Islamification of Toronto?

[WestCanMan]

5 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

We're not making 'progress' when we bring in people fast enough for them to start balkanizing instead of operating in a healthy multicultural society, and we cater to their balkanizing demands.

"We want our own buildings, we want our own towns, we want other people to stop displaying their religious symbols while we display our own religious garb", etc.

It's silly. 

If people want to live in a country where only their religion can be seen in public then they should have stayed where they were. 

@dialamah what's to get upset about? 

Do you not know that there are muslim-only buildings in Canada? A man in Quebec was forced to move out of a building just so that it could be free of non-muslims. How is that not morally repugnant and bigoted?

It's not the only one though: https://globalnews.ca/news/2187517/toronto-city-councillor-says-muslim-only-subsidized-housing-is-acceptable/

Isn't it weird that they have to have a building which is religiously pure? And by weird I mean - religiously bigoted. If you can't handle being around people who don't share your exact belief system then you're a bigot and it's actually dangerous to allow bigots to balkanize.

It's not just muslims that complain about the word Christmas, or seeing crosses, etc, this is a broad statement that applies to all kinds of religions and cultures - how about if people just fuck off if they don't like it? Why should I give a shit about what people don't want to see when they move to a new country? It's the height of bigotry and stupidity to think that one can move to a country and force the people there to change to accommodate them.

I don't feel bad for saying that Christians should be allowed to celebrate Christmas, and say that word. It doesn't get me all bent out of shape if Jews celebrate Hannukah, Indians celebrate Dhiwali (Surrey pretty much celebrates Dhiwali), Chinese to celebrate New Year's Day late, or any other cultures wanna party or observe or whatever the hell they want. It's just the height of ignorance to say "no one can observe any holidays that I don't". 

[Goddess]

On 6/19/2021 at 11:50 AM, Michael Hardner said:

Ok, would you ban people from Canada if they were redeemable?

 

Would you disparage them openly, as a people rather than dismantle the details of their belief system of they are redeemable?

No.

No.

[Michael Hardner]

1 hour ago, Goddess said:

No.

No.

Then I don't think we are far apart at all.

[WestCanMan]

On 6/19/2021 at 10:50 AM, Michael Hardner said:

1) Ok, would you ban people from Canada if they were redeemable?

 

2) Would you disparage them openly, as a people rather than dismantle the details of their belief system of they are redeemable?

1) I'm happy for any decent people to come to Canada, the problem is that we never send the irredeemables back and we never screened anyone to find out whether or not they were irredeemable before they came. Even if they commit terrorist attacks here they get to stay thanks to our village idiot.

2) We don't disparage them, but we bring up inconvenient truths.

On the other hand, as a group, muslims here are extremely disparaging of Israel and Jews. Their propaganda and their quds day hate rallies are atrocious to everyone outside of the liberal MSM and our PM.

They also spread their bigotry here when the attack on the mosque happened and they started acting like it was the first terrorist attack ever here regarding muslims. They rush to claim victim status like no other group of humans ever. 

[RedDog]

Canada cancels it's own culture at our own peril. We continue to flood in people from the wrong places who have ZERO interest in assimilation or conforming. Voters in OntariOWE and PAYbec evidently want this.

[Michael Hardner]

20 minutes ago, RedDog said:

1. Canada cancels it's own culture at our own peril.
2. We continue to flood in people from the wrong places who have ZERO interest in assimilation or conforming.
3. Voters in OntariOWE and PAYbec evidently want this.

1. Compromise and pluralism IS our culture.
2. Conservatives like freedom, not government-imposed culture laws on 'conforming'.  I'm not interested in your culture shampoo.... go wash a dog or something.
3. Yes, we want to build an economy... Also note that Ontario doesn't have weird disparaging nicknames for other provinces, but dress up in whatever costume you like, cowboy...

[RedDog]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. Compromise and pluralism IS our culture.
2. Conservatives like freedom, not government-imposed culture laws on 'conforming'.  I'm not interested in your culture shampoo.... go wash a dog or something.
3. Yes, we want to build an economy... Also note that Ontario doesn't have weird disparaging nicknames for other provinces, but dress up in whatever costume you like, cowboy...

Cowboy? Because Alberta has 70% of the cattle business in CanaDUH? I suppose you have no clue Alberta has the highest percentage of population in the country with a post secondary education.

Nobody expects much from you in Toronto. You’re a national burden. Now get back to building an economy with your Syrian and Afghan refugees.

[Michael Hardner]

39 minutes ago, RedDog said:

1. Cowboy? Because Alberta has 70% of the cattle business in CanaDUH?

2. I suppose you have no clue Alberta has the highest percentage of population in the country with a post secondary education.

3. Nobody expects much from you in Toronto. You’re a national burden.

4. Now get back to building an economy with your Syrian and Afghan refugees.

1. Are you a cattle ranchers?  That's so exotic!

2. Great!

3. Hahaha.  We pay for a lot, that's not what a burden does.

4. That's just helping people, is all

 

 

[RedDog]

You don’t pay squat for us. WE pay for your folly to the tune of $10B annually, much of it to PAYbec.

I no longer want to help people who’re a drain on me and my neighbors. That seems to be the routine and a fine system you’ve established controlling the colonies. I would shatter it in a New York Minute. Then what’s your plan? You don’t have one actually.

[Michael Hardner]

12 minutes ago, RedDog said:

You don’t pay squat for us. WE pay for your folly to the tune of $10B annually, much of it to PAYbec.

Can you explain how you pay money to Toronto, who has roughly the same GDP as Alberta?

[RedDog]

islam has no place on this continent. We must halt more coming and make life difficult for those here refusing to assimilate. They are filled with evil terror and their women are owned chattel property. They don’t fit.

[Michael Hardner]

16 minutes ago, RedDog said:

islam has no place on this continent. We must halt more coming and make life difficult for those here refusing to assimilate. They are filled with evil terror and their women are owned chattel property. They don’t fit.

The West was built in freedom of religion.  There's no reason to change that, it works well.

[Goddess]

On 8/1/2021 at 5:35 PM, Michael Hardner said:

The West was built in freedom of religion.  There's no reason to change that, it works well.

Freedom of religion is a wonderful principle.

Sometimes there are other principles, such as women not being owned property, that should override another principle.

[Goddess]

On 7/21/2021 at 1:20 PM, Michael Hardner said:

1. Compromise and pluralism IS our culture.

Same thing applies here.  Yes, our culture is to compromise and get along but there are some things we should not be compromising on - the status of women in society is an important one.

I really hope you are not suggesting that women's status, which has been hard fought for and still has a ways to go, should be compromised in the name of freedom of religion and to get along with people who cling to stone-age religious beliefs.

[QuebecOverCanada]

On 8/1/2021 at 7:35 PM, Michael Hardner said:

The West was built in freedom of religion.  

Yes and no. It was also built in between fights implicating different religious groups, and the imposition of Christianity to the masses. Spain was not made out of religious freedom at all, for instance, nor did Germany or France. It's more like a Magna Carta thing for anglo-saxon societies, and even then, English society was not really open until much later in Canada. For instance, Jews were only able to partake in higher education with the same rights as everyone until very much later after 1867. 

[Michael Hardner]

21 minutes ago, QuebecOverCanada said:

Yes and no. It was also built in between fights implicating different religious groups, and the imposition of Christianity to the masses. Spain was not made out of religious freedom at all, for instance, nor did Germany or France. It's more like a Magna Carta thing for anglo-saxon societies, and even then, English society was not really open until much later in Canada. For instance, Jews were only able to partake in higher education with the same rights as everyone until very much later after 1867. 

Sorry - I should have said 'western democracy'.  We got to it in the 18th and 19th (and 20th 21st maybe) centuries.

Point taken.

[TreeBeard]

On 8/1/2021 at 4:35 PM, Michael Hardner said:

The West was built in freedom of religion.  There's no reason to change that, it works well.

Was it actually?  Or did it move that way more recently?

Blasphemy was codified in law until a few years ago.  How do you square that with your statement? 

[Michael Hardner]

4 hours ago, TreeBeard said:

1. Was it actually?

2. Or did it move that way more recently?

3. Blasphemy was codified in law until a few years ago.  How do you square that with your statement? 

1. Yes.

2. By West I mean Western style democracy.

3. I don't know.  Was it enforced? If you compare our religion was treated during the Reformation versus in democracy, you'll understand what is meant by freedom of religion. You can't compare it to what that means today, or in 100 years.

 

 

[WestCanMan]

On 7/21/2021 at 12:20 PM, Michael Hardner said:

1. Compromise and pluralism IS our culture.

Not true. We do have a culture here, we're just not bigots who carve everything in stone and then force everyone else to conform in every way imaginable.

Quote

2. Conservatives like freedom, not government-imposed culture laws on 'conforming'.  I'm not interested in your culture shampoo.... go wash a dog or something.
 

For sure, but people should have to conform on the "tolerance towards others" front or go home and that's not a policy here right now. We're far too tolerant towards violent bigots: we let terrorists keep their citizenship and we don't say or do anything about quds day hate rallies. 

[Michael Hardner]

57 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

1. We do have a culture here, we're just not bigots who carve everything in stone and then force everyone else to conform in every way imaginable.

2. people should have to conform on the "tolerance towards others" front or go home and that's not a policy here right now.  

1. Didn't I just say that ?
2. I agree but we should promote it positively, yes.

[WestCanMan]

4 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. Didn't I just say that ?

Your answer sounded to me like "we have no worthwhile core culture to speak of, we're just mainly a hodgepodge of sub-cultures with nothing innately Canadian about them".

I'd argue that we actually do have a strong core culture and that we shouldn't be embarrassed to embrace it. 

Canadians generally congregate for sporting activities or artistic performances and we're very keen on education, medical care, and clean, safe communities. Religion here isn't overt but it plays a strong role as well. Men are expected to be married and work 40+ hrs a week and women here usually work 20-40 as well. We have small family units of 3-5 that live together in modern residences of 1100 - 2900 sq ft on avg.

It sounds normal to us, but it's our culture. If you moved to Afghanistan or India or Brazil or the Congo you'd find that those places aren't very 'Canadian' at all. 

[Robert Salyers]

On 7/27/2011 at 9:22 AM, Shwa said:

I thought I had posted this as a topic already, but guess I didn't. However, it is an interesting issue since it touches on all those sensitive bits in society, especially nowadays.

Protesters oppose Muslim prayer in public schools

So it is not against the law to have prayer in public schools in Ontario, you just can't force anyone into it AND you can't have religious services, but you can accomodate prayers and other services I suppose.

The neighbourhood is almost all Muslim. Should we worry?

worry is my advice . Id move.

[RedDog]

On 8/1/2021 at 5:35 PM, Michael Hardner said:

The West was built in freedom of religion.  There's no reason to change that, it works well.

Then you obviously support the ayatollah’s fatwa on Salmon Rushdie, as well as the $3M bounty.

Enjoy your “freedom of religion”. The sane know a death cult when we see one. They already own you.

[herbie]

31 minutes ago, RedDog said:

On 8/1/2021 at 4:35 PM, Michael Hardner said:

The West was built in freedom of religion.  There's no reason to change that, it works well.

Then you obviously support the ayatollah’s fatwa on Salmon Rushdie, as well as the $3M bounty.

Enjoy your “freedom of religion”. The sane know a death cult when we see one. They already own you.

That's about the most narrow minded, butt stubborn, undemocratic and ignorant response anyone could reply to what MH posted.

[Michael Hardner]

47 minutes ago, RedDog said:

1. Then you obviously support the ayatollah’s fatwa on Salmon Rushdie, as well as the $3M bounty.

2. Enjoy your “freedom of religion”. The sane know a death cult when we see one. They already own you.

1. Retarded logic.

2. I do.  You want the government to control thought and ban ideas, and yet you misclassify yourself as conservative.