Canada & a New Structure of World Peace

[Army Guy]

4 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I find it intriguing to explore hypothetical situations, such as what would occur if geopolitical tensions arose between the US and Canada due to alleged influence from a foreign power. Let us suppose American Intelligence decides the CCP from Beijing thuggery has taken over here. 

From a critical thinking perspective, it could be interesting to consider the potential thoughts and reactions of members of the Canadian military in such a situation. What are your thoughts on this speculative scenario?

Would that be a confusing scenario? 

The military would do their jobs, no question asked, people are going to die, how many is the question... It would be over before the morning sun came up, it is not like we have dozens of major bases spread across the country... most of the Army units are in three bases, 2 air force bases, and two naval bases...seize them at night when manning is at a minimum...seize the parliament and the Ottawa air port, PM's residence,  also at night... that could be done by airborne or air mobile forces...by the time we  broke out the weapons' it would be almost over...once those few bases are secure, and the PM is in custody, what are the other bases going to do...there is nothing left to fight over, nothing to fight with...those bases could be insolated, or taken at the same time...it's really not that hard...and would not require a whole lot of soldiers...

[eyeball]

18 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Investing in Nuclear weapons makes no sense at all, everyone knows that Canada would not use them ever, it would not be a deterrent at all, Our nations deterrent is the US plain and simple...

Exactly.

9 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Tell me do you sleep in your bed or under it...WTF would the US want with Canada anyways...they got enough problems with democrat's, that make our conservatives look like the green party....ya becasue that is what their looking for, more lefty's.

If you have doubts about where our soldiers loyalties lie, your free to join up and change that...I'll even fly out and drive you to the recruiting station...

No, you just repeated what I've been telling you for over 20 years.  No one will invade us because the US wouldn't stand for it.  I guess it finally sunk in.

8 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Thats what it would come down to, the left getting ahold of the keys and the right going up in a ball of flames...some days i think it would stop all of the torture of listening to them whine and bicker about useless stuff...

If the topic of our defence is such a joke to you why do you bother?  You think I'm joking?  I'm quite serious. Believing we can make a difference militarily by spending billions on conventional weapons is as silly as believing we can make a difference to climate change by driving electric cars.

WTF is the point?  

[Dougie93]

8 hours ago, Army Guy said:

The military would do their jobs, no question asked, people are going to die, how many is the question... It would be over before the morning sun came up, it is not like we have dozens of major bases spread across the country... most of the Army units are in three bases, 2 air force bases, and two naval bases...seize them at night when manning is at a minimum...seize the parliament and the Ottawa air port, PM's residence,  also at night... that could be done by airborne or air mobile forces...by the time we  broke out the weapons' it would be almost over...once those few bases are secure, and the PM is in custody, what are the other bases going to do...there is nothing left to fight over, nothing to fight with...those bases could be insolated, or taken at the same time...it's really not that hard...and would not require a whole lot of soldiers...

there is no need for America to launch a military invasion of Canada

as at this juncture, the provincial economies are totally dependant on access to American markets

thus America could bring Canada to its knees by trade war alone, nary a shot fire

[Dougie93]

Just now, Contrarian said:

@Dougie93 what would you do in such a situation? 

that would depend on what the reason for the war was

why is America invading Canada ?

what has Canada done to incite America to take such extreme measures ?

[Dougie93]

8 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Well, we are on this board, and we are bored, I guess, are you bored? I wrote it above. 

I find it intriguing to explore hypothetical situations, such as what would occur if geopolitical tensions arose between the US and Canada due to alleged influence from a foreign power.

Let us suppose American Intelligence Services decide CCP (from Beijing) thuggery has taken over here. 

From a critical thinking perspective, it could be interesting to consider the potential thoughts and reactions of members of the Canadian military in such a situation.

What are your thoughts on this speculative scenario? Would that be a confusing scenario? 

if the British Crown in North America had fallen to the Chinese Communists in Beijing,

then I would fight with the Americans in defence of the British Crown

once again come to our aid in the darkest hours

[Queenmandy85]

Army Guy, I hope you understand that I personally have a different view on Defence Policy than the government. I have always advocated for a viable Canadian military, cabable of defeating any threat. I have yet to find anyone on this forum who agrees with me. I am also a realist. Canadians do not wish to have anything but a token military. Yes, they are handy for aid to the civil power for medical assistance, and natural disasters. But no government could get elected on a platform promising to defend Canada. 

A token military is alright, but it is a waste to provide equipment in such small numbers that they, and the men and women who use it, would be overwhelmed in a day.

I support NATO, but it should be a side commitment to the primary role of the defence of Canada. We should be in a position to maintain a 5% of GDP contibution to NATO while still maintaining our own defence. The American taxpayer paid for World War II. They lent massive amounts of money to help in the Great War (1914-1918) and the only country that paid back that war debt to the US after the Great War was Britain. They made their last payment in the 1980's. It is totally unfair to burden the American taxpayer for the defence of Canada.

And once again, I am whistling in the wind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 8, 2023 by Queenmandy85

[Queenmandy85]

18 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

that would depend on what the reason for the war was

why is America invading Canada ?

what has Canada done to incite America to take such extreme measures ?

That depends on what happens in 2025. 

[Dougie93]

21 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

 are you bored?

not at all

enjoying breakfast served on the deck with my wife

relishing the summer weather

listening to some patriotic martial music while I take in the view of my estate

literal bliss

 

[Dougie93]

7 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

That depends on what happens in 2025. 

we are only bound to defend the Sovereign, Head of State & Commander-in-Chief

any government which does not bear true and faithful allegiance therein, is forfeit

[Dougie93]

6 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Ah, the gratification of PRIVATE PROPERTY.

in Canada, we only free hold

His Majesty The King remains the legal title holder of all the lands

[Dougie93]

9 hours ago, Contrarian said:

Setting aside the tactical considerations,

for the US military the concern would be at the operational level

like invading Russia, the threat of Canada is the tyranny of distance

there is simply too much territory for any military to control by operational means

while decapitating Canada would simply result in chaos

an ungoverned space on the American border which America herself could not govern from Washington

Pottery Barn Rule

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Yes, but I think it will be confusion, let's not forget how politicians used the intelligence services in the US to fight wars, even though brilliant analysts presented reports, politicians acted on interest using those analysts and professional work.  

Politicians spit and disrespect intelligence officers in general, as you can see with your Trudeau, that you say you voted for Legal Marijuana, please correct me if I am wrong, and will apologize, however, back on track, it will be confusion, what if an old Loyalist fever comes upon the land and questions the moves of the US? What are you going to do then?

Listen, is a Saturday, I am sitting here in my condo too, instead of doing the usual, let's insult each other lightly but play this scenario to the end.

In the end, where would your loyalty be? 

in a Westminster Parliament, one only votes for an MP to represent your ridding

there was no referendum on cannabis legalization

I simply said that it was one policy of the Liberals that I agreed with

that cannabis should be a controlled substance legally consumable by adults, like alcohol & tobacco

in terms of we Loyalists, we are actually the Pro-American contingent now

ever since America came to our aid in the darkest hours, during the First & Second World Wars

America is the greatest and increasingly the only defender of the British Crown

it's not Canada actually defends itself, we rely totally upon the Americans to defend British North America

but as an Ulster Scot, my loyalty is to my beliefs & principles

and those are best expressed & defended in this world, jointy

by the constitutional monarchy of the British Crown

and the constitutional republic of the United States of America

in an alliance called the United Kingdom United States of America Agreement

I cannot foresee any scenario where British Loyalists would abandon said treaty

the only scenario wherein I could envision America using force against Canada

would be if the British Crown were to be overthrown in Canada

which leads to the more realistic Canadian conflict scenario

which is an internal conflict

wherein the totalitarian left attempts to impose an illegitimate People's Republic upon the Loyalists

leading to what I call the Giant Ulster scenario

[Dougie93]

31 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

•  in that case, American Forces would come in? 

I see no scenario where American forces would enter Canada uninvited

the only realistic scenario is the Crown requesting assistance from Washington

again, in the face of internal insurrection, plausibly assisted by a hostile foreign power in Beijing

at which point, Canadian & American forces would likely operate jointly

under the Continental Defence & Security Agreement

it is in fact practically impossible for Canadian forces to operate independently of the US military

and by treaty, it would actually be unlawful for HM Canadian Forces to engage in hostilities against America

Edited July 8, 2023 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

40 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

, maybe if I would smoke up, would not be in the issue to be in a hole talking to you now. 

if you could replace alcohol with cannabis, that would be beneficial of course

but smoking dope tends to make you want to smoke tobacco & drink alcohol if you are so inclined

so I wouldn't recommend it as an addiction cessation product

[WestCanMan]

23 hours ago, myata said:

Did you mean innocent Russians walked into a foreign land, no visas or permissions, burned a few villages, robbed and raped some citizens.. and then the lawful government of the country dared to show resistance and so "started the war"? If you just lie down before a brutal invader and kiss his boot there would be no war, right? .. only minor repressions, extermination of national culture elites, hunger death, gulag death such little cute things Russia likes to treat her new subjects with.

Or were trying to say something even more bizarre? Perhaps in the language that Putin and Hitler speak?

No, I mean that the Ukrainians threatened to bring countries that are hostile towards Russia right to Russia's western border.

If you think that the US wouldn't have invaded us if we did the same thing to them then you're living in denial.

Hillary, Trudeau and Biden are very fluent in the language that Hitler speaks. 

[myata]

4 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

No, I mean that the Ukrainians threatened to bring countries that are hostile towards Russia right to Russia's western border.

Like Norway (1949) and three Baltic states (2004)? Liar, liar. But what else? Like how else but with a gross, outrageous lie could one justify modern Hitlers?

[WestCanMan]

3 minutes ago, myata said:

Like Norway (1949) and three Baltic states (2004)? Liar, liar. But what else? Like how else but with a gross, outrageous lie could one justify modern Hitlers?

You're ignorance and stupidity are overwhelming dude.

1) Russia was too weak to do anything in 2004, and 2) none of those other countries pose anything close to the threat that NATO in Ukraine poses.

It's literally the same as if we parked a Chinese/North Korean/Iranian/Russian army in Ontario, and you're saying "but what about Estevan Sask and Winkler Man?!?!?!?!"

[myata]

Just now, WestCanMan said:

none of those other countries pose anything close to the threat that NATO in Ukraine poses.

Just because psycho said so.. no evidence needed? Lie and more bombastic lie and nothing else. Who attacked Russia? Who crossed her border with arms? Innocent psycho victim in the psycho world.

[OftenWrong]

10 minutes ago, myata said:

Like Norway (1949) and three Baltic states (2004)? Liar, liar. But what else? Like how else but with a gross, outrageous lie could one justify modern Hitlers?

Why should he lie? It doesn't benefit anyone.

The difference is that he , like myself, does not see any "good" guys in this fiasco. You may think that the US, Canada, EU are the good guys but I disagree. They did all the political manouvering to make this war become a reality, without them being in it directly. Classic Macchiavelli technique. Same old same old.

But back to thread title, this is not the peacekeeper role that Canada would have normally taken in its past.

The new structure of world peace should be Canada's old structure of peace. Canada having been the most progressive and futurist country in the world, would have been the ones to initiate dialogue on a ceasefire. Under JT, Canada is just another globalist war supporter.

[OftenWrong]

6 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Do you really believe this? What other system went around the world and left something better after the 1990's? 

It was the Americans that came in and gave freedom in Eastern Europe and now some sex debates are overwhelming you, and you, a smart man, are willing to sell your soul to the KGB over some cultural warfare? 

Why? Because Putin says he is into family and all that? He has kids in many countries, properties from Monaco to the Capartnians mountains, same with that priest of his, both KGB officers that got people executed.

Of course, there are good guys here, and they are the Americans, and no matter how the KGB, now FSB tries to recruit you Chuds will be some of us here that will punch you right back in the mouth. 

Yes I believe it. I was against the US wars in Iraq and Afghanistan as well.

[Army Guy]

13 hours ago, Contrarian said:

Setting aside the tactical considerations, I'm more interested in exploring the psychological aspects and the potential impact of social media influence.

In your opinion, how do you think the main core of the military would respond to such a situation from a psychological perspective? 

You, yourself, where would your loyalties be, Army Man? 

It is goliath vs the giant situation, Military would do their jobs until the situation became pointless, which would be very quickly... once again Canadian soldiers would be asked to do a job, that the government and the people refused to equip and train them for. It would be like a peewee hockey team going against a NHL team...very over whelming for the pee wee team, moral would suck, lives would be thrown away for nothing....

Our military would do their jobs, until they could no longer do them, not sure why this is even a question, our military has NEVER failed to answer it's nations call... regardless of the situation or who was the enemy... In Germany we were told our jobs were to hold off the check armies for 24 hours  that was our mission, In reality would might have been able to hold for 12 hours then be over run...it was a highly sought after posting...

My loyalties are with the men and women in uniform. 

The question should be where are the loyalties of most Canadians, I'm sure they would except this defeat in stride, without taking up arms to defend the nation, national patriotism died a long time ago...

[OftenWrong]

4 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

think Putin has you with the cultural warfare, because of the trannies running wild around here, or their policymakers, am I wrong or right? 

I am already against that, regardless of Putin. I've been clear on my position that I am no homophobe, but I see these as non-issues being pushed on the public by liberal governments, as a distraction.

[OftenWrong]

8 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I was pro-intervention in Afghanistan. 

To what end? Bin laden was not there, and after decades of war. US pulled out in virtual defeat while taliban and mujahideen still run things as they see fit. Afghanistan, the graveyard of empires won again.

[Army Guy]

5 hours ago, eyeball said:

Exactly.

No, you just repeated what I've been telling you for over 20 years.  No one will invade us because the US wouldn't stand for it.  I guess it finally sunk in.

If the topic of our defence is such a joke to you why do you bother?  You think I'm joking?  I'm quite serious. Believing we can make a difference militarily by spending billions on conventional weapons is as silly as believing we can make a difference to climate change by driving electric cars.

 

WTF is the point?  

One day we are going to wake up and the US is going to demand we step up, or do it ourselves....and it is going to cost us more than 2 % GDP to control our sovereignty.

Having the US pay for the whole defense thing may sound cool to you, but to me we should be paying our fair share, that sir is just taking advantage of the situation, it is convenient for them to do that right now, but they have the capacity to say your on your own and boost their own border security to the max... 

Becasue like most Canadians you do not know what the Military provides you every hour of everyday...nor will you ever know until the day it all stops...

Spending billions on tanks and planes and boats, may sound useless to you, but those same resources help millions each year, yes during the floods and ice storms we brought in tanks and IFV to help rescue people and build sand bag walls, as the waters were to deep for anything else, those fancy helicopters help put out fires, and evac civilians to safer areas...not only here in Canada but aboard as well... i know hard not to think about your self for a minute, but we as a nation are fortunate to be rich in resources, and have great level of standard of living, why would we not want to protect that....

[OftenWrong]

54 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Bin Landen was not hosted by the Taliban? 

Don't know but he was not found until years later in another country.

So US has the right to invade anywhere with their military and kill thousands, maybe millions by some estimates, just to go after one man?

Not only the deaths but the suffering. Those countries became shitholes far worse than before thanks to the US. No one talks about conditions or what happened to women's rights in Iraq after Saddam was executed.

For that part they keep their mouth shut.