Michael Hardner Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Nazis murder people and delight in it, because they are racists, and these Nazis are subsidised by the Yanks. I dread what may be done to decent Jewish people later as a result of this vomitous filth. Comparisons to Nazis are facile at best, and insulting and defamatory at worst. Please refrain. Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Keepitsimple Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Peace would come quickly if Hamas would simply accept the right of a Jewish State to exist. It would be helped by the UN insisting that Hamas do precisely that. One clear, unambiguous step is all it would take. Until that happens, no peace is possible. Everything else is just noise and window dressing. As Golda Meir once said: "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us." Quote Back to Basics
Big Guy Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 ... Big Guy, maybe they don't want what you state. Also you should consider that they target the homes and vehicles of high ranking Hamas officials. They don't just indiscriminately target any old house. So yes, if these people decide they'll be human shields for Hamas then indeed they deserve what they get. If you have plenty of warning and decide you are going to remain then yes, you're basically asking for what you get. ... So if somebody is told that their home is a target and they do not leave that home then they are "asking for it"? Are you serious? The vast majority of those who are being killed are women and children - they are "asking for it"? The government of Hamas is fair game? So the Israeli parliament and officials are also fair game for Hamas? How about chemical and biological weapons dropped on Gaza? They will also kill discriminately - they will only kill those who choose to stay in Gaza. Where have we devolved to when we try to spin the slaughter of innocent women and children as "acceptable collateral damage". But if the end justifies the means then there is no limit to the means! Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Big Guy Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Peace would come quickly if Hamas would simply accept the right of a Jewish State to exist. It would be helped by the UN insisting that Hamas do precisely that. One clear, unambiguous step is all it would take. Until that happens, no peace is possible. Everything else is just noise and window dressing. As Golda Meir once said: "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us." Neither of the combatants in this latest battle adhere to what the UN has asked. There was a resolution co-sponsored by over 120 of the UN's 192 member states in 2011 that stated "Israel, as the occupying power, immediately and completely ceases all settlement activities in the occupied Palestinian territory, including East Jerusalem and that it fully respect its legal obligations in this regard.” But as one of the five permanent members, the negative US vote is the equivalent of a veto. Neither Israel nor Gaza will do anything that the majority of the rest of the world would like to see. They appear to intend to stay in a mutual death grip until the other side blinks. Neither side has clean hands in this ongoing battle. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Israel should continue to do whatever is necessary to neutralize the threat from Gaza or Lebanon. Several members here opined that "innocent civilians" pretty much "had it coming", "deserved it", and "asked for it" on 9/11, and they didn't even launch any rockets. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Black Dog Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Israel should continue to do whatever is necessary to neutralize the threat from Gaza or Lebanon. "Continue to" implies they are currently doing whatever is necessary to neutralize the threat. Obviously, that is inaccurate. Quote
jacee Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) Peace would come quickly if Hamas would simply accept the right of a Jewish State to exist. It would be helped by the UN insisting that Hamas do precisely that. Actually ... (try to keep up with the news) ... Palestine (West Bank and Gaza) is seeking state status at the UN, indicating acceptance of a two state solution. That's all that is necessary, and it is already done.Itis absolutely pathetic how Israel keeps whining that Hamas won't recognize a Jewish state, when Israel is already recognized as a state ... really ... crawling begging whining mewling for recognition ... from Hamas? Pathetic, stupid pitiful sickening ... SICKENING! ... and using that as an excuse for bombing and killing children?!?!! How can any decent human beings respect that? It's disgusting. Neighbour1: I demand that neighbour2 recognize that my property is a PROTESTANT property ... or I'll kill him. Neighbour2: I don't care what you call your property! Get your campfire out of my backyard, and stop firebombing my house! You killed my kids! YOU KILLED MY KIDS!!! Neighbour1: Say it's a PROTESTANT property! SAY IT!! ... It's very clear to me that Israel refuses to accept the two state solution and has no intention of ever living within its borders. Apparently now taking pleasure in killing Palestinian children, any feeble excuse will do. Israel is a monster. I am ashamed that I once supported them. They have lost support and credibility for their heinous actions and complete lack of any good intention of peace. . Edited July 14, 2014 by jacee Quote
Hal 9000 Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 The leftists hate Jews and will always make it their fault no matter who attacks them. Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Keepitsimple Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Actually ... (try to keep up with the news) ... Palestine (West Bank and Gaza) is seeking state status at the UN, indicating acceptance of a two state solution. That's all that is necessary, and it is already done. Perhaps you're onto something that I might have missed Jacee. So you're saying that Hamas now recognize Israel's right to exist - is that right? Because if you can show me where that's the case, I'll be seriously re-thinking my Middle-East position. A cite would be appreciated. Quote Back to Basics
jbg Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Lately, Israel has warned Hamas to clear out of Northern Gaza because it is going to be bombed. The argument is that if those Palestinians stay there then they deserve to be killed. Interesting logic. Why does Israel just not warn everybody to clear out of Gaza. Anyone still there would then deserve to be killed. All the Palestinians clear out of Gaza. Then Israel could establish settlements there with no opposition. What a simple solution - for Israel. How about something less radical; Hamas stops the violence? Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Black Dog Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 How about something less radical; Hamas stops the violence? Paraphrased jbg: "Why won't these crazed extremists with a death wish just act reasonably?" Quote
Big Guy Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 The leftists hate Jews and will always make it their fault no matter who attacks them. Why do differences of opinion always have to deteriorate to "you lefties" or "you neocons" or "you socialists" or "you Nazis" or ....? A leaning to the left or right is a subjective evaluation, depending where in the political spectrum the evaluator is standing at the time. Besides, how can you attribute a persons position on a specific issue based on your perception of their general vision of the world? I believe that to attribute a negative behaviour to a collection of people based on a personal and subjective view is unfair and does nothing to try to understand others and strive towards possible solutions to conflicts. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
jbg Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Paraphrased jbg: "Why won't these crazed extremists with a death wish just act reasonably?"Obviously they won't. But if they want death why not just oblige? Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Hudson Jones Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Perhaps you're onto something that I might have missed Jacee. So you're saying that Hamas now recognize Israel's right to exist - is that right? Because if you can show me where that's the case, I'll be seriously re-thinking my Middle-East position. A cite would be appreciated. I don't think Hamas will ever officially accept the state of Israel. But guess what, Israel exists, whether Hamas likes it or not. I'm curious Keepitsimple, how do you feel about the Israeli government never recognizing a Palestinian State? Not only is it in Likud's platform but Bibi has come out to say that he will never accept an independent Palestinian State. Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
Black Dog Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Obviously they won't. But if they want death why not just oblige? Ask Israel why they are engaging in a strategy that won't actually eliminate the threat of Hamas and are arguably increasing their popular support. Quote
Hudson Jones Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Argus is either intentionally or unintentionally giving a false narrative of what is going on. He is trying to give the impression that it's Israel who is the victim of an aggressive foreign entity and that all it's doing is defensive. Israel will always give an excuse for not stopping the occupation, land theft and not allowing a Palestinians State to be formed. It used to be that Israel had to be recognized. Palestinians did that and accepted Israel along the 67 border, as it's required by international law. Then, suddenly, in the past few years, it is no longer good enough. Now they must recognize Israel as a "Jewish" state. That's just one of the slimy ways the Zionist marketing machine propagates and gives an excuse not to stop the settlements, the occupation and not to accept a Palestinian State to be formed. There is always a stupid excuse. The line in the sand is always changing. Netanyahu finally speaks his mind At his Friday press conference, the prime minister ruled out full Palestinian sovereignty, derided the US approach to Israeli security, and set out his Middle East overview with unprecedented candor. His remarks were not widely reported; they should be BY DAVID HOROVITZ Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
jacee Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) Perhaps you're onto something that I might have missed Jacee. So you're saying that Hamas now recognize Israel's right to exist - is that right? Because if you can show me where that's the case, I'll be seriously re-thinking my Middle-East position. A cite would be appreciated. Palestine, with Hamas' support, sought state status at the UN. They were given 'observer state' status, and continue to pursue full state status.That is Palestinian acceptance of a two state solution. This juvenile stupidity of 'Butbutbut Hamas has to say ... ' whatever ... just makes Israel look pathetic. 'Hamas won't say blahblahblah' so we're going to kill their children until they do' ?? Sick. . Edited July 14, 2014 by jacee Quote
TimG Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Ask Israel why they are engaging in a strategy that won't actually eliminate the threat of Hamas and are arguably increasing their popular support.Eliminating Hamas will simply see it replaced with something else that could be worse. Also they don't have any real options available since there is no peaceful resolution to be found with a group that does not acknowledge the right Israel to exist. So civilians are going to dies as long as Hamas uses them as shields for their rockets. If change is to come it must come from the Palestinians who allow Hamas to exist among them. Quote
cybercoma Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) See how Israel "warns" Gazans it is going to bomb their homes and imagine the terror.Does it anger you that Hamas is launching rockets from residential areas and using innocent people in Gaza as human shields to target innocent civilians in Israel? Edited July 14, 2014 by cybercoma Quote
TimG Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Hamas won't say blahblahblah' so we're going to kill their children until they do' ??What is sick are the western anti-Israel bigots who think the Israel should just do nothing when Hamas fires rockets at civilian targets. I guess from a western progressive's viewpoint dead Jews are fine but dead Palestinians are war crime. Quote
cybercoma Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 "Continue to" implies they are currently doing whatever is necessary to neutralize the threat. Obviously, that is inaccurate.He also doesn't mean "whatever is necessary" because I don't believe he agrees with Israeli withdrawal from Palestinian territories. Quote
jacee Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Eliminating Hamas will simply see it replaced with something else that could be worse. Also they don't have any real options available since there is no peaceful resolution to be found with a group that does not acknowledge the right Israel to exist. So civilians are going to dies as long as Hamas uses them as shields for their rockets. If change is to come it must come from the Palestinians who allow Hamas to exist among them. It already has. Palestine exists as an observer state at the UN. Now about those Israeli settlements ... And ya, the bombs killing children ... Because Hamas won't lick Israel's boots? That's just sick. . Quote
cybercoma Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 Ask Israel why they are engaging in a strategy that won't actually eliminate the threat of Hamas and are arguably increasing their popular support.If some group was launching rockets at innocent civilians in Canada, would you even dream of suggesting that we don't fight back with force? Quote
cybercoma Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 It already has. Palestine exists as an observer state at the UN. Now about those Israeli settlements ... And ya, the bombs killing children ... Because Hamas won't lick Israel's boots? That's just sick. . But it doesn't bother you one bit that Palestine is targeting innocent civilians in Israel. Why is that? Quote
jacee Posted July 14, 2014 Report Posted July 14, 2014 What is sick are the western anti-Israel bigots who think the Israel should just do nothing when Hamas fires rockets at civilian targets. I guess from a western progressive's viewpoint dead Jews are fine but dead Palestinians are war crime. What about those illegal settlements? How is Israel fulfilling its peace commitments? . Quote
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