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Did Trudeau Fail His Country On Covid-19


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The thread "Trudeau Government FAILED in Handling the Pandemic" was merged into this thread. 

Did Trudeau Fail His Country On Covid-19  

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10 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

The thing is, stats can be completely misleading if used properly, and CBC used the covid stats for Canada and the US properly in order to give you your opinion.

They convinced you that the covid stats for a place like NYC should be similar to the combined covid stats for Yellowknife, Whitehorse, Fort Mac, Sudbury, Timmins, Churchhill, Flin Flon, Fort Assiniboine, Truro, Charlottetown, Biggar, Moosamin, Spuzzum, Grand Forks, Thunder Bay, Petawawa, Moncton, Leduc, Gravenhurst, Swift Current, Lethbridge, Vermillion, Vernon, and Labrador. You'll have to take my word for it, that's not the case.

The trouble is that taking your word for it involves either deciphering your string and post-it note salads or swallowing your hooey about CNN's mind-controlling rays being in charge of CBC's and my thinking.  I'm guessing your PPE kit includes tinfoil.

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Just now, WestCanMan said:

Explain California, with a larger pop than Canada, 10X our pop density, and less covid deaths, despite the fact that the Dems were PROMOTING mass gatherings there as late as Feb 24th?

If you can't then you're just admitting that you're an idiot.

Strict Social Distancing Measures.

I know you keep citing Nancy Pelosi. But San Fran was pretty much the first large city to declare a Stay at Home Order on March 16th.  

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Just now, eyeball said:

The trouble is that taking your word for it involves either deciphering your string and post-it note salads or swallowing your hooey about CNN's mind-controlling rays being in charge of CBC's and my thinking.  I'm guessing your PPE kit includes tinfoil.

Don't take my word for it. Think about it. Weight the merits of different arguments instead of just blindly assuming that the CBC is right despite the fact that they have never questioned a single thing that Trudeau did re: covid.

They're questioning Trump, as if thats even any of their business.

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Just now, Boges said:

Strict Social Distancing Measures.

I know you keep citing Nancy Pelosi. But San Fran was pretty much the first large city to declare a Stay at Home Order on March 16th.  

So they started social distancing when we did, and you think that makes them a bad comp for Canada? 'Splain?

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Just now, Boges said:

Without testing, it's impossible to know if people are getting sick or dying of COVID or the Flu. 

OMG you'll go to any lengths to deny cognitive dissonance from entering your head lol.  

Just for you Boges "Trudeau did everything perfectly or everyone in Canada would have died right on Feb 1". Now rest your little head. 

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Just now, WestCanMan said:

Explain California, with a larger pop than Canada, 10X our pop density, and less covid deaths, despite the fact that the Dems were PROMOTING mass gatherings there as late as Feb 24th?

First you have to explain how CNN controls CBC. You've been making this assertion since the Before Times without once ever explaining how that works.

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If you can't then you're just admitting that you're an idiot.

I'm simply admitting I need your help in understanding how you arrive at your conclusions so I can test your methodology.

One step at a time from the top. The CNN mind control thingy and then the salad.

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Just now, WestCanMan said:

OMG you'll go to any lengths to deny cognitive dissonance from entering your head lol.  

Just for you Boges "Trudeau did everything perfectly or everyone in Canada would have died right on Feb 1". Now rest your little head. 

Everyone is saying that Testing is the only way to gauge the spread of the disease. 

As noted previously. The idea that this was a disease that only came from people that had travelled to China (as was the theory in February) is probably false and people were probably getting it in January. 

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1 minute ago, eyeball said:

First you have to explain how CNN controls CBC. You've been making this assertion since the Before Times without once ever explaining how that works.

I'm simply admitting I need your help in understanding how you arrive at your conclusions so I can test your methodology.

One step at a time from the top. The CNN mind control thingy and then the salad.

You finally admitted that you need my help to understanding things, thats a start.

Just read my posts and learn instead of denying.

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7 minutes ago, Boges said:

Strict Social Distancing Measures.

I know you keep citing Nancy Pelosi. But San Fran was pretty much the first large city to declare a Stay at Home Order on March 16th.  

Yup. First Nations around here were dragging logs across roads leading into their communities while toilet paper was flying off the shelves the same day.  It's uncanny.

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21 minutes ago, eyeball said:

You should have an idea, you're in here supporting the assumption and making it pretty clear ideology is a big reason why.

Nonsense. The thread title is not "Did Trudeau kill 4,000 people.

It asks if he failed his country regarding Covid-19.

Some want to compare Trudeau's response to Trump's. At the moment I'm considering that one.

If you would like specific claims on where Trudeau's response lagged behind Trump's I would direct you, once more, here:

https://tnc.news/2020/04/01/trudeau-trailed-behind-trump-by-days-and-even-weeks-in-coronavirus-response/

 

Edited by Infidel Dog
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15 minutes ago, Boges said:

If you're not testing, how can you be sure any given dead person died of COVID-19. 

If covid is bad enough that we need to shut down the country to stop people from dying from it, then there must be enough symptoms that we are able to tell when people are dying from it, right?

Also, when people die, they do get tested for covid.

My wife's father just passed away less than a week ago in a care home. They tested him for covid and said that it was negative, and we have no reason to believe otherwise. He had dementia for a long time and wasn't able to swallow anymore. 

 

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5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

If covid is bad enough that we need to shut down the country to stop people from dying from it, then there must be enough symptoms that we are able to tell when people are dying from it, right?

Symptoms are just your bodies reaction to the virus. They aren't universal. 

Ultimately both disease lead to lung or renal failure (if fatal). 

I'm hearing some young people are getting stroke or blood clots from COVID-19. How would you assume that earlier. There could have been many similar cases undetected. 

Quote

Also, when people die, they do get tested for covid.

Do we know that for sure? I guess only if they were already assumed to have it initially. Ontario gives rather detailed figures on COVID-19 everyday. I don't have the resolve or time to research similar numbers in other states, provinces or countries just to score points in an internet debate. 

 

Quote

My wife's father just passed away less than a week ago in a care home. They tested him for covid and said that it was negative, and we have no reason to believe otherwise. He had dementia for a long time and wasn't able to swallow anymore. 

As callous as it sounds, People go to these places to die. The increases death rate could be evidence of DNR orders where people aren't put on Ventilators in LTC homes. 

Edited by Boges
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1 hour ago, Infidel Dog said:

If you would like specific claims on where Trudeau's response lagged behind Trump's blah blah blah

The main touted response being Trump's so-called travel ban that never happened. Thousands of planes and well over a million people poured into the US thru a screening process as lax as just about any other country around the planet including our's.

If you expect any respect for anything you put forth as evidence you need to stop putting something that never happened at the top of the pile.

Like I said figures lie and liars figure.

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51 minutes ago, Boges said:

Symptoms are just your bodies reaction to the virus. They aren't universal. 

Ultimately both disease lead to lung or renal failure (if fatal). 

As callous as it sounds, People go to these places to die. The increases death rate could be evidence of DNR orders where people aren't put on Ventilators in LTC homes. 

He was DNR. He was put on palliative because he wasn't able to eat anymore. It was a mess before that. 

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Do we know that for sure? I guess only if they were already assumed to have it initially. Ontario gives rather detailed figures on COVID-19 everyday. I don't have the resolve or time to research similar numbers in other states, provinces or countries just to score points in an internet debate. 

They test people in care homes for sure, it's too important to not know, but I think pretty much everyone who dies gets at least a preliminary autopsy. 

Quote

I'm hearing some young people are getting stroke or blood clots from COVID-19. How would you assume that earlier. There could have been many similar cases undetected. 

I've heard of healthy young people getting strokes before covid. I saw a show one time blaming it on chiropractors. It's not unheard of. 

I don't know what to think about covid anymore because new testing is saying that so many people have it that the death rate is back down to below .2%

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Coronavirus (COVID-19) Mortality Rate

Last updated: March 5, 3:00 GMT 

See also: Death Rate by Age and Sex of COVID-19 patients

On this page:

 

From Nat Post: https://nationalpost.com/news/world/utterly-unreliable-the-mystery-behind-the-true-covid-19-death-rate

Quote

The figure at the root of so much global angst about coronavirus is currently 4.7 per cent.

That is the proportion of people, as of Sunday afternoon, who have died after being diagnosed with the virus — 32,137 out of the 685,623 who have tested positive for Covid-19 around the world.

It compares with a death rate of around 0.1 per cent for seasonal flu and 0.2 per cent for pneumonia in high-income countries. However, 4.7 per cent is not only changeable but frustratingly unreliable, both for governments seeking to calibrate their policy response and for citizens trying to gauge how much they should worry.

If the death rate among confirmed cases is 4.7% then the real mortality rate is far lower, because so many people don't get sick enough to bother with testing. Some even remain asymptomatic for the whole time that they're carriers.

I don't know how they arrive at the 0.1% mortality rate for the seasonal flu though. It could be determined by this same calculation for all I know. 

Just found this site: https://ourworldindata.org/mortality-risk-covid

They do a really good of explaining the difference between case fatality rate, crude fatality rate, and infected fatality rate.

IFR is what we all really want to know: If you get it, what's your chance of dying? 

Crude fatality rate isn't something you see very often, just in the really bad ones:

Quote

 A common example is the Spanish flu pandemic in 1918. One estimate, by Johnson and Mueller (2002), is that that pandemic killed 50 million people.2 That would have been 2.7% of the world population at the time. This means the crude mortality rate was 2.7%. 

But 2.7% is often misreported as the case fatality rate – which is wrong, because not everyone in the world was infected with Spanish flu. If the crude mortality rate really was 2.7%, then the case fatality rate was much higher – it would be the percentage of people who died after being diagnosed with the disease.

 

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