So how do you fire a governor general?

Queenmandy85 · August 21, 2020

13 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

However nothing in this regard will change until after the Queen dies. Canadians will have to wait.

How will that change anything? The Constitution rules that our new Head of State will be the Prince of Wales (George VII?) You should never underestimate the support Canadians have for the Crown. If republicans don't like it, there are still flights to take them to the land of President Trump.

Edited August 21, 2020 by Queenmandy85

OftenWrong · August 21, 2020

6 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said:

How will that change anything? The Constitution rules that our new Head of State will be the Prince of Wales (George VII?)

Ok, fair enough. I kind of meant at least until. The joke is, regardless of the will of Canadians we must wait. It's only after she's gone that the possibility of reform even exists at all, you see.

It's the good-old British way...

Edited August 21, 2020 by OftenWrong
trimmed quote ;)

Queenmandy85 · August 22, 2020

What is to reform? Constitutional Monarchy works well. Japan, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, the UK, the Netherlands, and New Zealand, all have Constitutional Monarchs. The GG in Canada serves at HM's pleasure. As long as the Queen and her successors have confidence in the GG, the matter is settled.

-TSS- · August 22, 2020

Isn't the GG selected by a vote in parliament even though that is just a formality? Whatever parliament gives it can also take away.

SpankyMcFarland · August 31, 2020

On 8/21/2020 at 9:41 PM, Queenmandy85 said:

What is to reform? Constitutional Monarchy works well. Japan, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, the UK, the Netherlands, and New Zealand, all have Constitutional Monarchs. The GG in Canada serves at HM's pleasure. As long as the Queen and her successors have confidence in the GG, the matter is settled.

Apart from NZ, they have their own monarchs. By contrast, we have a foreigner who gave up visiting us some time ago. It's time we grew up and at least made the GG a more serious position à la the presidencies of Israel or Germany.

Edited August 31, 2020 by SpankyMcFarland

-TSS- · September 12, 2020

Canada, Australia and New Zealand are de facto republics with the GG being a kind of powerless President like the ones in Germany or Italy. I mean the Queen can't fire the GG, can she?

SpankyMcFarland · September 23, 2020

On 9/12/2020 at 6:39 PM, -TSS- said:

Canada, Australia and New Zealand are de facto republics with the GG being a kind of powerless President like the ones in Germany or Italy. I mean the Queen can't fire the GG, can she?

The thing is that the German Chancellor does not appoint the President. In our Canadian system, the GG, our head of state’s representative, is less independent of the head of government. This isn’t a huge deal but it doesn’t look good when the GG is considering a request by the PM to abruptly prorogue Parliament, a bit like bringing your own referee to a game.

-TSS- · September 26, 2020

Sounds to me like if the office of GG was abolished hardly anybody would notice any difference. His/her duties only include the formal appointments and granting resignations of the government.

cannuck · September 28, 2020

On 7/28/2020 at 4:28 AM, dpwozney said:

"A corporation is a 'fiction' as it has no separate existence, no physical body and no 'mind'", according to Joanne Klineberg in a presentation to the Canadian Aviation Safety Seminar in 2004.

Which is of course totally bullshit. A corporation does not exist without a human at its helm and its defacto embodiment is its board of directors. In the case of GG, it is the GG who is the mind, body and soul of the body corporate.

dpwozney · November 2, 2020

On 7/28/2020 at 4:28 AM, dpwozney said:

The Governor General of Canada is a "corporation sole", according to Elizabeth the Second in this document.

A "corporation sole" is defined and recognized as being a corporation.

It is a fiction that a corporation is a person.

"A corporation is a fiction, by definition, ...", according to Patrick Healy in a statement found in evidence provided to the Canadian Parliament's Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights in 2002.

"A corporation is a 'fiction' as it has no separate existence, no physical body and no 'mind'", according to Joanne Klineberg in a presentation to the Canadian Aviation Safety Seminar in 2004.

In 1863, "... government of the people, by the people, for the people, ..." was mentioned in the Gettysburg Address.

Subsequent court decisions supported the notion of corporate personhood with a corporation being a fictitious person.

As a result, "... government of the people, by the people, for the people, ..." can thus be transformed into "government of the corporations, by the corporations, for the corporations".

Army Guy · November 8, 2020

On 8/21/2020 at 9:11 PM, Queenmandy85 said:

What is to reform? Constitutional Monarchy works well. Japan, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, the UK, the Netherlands, and New Zealand, all have Constitutional Monarchs. The GG in Canada serves at HM's pleasure. As long as the Queen and her successors have confidence in the GG, the matter is settled.

I think it is because it is not ours. It is like we borrowed it, because we lacked any imagination to come up with one of our own. That and it is outdated....

Queenmandy85 · November 8, 2020

Of course the Queen is our own. She is a Canadian citizen.

How would you designate someone else to be the Monarch? Do you install Prince Andrew and on who's authority?

JohnnyCanuck · November 8, 2020

1 hour ago, Queenmandy85 said:

Of course the Queen is our own. She is a Canadian citizen.

How would you designate someone else to be the Monarch? Do you install Prince Andrew and on who's authority?

The question on the Australian monarchy referendum 21 years ago was NOT 'do you want the queen yes or no?' It was 'Do you want Australia to become a Republic yes or no'. Autralians were about 35% Queen Lovers 'she does a good job etc', and 35% Queen Haters ' they are parasites', 'we don't need to pay for Kings and Queens in the 21st Century'. The remaining 30% were a bit more thoughtful. Their thought was 'What would this Republic look like?' When they discovered the proposed Australian Republic was merely a change of title of the GG to President, and the existing status quo would remain in place, they quickly said 'no thanks'. They wanted the Republic to be something better than they have now.

Let us all be wary of proposals to remove the monarchy that just involve a lard-arse GG being given the title of lard-arse President. BUT - it there is a decent proposal of a fair and equal republic, with garbage like 4 MPS and 4 Senators for the 150,000 people in PEI, swept away - then lets go for it.

JohnnyCanuck · November 8, 2020

This topic was opened up in July 2020 , in early september 2020 the Privy Council hired Quintet Consulting Corporation to conduct a 'review' into the allegations made by the CBC about Payette. They said the 'review' will be confidential. They have been diligently working away on this now for 8 solid weeks, has anyone heard anything? Does anyone expect to hear anything more on this?... other than perhaps 'the govt are considering the report produced by Quintet. It is almost as if they are delaying and delaying , until Payette's term runs out, then it won't be an issue any more, and the Govt won't have to answer anything. Surely Justin is not going to stoop that low ?

Queenmandy85 · November 9, 2020

17 hours ago, JohnnyCanuck said:

They wanted the Republic to be something better than they have now.

A republic cannot be better than anything we have now. We have been a Monarchy for four centuries. Republics give us Heads of State who are political and governments embroiled in instability.

France has had nothing but chaos since they chose to become a republic rather than a constitutional monarchy. Israel and Germany are constantly in unstable coalition governments. Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Japan, the UK, etc. have stability. ( I do wish we could trade Trudeau with PM Ardern of New Zealand.)

A Head of State must be above politics, with, if possible, years of pre-job training. That being said, Our longest serving Head of State came to power as a toddler, but grew into the job to become a highly effective Head of State.

17 hours ago, JohnnyCanuck said:

they are parasites', 'we don't need to pay for Kings and Queens in the 21st Century'.

We pay virtually nothing for the Queen. Our cousins in the UK spend more for the Embassy in Paris than for the up keep of the Monarchy.

JohnnyCanuck · November 14, 2020

On 11/9/2020 at 6:44 AM, Queenmandy85 said:

A republic cannot be better than anything we have now. We have been a Monarchy for four centuries. Republics give us Heads of State who are political and governments embroiled in instability.

We pay virtually nothing for the Queen. Our cousins in the UK spend more for the Embassy in Paris than for the up keep of the Monarchy.

You are missing my point - A fair and equitable Republic where all citizens have equal political weight is what I am after. A republic with an equal elected and effective senate, a republic where there is one MP for every 125,000 citizens regardless of province. The current unfair system where maritime provinces are unfairly overrepresented must be swept away. If we could get reform of the Senate, and a fair redistribution of federal ridings under the current system **, then the Queen can stay. She is harmless and irrelevant. However the way things sit with the status quo benefiting from the way the country is currently set up today, it looks like like the move to a Republic is the only chance to redefine Canada as a full and fair democracy.

**(the current system being one where Ontario and Quebec run the country to their advantage vs the Western Provinces, they always get supported by the maritime provinces by promises of bribes and handouts after the elections. The center plus the east outweigh the political strength of the Western Provinces. )

Edited November 14, 2020 by JohnnyCanuck

Michael Hardner · November 14, 2020

17 minutes ago, JohnnyCanuck said:

**(the current system being one where Ontario and Quebec run the country to their advantage vs the Western Provinces, they always get supported by the maritime provinces by promises of bribes and handouts after the elections. The center plus the east outweigh the political strength of the Western Provinces. )

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_of_Canadian_federal_ridings

You can sort by population and see how Ontario is being screwed over. By my count we are short 10 seats - which we could reallocate from the Maritimes or the west. All the same to me.

OftenWrong · November 29, 2020

On 11/13/2020 at 8:33 PM, JohnnyCanuck said:

The current unfair system where maritime provinces are unfairly overrepresented must be swept away

Why, if its not causing us any big problems. Democracy is not the tyranny of the masses.

Queenmandy85 · November 29, 2020

1 hour ago, OftenWrong said:

Why, if its not causing us any big problems. Democracy is not the tyranny of the masses.

I could refer you to some Republicans in the US who say democracy IS the tyranny of the masses. They say the US is Not a democracy. It is a Republic.

On 11/13/2020 at 7:33 PM, JohnnyCanuck said:

**(the current system being one where Ontario and Quebec run the country to their advantage vs the Western Provinces,

the status of Ontario and Quebec is dictated by geography. No constitutional alterations can overcome geography.

On 9/25/2020 at 7:22 PM, -TSS- said:

Sounds to me like if the office of GG was abolished hardly anybody would notice any difference. His/her duties only include the formal appointments and granting resignations of the government.

So you are suggesting direct rule by the Queen. While that would be a benifit to Canadians, it would put a dreadful load on the Monarch. She would be in a position of having to micro-manage. Her job is to over-see affairs. That is why she appoints ministers to run her government and that has been the way it has worked for over four centuries.

OftenWrong · November 29, 2020

2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said:

I could refer you to some Republicans in the US who say democracy IS the tyranny of the masses. They say the US is Not a democracy. It is a Republic.

Even so, that is how the agreement on confederacy was founded. Shall we now rescind our agreement, after the provinces signed on board?

Useless discussion really, in that context. Mental "exercise", for lack of better term.

Edited November 29, 2020 by OftenWrong

Queenmandy85 · November 29, 2020

1 hour ago, OftenWrong said:

Useless discussion really, in that context. Mental "exercise", for lack of better term.

Agreed.

-TSS- · November 29, 2020

There's no point in replacing the monarchy with a republic of a ceremonial president like in Germany, Italy etc. What would be the point of doing that?

As for presidency with large powers like in the USA and France I think experience from those countries has showed that is not an ideal system either.

Nefarious Banana · January 21, 2021

Bump

Aristides · January 21, 2021

On 8/31/2020 at 12:01 PM, SpankyMcFarland said:

Apart from NZ, they have their own monarchs. By contrast, we have a foreigner who gave up visiting us some time ago. It's time we grew up and at least made the GG a more serious position à la the presidencies of Israel or Germany.

Australia as well.

US News ranking of countries with the best quality of life had the top six and seven out of the top ten as constitutional monarchies.

Canada, Australia and New Zealand were all on the list.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Aristides

Argus · January 22, 2021

45 minutes ago, Nefarious Banana said:

Bump

She was a terrible governor general, lacking the dignity and temperament. Every woman appointed to this job seems to have mistaken being the representative of the Queen to BEING a Queen.

Edited January 22, 2021 by Argus