Michael Hardner Posted August 26, 2017 Report Share Posted August 26, 2017 Look. Your first link is not about paying news organizations to air content. It's something else entirely. Care to address that? What happened? Will you restate what we're trying to prove before we move on because I can't stand pursuing unclear, scattered arguments. I never learn anything from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 Getting rid of DACA (Where people who came to the US as children can stay in the country) is probably the cruelest and most racist things Trump has done to date. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 25 minutes ago, Boges said: Getting rid of DACA (Where people who came to the US as children can stay in the country) is probably the cruelest and most racist things Trump has done to date. And he tries to take the sting out of it by handing it back to congress for six months. The ~34% GOP drones who make up his base will likely buy his bullshit yet again. Sad case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 1 hour ago, Boges said: Getting rid of DACA (Where people who came to the US as children can stay in the country) is probably the cruelest and most racist things Trump has done to date. I had hoped that he would grandfather this group but close the door on future applicants. DACA was never legislated it was an Obama Executive Order which many think was unconstitutional - but hey - it was Obama so it's okay that he acted without Congress. http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/the-administration/349152-opinion-president-trump-is-right-to-send-daca-back-to DACA was unilaterally ordered by President Obama after Congress refused to approve the program. Some of us criticized the action as a circumvention of the legislative branch that undermined our system of the separation of powers. But because they liked the result, Democratic members yielded their institutional power to the White House and helped create an unchecked presidency. With Trump using the same authority to pursue his own policies, Democratic leaders now want to radically expand the powers of the judiciary to block an uber presidency of their own making. They have become constitutional short sellers who dump core principles as soon as they raise political costs. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted September 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 (edited) 14 minutes ago, scribblet said: I had hoped that he would grandfather this group but close the door on future applicants. I betcha it would come to that. This group will be grandfathered. Edited September 6, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 (edited) No one is saying Trump can't do what he's doing. Just like with Pardoning a dude that randomly asked people for papers, even though a court told him not to, it's what good and moral people shouldn't do. Trump has proven that he's either supremely racist or so completely dependant on racists for the political support he has. Edited September 6, 2017 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 There's only 7 billion people and climbing. Lots of room in Wyoming. And tax payers don't mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 I don't think he's 'supremely racist' because he wants to enforce the law and secure borders. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 3 minutes ago, scribblet said: I don't think he's 'supremely racist' because he wants to enforce the law and secure borders. Oh yes because THIS! is where he thinks enforcing the law is important and not letting a Sherif that openly ignored a court ruling free. DACA recipients are people who want to contribute to society and even pay money to be part of the program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capricorn Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 18 minutes ago, scribblet said: I had hoped that he would grandfather this group but close the door on future applicants. DACA was never legislated it was an Obama Executive Order which many think was unconstitutional - but hey - it was Obama so it's okay that he acted without Congress. http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/the-administration/349152-opinion-president-trump-is-right-to-send-daca-back-to Had Obama brought this matter before Congress rather than deciding unilaterally that he wanted DACA to go forward, the present mess would probably been avoided. What's done is done though. I like the idea of grandfathering today's Dreamers. Yet that won't provide a permanent solution for the children of illegals in the US. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capricorn Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 DACA needs it's own thread, especially as some in Canada are calling for accepting a good number of Dreamers. Someone please start one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 33 minutes ago, capricorn said: Had Obama brought this matter before Congress rather than deciding unilaterally that he wanted DACA to go forward, the present mess would probably been avoided. What's done is done though. I like the idea of grandfathering today's Dreamers. Yet that won't provide a permanent solution for the children of illegals in the US. It's only become a mess due to Trump's approach. He's trying to cover his bigotry with a bait and switch tactic that only his base will be dumb enough to fall for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Omni said: It's only become a mess due to Trump's approach. He's trying to cover his bigotry with a bait and switch tactic that only his base will be dumb enough to fall for. Lots of folks pretty bigoted against illegal border jumpers. You're planning on taking on how many yourself? Edited September 6, 2017 by DogOnPorch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: Lots of folks pretty bigoted against illegal border jumpers. You're planning on taking on how many yourself? Huh? Try to follow the topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 Just now, Omni said: Huh? Try to follow the topic. Zero, eh? Not a surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 9 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Zero, eh? Not a surprise. Yep, 1-zip. Try harder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 55 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Lots of folks pretty bigoted against illegal border jumpers. You're planning on taking on how many yourself? These DACA "Dreamers" are productive members of society. They pay taxes and they even make a fee every two years to stay in the program. They aren't Refugees that are sucking at the gumint teet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capricorn Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 1 hour ago, Omni said: It's only become a mess due to Trump's approach. Trump could have abolished the DACA program by issuing an Executive Order but he did not. In this case at least he's showing respect for Congress by turning the matter toward Congress for resolution. Contrast that to Obama issuing an Executive Order to bring DACA into force. Quote He's trying to cover his bigotry with a bait and switch tactic that only his base will be dumb enough to fall for. I'm just as aware as the next person of Trump's failings and there are many. Yet, it's not up to me to determine whether his actions in this case were due to bigotry. That said it would be so very easy to jump on the "hate Trump" bandwagon. I will not do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Boges said: These DACA "Dreamers" are productive members of society. They pay taxes and they even make a fee every two years to stay in the program. They aren't Refugees that are sucking at the gumint teet. It's such a great idea that Congress wasn't needed. Edited September 6, 2017 by DogOnPorch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 10 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: It's such a great idea that Congress wasn't needed. Seems Trumps whole first week was devoted to executive orders. But when Obama does it, SHAME!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 1 hour ago, Boges said: These DACA "Dreamers" are productive members of society. So are a lot of other illegal U.S. immigrants...including those from Canada. But that doesn't mean they get special treatment. President Trump did the right thing.....Congress has been avoiding this issue for many years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 (edited) 5 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: So are a lot of other illegal U.S. immigrants...including those from Canada. But that doesn't mean they get special treatment. President Trump did the right thing.....Congress has been avoiding this issue for many years. Yeah deporting people who have no connection to the country they were born in is sooo MAGA. Especially when 100% of the people in DACA have no criminal record. Trump certainly was trumpeting following the letter of the law when pardoning a Sheriff that willfully ignored a court order. Look I'm not debating that Trump has the right to do this or not. He clearly does. I'm just saying he's a cruel racist. Edited September 6, 2017 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 It seems Trump's entire narrative around an Immigration policy is that Mexico is sending Rapists and Bad Hombres. That's completely undercut when he goes after people that have lived their entire adult lives in America as productive members of society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Boges said: Yeah deporting people who have no connection to the country they were born in is sooo MAGA. Especially when 100% of the people in DACA have no criminal record. Trump certainly was trumpeting following the letter of the law when pardoning a Sheriff that willfully ignored a court order. Look I'm not debating that Trump has the right to do this or not. He clearly does. I'm just saying he's a cruel racist. Has nothing to do with being a racist....Congress should have passed legislation years ago to provide legal residency. The U.S. is not the Promised Land for every illegal that manages to get in the country, regardless of circumstances. ...and 100% of DACA illegals have not remained crime free. http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/feds-30-surge-in-illegals-losing-daca-freedom-for-crimes-gang-violence/article/2632820 Edited September 6, 2017 by bush_cheney2004 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 9 minutes ago, Boges said: Seems Trumps whole first week was devoted to executive orders. But when Obama does it, SHAME!!! That's awesome. ----- How many more exceptions should be made for those in the USA illegally? Isn't this just another way of saying you'd prefer no borders? No borders for USA/Canada/Europe/Australia, at least... Are you a post-national type of fellow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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