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Posted

What Trump is saying is referring to the Mexicans that come to the US, not all Mexicans. He's saying that more of the bad ones enter the US, and he assumes that some of those ones are good people. He's not speaking of all Mexicans or Mexico in general. If he said this of Mexico in general, then I'd agree with you. Either way it was sloppy language, and typical of Trump, from the hip in a unorganized ramble.

My opinion is that people that are willing to break the law, and enter another country illegally have a lower moral code.

Who cares if he's not talking about Mexicans in Mexico. There's more than a couple in the United States and that doesn't change what I'm arguing. I'm saying that he's hedging racist arguments. Do you really think it's difficult to find good Mexicans living in America? "I'm sure there's some" maybe....possibly....I don't know. I can't believe anyone would even defend this nonsense and think that it's reasonable.

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

You're sure about that, eh?

Well, I asked and you refuse to answer. Regardless whether you are or not. Should we track all white people?

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

My opinion is that people that are willing to break the law, and enter another country illegally have a lower moral code.
I missed this in my last reply. You can have whatever opinion you want, but I think your opinion isn't thought out very well. You think the ONLY reason someone would sneak into another country is because they have a lower moral code? Could there be other reasons, like, oh, I dunno....escaping the brutal violence of the cartels and the crushing poverty that many of them face. Perhaps they see no other choice. It's either stay and die or take a chance.

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Trump's mannerisms remind me more of Mussolini than Hitler but that's as far as it goes. Unlike Hitler or Mussolini, Trump doesn't have a political philosophy, he is just a huckster willing to say anything that might appeal to his followers without any regard for the consequences of what comes out of his cake hole.

If he does get elected, he and the US will have to wear all the crap he has spewed.

"Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC

Posted

White Muslims preaching violence...

Oh, now just the Muslims preaching violence.

That's more like it.

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Trump's mannerisms remind me more of Mussolini than Hitler but that's as far as it goes. Unlike Hitler or Mussolini, Trump doesn't have a political philosophy, he is just a huckster willing to say anything that might appeal to his followers without any regard for the consequences of what comes out of his cake hole.

If he does get elected, he and the US will have to wear all the crap he has spewed.

You're definitely right. Trump is no Hitler. Mackenzie King once said that "[Hitler] is the Joan of Arc of his people." Trump can't even garner the kind of respect that Hitler initially had in the international community.

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted (edited)

If we're going to be tracking Muslims like we track...say....the Hell's Angels...or the KKK...I'd think the ones preaching violence would be my first go-to re: Islamic terrorism. How about you?

Oh sure. I absolutely agree. I don't agree that we should be tracking Muslims, as in generally ALL Muslims though. Why would I even argue against tracking violent radicals? The problem is there's some around here who conflate violent radicals with ALL of Islam. Like, you know, they'll say things about the track record of "the Islamic Faith," as opposed to actually identifying that they're not talking about Islam at all, but radical Islamofascists.

Edit: Took out the insult because I usually respect you.

Edited by cybercoma

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Oh sure. I absolutely agree. I don't agree that we should be tracking Muslims, as in generally ALL Muslims though. Why would I even argue against tracking violent radicals? The problem is there's some around here who conflate violent radicals with ALL of Islam. Like, you know, they'll say things about the track record of "the Islamic Faith," as opposed to actually identifying that they're not talking about Islam at all, but radical Islamofascists.

Which Muslims are the bad ones?

Posted

Who cares if he's not talking about Mexicans in Mexico. There's more than a couple in the United States and that doesn't change what I'm arguing. I'm saying that he's hedging racist arguments. Do you really think it's difficult to find good Mexicans living in America? "I'm sure there's some" maybe....possibly....I don't know. I can't believe anyone would even defend this nonsense and think that it's reasonable.

Well like I said, it's sloppy and disorganized and from the hip. But he's speaking specifically of the Mexicans that are being "sent" to the US, whatever that means. Look, the Mexican border is a huge problem in the US. Something has to be done about it. In his sloppy way he's trying to say this.

Posted

Far be it for me to defend Trump, and I'm not a fan at all, but that is both overly dramatic and

The comparison made was not between Trump and Hitler, it was the similarity in the situation. Then, as now, we had someone making inflammatory statements about a group and being wildly popular as a result. Then, as now, we have people saying he doesn't really mean it and it's just politics. It's too soon to draw any further comparisons than that but intelligent people should sit up and take notice. And the GOP should do some soul-searching and figure out how it created this Frankenstein monster and how to contain it.

would be akin to suggesting Bernie Sanders was the next Stalin because he rallies his supporters with anti-capitalism tones combined with ultra-statism.........let us not forget, Uncle Joe killed far more (of his own) people than Hitler........sounds pretty stupid doesn't it?

It sounds stupid because it is stupid; not to mention insulting. Saying Sanders is like Stalin because he says he's a socialist is no different from saying Bloomberg is like Pinochet because they're both capitalists.

Unlimited economic growth has the marvelous quality of stilling discontent while preserving privilege, a fact that has not gone unnoticed among liberal economists.

- Noam Chomsky

It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.

- Upton Sinclair

Posted

Edit: Took out the insult because I usually respect you.

Usually? LOL! Why insult at all?

Look...I know it's VERY tempting to just play the racist card and dispose of my opinion that way. Unfortunately for that tactic, I'm not the one causing the problem with Islam. That's all thanks to other parties besides me. You're free to deny the problem Islam presents to a free society in hopes that it will go away on its own. I don't trust that approach for a second. Islam has been around a long time more or less unchanged from the day it was put forth onto the planet by Mohammad's companions.

Posted

Which Muslims are the bad ones?

Which white people are the bad ones?

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Well like I said, it's sloppy and disorganized and from the hip. But he's speaking specifically of the Mexicans that are being "sent" to the US, whatever that means. Look, the Mexican border is a huge problem in the US. Something has to be done about it. In his sloppy way he's trying to say this.

I think someone should give him a map and let him know the difference between Mexico today and Cuba in 1980-84. It's like he watched Scarface one night and thought Tony Montaña was Mexican.

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Trump's mannerisms remind me more of Mussolini than Hitler but that's as far as it goes. Unlike Hitler or Mussolini, Trump doesn't have a political philosophy, he is just a huckster willing to say anything that might appeal to his followers without any regard for the consequences of what comes out of his cake hole.

If he does get elected, he and the US will have to wear all the crap he has spewed.

Trump has been doing this for decades, too. There's no excuse for his popularity except willful blindness to his past exploits.

Posted

The comparison made was not between Trump and Hitler, it was the similarity in the situation. Then, as now, we had someone making inflammatory statements about a group and being wildly popular as a result.

Right, just like Sanders now, contrasted with Stalin a century ago during the October Revolution.......doesn't

Sanders call his rise in popularity a revolution too?

And the GOP should do some soul-searching and figure out how it created this Frankenstein monster and how to contain it.

Couldn't the same be said with the Democrats and Sanders?
It sounds stupid because it is stupid; not to mention insulting. Saying Sanders is like Stalin because he says he's a socialist is no different from saying Bloomberg is like Pinochet because they're both capitalists.

Again, that is my point, comparing Sanders to Stalin is as stupid as comparing Trump to Hitler.........or Bloomberg to Pinochet etc............doing so only lowers the level of discourse.

Posted (edited)

Usually? LOL! Why insult at all?

Look...I know it's VERY tempting to just play the racist card and dispose of my opinion that way. Unfortunately for that tactic, I'm not the one causing the problem with Islam. That's all thanks to other parties besides me. You're free to deny the problem Islam presents to a free society in hopes that it will go away on its own. I don't trust that approach for a second. Islam has been around a long time more or less unchanged from the day it was put forth onto the planet by Mohammad's companions.

I'm not playing the "racist card" at all. I pointed out that you said "the Islamic Faith" without regard to the fact that following and monitoring people based on their religion is stupid and wrong. Profiling based on race or religion is illegal for a reason and in this case you're advocating that we monitor everyone who is Muslim. Like, let's give them all ID cards and arrest them if they don't have them on them when asked. Maybe we can tattoo them all with ID numbers or something and just not have to worry about it, eh?

To try to show you how stupid the argument is, I keep pressing you about monitoring white people, due to their track record of violence. There's all kinds of people who assault and murder others in the name of White Power, but I've never seen you advocate for tracking white people. Hell, maybe you think everyone should be monitored. Hell if I know, but I don't think you're that stupid.

When there's evidence to believe that someone is advocating or planning violence, then they should be monitored. We agree on that. I don't agree that people give up their rights simply by being Muslim. I don't believe we just throw out freedom of association and freedom of religion because people who are Muslims are involved in violence in the name of Islam. People are involved in violence in the name of tons of things. We don't go bats*** crazy and start a police state to deal with them. We go after people when there's evidence of their involvement in such things, not everyone of a particular colour or religion.

Edited by cybercoma

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Again...Islam isn't a race, cybercoma. It's a religion like Christianity. Are there no Arab Christians? So let's drop the race baiting...

Quit pretending that you don't understand the point.

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Look, I get it. You're an atheist and everyone who believes in a religion is scum. So f*** 'em. They shouldn't have any rights. You're usually reasonable, but when it comes to this, you're completely wrong and it's your rabid atheism that's making you biased here.

"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions." --Thomas Jefferson

Posted

Look, I get it. You're an atheist and everyone who believes in a religion is scum. So f*** 'em. They shouldn't have any rights. You're usually reasonable, but when it comes to this, you're completely wrong and it's your rabid atheism that's making you biased here.

I appear to be making you angry, so I'll stop here. Have a good day, cyber.

Posted

I'm one of the people who thought calling Bush Jr. Hiltler was an insult, so I don't use the term lightly, but indeed, Trump has the potential to be a Hitler in the making.

According to some, my views place me in good standing with the Pol Pots and Stalins of the world and Hitler too, for also being a lefty apparently.

Then we had Harper comparing the opposition and presumably anyone who didn't agree with him that we were with the terrorists. This should just be water of a ducks back these days it's so common now.

Truth be told I think we all have a little inner tyrant that yearns to be free, no irony intended. Just think how many times people ask themselves, usually in exasperation, "If I was the King/Queen of the world?"

A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.

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