Hodad Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 34 minutes ago, taxme said: Some words may and can hurt some peoples feelings, but that is life. As long as nobody goes beyond that, then all should be okay. I have been called many nasty names in my life time, but i had to learn to suck it up. What? Do you think that we all live in a wonderful loving and caring world? Well, that ain't ever going to happen, pardner. Reality sucks, so we will just have to learn to live with it. A fact of life. My problem with hate laws is that those hate laws can be used to shut down people who may appear to be showing some kind of hate towards another, but in reality, that may not be the case. All the government has to say is that this certain organization or group are showing tendencies towards showing some kinds of hatred towards someone or something else and the government can shut them down even though there was no hatred being shown at all. Just a scenario, but the liberal party can say that the conservative party is showing some signs of hatred towards someone else or group, and the government could designate the conservative party as promoting hate, and possibly shut the conservative party down for good. Some would see hate as extreme hate, while others would say that what was said was not all that extreme. It all depends on what someone else believes is extreme. For myself, hate laws are just anti-free speech and anti democratic laws and nothing more. Just saying. Is it your position that some substantial portion of the population would find, say, calls for genocide as speech that is not extreme? Is there value in such speech? No. Is there harm in such speech? Yes. So, as with all other rights, there's a practical analysis to be made and sensible laws to be made. In the same way that most gun enthusiasts think the 2nd amendment protects a neighbor's right to own a rifle, but not to own a nuclear bomb. We recognize that rights are not absolute and we pass laws to balance harm and benefit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 26 minutes ago, taxme said: Trump was no doubt right when he said that America was living in an existential crisis where Trump believed that the election was stolen from him. Hillary Clinton said that when she lost the 2016 election to Trump she also said that the election was stolen from her. Trump won the election in 2020 fair and square. Bidumb did not. When the vote counting was being tabulated, Trump was leading in five states that night by the tens of thousands. When the voting counting was stopped for the night, to be resumed in the morning, all of a sudden In the morning when the count began again, Bidumb had supposedly won the count by the same numbers as Trump had. So bs to your lies. VP Pence let the demoncrats win the election. Trump made a big mistake when he made Pence is VP. 😇 The only existential crisis was Trump attempting a coup. For the first time in our nation's history a president sought to circumvent the peaceful transfer of power. There is no evidence that the 2020 election was stolen, and no evidence that there was widespread voter fraud. There simply isn't. Despite it being the most scrutinized and analyzed election in history. Pence didn't LET the Democrats win. The voters chose the Democratic candidate. Pence simply upheld his constitutional responsibility to certify the vote, as has been done by every VP before him. ^^those are facts, and they will not be washed away by your ungrounded conspiracy speculation. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 (edited) 54 minutes ago, taxme said: Trump was no doubt right when he said that America was living in an existential crisis where Trump believed that the election was stolen from him. Trump is pathological LIAR and you're a fool to believe you know what he "believed" just cause he told you that. What he KNEW is he could RAISE MONEY from the MAGA CHUMPS by LYING about that and run again based on the FALSE PREMISE that he didn't "LOSE." 54 minutes ago, taxme said: Hillary Clinton said that when she lost the 2016 election to Trump she also said that the election was stolen from her. She never said that, and you're unable to provide that quote. 54 minutes ago, taxme said: Trump won the election in 2020 fair and square. Bidumb did not. Then why didn't Trump prove that in 60+ legal challenges. Cause NO EVIDENCE. 54 minutes ago, taxme said: When the vote counting was being tabulated, Trump was leading in five states that night by the tens of thousands. When the voting counting was stopped for the night, to be resumed in the morning, all of a sudden In the morning when the count began again, Bidumb had supposedly won the count by the same numbers as Trump had. So bs to your lies. VP Pence let the demoncrats win the election. Trump made a big mistake when he made Pence is VP. 😇 Just cause FOS LIES told you ^this, does not make it true. Edited January 12 by robosmith 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted January 13 Report Share Posted January 13 23 hours ago, Hodad said: Is it your position that some substantial portion of the population would find, say, calls for genocide as speech that is not extreme? Is there value in such speech? No. Is there harm in such speech? Yes. So, as with all other rights, there's a practical analysis to be made and sensible laws to be made. In the same way that most gun enthusiasts think the 2nd amendment protects a neighbor's right to own a rifle, but not to own a nuclear bomb. We recognize that rights are not absolute and we pass laws to balance harm and benefit. Anyone should be able to shout out whatever they want to shout out about. When we see that Israel has been bombing the crap out of the Palestinian people for the last few months, and appearing to be committing genocide against the Palestinian people, how dare those same people dare to shout out genocide, and call for genocide against those that are trying to commit genocidal crimes against them. What Israel is doing to the Palestinian people is genocide. This is not a war to eliminate Hamas. This is a war to eliminate the Palestinian people. This is an hate act being committed by Israel and anyone should be free to express so. Anyone should be freely able to say so. We are still suppose to have freedom of speech in Canada whether someone likes it or not. What happens when one day it becomes their turn to be attacked and charged with hate speech over something they said that the government did not like. Hate laws are meant to really go after anyone whom the government in power does not agree with and wants to shut them down. 🙃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted January 13 Report Share Posted January 13 23 hours ago, Hodad said: The only existential crisis was Trump attempting a coup. For the first time in our nation's history a president sought to circumvent the peaceful transfer of power. There is no evidence that the 2020 election was stolen, and no evidence that there was widespread voter fraud. There simply isn't. Despite it being the most scrutinized and analyzed election in history. Pence didn't LET the Democrats win. The voters chose the Democratic candidate. Pence simply upheld his constitutional responsibility to certify the vote, as has been done by every VP before him. ^^those are facts, and they will not be washed away by your ungrounded conspiracy speculation. Oh FFS. Go away will you. Your pro liberal progressive bs has become quite boring to say the least. You hate Trump, and so, you want him gone, only because you are a demoncrat supporter. Those are the facts, liberal. Conspiracies do happen and they do happen every day and their was conspiracy to stop Trump from becoming the President in the 2020 election. President Trump should be the President today, but Trump was robbed of that position. Those are the facts, mac. 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted January 13 Report Share Posted January 13 14 minutes ago, taxme said: Anyone should be able to shout out whatever they want to shout out about. When we see that Israel has been bombing the crap out of the Palestinian people for the last few months, and appearing to be committing genocide against the Palestinian people, how dare those same people dare to shout out genocide, and call for genocide against those that are trying to commit genocidal crimes against them. What Israel is doing to the Palestinian people is genocide. This is not a war to eliminate Hamas. This is a war to eliminate the Palestinian people. This is an hate act being committed by Israel and anyone should be free to express so. Anyone should be freely able to say so. We are still suppose to have freedom of speech in Canada whether someone likes it or not. What happens when one day it becomes their turn to be attacked and charged with hate speech over something they said that the government did not like. Hate laws are meant to really go after anyone whom the government in power does not agree with and wants to shut them down. 🙃 You've managed to turn the concept of hate speech upside down. No one thinks that saying "Stop commiting genocide" is hate speech. But advocating for genocide is. Just follow the hate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted January 13 Report Share Posted January 13 10 minutes ago, taxme said: Oh FFS. Go away will you. Your pro liberal progressive bs has become quite boring to say the least. You hate Trump, and so, you want him gone, only because you are a demoncrat supporter. Those are the facts, liberal. Conspiracies do happen and they do happen every day and their was conspiracy to stop Trump from becoming the President in the 2020 election. President Trump should be the President today, but Trump was robbed of that position. Those are the facts, mac. 😁 Yeah, there was a conspiracy to stop Trump from being president. It's called voting. Millions and millions of voters conspired to kick the corrupt autocrat out of the White House. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 13 Report Share Posted January 13 On 1/11/2024 at 12:13 PM, Yakuda said: Whenever normal people use the word compel they mean force. The problem is abnormal people who use the word force to imply people are given no choice i.e. as if agents of the state strapped people to gurney's and injected them with vaccine against their will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legato Posted January 13 Report Share Posted January 13 4 minutes ago, Hodad said: Yeah, there was a conspiracy to stop Trump from being president. It's called voting. Millions and millions of voters conspired to kick the corrupt autocrat out of the White House. and replace him with another corrupt autocrat. Be careful what you wish for. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted January 13 Report Share Posted January 13 23 hours ago, robosmith said: Trump is pathological LIAR and you're a fool to believe you know what he "believed" just cause he told you that. What he KNEW is he could RAISE MONEY from the MAGA CHUMPS by LYING about that and run again based on the FALSE PREMISE that he didn't "LOSE." She never said that, and you're unable to provide that quote. Then why didn't Trump prove that in 60+ legal challenges. Cause NO EVIDENCE. Just cause FOS LIES told you ^this, does not make it true. We all know as to who the real pathological liar is here. I will mention no names. There is plenty of evidence that Trump did win the election. Live with it. She did say it. Live with it. Just because CNN or MSNBC says it, it does not have to be true. Live with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yakuda Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 On 1/13/2024 at 3:19 PM, eyeball said: The problem is abnormal people who use the word force to imply people are given no choice i.e. as if agents of the state strapped people to gurney's and injected them with vaccine against their will. I agree there his always a choice but people losing jobs if they didn't comply though has the same effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted January 15 Author Report Share Posted January 15 On 1/12/2024 at 2:26 PM, taxme said: Trump was no doubt right when he said that America was living in an existential crisis where Trump believed that the election was stolen from him. Hillary Clinton said that when she lost the 2016 election to Trump she also said that the election was stolen from her. Trump won the election in 2020 fair and square. Bidumb did not. When the vote counting was being tabulated, Trump was leading in five states that night by the tens of thousands. When the voting counting was stopped for the night, to be resumed in the morning, all of a sudden In the morning when the count began again, Bidumb had supposedly won the count by the same numbers as Trump had. So bs to your lies. VP Pence let the demoncrats win the election. Trump made a big mistake when he made Pence is VP. 😇 What you are saying is not true. The results did not change the next morning. It took days. On Tuesday night, Trump was ahead in those states because only voting machine results had been tabulated. Yeah… that’s right… The Dominion Voting Machines had Trump winning. But Republicans had passed laws providing tabulation of vote by mail ballots until Election Day, and no sooner. They couldn’t even open the envelopes! So workers had to open each envelope and methodically hand feed millions of vote by mail ballots into tabulators. That took several days. Trump had directed his followers to vote only in person, so the in person votes were biased more in his favor. Democrats had instead launched a massive campaign to get out the vote by mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 18 minutes ago, Rebound said: The Dominion Voting Machines had Trump winning. ... Wait... if the machines were compromised, why not just have Trump winning all along ? Seems odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted January 15 Author Report Share Posted January 15 5 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Wait... if the machines were compromised, why not just have Trump winning all along ? Seems odd. Dominion machines were not used to tabulate the vote by mail ballots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 3 hours ago, Yakuda said: I agree there his always a choice but people losing jobs if they didn't comply though has the same effect. I, along with thousands of others, was forced out of two occupations in my life because people didn't care and now I do a something else. The effect is mostly temporary but I admit it seems to have left me with a lingering cynicism for some of the things the public choose or don't choose to get concerned about. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yakuda Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 10 minutes ago, eyeball said: I, along with thousands of others, was forced out of two occupations in my life because people didn't care and now I do a something else. The effect is mostly temporary but I admit it seems to have left me with a lingering cynicism for some of the things the public choose or don't choose to get concerned about. I am usually always cynical of the majority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 (edited) 20 minutes ago, eyeball said: I, along with thousands of others, was forced out of two occupations in my life because people didn't care and now I do a something else. The effect is mostly temporary but I admit it seems to have left me with a lingering cynicism for some of the things the public choose or don't choose to get concerned about. Also happened to me. No press coverage, no impact other than a few pennies in stock dividends per share to someone somewhere. Rather than all of us get angry at easy targets, we should inform each other that THAT is the game: cut costs, make owners richer so that... so that... Interestingly they don't even WHISPER "trickle down" anymore. They just use the term "the economy", to refer to a great ghost who becomes pleased when it gets bigger irrespective of peoples' lives. In the 20th century, even the centre-left used "the rich" as an even worse version of that great ghost... as a demon who wanted to exploit the little guy. That was just as disingenuous but the results were affordable homes, the 40 hour workweek, and public healthcare. "Hate the game not the player" Snoop Hardy Hardnerr Edited January 15 by Michael Hardner 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 1 minute ago, Yakuda said: I am usually always cynical of the majority. I try not to say always when it comes to this broader application. I'm usually more trusting when it's something like scientists or experts who've arrived at their majority opinion honestly through a transparent process that contains checks and balances. That's a lot different than a moral entrepreneurship that's simply trying to generate a consensus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 3 hours ago, Rebound said: What you are saying is not true. The results did not change the next morning. It took days. On Tuesday night, Trump was ahead in those states because only voting machine results had been tabulated. Yeah… that’s right… The Dominion Voting Machines had Trump winning. But Republicans had passed laws providing tabulation of vote by mail ballots until Election Day, and no sooner. They couldn’t even open the envelopes! So workers had to open each envelope and methodically hand feed millions of vote by mail ballots into tabulators. That took several days. Trump had directed his followers to vote only in person, so the in person votes were biased more in his favor. Democrats had instead launched a massive campaign to get out the vote by mail. Not according to what i heard. What i heard was that Trump would have won the election if there was no demoncrat hanky-panky involved. How could a guy like Trump lose the election when he was doing great things for America? Why would anyone want to put a demoncrat back in power? The fix was in. Live with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted January 16 Report Share Posted January 16 11 hours ago, taxme said: Not according to what i heard. What i heard was that Trump would have won the election if there was no demoncrat hanky-panky involved. How could a guy like Trump lose the election when he was doing great things for America? Why would anyone want to put a demoncrat back in power? The fix was in. Live with it. What "you heard" is what you choose to hear. If you listen to FOX pundits and YouTube kooks then you're not likely to hear accurate information. The folks who instead listen to 60+ failed court cases (laughed out of court for lack of evidence) multiple audits, forensic audits and recounts in the most scrutinized election in history, well, those folks will think you're completely unsupported allegations are deranged. It should be no surprise to ANYONE that Trump wasn't reelected. He was always very unpopular (seriously, check the polling), obviously corrupt, and in the middle of a massive--and massively mismanaged--pandemic and the associated economic fallout. What about any of that portends reelection? The fact that you were surprised, or can't even imagine how it could have happened without fraud speaks to just how disconnected you are from reality. Try real news. It'll help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted January 16 Report Share Posted January 16 12 hours ago, Hodad said: What "you heard" is what you choose to hear. If you listen to FOX pundits and YouTube kooks then you're not likely to hear accurate information. The folks who instead listen to 60+ failed court cases (laughed out of court for lack of evidence) multiple audits, forensic audits and recounts in the most scrutinized election in history, well, those folks will think you're completely unsupported allegations are deranged. It should be no surprise to ANYONE that Trump wasn't reelected. He was always very unpopular (seriously, check the polling), obviously corrupt, and in the middle of a massive--and massively mismanaged--pandemic and the associated economic fallout. What about any of that portends reelection? The fact that you were surprised, or can't even imagine how it could have happened without fraud speaks to just how disconnected you are from reality. Try real news. It'll help. You appear to do the same thing, and keep hearing what you want to hear. So, what's your point, stoopid? Any and all charges against Trump will die on the vine. The demoncrats have nothing on Trump and never will, but Trump has plenty of good stuff on the demoncrats. I do hope that when Trump becomes President, he will go after the deep state demoncrat party scum bags and put them all in the gulag where they truly belong. How can a guy like Trump not be popular when he was in the process of trying to make America great again and was seen as a great patriotic American by approx. 85% of the American people who voted for Trump. The plandemic got worse under Bidumb. Americans lost pretty much all of their freedom thanks to Bidumb. You are going to be surprised when Trump wins the 2024 election this year. Aw, to bad, so sad for you. The fix was in for Trump not to win. The leftist liberal MSM will always try to make Trump look unpopular and a crook. A stoopid bunch of commie activist losers. Yesterday Trump won the primary in Iowa. Must be a pretty popular guy, eh? 😁 Like what real news outlets should i be listening to then? Give me some examples, will you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted January 17 Report Share Posted January 17 (edited) 7 hours ago, taxme said: You appear to do the same thing, and keep hearing what you want to hear. So, what's your point, stoopid? Any and all charges against Trump will die on the vine. The demoncrats have nothing on Trump and never will, but Trump has plenty of good stuff on the demoncrats. I do hope that when Trump becomes President, he will go after the deep state demoncrat party scum bags and put them all in the gulag where they truly belong. How can a guy like Trump not be popular when he was in the process of trying to make America great again and was seen as a great patriotic American by approx. 85% of the American people who voted for Trump. The plandemic got worse under Bidumb. Americans lost pretty much all of their freedom thanks to Bidumb. You are going to be surprised when Trump wins the 2024 election this year. Aw, to bad, so sad for you. The fix was in for Trump not to win. The leftist liberal MSM will always try to make Trump look unpopular and a crook. A stoopid bunch of commie activist losers. Yesterday Trump won the primary in Iowa. Must be a pretty popular guy, eh? 😁 Like what real news outlets should i be listening to then? Give me some examples, will you? NPR, PBS, WSJ, Forbes are all good. They cater to educated audiences who prioritize credibility and completeness. Really, most of the media is basically fine, except for a few bad apples, but those listed are among the better. But the point was not to convince you to pick a news source, but to look at original sources. Look at the court cases. Look at the audits--conducted by Republicans in Monday in most cases--and ask yourself whether all the numerous, diverse and varied parties involved are in a conspiracy to hide the truth, or whether a handful of self-interested people are trying to manipulate you through lies. Put some thinking into it. When Tucker Carlson is commiserating with his peers about having to lie to the audience and about how there never was any evidence of a stolen election and how they all knew it was bullshit, you choose not to believe those candid remarks. But when the cameras are on and he tells you a different story, you buy it--literally. It's a willing suspension of disbelief. At that point, you are as much to blame as those manipulating you. And FWIW, there was no conspiracy to make Trump seem unpopular. He was unpopular all along. He lost the popular vote to already unpopular Hillary Clinton, and things went downhill from there. Edited January 17 by Hodad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted January 17 Report Share Posted January 17 16 hours ago, Hodad said: NPR, PBS, WSJ, Forbes are all good. They cater to educated audiences who prioritize credibility and completeness. Really, most of the media is basically fine, except for a few bad apples, but those listed are among the better. But the point was not to convince you to pick a news source, but to look at original sources. Look at the court cases. Look at the audits--conducted by Republicans in Monday in most cases--and ask yourself whether all the numerous, diverse and varied parties involved are in a conspiracy to hide the truth, or whether a handful of self-interested people are trying to manipulate you through lies. Put some thinking into it. When Tucker Carlson is commiserating with his peers about having to lie to the audience and about how there never was any evidence of a stolen election and how they all knew it was bullshit, you choose not to believe those candid remarks. But when the cameras are on and he tells you a different story, you buy it--literally. It's a willing suspension of disbelief. At that point, you are as much to blame as those manipulating you. And FWIW, there was no conspiracy to make Trump seem unpopular. He was unpopular all along. He lost the popular vote to already unpopular Hillary Clinton, and things went downhill from there. Trump won in Iowa by a huge margin. It would appear to me that Trump is quite popular. But your MSM that you prefer to listen to, will always tell you that Trump is unpopular. The MSM must lie in order to keep trying to make Trump look always like the anti-Christ. But, it backfired in Iowa. I can only see things going uphill for Trump from now on. So far, I guess that all those people in Iowa must be a bunch of manipulated fools for giving their support to Trump then, eh? They must have no idea as to what they are doing by voting for Trump? Silly manipulated fools, eh? LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted January 17 Report Share Posted January 17 48 minutes ago, taxme said: Trump won in Iowa by a huge margin. It would appear to me that Trump is quite popular. But your MSM that you prefer to listen to, will always tell you that Trump is unpopular. The MSM must lie in order to keep trying to make Trump look always like the anti-Christ. But, it backfired in Iowa. I can only see things going uphill for Trump from now on. So far, I guess that all those people in Iowa must be a bunch of manipulated fools for giving their support to Trump then, eh? They must have no idea as to what they are doing by voting for Trump? Silly manipulated fools, eh? LOL. Dude. you're talking about the Republican primary. He got half the votes in a primary. Half of Republicans think someone else should be President, let alone Democrats and independents. If you think that relates in any way to his popularity in general--or specifically in 2020--then you should re-think that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted January 17 Report Share Posted January 17 1 hour ago, Hodad said: Dude. you're talking about the Republican primary. He got half the votes in a primary. Half of Republicans think someone else should be President, let alone Democrats and independents. If you think that relates in any way to his popularity in general--or specifically in 2020--then you should re-think that. Trump was leading by 51% in Iowa, while the others were in the low teen numbers. That shows us all that Trump was the popular candidate for the people of Iowa. All your efforts in trying to make it appear as though Trump was not all that popular is just plain crazy and stupid. Trump got well over 85 million people to vote for him in the 2020 election. Not too bad a figure for a guy who is not all that popular, eh? You might as well give up on trying to make Trump look not all that popular because you are just wasting your useless time on trying to make Trump look unwanted. Trump will be the President in the coming election. Believe it or not. 😇 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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