.

[herbie]

Tesla Model Y was the best-selling car worldwide in the first quarter

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/tesla-model-y-was-the-best-selling-car-worldwide-in-the-first-quarter-154909234.html

[herbie]

Boy, that sure ended discussion fast.
Real kick in the nuts, eh EV haters?

[Perspektiv]

On 6/8/2023 at 1:48 PM, herbie said:

Boy, that sure ended discussion fast.
Real kick in the nuts, eh EV haters?

Nobody is hating on EVs. Or at least not me.

The point was quite clearly eluding to North American markets. 

When you look at markets where the Tesla is dominant, you're not dealing with the challenges you see here.

We are a car dependent society.

Road trips are king. Many do camping and the like, all the reason why our market's unique needs make it more of a challenge for EV makers.

Am all for EVs.

I will not sacrifice comforts I get with my ICE, I'm the name of being "green".

Find me an EV that can match my car's nearly 500 mile range on a single tank and have it competitive on pricing, and I would switch tomorrow.

You can't pressure people to switch.

I still remember the box office bomb Bros movie. Everyone touted the gay couple, and how unprecedented this was for the LGBTQ community. All talk about the gay couple, little about what would drive butts into seats. It bombed, and the lead actor chastised people and homophobia as the cause of this. No look in the mirror as to how his aggressive shame laden sales pitch may have put people off.

You need to build what people are demanding and they will flock. Business 101.

I was recently in Hong Kong. You won't go it seems a block without seeing a Tesla. 

In this city, public transport is king. But distances are short, and tolls must be paid for highway travel. So electric makes perfect sense.

Covert that sense into a North American market, and people will flock. 

This isn't Bros. You can't strong arm demand. You create a product that meets it.

[Perspektiv]

On 5/19/2023 at 3:41 PM, Michael Hardner said:

it's possibly normal to imply someone is a pedophile ? 

Some people have pedophile vibes. Implying they are, is perfectly acceptable based on this.

Doesn't make them pedophiles, but the vibe being discussed is more opinion than fact. 

[Perspektiv]

On 6/8/2023 at 1:48 PM, herbie said:

Real kick in the nuts, eh EV haters?

I just don't understand how one is obligated to buy something that doesn't work for them, on your moral compass. 

Explain that to me.

How can one on the market for a pick up truck, find anything suitable that is electric. Tell me. 

You own a moving business and need trucks. Tell me.

Need vans to move smaller apartments and keep your carbon footprint and costs as low as possible. Again, tell me.

There are EVs for all of these needs, but they are utter garbage.

Canada is a large country. 

Many major cities are separated by 2, 3 and 5 hours if not far more if traveling provincially.

I have family across states in the US  where I would be looking at a 5 to 7 hour drive. 

Tell me, what vehicle on today's market that is electric that can do the trick. 

My car does a 6 hour drive with over a quarter tank of gas left over. I can fuel to full in less than 5 minutes. 

Empty tank? No problem, I have over 10 to 15kms left in reserves to get me to a station.

Again. Tell me.

Instead of virtue signaling like you are superior for driving an EV, you should take a page from Elon Musk's book.

He understands the market. He focused on making beautiful vehicles. He also importantly, knew that it was best to keep them looking as closely as possible to their gas counterparts.

His gamble paid off.

EVs will explode in Canada regarding sales, when makers understand that the main sellers in Canada sell for a reason.

Build a pickup truck that can haul and provide high range without breaking the 80K price point, and you have a winner.

Very few buy the top trims, and the lighting from Ford is top trim priced, minus the top trim performance.

You come across as the kind of person who would open a Canadian restaurant in Manila, and not localize the menu, and wonder why you go out of business: "what's wrong with these people?! Poutine is delicious. Who the hell wants to eat rice for breakfast?!"

Not understanding that rice is a key staple in that country. KFC, McDonald's and Pizza Hut had to adapt, for survival.

EVs are no different.

[Perspektiv]

Nobody gives a s*** about saving the planet, when considering the bulk of the market.

People buy s*** for selfish reasons. I don't care if a family of kids produced the cocoa in my chocolate bar. I wanted to eat a Mars bar.

What kills me, are such people turning their noses at people who aren't sacrificing everything to be green, yet using products reputed for child labor or inhumane working conditions.

If you use an IPhone, Nestlé, leather products from the Gap or any Bangladesh leather you're a hypocrite. 

Most people have enough personal problems to deal with, to try to play hero and "save a planet" that has done just fine for billions of years to fill a void filled by their own incompetence and fact they haven't amounted to anything tangible in life.

[Michael Hardner]

39 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

1. Some people have pedophile vibes. Implying they are, is perfectly acceptable based on this.

 

1. WTF.  No, it's not by any means.  Were you raised in a barn?  If you're effeminate, can I casually call you gay?  No.  It's repugnant behaviour.

[Michael Hardner]

25 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

 I don't care if a family of kids produced the cocoa in my chocolate bar. I wanted to eat a Mars bar.

Wait.  Are you going to do like last time and claim this is tongue in cheek?

 

Or is your "think of the children" theatre restricted to sexual abuse, not child labour to help you stuff your face with cheap candy?

 

Just trying to understand here.

[Perspektiv]

43 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

If you're effeminate, can I casually call you gay?

You can assume am gay. If I wear makeup you can assume am trans. Why are you so defensive on pedo jokes? Just asking.