China warns Canada not to be 'naive' in thinking allies can help fix issues (updated with Trudeau's reply)

[Charles Anthony]

Folks, 

I took down a lot of cluttered derailment.  

If your post is missing, then take this as a warning:  Avoid thread drift. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

Canada is in the position of any small country outside the EU these days. It’s at the mercy of the great powers. Scheer would be in the same spot. The one thing we could have done is let Meng escape. Now we’re stuck in the middle of this mess getting no thanks from the Yanks either. 

[Dougie93]

13 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Canada is in the position of any small country outside the EU these days. It’s at the mercy of the great powers. Scheer would be in the same spot. The one thing we could have done is let Meng escape. Now we’re stuck in the middle of this mess getting no thanks from the Yanks either. 

I thank the Yanks, because most Canadians are Communist sympathizers, the only thing standing between me and Beijing, is the Washington National Security Consensus.

Canada is a rogue state, Five Eyes is right to drive a wedge between the Liberals and the People's Communist Party of China, the Liberals are want to sell their own down the river to a monstrous dictatorship, Mike Pompeo come to the rescue in the face of that.

God bless America, home of the brave.

 

Edited August 7, 2019 by Dougie93

[SpankyMcFarland]

Not everyone is cut out to live in ‘communist’ Canada. 

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Not everyone is cut out to live in ‘communist’ Canada. 

True, but those who are not, are outnumbered by about three to one ratio, and the Charter of Rights doesn't really protect the individual in Canada, from the rule of the Progressive mob.

Thus, for our national security in the face of the Chinese, we are entirely dependent on the Washington National Security Consensus.

It's not like Canada is going to keep the Communists at bay, Canada is down in the alley on its knees blowing them like a two nickel whore.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Dougie93

[Zeitgeist]

4 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

True, but those who are not, are outnumbered by about three to one ratio, and the Charter of Rights doesn't really protect the individual in Canada, from the rule of the Progressive mob.

Thus, for our national security in the face of the Chinese, we are entirely dependent on the Washington National Security Consensus.

It's not like Canada is going to keep the Communists at bay, Canada is down in the alley on its knees blowing them like a two nickel whore.

So who will protect us from the Americans?

I should say some Americans.  Guess it depends who wins the election st this point.  

Edited August 7, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Dougie93]

Just now, Zeitgeist said:

So who will protect us from the Americans?

They are no threat to me, I am them, they are we, we are all Americans, Loyalists are simply the Americans who remain loyal to the British Crown in North America.

[Argus]

On 8/7/2019 at 2:18 PM, SpankyMcFarland said:

Canada is in the position of any small country outside the EU these days. It’s at the mercy of the great powers. Scheer would be in the same spot. The one thing we could have done is let Meng escape. Now we’re stuck in the middle of this mess getting no thanks from the Yanks either. 

There is little China can do to us which will have any serious or lasting consequences.

The government is not hesitating to take any action because of fear of any particular loss but fear of the loss of hoped-for future gains.

[SpankyMcFarland]

8 hours ago, Argus said:

There is little China can do to us which will have any serious or lasting consequences.

The government is not hesitating to take any action because of fear of any particular loss but fear of the loss of hoped-for future gains.

Canadians in China might disagree there.

 

 

[Zeitgeist]

5 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Canadians in China might disagree there.

 

 

I don’t think the government is doing enough for those detained Canadians and the farmers of Canola, pork, and beef.  The government should immediately impose equally impactful counter-tariffs and warn that further measures will be implemented if the Canadians aren’t released in a reasonable time frame, with a firm deadline.  China has more to worry about from a reduction in trade with Canada than Canada does because we import far more from China than we export.   Also, however, Canada should set a firm deadline for the Meng predicament to be resolved and the extradition to take place (or not if the court decides it), after the violation of which Meng is unconditionally released.   The US is using Canada to get at China in its trade war with China and in the US government’s Iran sanction policy, which is not Canadian policy.  Canada must not act as a proxy for any external powers.  

Edited August 9, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Argus]

14 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Canadians in China might disagree there.

Unless they were kidnapped and brought there against their will it's their choice to be there and accept the risks.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Canada has benefited in no way from this Meng business. Even the charges had nothing to so with Canada. 

[egghead]

18 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

I don’t think the government is doing enough for those detained Canadians and the farmers of Canola, pork, and beef.  The government should immediately impose equally impactful counter-tariffs and warn that further measures will be implemented if the Canadians aren’t released in a reasonable time frame, with a firm deadline.  China has more to worry about from a reduction in trade with Canada than Canada does because we import far more from China than we export.   Also, however, Canada should set a firm deadline for the Meng predicament to be resolved and the extradition to take place (or not if the court decides it), after the violation of which Meng is unconditionally released.   The US is using Canada to get at China in its trade war with China and in the US government’s Iran sanction policy, which is not Canadian policy.  Canada must not act as a proxy for any external powers.  

The problem with him is that he don't understand politics. And, JT is not  "an eye for an eye" people ; he believes in "turning the other cheek" 

First of all, Canada shall not let Meng go free. Canada should put her back to detention center until China release three (??) canadians.

 

[egghead]

7 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Canada has benefited in no way from this Meng business. Even the charges had nothing to so with Canada. 

Not befriend with China is a benefit already

[Argus]

17 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Canada has benefited in no way from this Meng business. Even the charges had nothing to so with Canada. 

We benefit from upholding the law. We are not a country like China which does not operate under the rule of law, and which violates every agreement it signs.

[SpankyMcFarland]

6 hours ago, Argus said:

We benefit from upholding the law. We are not a country like China which does not operate under the rule of law, and which violates every agreement it signs.

This was not an internal Canadian matter. We were naive to get involved. 

[Michael Hardner]

2 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

This was not an internal Canadian matter. We were naive to get involved. 

How were we to not get involved ?  Refuse an extradition request ?  Pretend to bumble the extradition and look incompetent - and invite domestic criticism also ?  

[SpankyMcFarland]

Meng’s extradition may yet be blocked by the courts:

Quote

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiECD8_L2m3VU0FU2EedRyM-wqGQgEKhAIACoHCAowqeP_CjDdg_oCMNTh6QU?hl=en-CA&gl=CA&ceid=CA%3Aen

 

 

 

 

 

[egghead]

3 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Meng’s extradition may yet be blocked by the courts:

Ya, it really depends who are the judges? are they JT's minions or Trump's racists?
I believe her case will not move the needles. China and USA are flighting a bigger war now.

[Army Guy]

On 8/9/2019 at 6:42 AM, Zeitgeist said:

I don’t think the government is doing enough for those detained Canadians and the farmers of Canola, pork, and beef.  The government should immediately impose equally impactful counter-tariffs and warn that further measures will be implemented if the Canadians aren’t released in a reasonable time frame, with a firm deadline.  China has more to worry about from a reduction in trade with Canada than Canada does because we import far more from China than we export.   Also, however, Canada should set a firm deadline for the Meng predicament to be resolved and the extradition to take place (or not if the court decides it), after the violation of which Meng is unconditionally released.   The US is using Canada to get at China in its trade war with China and in the US government’s Iran sanction policy, which is not Canadian policy.  Canada must not act as a proxy for any external powers.  

Sanctions on both ends are only going to make Canadian consumers pay more for that product, with all those funds going to the government of China ….It's a win, win for them... we could not compete in a trade war with China...we also have to keep in mind most of our own Canadian companies have our manufacturing in China,,,to take advantage of the cheap labor...it would be another chip they  "China" could hold over us, by simply kicking them out or shutting them down...That being said we should have placed sanctions on the equal value just to save face, and top show them we are willing to sacrifice some to achieve our goals. 

[Zeitgeist]

16 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Sanctions on both ends are only going to make Canadian consumers pay more for that product, with all those funds going to the government of China ….It's a win, win for them... we could not compete in a trade war with China...we also have to keep in mind most of our own Canadian companies have our manufacturing in China,,,to take advantage of the cheap labor...it would be another chip they  "China" could hold over us, by simply kicking them out or shutting them down...That being said we should have placed sanctions on the equal value just to save face, and top show them we are willing to sacrifice some to achieve our goals. 

I disagree.  I think we should go hard on China with trade.  Chinese companies are employing few Canadians.  The Canadian companies operating in China are employing Chinese and undermining companies that manufacture in Canada.  China is mistreating one of the few western countries that reached out to China and established strong partnerships.  Now they will only have the likes of Trump to deal with.  If the Liberals lose the election, China will quickly see how foolish they were to throw Freeland and Trudeau under the bus.  They were China friendly.  I hope China kicks out Canadian companies so that they can manufacture in Canada.  We buy far more from China than they buy from us.  China loses.  

Edited August 22, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Army Guy]

A good majority of our manufacturing sector is in china, you name most north American brands all made and built in China, shit they have found American fighter aircraft parts made in China.....? because the labor is so cheap, and they have no patient laws , thats why they have the advantage....our greed, meaning our north American companies are following the money, make it in china and we can make x 10 more for the same price to build it here by  NA workers....we screwed ourselves with our greed...

So go hard as you want , China smiles as the dollars start pouring in, even with the tariffs it is still going to be cheaper than building it here, and now we are paying more because you wanted to show them pesky Chinese a thing or two.... ...first you would have to build a factory...then hire NA workers, ...your overhead goes through the roof..., , etc....having to charge top dollar for the same crap that was made in China .. Yes we would gain our industry back, some jobs, ...but the products would be priced out of our range, and not competitive out side NA market.... it would take years to turn around the manufacturing sectors....and not just in the US/ Canada but every where would have to do the same....or the same Chinese made stuff is going to come in via 3 rd party like we do to the US with Chinese steel .

And when China has had enough they would tell the US/Canada take your mikes and get the F#### out we will buld the same thing only we will call it nikey or "FU America" and sell it to the rest of the world...there is no patient protection, no copy right anything....they hold all the cards....

I agree with everything you say, but it will never happen we can talk tough but we are holding 4 douces….and they got 6 aces.... 

 

[Dougie93]

12 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

A good majority of our manufacturing sector is in china, you name most north American brands all made and built in China, shit they have found American fighter aircraft parts made in China.....? because the labor is so cheap, and they have no patient laws , thats why they have the advantage....our greed, meaning our north American companies are following the money, make it in china and we can make x 10 more for the same price to build it here by  NA workers....we screwed ourselves with our greed...

Manufacturing is a dying prospect at the strategic level, you are living through an Information Age Revolution epoch which is like the Industrial Age epoch, in fact the Information Age is a direct result of the Industrial Age, even the Chinese are transitioning from manufacturing to consumption in their internal market.

Labour is one of the least valuable commodities, information is now the most valuable commodity, there's no going back, it's adapt or perish, no sense whinging about it.

[eyeball]

23 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

 because the labor is so cheap, and they have no patient laws , thats why they have the advantage....our greed, meaning our north American companies are following the money, make it in china and we can make x 10 more for the same price to build it here by  NA workers....we screwed ourselves with our greed...

I suppose it's good to see the conservative half of the proletariat finally waking up to what's been happening - it should never be forgotten however that when the progressive side was pointing where we were headed and why decades ago all the conservatives could do was shill for our companies while denigrating North American workers as being little more than lazy overpaid communists.

We screwed ourselves because we listened to right-wing conservatives and now they're poised to save us from what's happened?  Maybe you guys should just go back to sleep.

[Army Guy]

2 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I suppose it's good to see the conservative half of the proletariat finally waking up to what's been happening - it should never be forgotten however that when the progressive side was pointing where we were headed and why decades ago all the conservatives could do was shill for our companies while denigrating North American workers as being little more than lazy overpaid communists.

We screwed ourselves because we listened to right-wing conservatives and now they're poised to save us from what's happened?  Maybe you guys should just go back to sleep.

Thats right, you still feel the need to point fingers....so your saying all those greedy NA companies are conservative owned and operated....I find it hard to believe that liberals and NDP and Greens don't like money. and when has the NDP or the greens ever paid any attention to what the cons did...