Time to take on far-right terrorists

[marcus]

12 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

I agree that all terrorism is bad and I’d like to think that its perpetrators are only insane extremists, but is there something inherent in the religion that promotes mistreatment of non-Muslims?

I find it quite sad when people paint this brush stroke. Like your comment which suggests that all Muslims follow the exact same ideals and interpretation of what Islam is. This is over 1 billion people. You've taken a caricature of a Muslim and have applied it to over a billion people. It's wrong. Some of the most welcoming countries I have traveled through have been Muslim countries and I'm not Muslim. From Turkey, to Iran, to Indonesia. I had nothing but positive experiences there.

Resist the trap of repeating these stereotypes and thinking like the extremists do. Extremists live in a black and white world and they're unable to acknowledge that every person is unique.

[cannuck]

It is not only immigration that is causing so many problems, it is religion.   If you look around for the last few centuries, one of the most consistent divisive forces is organized religion.  If the human race ever matures to the point of understanding that Santa Claus is not real, there might be hope for the end of this BS.

Meanwhile, the left leaning media gives the Muslim terrorists and the skin-head terrorists exactly what they want - coverage.  Throw in a lot of editorializing from their political agenda, and you can imagine how they help the kind of backlash against Muslim terrorism that we saw in NZ this week.

[eyeball]

40 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Competition for power and resources demands nothing less.

With an overwhelming out-of-control emphasis on power and of which resources are usually just stepping stones in said competition.

16 minutes ago, cannuck said:

It is not only immigration that is causing so many problems, it is religion.   If you look around for the last few centuries, one of the most consistent divisive forces is organized religion.

I'd say the divisiveness of organized religion pales in comparison to the divisiveness that the organized competition for power is causing.  Religion is little more than a different stepping stone on the path to power, whether you use it to strike or stoke fear.

[eyeball]

36 minutes ago, cannuck said:

Meanwhile, the left leaning media gives the Muslim terrorists and the skin-head terrorists exactly what they want - coverage.  Throw in a lot of editorializing from their political agenda, and you can imagine how they help the kind of backlash against Muslim terrorism that we saw in NZ this week.

I could say "wow, what a retarded pile of horseshit". I think I'll just laugh my ass off instead.

[Army Guy]

21 minutes ago, marcus said:

I find it quite sad when people paint this brush stroke. Like your comment which suggests that all Muslims follow the exact same ideals and interpretation of what Islam is. This is over 1 billion people. You've taken a caricature of a Muslim and have applied it to over a billion people. It's wrong. Some of the most welcoming countries I have traveled through have been Muslim countries and I'm not Muslim. From Turkey, to Iran, to Indonesia. I had nothing but positive experiences there.

Resist the trap of repeating these stereotypes and thinking like the extremists do. Extremists live in a black and white world and they're unable to acknowledge that every person is unique.

Maybe you should reread what he wrote, he said that the Quran does have passages in it that promotes mistreatment of non Muslims...would that be a yes or no.....also can scripture in the Quran be changed or modernized , is that permitted...yes or no, if it can not be brought into the 21 st century how can it evolve, does it not tie the moderates hands behind their backs does it not...

And yet when a ex Muslim living in Europe made a drawing of Mohamad he had death threats placed upon his life, from all over Europe, North America, from around the globe , normally these people are what we considered moderate Muslims live in these areas..….Next the day of 9/11 happened US new agencies were broadcasting from many Muslim countries , who were not suffering or disgusted by the attack, nor where they condemning the attack, instead they were celebrating the terrorist act, and calling them martyrs....It is hard to see them as the peaceful Muslims you want us to believe most are.....I have also visited a lot of Muslim countries, including some that are consider moderate or civilized such as turkey, Egypt, Jordan, and they are not so much friendly , but you draw a cartoon of Mohamad here or condemn  Islam you run the risk of losing your life or arrested to languish in a Turkish prison..........  Yes i'm sure there are a lot of peaceful, and very moderate Muslims... but do you think they are the majority, or minority ?  

[Michael Hardner]

13 hours ago, Argus said:

I can think of that one attack on the mosque in Quebec by the loonie who then called police and turned himself in. That's about it. Not exactly an organized guerrilla cell there...

6 dead.  And the parliament hill guy..  The risks are in the same order of magnitude.

[Michael Hardner]

13 hours ago, Argus said:

What kind of freaking sites are you visiting anyway?

Facebook.

[Michael Hardner]

12 hours ago, Donnie said:

1. Is it because Muslims are part of the accepted victim class and whites are not?  Is that why people excuse the violence of Muslims?

2.  That is evil.

1. Find someone who excuses Islamic terrorists and says it's ok for them to kill and ask them.  I do that on Facebook to run-of-the-mill Canadians who think Muslim innocents had it coming.

2. You have an evil detector.

[Michael Hardner]

11 hours ago, jacee said:

1. But the efforts of police, CSIS, etc are focused on Islamic terrorism. And they have prevented some attacks.

2. They don't track white supremacists, they dismiss their importance, consider anti-Muslim hate groups, websites and rallies a matter of "free speech", so police are never able to prevent their attacks. 

1. I think it's both.

2. I don't think that's true but do you have a cite ?

 

[Zeitgeist]

3 hours ago, marcus said:

I find it quite sad when people paint this brush stroke. Like your comment which suggests that all Muslims follow the exact same ideals and interpretation of what Islam is. This is over 1 billion people. You've taken a caricature of a Muslim and have applied it to over a billion people. It's wrong. Some of the most welcoming countries I have traveled through have been Muslim countries and I'm not Muslim. From Turkey, to Iran, to Indonesia. I had nothing but positive experiences there.

Resist the trap of repeating these stereotypes and thinking like the extremists do. Extremists live in a black and white world and they're unable to acknowledge that every person is unique.

I too have enjoyed the hospitality of Muslim countries.  Some of the biggest critics of Islam originate from Islamic countries.  I would draw a distinction between polite society where business takes place and the beliefs that people share within their trusted social circles.  Some people perform very differently behind the scenes.  This is where education and indoctrination come in.  What are the prevailing views within the family, social circles, and the wider society?  In some Shia and Sunni societies children are raised to believe the West is the Great Satan and that Israel should be destroyed.  They aren’t radical ideas in Iran, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Yemen, and swaths of North Africa.  Don’t pretend this isn’t the case.  

We oppose Sharia law here because many immigrants from Muslim countries came here to flee Sharia law.  While white nationalist extremism is also troubling, it isn’t tacitly supported by the wider society, though right wing populists have stirred these demons.  I also agree that colonial meddling has caused big backlashes throughout the Middle East, Africa, and Indonesia.  That’s true, but don’t downplay Muslim versus Muslim hatred and terror, and don’t pin it on the West.  The Saudis, UAE, Kuwaities, and Iranians benefitted from selling oil to the West.  The Saudis exploit Palestinian labour.  How many of these countries welcomed Syrian refugees?  

I also want to add that I believe most members of all the major religions and most agnostics and atheists are reasonable, decent people just trying to get ahead in life.  Same goes for people of different ethnicities.  People are people.  Not all beliefs, however, are of equal value in terms of personal health and the health and cohesion of the wider society.  Some narratives are healthier than others.  I say this from a purely humanist, scientific perspective.  

Edited March 17, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Zeitgeist]

2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. I think it's both.

2. I don't think that's true but do you have a cite ?

 

CSIS has closely tracked and even infiltrated white supremacist groups for decades.  Some of these crimes are genuinely difficult to prevent.  If someone decides to simply veer their car onto a sidewalk and run people over, how do we prevent that without limiting freedom of movement to an extreme that most of us wouldn’t support?  There isn’t always a Facebook page, meeting place or phone call where plans are shared.  

Edited March 17, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[jacee]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. I think it's both.

2. I don't think that's true but do you have a cite ?

 

2nd link in the OP.   RCMP/CSIS downplay far right extremism. 

Good analyses in this article below from Australia - home of the shooter - but true in Canada and the US too:

https://theconversation.com/christchurch-attacks-are-a-stark-warning-of-toxic-political-environment-that-allows-hate-to-flourish-113662?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1552790316

"The result has been such a cacophony of hateful rhetoric that it has been hard for those tasked with spotting the emergence of violent extremism to separate it from all the background noise of extremism.

... But ultimately, we need to address the permissive political environment that allows such hateful extremism to be promulgated so openly. The onus is on commentators and political leaders alike. They cannot change the past, but they will determine the future."

The onus is on police and the justice system too, to clarify lines between free speech and inciting or promoting hatred. Police have been escorting white supremacists' marches around Canada like they're visiting dignitaries. 

Andrew Scheer and Maxine Bernier are both looking like weasels in their response, or lack of, to the violent deaths of 49 Muslims. It's obvious they don't want to lose their Islamophobic voters. 

Edited March 17, 2019 by jacee

[Saudi Monitor]

12 hours ago, jacee said:

My concern is that white supremacist terrorists succeed in mass murders because police and security forces don't pay any attention to them. 

All funding for terrorism is directed at 'Islamic' radicals, with fairly successful prevention.

But police don't prevent white supremacist terrorist attacks because they don't look for white supremacists. They only look for 'Islamic' terrorists.

I wholeheartedly agree with the OP. The authorities should start mass covert surveillance on this dangerous community to ensure that they aren't harbouring dangerous elements that would harm the society!
. 

[Saudi Monitor]

10 hours ago, taxme said:

They are mostly being brought into western countries by globalist scum like George Soros. 

A quote from the terrorist manifest

Quote

Millions of people pouring across our borders, legally.Invited by the state and corporate entities to replace the White people who have failed to reproduce,

A quote from Sam Harris in 2006

Quote

Islam is the fastest growing religion in Europe. The demographic trends are ominous: Given current birthrates, France could be a majority Muslim country in 25 years, and that is if immigration were to stop tomorrow. 

No offense to you, but i see no difference between all 3 of you Islamophobes. The only difference is, one is responsible for making this shit mainstream, one takes it to practices through mass murder, and you are just gullible person who are just inflaming the paranoia.

Edited March 17, 2019 by Saudi Monitor

[DogOnPorch]

Some words of wisdom.

[scribblet]

19 hours ago, jacee said:

Not "just".

But white supremacists are not getting the same police surveillance and budget allocation as 'Islamic' radicals. 

Scribblet:  no mention of the 'far left' extremists  notably ANTIFA who promote violence and incite people to violence.  

Only against white supremacists ... and who gives a sh!t about them!!! ......

Not so, they are against anyone with whom they disagree,  they are the fascists.

[jacee]

11 hours ago, cannuck said:

It is not only immigration that is causing so many problems, it is religion.   

Immigration and religion are not causing problems. Racism, white supremacism, bigotry and hatred are causing the problems. 

Politicians, media and others in positions of responsibility are causing the problems by 'inciting and promoting hatred' to get votes or make profits.

Police who defer to white supremacism as "free speech" are causing the problems, validating hatred and allowing hatred public space to spread and grow, escorting and protecting white supremacist hate marches through crowds of decent Canadians there to oppose their messages of hatred. Police have even violently pushed such people aside to escort white supremacists through (eg, Toronto Police Services). 

Police, national security agencies and Attorneys General who fail to monitor and lay charges against white supremacist propagandists online are causing problems.

We have the laws to draw the lines between free speech and inciting or promoting hatred:

https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-46/section-319.html

Public incitement of hatred

• 319 (1) Every one who, by communicating statements in any public place, incites hatred against any identifiable group where such incitement is likely to lead to a breach of the peace is guilty of

  • (a) an indictable offence and is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years; or

  • (b) an offence punishable on summary conviction.

• Wilful promotion of hatred

  (2) Every one who, by communicating statements, other than in private conversation, wilfully promotes hatred against any identifiable group is guilty of

  • (a) an indictable offence and is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years; or

  • (b) an offence punishable on summary conviction.

In Canada, we now need the public will and demand that they be applied systematically to prevent the spread of hatred. 

[Zeitgeist]

8 hours ago, jacee said:

2nd link in the OP.   RCMP/CSIS downplay far right extremism. 

Good analyses in this article below from Australia - home of the shooter - but true in Canada and the US too:

https://theconversation.com/christchurch-attacks-are-a-stark-warning-of-toxic-political-environment-that-allows-hate-to-flourish-113662?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1552790316

"The result has been such a cacophony of hateful rhetoric that it has been hard for those tasked with spotting the emergence of violent extremism to separate it from all the background noise of extremism.

... But ultimately, we need to address the permissive political environment that allows such hateful extremism to be promulgated so openly. The onus is on commentators and political leaders alike. They cannot change the past, but they will determine the future."

The onus is on police and the justice system too, to clarify lines between free speech and inciting or promoting hatred. Police have been escorting white supremacists' marches around Canada like they're visiting dignitaries. 

Andrew Scheer and Maxine Bernier are both looking like weasels in their response, or lack of, to the violent deaths of 49 Muslims. It's obvious they don't want to lose their Islamophobic voters. 

I agree with the article.  You have no idea how much discussion has gone on regarding this new dichotomy between those who support a multicultural society with the free exchange of ideas, goods and services internationally, including good international rules to protect labour, the environment, and human rights versus the anti-Globalist, protectionist, xenophobic, and quasi-fascist movement that has taken hold in the US, Brazil, Poland, Italy, Hungary, and other countries.  Because this right wing movement has become more mainstream, it’s harder to distinguish the more radical forces that would actually unleash violence on innocent people.  The propaganda of the populist right is normalizing rascism and xenophobia.  I was saying this several months ago.  The response was mostly more anti-immigrant sentiment.  

Edited March 17, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[jacee]

5 minutes ago, scribblet said:

Not so, they are against anyone with whom they disagree,  they are the fascists.

You're making it pretty clear that you stand with the white supremacists. 

[DogOnPorch]

 

Nobody bothered with my video as I can see.

[Saudi Monitor]

On 3/16/2019 at 5:10 AM, egghead said:

Yes, just last week, muslims killed over 30 christians in Nigeria. Did we hear it? No, It is bec'os the news don't fix the lefties agenda

https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/cwn/2019/march/radical-muslims-murder-32-nigerian-christians-torch-church-in-brutal-attack

Astonishing how some dead Muslims reminds white nationalists islamophobes Nigeria is a country that exists and they gotta take a brief break from their usual 24/7 ranting about how Africans are lower IQ people

"look at all the coverage these dead NZ Muslims get, Christians don't get this coverage when killed in Nigeria, Philippines or the ME!"

It's not covered just like Muslims killed by a drone or suicide bomber in such countries is not covered, compare with some Christians in the same country being killed in a terror attack, an inequality in media coverage won't be in the Muslims favour.

 Speaking of the incident in Nigeria, it was most definitely a Herder-Farmer conflict, at its roots it's not a religious conflict, but a conflict about land and natural resources, and for you're information,  Boko Haram have killed lots more Nigerian Muslims.

Nigeria's pastoral conflict 'six times deadlier' than Boko Haram in 2018, ICG says

 

Quote

 

"The farmer-herder conflict has become Nigeria's gravest security challenge, now claiming far more lives than the Boko Haram insurgency," said the ICG.

"It has displaced hundreds of thousands and sharpened ethnic, regional and religious polarization. It threatens to become even deadlier and could affect forthcoming elections and undermine national stability."

 

 

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/07/27/africa/nigeria-herdsmen-boko-haram-report/index.html

Edited March 17, 2019 by Saudi Monitor

[jacee]

17 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I agree with the article.  ...  Because this right wing movement has become more mainstream, it’s harder to distinguish the more radical forces that would actually unleash violence on innocent people.  The propaganda of the populist right is normalizing rascism and xenophobia.  I was saying this several months ago.  The response was mostly more anti-immigrant sentiment.  

Ya, there's a lot of that here. It's always important to continue to counter that.

This is also fertile ground for police to monitor people who incite and promote hatred.

As Antifa says ... "Make racists afraid again!" Lol 

[GostHacked]

4 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

Nobody bothered with my video as I can see.

What this guy said in the video does not line up with any of your rhetoric here on MLW.  What was the point.

[DogOnPorch]

Islam is a religion. Not a race or a skin colour.

But Islam does have Al Wala' Wal Bara (literal: "loyalty and disavowal")...that none of you with the exception of our Saudi poster have a clue about.

Loving and hating what Allah loves and hates.

And Allah hates the Unbeliever.

 

 

[DogOnPorch]

2 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

What this guy said in the video does not line up with any of your rhetoric here on MLW.  What was the point.

 

What is my rhetoric again?