Black Dog Posted February 21 Report Share Posted February 21 39 minutes ago, Perspektiv said: No, the world has two genders. The woke world has limitless. The world couldn't care less about this. Given how much effort goes into policing gender norms, I'd say the world seems cares a lot. Quote Am an effeminate man. Butch women. You're literally proving my point. Being gender nonconforming doesn't equate being the opposite gender, unless you're woke. How do you know someone is a man or woman? Quote Gender used to be binary. The waters have been murkied, as harder to debate people with "facts" that are ever evolving like types of gender. You keep using gender and biological sex characteristics interchangeable so it's almost impossible to know what you're talking about at any given moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 1 hour ago, Black Dog said: Given how much effort goes into policing gender norms If you had traveled much, you would be quick to see the bulk of the planet sees gender as a binary. The divisiveness over things as ridiculous as pronouns, is unique to the west. It takes privilege to feel entitled to have your trumped up pronouns respected. Heck, even in places like Brazil and Thailand, which hold among the largest trans populations globally, these people have far more important things to worry about, like food clothing and shelter. 1 hour ago, Black Dog said: How do you know someone is a man or woman? The fact you need to ask, is a testament to how sad our times are. The vast majority of people will determine gender simply by looking at someone. I would be willing to bet heavy handed, I could tell you are male or female within a second of looking at you. It's why this movement must use force and vitriol. Because what they are asking for is not natural, nor biological, which is why that server at Starbucks has to wear a name tag with He/Him, because anyone else seeing the mustache but the clearly female appearance will instinctively be calling them Miss or Mrs. with no malice behind. Your green hair only tells me you're easily offended. 1 hour ago, Black Dog said: You keep There are two genders. Period. There. Simple. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 1 hour ago, CdnFox said: What really honks me off is that the story always changes - that community will go from 'gender is based on biology' to biology has nothing to do with it to gender is a construct to you're born with your gender it's who you are and can't be changed, etc etc etc. Confusion is key. Make things vague and murky and heavy handed vitriol for any misstep, and you can see how easily one can control the narrative. Few are willing to risk their career to challenge it, which is why its a breath of fresh air to see intellectuals who not only do, but present the research and fact to boot. The fact so many are petrified to define a woman when it comes to in the media, is a sign of our times. 1 hour ago, CdnFox said: it's an 'assigned sex' Anyone using words like "assigned" or cis, automatically lose my attention. I already know am going to be lectured on gender by another pseudo intellectual. Was on a website where this was the case, because I was apparently being violent for calling my wife a "biological woman", vs the cis woman I was insisted on using to be inclusive. Yet, my discomfort with being called a cis male was swiftly refuted. So I should care what I use to call you, but you can label me with any words you see fit? Yeah, okay. That will sell like hot cakes. It would be like a white person insisting on calling me racialized vs black. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 22 Author Report Share Posted February 22 3 minutes ago, Perspektiv said: I already know am going to be lectured on gender by another pseudo intellectual. That's racist. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 20 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: I do know several people who have undergone GRS and none have regretted it. There was one individual in the news who regretted it but when you consider the hoops one has to jump through, all designed to avoid such an outcome. The Menard clinic in Montreal requires a patient to live at the clinic for a full month before surgery, to undergo exhaustive analysis to ensure the surgery is truly what they need. Not talking about GRS, I'm talking about the overall mental health issue, and seeing psychiatrist or a therapist to work through the mental health issue... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 21 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: This is the type of voter that is targeted by such legislation. I told my friend what Alberta was planning to do about banning bottom surgery and she strongly agreed. Then I explained that the surgery isn't being done and she was utterly befuddled. Thats not true at all, not sure why you feel the need to pigeon hole posters after a few comments... i have said many times that after 18 years of age everyone is free to do what ever they want with their bodies, until then they are under parental control...And that these transformation should be a personal cost to the individuals not the tax payers. This whole issue has blown out of control over the last decade, and is now about as far left as one could go with the policies/ laws in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 (edited) 17 hours ago, Perspektiv said: If you had traveled much, you would be quick to see the bulk of the planet sees gender as a binary. The divisiveness over things as ridiculous as pronouns, is unique to the west. It takes privilege to feel entitled to have your trumped up pronouns respected. Heck, even in places like Brazil and Thailand, which hold among the largest trans populations globally, these people have far more important things to worry about, like food clothing and shelter. So what? The bulk of the planet also still treats women like garbage, why are you taking gender cues from them? Quote The fact you need to ask, is a testament to how sad our times are.The vast majority of people will determine gender simply by looking at someone. Exactly. It has nothing to do with chromosomes or genitals, but is largely how one presents themselves. Quote I would be willing to bet heavy handed, I could tell you are male or female within a second of looking at you. Yeah I have a beard and developed muscles, but then so do many transmen. Quote It's why this movement must use force and vitriol. Force? lol ok. Quote Because what they are asking for is not natural, nor biological, which is why that server at Starbucks has to wear a name tag with He/Him, because anyone else seeing the mustache but the clearly female appearance will instinctively be calling them Miss or Mrs. with no malice behind. Your green hair only tells me you're easily offended. This is just a right-winger bingo card. Quote There are two genders. Period. There. Simple. I would agree society has been historically organized around a binary social construct of gender. Which isn't to say other ways aren't possible. Edited February 22 by Black Dog 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 21 hours ago, Army Guy said: Not talking about GRS, I'm talking about the overall mental health issue, and seeing psychiatrist or a therapist to work through the mental health issue... Being trans-sexual is not a mental illness. That being said, a major part of the process to transition is a rigorous psychological assessment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 23 Author Report Share Posted February 23 2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: Being trans-sexual is not a mental illness. That being said, a major part of the process to transition is a rigorous psychological assessment. Unfortunately it is directly connected with a serious mental illness. If you're transgender then there is an exceptionally high chance of you having gender dysphoria to one degree or another which is a mental health issue with very serious implications. So you can't just seperate them as if the mental health element doesn't exist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 (edited) 46 minutes ago, CdnFox said: Unfortunately it is directly connected with a serious mental illness. If you're transgender then there is an exceptionally high chance of you having gender dysphoria to one degree or another which is a mental health issue with very serious implications. So you can't just seperate them as if the mental health element doesn't exist https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/gender-dysphoria/diagnosis-treatment/drc-20475262#:~:text=Medical treatment of gender dysphoria,facial features and body contour "Medical treatment of gender dysphoria might include: Hormone therapy, such as feminizing hormone therapy or masculinizing hormone therapy Surgery, such as feminizing surgery or masculinizing surgery to change the chest, external genitalia, internal genitalia, facial features and body contour..." Edited February 23 by Queenmandy85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 23 Author Report Share Posted February 23 3 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/gender-dysphoria/diagnosis-treatment/drc-20475262#:~:text=Medical treatment of gender dysphoria,facial features and body contour "Medical treatment of gender dysphoria might include: Hormone therapy, such as feminizing hormone therapy or masculinizing hormone therapy Surgery, such as feminizing surgery or masculinizing surgery to change the chest, external genitalia, internal genitalia, facial features and body contour..." uhhh - and? If you're trying to prove it's actually a medical condition as i said then sure, well done. I mean you can't have treatment without an illness right? So yes - i think we all agree it's a serious mental illness. Thanks for the back up but i think everyone was willing to accept that already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 52 minutes ago, CdnFox said: uhhh - and? If you're trying to prove it's actually a medical condition as i said then sure, well done. I mean you can't have treatment without an illness right? So yes - i think we all agree it's a serious mental illness. Thanks for the back up but i think everyone was willing to accept that already. It is a condition, not an illness. It likely is established inutero. And what is the treatment? "Hormone therapy, such as feminizing hormone therapy or masculinizing hormone therapy Surgery, such as feminizing surgery or masculinizing surgery to change the chest, external genitalia, internal genitalia, facial features and body contour..." Why is this an issue? Why is there no issue around F2M trans? Do you have an issue with crossdressers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 6 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: Being trans-sexual is not a mental illness. That being said, a major part of the process to transition is a rigorous psychological assessment. Gender dysphoria is a mental health issue....it has been for decades...it does not need a assessment but rather treatment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 23 Author Report Share Posted February 23 2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: It is a condition, not an illness. It likely is established inutero. It's an illness. That's why it's "dysphoria" As one famous doctor said "You can't have a pathology without an illness". Some people prefer the term 'condition' because they feel it's more 'neutral sounding' but it's an illness. Anything that requires treatment is an illness. Quote And what is the treatment? What does it matter? If there's a treatment, there's an illness. Quote Why is this an issue? Why is there no issue around F2M trans? Why is WHAT an issue? And who said there's no issues around f2m? The fact of the matter is there ARE some differences between the two in certain issues because a female who dresses up like a man is still a biological female - so if they compete in male sports they're at a disadvantage not an advantage. So fair enough - that's not cheating. But if a male who dresses as a female competes against females he's still a male - i don't care how many 'hormone blockers' he's taken he's still got an advantage in strength and size on average. And it's unlikley that a woman will be able to overpower a man in a washroom for example - but a man can usually overpower a woman (on average). But other than that what makes you think that the issues are any different for men or women? You're not being very clear about what your point is here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 3 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/gender-dysphoria/diagnosis-treatment/drc-20475262#:~:text=Medical treatment of gender dysphoria,facial features and body contour "Medical treatment of gender dysphoria might include: Hormone therapy, such as feminizing hormone therapy or masculinizing hormone therapy Surgery, such as feminizing surgery or masculinizing surgery to change the chest, external genitalia, internal genitalia, facial features and body contour..." Lets not look at the mental health element of all of this...instead all that is being done is carrying out the wishes of people that may or may not really know the seriousness of this mental health issue really is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted February 24 Report Share Posted February 24 On 2/22/2024 at 11:30 AM, Black Dog said: So what? Medical experts in the bulk of the planet, side with gender being binary. Most aren't governed by activism and woke ideology. On 2/22/2024 at 11:30 AM, Black Dog said: Exactly. That doesn't prove anything. A woman can look like a man and not be trans, and would mistakenly be assumed as being male. It speaks nothing, to the many non passable trans people, who accuse people of transphobia for misgebdering them. It only states, if you put enough work to pass, good on you, which doesn't sound like sound legislation. On 2/22/2024 at 11:30 AM, Black Dog said: Yeah I have a beard and developed muscles, but then so do many transmen. You're comparing a Ferrari to Fiero with a Ferrari kit, screaming that they are the same. Your logic likely feels a white person couldn't identify as black, because it's impossible. But a man identifies as a woman? Let her! This is fine, and I agree. Let her. I draw the line at changing language to where I have to play along with the charade. On 2/22/2024 at 11:30 AM, Black Dog said: Force? Doxxing, social shaming. Forcing people to apologize publicly, to bolster the shame vs actual accurate information that would refute an intellectual argument. Not all force is physical. O_o On 2/22/2024 at 11:30 AM, Black Dog said: I would agree society has been historically organized around a binary social construct of gender. Which isn't to say other ways aren't possible. That was a wordy way of saying there are two genders, but "don't stop believing!". *sings* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted February 24 Report Share Posted February 24 2 hours ago, Perspektiv said: Most aren't governed by activism and woke ideology. Are you in possession of any evidence that most are governed by comatose ideology instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 24 Report Share Posted February 24 I saw the poor little red-haired guy, workin the cash at Crappy Tire. His hair was like a girl, and he was small. But when he spoke, his voice was that of a man. I couldn't help but feel a little pity for the turmoil the person must go through in their life, to figure out who they are and how they might fit in this crazy f*ed up world you people created. It doesn't help that people are so cold, and in a confused state or depressed some people will believe there is a magic bullet or potion that will set everything right, if only they can get it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted February 24 Report Share Posted February 24 58 minutes ago, eyeball said: comatose ideology instead? You mean biology and medical expertise? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 On 2/24/2024 at 11:22 AM, Perspektiv said: Medical experts in the bulk of the planet, side with gender being binary. Most aren't governed by activism and woke ideology. Cite required. Quote That doesn't prove anything. A woman can look like a man and not be trans, and would mistakenly be assumed as being male. Yeah that's kinda my point. Quote It speaks nothing, to the many non passable trans people, who accuse people of transphobia for misgebdering them. It only states, if you put enough work to pass, good on you, which doesn't sound like sound legislation. What are you talking about, "legislation"? Quote You're comparing a Ferrari to Fiero with a Ferrari kit, screaming that they are the same. They are both cars tho? Quote Your logic likely feels a white person couldn't identify as black, because it's impossible. But a man identifies as a woman? Let her! This is fine, and I agree. Let her. I draw the line at changing language to where I have to play along with the charade. So you don't have a problem with people identifying as a different gender but won't actually do them the courtesy of addressing them as such? Kind of a dick move imo. Quote Doxxing, social shaming. Forcing people to apologize publicly, to bolster the shame vs actual accurate information that would refute an intellectual argument. Not all force is physical. O_o Examples? Quote That was a wordy way of saying there are two genders, but "don't stop believing!". *sings* I'm trying to get you to understand the social construction of gender, but I worry that might be too much intellectualism for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 26 Author Report Share Posted February 26 1 hour ago, Black Dog said: Cite required. Yeah that's kinda my point. What are you talking about, "legislation"? They are both cars tho? So you don't have a problem with people identifying as a different gender but won't actually do them the courtesy of addressing them as such? Kind of a dick move imo. Examples? I'm trying to get you to understand the social construction of gender, but I worry that might be too much intellectualism for you. As usual the answers are trite and childish. Sure a fiero and a ferrari are both cars - men and women are both people. But a fiero dressed like a ferrari is not a ferrari and a man dressed as a woman is not a woman. Pretty simple. And you're not trying to get anyone to understand anything. There are two genders. Gender is not a social construct - you've already said it's based significantly on biology. All people have some female traits and some male traits and the combination of those two is what your overall gender looks like - just like strumming a chord on a guitar, lots of strings, but you get a specific sound. And yes its different for everyone and there's a 'window' of what's considered 'average or normal' and some people are outside of that and that's fine. It's no more complex than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 4 hours ago, Black Dog said: They are both cars tho? You've literally displayed woke culture with that sentence right there. If I have to explain to you the difference between a Ferrari and a Fiero, thats precisely the issue. That a woman is now a political grenade, vs talking about someone who has a vagina and breasts and a female reproductive system. Your Fiero is a hollowed out hole, implants and a deep voice. Most with money, will go for the real deal. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 14 minutes ago, Perspektiv said: You've literally displayed woke culture with that sentence right there. By stating an objective truth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, Black Dog said: By stating an objective truth? Stating a Ferrari the same type of car as a Fiero. Them being both cars, is like saying a trans woman and biological woman are identical, because they are both humans. Cats and dogs are both animals. A Uhaul truck and ambulance are identical, as they are both truck frames underneath it all. Thats woke culture in a nutshell. Math is racist. Professionalism is discriminatory. Women have penises. Men can give birth.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 26 minutes ago, Perspektiv said: Math is racist. Professionalism is discriminatory. Women have penises. Men can give birth.... Dogs and cats, sleeping together - Mass hysteria!!!! (gotta love ghostbusters ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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