The Battle of Charlottesville

Michael Hardner · August 19, 2017

1 minute ago, hot enough said:

Michael Hardner being coy, just before he flees.

I'm just saying that you have overloaded your rhetorical Nerf gun yet again. I am sorry for not accepting your offer of a play date.

Michael Hardner · August 19, 2017

1 minute ago, GostHacked said:

The notion is the same. Not surprised you failed to see that.

I'm not saying it's different. You said 'rethink' but I haven't even posted any thoughts on it. I don't think I have anyway.

GostHacked · August 19, 2017

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

I'm not saying it's different. You said 'rethink' but I haven't even posted any thoughts on it. I don't think I have anyway.

Come on Mike. You said yourself you don't think violence is productive against fascists. And that notion applies on all scales.

hot enough · August 19, 2017

13 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

That sounds post.modernist and nonsensical. Also, doesn't really address the point I was responsible to.

You have a terrible habit of using jargon you don't have a very good grasp of, Michael, to avoid having to address the conundrums you invariably get yourself into. It's all obfuscation.

Michael Hardner · August 19, 2017

4 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

Most of your points recently have been terrible and counter productive.

Ok, thanks for that. I'll take your non-response to my point as an admission of fault mixed with dejected petulance.

Wilber · August 19, 2017

14 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

On one side of me, I am opposed to the statues in the cities. But on the other side, they should still remain in some fashion. Put them all in a museum as a reminder of what it represents.

We need to remember history, not wipe it out.

The Lee statue was being moved to a museum, not being destroyed. Baltimore wants to move its dual, Lee/Jackson statue to the Chancellorsville battlefield site which was the last place they met. That makes sense to me.

Lee, Davis and Jackson families OK with moving statues to museums.

Edited August 19, 2017 by Wilber

Michael Hardner · August 19, 2017

1 minute ago, GostHacked said:

Come on Mike. You said yourself you don't think violence is productive against fascists. And that notion applies on all scales.

Once again - I am not disagreeing with you. I just find it weird that you seem to have put me in support of the war on terror.

hot enough · August 19, 2017

14 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I'm just saying that you have overloaded your rhetorical Nerf gun yet again. I am sorry for not accepting your offer of a play date.

Usually you just flee. Why not consider growing a spine and addressing some issues instead of simply believing a Michael Hardner pronouncement has some merit?

GostHacked · August 19, 2017

On 8/17/2017 at 7:27 PM, Michael Hardner said:

I don't think violence is a good way to counter fascists, but I also reject the idea that there is moral equivalence here.

So you did not say the above statement? Maybe you can clarify for me then?

Michael Hardner · August 19, 2017

3 minutes ago, hot enough said:

You have a terrible habit of using jargon you don't have a very good grasp of, Michael, to avoid having to address the conundrums you invariably get yourself into.

And you love the run-on sentence more than life itself.

GostHacked · August 19, 2017

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

Once again - I am not disagreeing with you. I just find it weird that you seem to have put me in support of the war on terror.

I am quite certain you do. I have not read anything you posted that supports the notion you DON'T support the war on terror. This is the last I'll go on it, so back to the thread..

hot enough · August 19, 2017

10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

And you love the run-on sentence more than life itself.

Oh, now you are an expert on the English language. Your pretense knows no bounds.

Stop obfuscating and address your lame remarks by providing something of substance. The USA and the Nazis are very similar in nature.

Edited August 19, 2017 by hot enough

Michael Hardner · August 19, 2017

2 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

So you did not say the above statement? Maybe you can clarify for me then?

I did say this. And you said "Then you might want to re-think the whole war on terror."

I took your statement to say my views on these situations isn't consistent. But I don't remember saying anything about the war on terror.

Michael Hardner · August 19, 2017

3 minutes ago, hot enough said:

Stop obfuscating and address your lame remarks by providing something of substance. The USA and the Nazis are very similar in nature.

I did.

'very similar' ... Seems like a back pedal.

GostHacked · August 19, 2017

3 minutes ago, hot enough said:

Oh, now you are an expert on the English language. Your pretense knows no bounds.

Stop obfuscating and address your lame remarks by providing something of substance. The USA and the Nazis are very similar in nature.

I wonder how many other nations have symbols of fascism in government?

And I really am not sure how much Wikipedia can be trusted these days for objective truth...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fasces

Quote

During the first half of the 20th century both the fasces and the swastika (each symbol having its own unique ancient religious and mythological associations), became heavily identified with the authoritarian/ fascist political movements of Adolf Hitler and Benito Mussolini. During this period the swastika became deeply stigmatized, however the fasces did not undergo a similar process.

The fact that the fasces remained in use in many societies after World War II may have been due to the fact that prior to Mussolini the fasces had already been adopted and incorporated within the governmental iconography of many governments outside of Italy. As such, its use has remained as an acceptable form of governmental and other forms of iconography in various legitimate contexts. (The swastika remains in common usage in certain parts of Asia for certain religious purposes which are also entirely unrelated to the early 20th century fascism of the West.)

hot enough · August 19, 2017

12 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I did.

'very similar' ... Seems like a back pedal.

You didn't. No back pedaling on my part. That is your specialty, next to fleeing.

Still nothing from you, Michael, just your pronouncements, which, again, you seem to think have some merit.

Edited August 19, 2017 by hot enough

Wilber · August 19, 2017

I think this guy has the right perspective

DogOnPorch · August 19, 2017

7 minutes ago, Wilber said:

The Lee statue was being moved to a museum, not being destroyed. Baltimore wants to move its dual, Lee/Jackson statue to the Chancellorsville battlefield site which was the last place they met. That makes sense to me.

Lee, Davis and Jackson families OK with moving statues to museums.

Jackson was quite the fellow. Even more colourful than Lee. Wouldn't fight on Sundays (Kernstown being a rare exception). Threatened to shoot stragglers during the Valley Campaign. Nobody straggled. The 33rd Virginia was his lead regiment....typical for his brigade.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/33rd_Virginia_Infantry

Chacellorsville is an appropriate place for his statue. His final battle.

Wilber · August 19, 2017

1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said:

Jackson was quite the fellow. Even more colourful than Lee. Wouldn't fight on Sundays (Kernstown being a rare exception). Threatened to shoot stragglers during the Valley Campaign. Nobody straggled. The 33rd Virginia was his lead regiment....typical for his brigade.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/33rd_Virginia_Infantry

Chacellorsville is an appropriate place for his statue. His final battle.

He was a religious nutbag, but a brilliant soldier.

DogOnPorch · August 19, 2017

Just now, Wilber said:

He was a religious nutbag, but a brilliant soldier.

Yes indeed. Very "God Fearing". Devoted to his wife even from the battlefield in thousands of letters. She probably knew more than the Reb War Dept.

"Gods and Generals" does a pretty accurate version of him, I think.

DogOnPorch · August 19, 2017

Plus, it should be noted that Lee was summoned to Washington DC from Texas where he was serving and offered the job of commanding the Union Army by Lincoln. Lee replied that it all depended upon what the state of Virginia voted on in terms of secession. So had the vote gone differently....Lee would have been Union and not Rebel.

drummindiver · August 19, 2017

54 minutes ago, hot enough said:

From a big supporter of war criminals/terrorists/genocides, to a guy that will outright lie/fabricate/state things with no evidence, of what value do you consider your words have?

Says the fella who refuses to supply cites for his fabrications.

hot enough · August 19, 2017

10 minutes ago, drummindiver said:

Says the fella who refuses to supply cites for his fabrications.

Why do you go to such great lengths to highlight your incompetence?

Charles Anthony · August 19, 2017

Folks,

Please avoid personal attacks.

Omni · August 19, 2017

57 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

On one side of me, I am opposed to the statues in the cities. But on the other side, they should still remain in some fashion. Put them all in a museum as a reminder of what it represents.

We need to remember history, not wipe it out.

That's what the plan was in Charlottesville, but the alt right wouldn't stand for that either. Anything to get to wave a nazi flag and tote an assault rifle around town for that crowd it seems.