kidnapped Israeli teens bodies found

[cybercoma]

The claim that Hamas is using civilians as "human shields" is based on the fact that Gazan militants live among the civilian population and keep much of their weaponry in the neighborhoods. But this is hypocrisy; every guerrilla army that fights on its own turf against an incomparably stronger enemy fights from among the civilian population. The pre-1948 Irgun and Lehi guerrillas would kill the British, then “melt back” into the Jewish neighborhoods. In Tel Aviv and Ramat Gan, there are civilian public buildings – including schools – with plaques at the entrance telling how they housed weapons caches and training camps for the Irgun, Lehi or Haganah. Up through Israel’s War of Independence, the kibbutzim were military outposts as much as they were civilian settlements.

So then clearly there will be civilian casualties when you attack someone and they respond. Hamas is using innocent Palestinians as pawns to get people like you and jacee to condemn Israel for defending its citizens.

[cybercoma]

Why ever would you say such a silly thing? I'd be open to force, naturally. But I would also be supportive of measures that would, you know, end the threat.

that's exactly what I'm saying.

It's an unnecessary obstruction.

Israel is a state, can be whatever it wants.

Palestine will be too.

Two states that at some point may recognize each other ... or not.

Maybe it doesn't matter.

Maybe it only matters that the mass killing stops.

Maybe Israel's bargaining credibility is getting smaller every day.

.

yeah, it matters to you that Israel stops killing. You're perfectly fine with Hamas doing targeting innocent civilians, because hey...illegal settlements. Edited July 15, 2014 by cybercoma

[jacee]

that's exactly what I'm saying.yeah, it matters to you that Israel stops killing. You're perfectly fine with Hamas doing targeting innocent civilians, because hey...illegal settlements.

Again ... Gaza militants don't seem to be 'targeting' much of anything.

.

Edited July 15, 2014 by jacee

[Smallc]

Not for lack of trying.

[marcus]

So having rockets target innocent civilians in your border is an "excuse" for retaliation? Would you not expect our government to retaliate in that situation?

In this day and age, my government would not be subjecting another group of people to what the Palestinians are experiencing. My government would not be able to get away with killing over 4000 civilians in the past decade, demolishing their homes, limiting their movement through full control of borders, major roads, airports and the sea. My government would not be smashing doors down in the middle of the night to kidnap children away and subject them to torture. My government would not be controlling another people's water, then only give them 1/4 of it back to them, while giving the rest to illegal settlers living on stolen land.

These are the acts of a racist apartheid regime which any person who champions human rights would condemn.

Edited July 15, 2014 by marcus

[bush_cheney2004]

In this day and age, my government would not be subjecting another group of people to....

But your government has subjected another group to many of these these, and quite purposely so. Whether it be crippling sanctions, bombings, ground troops, kidnapping of a democratically elected president, etc. And it was never attacked by 10,000 rockets (or anything else).

[marcus]

But your government has subjected another group to many of these these, and quite purposely so. Whether it be crippling sanctions, bombings, ground troops, kidnapping of a democratically elected president, etc. And it was never attacked by 10,000 rockets (or anything else).

This reminds me of this post:

imagine that... the guy turns yet another post toward Canada! It truly begs the question as to what transgression/liberty some Canadian border guard must have taken with the guy... and at what point he will be set free to say "Mission Accomplished"!

[bush_cheney2004]

This reminds me of this post:

Nice dodge....you can hold Israel to a different standard if that is the game to be played. "My government" has good bombs....Israel has bad bombs, eh ?

Edited July 15, 2014 by bush_cheney2004

[marcus]

Nice dodge....you can hold Israel to a different standard if that is the game to be played. "My government" has good bombs....Israel has bad bombs, eh ?

I am not sure which group my government is annexing land from, kidnapping their children, torturing them and killing over 4000 civilians in the past decade, controlling their market, taking over their water and disproportionately sharing the water with them and illegal settlers.

I have now seen your attempts at equating Canada's treatment of people to Israel at least five times in the past month and I find it to be weird.

Edited July 15, 2014 by marcus

[bush_cheney2004]

I am not sure what group my government is annexing land from, kidnapping children, torturing them and killing over 4000 civilians in the past decade.

Sir/Madam, your government (if it be Canada), has individually and collectively supported and enforced sanctions that "killed" far more than 4000 civilians since Gulf War I. Bombings, kidnapping, torture, and associated "collateral damage" are well documented for several Canadian military actions. The difference here is that Israel has actually been attacked, up to this very day.

As for "annexing land", I would say that Canada (or the USA) have gobbled up and occupy far more than Israel.

I have now seen your attempts at equating Canada's treatment of people to Israel at least five times in the past month and I find it to be weird.

Both Israel and Canada are sovereign nation states that act in self interest. I find it weird that you would dismiss or ignore Canadian foreign/domestic policies and military actions while inconsistently judging Israel's actions and policies in the face of real existential threats.

Edited July 15, 2014 by bush_cheney2004

[Keepitsimple]

I don't see any evidence of 'targeting' ... or hitting much of anything.

Except Israel targeting innocent children.

Disgusting.

.

Their hundreds of attempts demonstrate that Hamas doesn't care who they hit with their rockets - and do you really doubt for a moment that if they had more accurate rockets - that Hamas would be firing directly at civilian centers? At least Israel warns everyone in the neighbourhoods that they bomb - through leaflets - and by phoning every number in every building that they target to the best of their ability.....but of course Hamas tells everyone to stay where they are. To use your naive terms - that's really sick - and disgusting.

Edited July 15, 2014 by Keepitsimple

[GostHacked]

Hamas is a terror group, and not a recognized national military of Palestine. Israel won't allow Palestine to have a standing army. So by default, Israel is always going to be fighting 'terrorists'. Terror groups will never abide by so called 'rules of war'. I will say there are no rules of war aside from one. The only rule is to win by whatever means.

The land in which Hamas can operate is also very limited. The barrier wall has cut through farm land and small towns which is isolating many people, eventually forcing them to move elsewhere in the occupied territories. With each piece of the wall going up, there is an eventuality that Hamas can only fight from the small towns they have left. There is no where else for them to fight from.

The settlements are still a huge issue here and that fact gets some glazing over by some. Rockets may stop once the Israelis dismantle their illegal settlements in the occupied territories. IN my view, rockets into Israel proper would not be valid, but I do think these illegal settlements are legitimate targets by Hamas. These settlements are not part of Israel. If they are, then you will eventually see Israel annex all the land. It will just take a couple more decades possibly.

[iolo]

'Israel' exists as a result of the terrorist murder of British troops (and the booby-trapping of their bodies) by the Mussolini-loving Maximalist-type scum, the Stern Gang and the other intellectual ancestors of Fuhrer Netemyahu and his killers. We should never forget which side these scum were on when the real Jews were being murdered.

Edited July 15, 2014 by iolo

[Argus]

I would expect our government to find out why these people are shooting rockets at us. Once we find that out then we deal with the cause of the rockets coming in.

So... people are firing rockets across the border at your citizens and you go on national TV and tell your people you're going to launch a royal commision to find out why they're angry? Then, after the royal commision gives you some answers, you'll see what you can do about aleviating their anger?

And the next day Pariament would move a vote of non-confidence - if your party didn't throw you out first and replace you, and we'd be bombing the hell out of them.

[Argus]

'Israel' exists as a result of the terrorist murder of British troops (and the booby-trapping of their bodies) by the Mussolini-loving Maximalist-type scum, the Stern Gang and the other intellectual ancestors of Fuhrer Netemyahu and his killers. We should never forget which side these scum were on when the real Jews were being murdered.

Drivel, and without any historical accuracy.

Edited July 15, 2014 by Argus

[bush_cheney2004]

DoP...we need you...please bring on the Grand Mufti !

[Big Guy]

So... people are firing rockets across the border at your citizens and you go on national TV and tell your people you're going to launch a royal commision to find out why they're angry? Then, after the royal commision gives you some answers, you'll see what you can do about aleviating their anger?

And the next day Pariament would move a vote of non-confidence - if your party didn't throw you out first and replace you, and we'd be bombing the hell out of them.

Royal commission, national TV, non-confidence?

And you expect me to respond to that? Why do you post statements that do nothing to move a topic but try to put other opinions in a ludicrous light? Why would anybody take your statements seriously and take the time to engage you in a discussion?

[DogOnPorch]

DoP...we need you...please bring on the Grand Mufti !

Luckily, Hamas will simply get what's coming. No matter me being here or not. I do pop in to see what you're up to, though.

[Topaz]

What really makes me angry is the Western leaders making comments on the fighting between the two parties and yet, Both, Canada and the US are supplying the military weapons needed to kill women and children! I know Harper Loves Israel, but I also thought he was a Christian and against the killing of women and children... oh yeah, there is big money for western companies when there is a war. Shame on all of them.

[Black Dog]

Luckily, Hamas will simply get what's coming.

A short-term reduction in their military capability and a boost in popular support? They must be terrified.

[bush_cheney2004]

Looks like Hamas has finally killed one Israeli after firing all those rockets. Some cease fire....Israel will keep bringing it to the peace loving militants.

[Black Dog]

Looks like Hamas has finally killed one Israeli after firing all those rockets. Some cease fire....Israel will keep bringing it to the peace loving militants.

And Hamas will keep bringing their rockets and you can keep getting off on the whole spectacle. Win-win-win.

[dre]

They actually have tried living within it's legal borders. And that resulted in 7 arab armies attacking it at the same time. Perhaps you're unaware of recent history?

Actually Israel had already bombed Syria and Egypt before any arab armies attacked.

[Hudson Jones]

'Israel' exists as a result of the terrorist murder of British troops (and the booby-trapping of their bodies) by the Mussolini-loving Maximalist-type scum, the Stern Gang and the other intellectual ancestors of Fuhrer Netemyahu and his killers. We should never forget which side these scum were on when the real Jews were being murdered.

The above is an inconvenient truth to some. Thanks for reminding everyone that without the Jewish terrorist groups, Israel would not have been created.

Many in the Jewish terrorist groups ended up joining the Israeli government and a couple even became prime ministers. This way, they were able to continue their policies through state terrorism.

Edited July 15, 2014 by Hudson Jones

[Black Dog]

The above is an inconvenient truth to some. Thanks for reminding everyone that without the Jewish terrorist groups, Israel would not have been created.

Many in the Jewish terrorist groups ended up joining the Israeli government and a couple even became prime ministers. This way, they were able to continue their policies through state terrorism.

Certainly no terrorists to be found on the other side, right?

Good lord.