The Coronavirus

WestCanMan · May 1, 2020

6 hours ago, Independent1986 said:

The point I was trying to make is that nowadays is irrelevant who has the truth because at the end of the day every human being goes through life and reaches certain conclusions which he or she thinks is the truth and that is precisely why the Western democracies as flawed as they are, they are great, it never allows an individual to have complete power to impose his truth.

The truth IS... the... truth. Period.

If people would try to actually gain a 100% understanding of an event before accepting the spin that's put on it that would be awesome.

Eg, there is a majority of people on this site who will swear that the Canadian gov't did a better job fighting against covid than the US did but not one single person can point to a single action that was taken by our government prior to March 16th to slow down the spread of the virus into or around this country. Canada did nothing at all. They helped stop covid like I helped the '87 Oilers win the Cup.

Instead of looking at the direct actions that we all know were taken by both sides, people rush to look for some twisted way to register a hit. They say stupid shit like: "The US [with 8x our population density] has way more covid than us! NYC [with 13,500x our population density, and the population of BC riding their subway every day] has way more covid than our whole country, and even our big cities [which do not compare in any way - even the GTA is small and vastly spread out by comparison, with 1/16th the population density].

People see what they want to see and that's actually a problem, because it makes them easy to control.

eyeball · May 1, 2020

6 hours ago, Independent1986 said:

Do you imagine waiting 2 hours in line to get 1 egg ?

Sure I can see how that might happen when you've got a complete moron in charge. But do you really imagine this is what Canadian or any other modern Western 'lefties' want or would stand for any longer than you? If you do I think I can safely say your thoughts are pickled in right-wing Kool-aid.

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In the west we have the luxury to argue and have competing ideas, some of them based on lies or on our BIAS, some of them based on truth. Is good that free elections exists here so we can penalize the individuals that seem to use BIAS and lie in their governing. Like Trump talking about coronavirus treatment meanwhile he has no medical background or Bernie Sanders talking about income inequality meanwhile he has 2 houses and 1 cottage.

Simply using your right to vote to punish some liar often years after the fact trivializes that right to a degree that its become a joke. An outraged vote is simply a weaponized opportunity to be exploited by some other liar, the rise of Trump being a perfect example. I saw you exhibit a low regard for lying politicians in another post and this should be something we can find deep agreement on. The difference perhaps is that I propose means other than voting to protect against political lying, starting with outlawing in-camera lobbying.

I'm pretty sure the sort of inequality Bernie Sanders is talking about has to do with a plant floor employee and a CEO where the CEO earns more by lunchtime on Jan 1st than his employee will make by the next Dec 31st. I suspect the reason for this sort of disparity has something to do with the ability of the CEO to sequester some lying politician behind a closed door in some smoke-filled back room where no one can hear or see what's being discussed, promised or agreed to.

People only seem to to think about equality as it relates to a democratic economic outcome while rarely if ever considering the unequal input of influence that's often at the front end of the economic process. As we used to say around the table discussing how to share fish quotas its hard to stab a competitor in the back when he's sitting across the table from you - that's what back rooms are for. This perhaps explains how after thousands of businesses and people lost their livelihoods up and down the coast following a fisheries restructuring process dubbed a "fleet rationalization" that BC's richest billionaire wound up controlling 40% percent of the quota. I don't recall talking about that outcome around the table at all. There's only one place that outcome could have been discussed.

Doing something about this kind of inequality has a lot more to do with redistributing power than redistributing wealth and if that makes me a Marxist in someones eyes then I'd say that person is as blind as a bat and willfully so.

And what does any of this have to do with COVID-19? Well, just imagine how smokey and secretive the back rooms where Xi Jinping hangs out in are.

Edited May 1, 2020 by eyeball

WestCanMan · May 1, 2020

17 minutes ago, Argus said:

No one who unwaveringly supports Trump gets to use honesty as a measure of morality.

I don't "unwaveringly support Trump." I've acknowledged his egregious flaws. He doesn't always tell the truth, but he's far more accurate than CNN any day of the week. He's the poster boy for hubris. He's ruthless at times. He puts Americans 1,000% ahead of everyone else on earth. He's a dastardly pro-lifer. He's a crass playboy, philanderer and a pig. He had an affair with a porn star and a playboy bunny and he got them to sign NDAs. So what? Would Nadler, Schiff or Schumer have gotten with those women if they thought that they could get away with it? Not one of those guys would have turned down the Playboy bunny. Not one. Chances are that at least one of those guys did far worse. Hillary's husband did far worse and Dem hypocrites don't care that Hillary punched down on bill's victims and called them bimbos, etc.

Can you point me to where something that I said in the Russian collusion threads was even the slightest bit inaccurate? We have the benefit of hindsight now, we should dig some of that stuff up and reminisce. I have probably 500 posts there, maybe more. Then go through the Kavanaugh threads, see what you can find there that's even a little bit inaccurate. Then comb the covid threads for something that isn't 100% true. I bet that I have over 1,000 posts between those 3 topics. Surely you can find where I said something that wasn't true, or was at least inaccurate, if I'm just being a toady.

Then let's look at your posts. Let's look at eyeball and boges and godzilla to see how many of their posts pass the sniff test with the benefit of hindsight.

eyeball · May 1, 2020

9 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I bet that I have over 1,000 posts between those 3 topics. Surely you can find where I said something that wasn't true, or was at least inaccurate, if I'm just being a toady.

You don't have to look very far, you said something completely untrue in this very post.

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He puts Americans 1,000% ahead of everyone else on earth.

He always put's himself first.

-TSS- · May 1, 2020

Our figures in Finland are just too good to be true, or yes they are true, but I mean that they would stay that good. Yes, we are very good by nature at social distancing compared to the Southern-European cointries where touchy feely hugging and kissing on both cheeks is the norm but even considering that aspect I expect things to get worse here in Finland too.

Yet, I'm not sure whether the strict lockdown-policies adopted in France, Italy, Spain etc is the right course to take. I can understand banning mass-gatherings like sport, concerts etc because they are high risk/low priority but is shutting down the entire economy the right path to take.

I don't agree with the multiple conspiracy-theorists around this issue but I think it is little wonder there are conspiracy-theories around this issue. Too many weird things going on.

Boges · May 1, 2020

1 minute ago, -TSS- said:

Our figures in Finland are just too good to be true, or yes they are true, but I mean that they would stay that good. Yes, we are very good by nature at social distancing compared to the Southern-European cointries where touchy feely hugging and kissing on both cheeks is the norm but even considering that aspect I expect things to get worse here in Finland too.

Yet, I'm not sure whether the strict lockdown-policies adopted in France, Italy, Spain etc is the right course to take. I can understand banning mass-gatherings like sport, concerts etc because they are high risk/low priority but is shutting down the entire economy the right path to take.

I don't agree with the multiple conspiracy-theorists around this issue but I think it is little wonder there are conspiracy-theories around this issue. Too many weird things going on.

The death toll in those countries were staggering per capita. They were forced into that scenario or face a total collapse of their healthcare systems.

You see Shut downs in North America in order to avoid that fate.

Note that Sweden, who weren't so eager to enforce social distancing haven't fared much better.

WestCanMan · May 1, 2020

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

You don't have to look very far, you said something completely untrue in this very post.

He always put's himself first.

That's nothing more than your own opinion, which is of zero value in a debate about actual verifiable facts.

If you want to call me on the fact that there's no such thing as 1,000% percent, that's not really your business. I believe that Argus is smart enough to know that I did not I literally mean "1,000%" and he's the one I said it to.

Argus · May 1, 2020

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I don't "unwaveringly support Trump." I've acknowledged his egregious flaws. He doesn't always tell the truth, but he's far more accurate than CNN any day of the week.

No, he quite simply is not. Not even remotely so. And I've been criticizing the mainstream media's bias for a lot longer than the phrase 'mainstream media' has been around.

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

He's the poster boy for hubris. He's ruthless at times. He puts Americans 1,000% ahead of everyone else on earth.

No, he puts HIMSELF 1000% ahead of anyone else on earth. America is way, way, WAY down the ladder in that respect.

SpankyMcFarland · May 2, 2020

As has already been noted, Greece’s official COVID-19 figures are impressively low.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/greece/

This good news story appears to be confirmed by data on excess mortality from all causes, showing that the country has not had a recent spike, unlike many of its European neighbours:

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Whatever the cause of the parallel spikes in Covid-19 and other deaths, the same pattern appears in many countries. Data from the EuroMOMO project shows high excess mortality across much of western Europe in the first half of spring, with spikes in Belgium, France, Italy, the Netherlands, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland and the UK. Countries that appear to have smaller Covid-19 outbreaks, such as Austria, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Greece, Ireland and Norway, show very little rise, if any at all.
https://fullfact.org/health/covid-deaths/

Edited May 2, 2020 by SpankyMcFarland

Independent1986 · May 2, 2020

What really worries me is that China is not reporting their numbers so is hard to have a reference point to go by for the timeline. If we go out too early and we are forced to go back in it will cripple the economy even more and stuff like this: https://toronto.citynews.ca/video/2020/04/23/i-lost-my-house-everything-restaurant-owner-says-coronavirus-has-forced-him-out-of-business/ will become normal.

There was an interview on the TV with a South Korean doctor and at one point the interviewer asked him "When will this end?". The response was "this is science" and I was expecting an academic response but he continued: "this is science, it is unpredictable what will happen, our best chance is to remain humble and do our best".

Edited May 2, 2020 by Independent1986

-TSS- · May 2, 2020

Are you in Canada in a lockdown? In big cities at least?

I'm glad here in Finland they have not imposed any absolute curfews as such would be ridiculous in a sparsely populated country as ours and ours is nowhere near as sparsely populated as yours is.

Bars and restaurants are shut as are many public places such as libraries or sporting facilities.

OftenWrong · May 2, 2020

33 minutes ago, -TSS- said:

Bars and restaurants are shut as are many public places such as libraries or sporting facilities.

Are other business and workplaces still running in Finland?

marcus · May 2, 2020

On 4/30/2020 at 7:05 AM, WestCanMan said:

Can you find video on CBC where they talk about Michel Fournier and SNC’s history of bribing Canadian politicians, while they were talking about Trudeau’s SNC scandal? It’s pretty relevant, there should be some but I couldn’t find it.

Ive seen SNC describes a company that did bad things abroad. Their criminal activity within the country was never mentioned on any news coverage that I saw.

I'll look for video coverage stats later. It might be a fun project to look into. But to give you an idea of CBC's coverage of SNC vs Mike Duffy, here is some information:

The National Post, known as a right of centre outlet and historically, a pro-conservative media outlet, at least when you look at editorials and opinion pieces. Here is their coverage of SNC vs Mike Duffy:

Note the difference in coverage.

The National Post, the difference in coverage is approximately 2:1 in favour of SNC.

Whereas CBC, the difference in coverage is approximately 5:1 in favour of SNC.

Edited May 2, 2020 by marcus

marcus · May 2, 2020

Video Coverage Comparison:

CBC

Similar coverage. 5:1 coverage in favour of SNC.

The National Post

The National Post has a similar ratio to CBC video. 5:1 coverage in favour of SNC.

Edited May 2, 2020 by marcus

bush_cheney2004 · May 2, 2020

Now this is interesting....WHO doctor has been summoned after refusing to appear.

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OTTAWA — After their invitation was turned down twice, MPs have become more forceful with a top representative of the World Health Organization, issuing a summons to demand he appear in front of the Commons health committee.

Dr. Bruce Aylward is a senior advisor and former assistant director-general with the WHO. He also led an expert group looking at the coronavirus’ emergence in China and has been with the WHO for decades, leading efforts against polio and other deadly diseases.

https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/mps-issue-rare-summons-of-who-doctor-bruce-aylward-to-appear-before-house-committee

Zeitgeist · May 2, 2020

3 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Now this is interesting....WHO doctor has been summoned after refusing to appear.

I want to hear his opinion on Taiwan’s handling of the virus and China’s cover-up early on.

-TSS- · May 2, 2020

12 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Are other business and workplaces still running in Finland?

Mostly yes. Some with reduced hours though.

WestCanMan · May 2, 2020

15 hours ago, marcus said:

I'll look for video coverage stats later. It might be a fun project to look into. But to give you an idea of CBC's coverage of SNC vs Mike Duffy, here is some information:

The National Post, known as a right of centre outlet and historically, a pro-conservative media outlet, at least when you look at editorials and opinion pieces. Here is their coverage of SNC vs Mike Duffy:

Note the difference in coverage.

The National Post, the difference in coverage is approximately 2:1 in favour of SNC.

Whereas CBC, the difference in coverage is approximately 5:1 in favour of SNC.

SNC is already dead. No one has been reporting on it for a long time and it's just over a year old. https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/timeline-the-snc-lavalin-controversy-and-jody-wilson-raybould-1.1221040

Investigations into Duffy received top of the hour coverage on evening news for 3 years, right up to the federal election. When was the last time you saw anything about SNC on the CTV or CBC evening news?

Did you find any video on CBC or CTV mentioning Michel Fournier while they were covering the SNC scandal? I have never seen it.

WestCanMan · May 2, 2020

15 hours ago, marcus said:

Video Coverage Comparison:

CBC

Similar coverage. 5:1 coverage in favour of SNC.

The National Post

The National Post has a similar ratio to CBC video. 5:1 coverage in favour of SNC.

SNC is already dead. No one has been reporting on it for a long time and it's just over a year old. https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/timeline-the-snc-lavalin-controversy-and-jody-wilson-raybould-1.1221040

Investigations into Duffy received top of the hour coverage on evening news for 3 years, right up to the federal election. When was the last time you saw anything about SNC on the CTV or CBC evening news?

Did you find any video on CBC or CTV mentioning Michel Fournier while they were covering the SNC scandal? I have never seen it.

marcus · May 2, 2020

30 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

SNC is already dead. No one has been reporting on it for a long time and it's just over a year old. https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/timeline-the-snc-lavalin-controversy-and-jody-wilson-raybould-1.1221040

Investigations into Duffy received top of the hour coverage on evening news for 3 years, right up to the federal election. When was the last time you saw anything about SNC on the CTV or CBC evening news?

It's not about now or before. CBC's coverage of SNC was higher than Duffy's coverage. Much higher. In fact, in ratio, they talked about SNC a lot more than other news outlets.

Ever looked at The Rebel's coverage of SNC vs Duffy?

30 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Did you find any video on CBC or CTV mentioning Michel Fournier while they were covering the SNC scandal? I have never seen it.

I'll leave your strawman searches to you. The point is not about a name. The point is that you said CBC covered SNC much less than Duffy. I showed you that CBC had MUCH HIGHER coverage of SNC than Duffy. In ratio, higher than The National Post and The Rebel Media.

The only outlet who had a higher coverage of Duffy than SNC? The Rebel Media.

WestCanMan · May 2, 2020

2 hours ago, marcus said:

It's not about now or before. CBC's coverage of SNC was higher than Duffy's coverage. Much higher. In fact, in ratio, they talked about SNC a lot more than other news outlets.

It's not how much, it's how. If they're downplaying it constantly then it doesn't matter how much they "cover" it.

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Ever looked at The Rebel's coverage of SNC vs Duffy?

SNC was an actual scandal with actual guilt on a large scale. IE - the government created a law (tucked into the back half of a 550+ page omnibus bill) specifically to help a criminal entity avoid the consequences of their own illegal actions. That's the only reason the DPA law even exists. Then he helped SNC again by trying to coerce the AG to use the DPA law even though it wasn't proper, in the eyes of the AG, who's a legal professional. Then the PM turfed the AG, then he punched down on her in public, and he prevented her and other members of his cabinet from telling the truth or cooperating with the RCMP. The media covered this story up at every step of the way, to the greatest extent possible. Even a person like you, who follows politics closely, were left unaware of SNC's history of bribing Liberal politicians.

Duffygate was about $90K in travel claims. Duffy's main home was in Ottawa, but he had a cottage in PEI which he then claimed travel expenses to travel to, as if it was his main residence. That hardly tied the PM in any way, but the PMO wanted him to pay the money back right away so they cleared up his tab. It was inappropriate, but in the end, who was out $90K? What was the net result to the taxpayer? 0$. FWIW, $90K is enough to make 2 blocks of sidewalk, on one side of a street. It's literally nothing on the scale of a federal budget. What Duffy did is regular for these clowns. Trudeau's personal flights on one Florida vacation were over $100,000. That's just the flight cost, because Mr. Global Warming has to fly on a private jet, like all the other global warming truthers. https://thepostmillennial.com/trudeau-flights-from-florida-to-ottawa-will-cost-taxpayers-over-100000/

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I'll leave your strawman searches to you. The point is not about a name. The point is that you said CBC covered SNC much less than Duffy. I showed you that CBC had MUCH HIGHER coverage of SNC than Duffy. In ratio, higher than The National Post and The Rebel Media.

The only outlet who had a higher coverage of Duffy than SNC? The Rebel Media.

The point is that you know you're getting biased coverage when an entirely relevant topic, like Michel Fournier, is well known to the media but is completely verboten.

Edited May 2, 2020 by WestCanMan

-TSS- · May 3, 2020

Even though the figures for Sweden are horrific now but what will they be in 2-3 months time in comparison to other countries? I mean, as a Finn I know those Swedes simply have some sort of skill to always land safely and avoid the worst.

taxme · May 3, 2020

On 4/29/2020 at 2:10 PM, bush_cheney2004 said:

The WHO also failed in very important ways....failure to declare a pandemic soon enough....failure to quickly announce human-to-human transmission....and failure to endorse travel bans.

Well, that is because the globalist plans for this plandemic exercise where not all yet prepared to kick into action back then. At that time they were telling us all that it was still okay to go outside and get plenty of fresh air and sunshine and lots of exercise. Then all of a sudden along came shut down and social distancing(engineering). It's all a hoax, folks.

taxme · May 3, 2020

On 5/2/2020 at 12:11 AM, bush_cheney2004 said:

Now this is interesting....WHO doctor has been summoned after refusing to appear.

Another deep state operative. Hopefully one day more like that pos will be summoned for all of us to hear about their lies. It's all a hoax, folks.

taxme · May 3, 2020

19 minutes ago, -TSS- said:

Even though the figures for Sweden are horrific now but what will they be in 2-3 months time in comparison to other countries? I mean, as a Finn I know those Swedes simply have some sort of skill to always land safely and avoid the worst.

Most of the China virus victim numbers have been fabricated. Many people are dying from many other diseases out there, but most of those people that are dying are being lumped in with those that are dying from some seasonal flu which is now called the China virus. When a swab test is done on some dead person, and it showed that they had the China virus, which we all carry around in our body, they will then be lumped in with this seasonal flu virus deaths, even though the person may have died from a heart attack. It's all a hoax, folks, and what the globalists want is for everyone to be vaccinated. Up theirs, mate.