This week in Islam

[DogOnPorch]

40 minutes ago, Argus said:

I think you meant to say there were many good Germans.

The actual argument I've heard was that it didn't matter that most Germans were good, and didn't want to slaughter Jews and conquer the world. They went along, or at least, didn't resist those who did. I'm sure most of the Muslims back in the day just wanted to raise their kids and do their job and weren't all that into the idea of conquering Europe, but that didn't stop the Sultan and his army from conquering Constantinople and putting its Christian residents to the sword.

 

Touche...other than Oskar Schindler, the list isn't full of Nazi luminaries. But let's not fool ourselves. Even Reinhard Heydrich was a fairly normal hombre before the War. Orchestra conductor before being put in charge of Interpol and worse. Goering...of course...a famous respected combat ace. The vast majority of Nazi Party members never fired a weapon let alone personally killed anyone. But...like the not all Muslims argument...meaningless.

Islam is the antithesis of the West. Literally the West's historical foe since its invention in the 7th century. Unlike the very human Mongols, who by great fortune...just went home never to be heard from again re: taking-over the world...Islam is still around as it's an idea...just like our recent enemy...Nazism. Only Ataturk and the wave of nationalism that made places like modern Syria possible put an end to the non-stop Jihad until now. Modern times.

Edited May 24, 2019 by DogOnPorch

[DogOnPorch]

43 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Should ask the Jews in France if they feel "protected" by their Muslim brethren.

 

The Covenant of Omar which put this 'protection' into Islamic jurisprudence can easily be deemed null & void if the contract is perceived broken. Causing fitnah, for example...a very BROAD term...can break this contract. Historically, massacres have resulted as a result of this apparent strife (fitnah) caused by the minority community.

[dialamah]

On 5/22/2019 at 3:13 PM, scribblet said:

If you want to read  a moderate Muslim  follow Imam Mohamad Tawhidi‏Verified account @Imamofpeace on Twitter, he is a breath of fresh air.   Fortunately he doesn't let death threats stop him

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4388672/Mohammad-Tawhidi-hiding-following-chilling-Islam-threat.html

Oops. Looks like I may have followed Scribblet into gullibility ...

https://www.abc.net.au/religion/welcome-to-the-weird-world-of-australias-fake-sheikh-mohammad-ta/10095874

"Tawhidi is not recognised as an Imam or Sheikh by either the Australian National Imams Council or its South Australian equivalent, nor is he affiliated with any Australian mosque or prayer centre. The only religious instruction he offers is a self-described "university standard" Islamic Studies class delivered from a rented classroom at the University of South Australia. 

Tawhidi's tales about Sunni Muslims' shadowy plot to instate Caliphate have been enthusiastically embraced by the far-Right, including Reclaim Australia. Perhaps less expected is the extent to which Tawhidi himself has courted such groups. In the lead-up to last year's federal election, he made offerings of roses to roadside anti-Muslim Liberty Alliance and One Nation posters, as if the face of Pauline Hanson belonged not to Australia's most recognisable anti-Islam campaigner, but a titian-haired deity."

Still, death death threats against him are unacceptable, imo.

[scribblet]

Well, even if this is so, he is still a moderate Muslim speaking out against extremism, something which the establishment obviously doesn't like so will happily try to relate it to the 'far right' in order to destroy him.  If he is not actually a Muslim, then that's a whole different kettle of fish.  

Imam only means a prayer leader, so any adult Muslim could become an Imam at some time, but I would think people would be happy to support someone who wants to reform extremism. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4371064/Muslim-leader-Imam-Shaikh-Mohammad-Tawhidi-called-fake.html

He defended himself claiming he was legitimate and only accused of being a fraud because he did not serve a radical Islamic agenda.

'For them, I am too Australian,' he said.  

The Muslim leader said he rejected controversial Sharia law to live by the Australian law 'because I am an Australian Muslim and not a Muslim Australian'.

'I want an Islam that is compatible with the west,' he said. 

'The bottom line is, I want Australia to stay Australian.'  

 

 

[DogOnPorch]

1 hour ago, scribblet said:

 

He defended himself claiming he was legitimate and only accused of being a fraud because he did not serve a radical Islamic agenda.

'For them, I am too Australian,' he said.  

The Muslim leader said he rejected controversial Sharia law to live by the Australian law 'because I am an Australian Muslim and not a Muslim Australian'.

'I want an Islam that is compatible with the west,' he said. 

'The bottom line is, I want Australia to stay Australian.'  

 

The ol' No True Scotsman fallacy applied to Islamic reform. It doesn't get much...heh...better than that.

[GostHacked]

Islam seems to be a problem that many like to complain about but yet do nothing about aside from complaining on the Internet echo chamber.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, GostHacked said:

Islam seems to be a problem that many like to complain about but yet do nothing about aside from complaining on the Internet echo chamber.

Yeah, I think all this complaining on internet forums has to stop.  If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.

[Michael Hardner]

4 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Yeah, I think all this complaining on internet forums has to stop.  If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.

Right.  I especially like how OTHER people's irrational beliefs are a problem to 'solve' collectively.

I would say people who believe in sky gods are less of a problem than 9/11 truthers.

 

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

Right.  I especially like how OTHER people's irrational beliefs are a problem to 'solve' collectively.

I would say people who believe in sky gods are less of a problem than 9/11 truthers.

 

 

I would disagree.  Only one of the two is really easy to ignore.

[GostHacked]

5 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Right.  I especially like how OTHER people's irrational beliefs are a problem to 'solve' collectively.

I would say people who believe in sky gods are less of a problem than 9/11 truthers.

 

 

Part of the problem is how certain people 'discuss' things.

And it's obvious that these people want a solution, but are too afraid to provide one.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

Part of the problem is how certain people 'discuss' things.

And it's obvious that these people want a solution, but are too afraid to provide one.

Ah, you're talking about a 'final" solution!  I don't think so.  I think people are just disgusted by disgusting things.

[GostHacked]

33 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Ah, you're talking about a 'final" solution!  I don't think so.  I think people are just disgusted by disgusting things.

So when I talk about providing a solution,  what is the purpose of going to the Nazi ideology of 'final solution' ?  Or you are incapable of thinking there are other solutions to this problem?

I have never advocated for a 'final solution'.  That is something put into your heads by DogOnPorch when he said 'final solution'.

 

 

 

[DogOnPorch]

13 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

So when I talk about providing a solution,  what is the purpose of going to the Nazi ideology of 'final solution' ?  Or you are incapable of thinking there are other solutions to this problem?

I have never advocated for a 'final solution'.  That is something put into your heads by DogOnPorch when he said 'final solution'.

 

 

 

 

Don't include me in your fantasies of genocide.

Thanks.

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

So when I talk about providing a solution,  what is the purpose of going to the Nazi ideology of 'final solution' ?  Or you are incapable of thinking there are other solutions to this problem?

I have never advocated for a 'final solution'.  That is something put into your heads by DogOnPorch when he said 'final solution'.

 

 

 

I'm incapable of many things, but one of them isn't interpreting someone's barely hidden meaning.  I never said you advocated for it.  Your implication seems to be others might. Bollocks!

[GostHacked]

8 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

Don't include me in your fantasies of genocide.

Thanks.

Then stop making stupid posts. 

[GostHacked]

5 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

I never said you advocated for it. 

So wtf is this then?

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

Ah, you're talking about a 'final" solution!  I don't think so.  I think people are just disgusted by disgusting things.

I never advocated or even mentioned any kind of final solution, that was all Doggy's trolling projecting again.

[Michael Hardner]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

I would disagree.  Only one of the two is really easy to ignore.

Islam is pretty easy to ignore too.  If you are saying it's a root cause, then I would say it's really ignorance... which is back to the other item.

[Guest]

 

11 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

So wtf is this then?

I never advocated or even mentioned any kind of final solution, that was all Doggy's trolling projecting again.

No, that's what I meant by interpreting.  Hey, if you say it was never implied I'll believe you, because the idea anyone on here would consider such a thing is unthinkable, of course.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Islam is pretty easy to ignore too.  If you are saying it's a root cause, then I would say it's really ignorance... which is back to the other item.

No it's not.  Too many people oppressed and killed.

[GostHacked]

4 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

 

No, that's what I meant by interpreting.  Hey, if you say it was never implied I'll believe you, because the idea anyone on here would consider such a thing is unthinkable, of course.

But don't let that stop others from calling someone a Nazi for talking about ANY kind of solution.  It's no use having a conversation with those types if that is the kind of tripe they throw out.

Tighter immigration limit the numbers, limit where we accept immigrants from , better vetting of people ect ect ..   And this applies to anyone from anywhere that Canada would take in.

[DogOnPorch]

2 hours ago, GostHacked said:

Then stop making stupid posts. 

 

Do it again and I will ask for moderation.

[GostHacked]

2 hours ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

Do it again and I will ask for moderation.

I encourage it.

[eyeball]

2 hours ago, GostHacked said:

I encourage it.

I think there is a point at which moderation should be on the hook for factualness otherwise they should should just stay out of it and let the free for all commence.

Wilful ignorance and disingenuousness should definitely be shut down. Protecting stupid speech is just stupid.  

[OftenWrong]

15 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I think there is a point at which moderation should be on the hook for factualness otherwise they should should just stay out of it and let the free for all commence.

Wilful ignorance and disingenuousness should definitely be shut down. Protecting stupid speech is just stupid.  

Sorry but there wouldn't be a lot of posting going on if we implemented those rules. Disingenuousness abounds.

[eyeball]

5 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Sorry but there wouldn't be a lot of posting going on if we implemented those rules.

Yes but what was posted would be worth debating.

Quote

Disingenuousness abounds.

Usually with unmitigated glee.