Is Hate Speech Free Speech?

[Michael Hardner]

On 1/22/2024 at 7:57 AM, Perspektiv said:

 

It just didn't go well for the reporter.

 

Really ?  I think the UFC guy comes off as a boorish dolt.  Why does he think it's his job to ask a reporter who he voted for ?  His feelings were clearly hurt that he had to go after the reporter and call him the enemy...

[Hodad]

8 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

You're missing a key ingredient.

Self-awareness. Without it, feedback is nothing more than a personal attack. Useless.

Learning from bullying, is personal growth. 

Main reason why drug rehab requires a party that knows they have an issue. More importantly, knowing that they need to change, thus opening their mind to it.

Well, considering the UFC is a multi billion dollar corporation, we have millions of people who appreciate ancient Rome?

Or, there is an insanely high skill level on display, considering the multiple disciplines one must master.

Probably why so many UFC fighters have university and college education.

Learns what? That a male who wears a dress is now a woman? Highly doubt anyone with common sense would ever believe in any more than two genders.

Only lesson there, is that being gay isn't weakness. There were two gay women who fought before his fight that put a chess match on display.

He also clarified his point. He loves gay people. He hates trans ideology.

Arena was sold out chanting f*** Trudeau. So much for cancelation.

No. Behavior that goes against the current ideology. Tons of bad behavior that goes unpunished.

21 Savage can shoot ops in videos, and refer to women as to the cavities he thinks they are. Plug drug dealing and killing people you don't like. Good.

But if he made a transphobic comment. WTF. Too far!

Its precisely people like you, who are responsible for the social decay in the west. 

Being a stand up man is no longer in vogue.

 

Jeebus. Going on a homophobic -- or transphobic -- rant does NOT make one a "stand up man." 

He said something that was dumb and cruel. People should let him know that's not acceptable behavior. The people calling him out on it are the people exhibiting courage, not the bully picking on already marginalized and vulnerable groups. 

[Hodad]

8 hours ago, Yakuda said:

What about it? 

I don't know because I wouldn't know your motivation.

But your opinion doesn't determine if I am subhuman or not. I'm not offended by people's opinions if me. 

You're the only to one playing a game. There usually is hidden behind words but unlike you I won't assume the motivation I would ask but only if I care what you think. 

Why do you care what Strickland thinks? Because you're offended? Thats childish 

Okay, so the most generous interpretation here is that you're 100% committed to playing dumb. 

Meanwhile, those of us not invested in this solipsistic charade will continue to infer meaning and intent from plain statements. That is the point of communication after all: to be understood. 

When you get over the weasly bullshit and have the courage to talk plainly about plain talk, just say so. 

[Perspektiv]

3 hours ago, Hodad said:

Jeebus. Going on a homophobic -- or transphobic -- rant does NOT make one a "stand up man." 

Standing up for what you believe in, does. 

I will respect someone not afraid not to hold their tongue, and having the backbone to stand behind their beliefs, and their principles. 

Also, what is transphobic about stating the fact that women don't have penises?

3 hours ago, Hodad said:

He said something that was dumb and cruel.

His star power skyrocketed after the rant, so either many feel the same, or they respect him for not backing down to a reporter for trying to shame and bullying him into compliance.

3 hours ago, Hodad said:

People should let him know that's not acceptable behavior.

Many sided with Sean. He has made his views clear. The reporter goaded him, and got roasted for it.

He was clearly backing him into a series of corners, trying to force an apology from him, and failed miserably. 

He was trying to back a person who fights for a living,  and has a huge gun arsenal, into a corner thinking he would cower to his will.

Sean toyed with him, and gained the respect of many, including myself.

3 hours ago, Hodad said:

The people calling him out on it are the people exhibiting courage

How so? For being brittle? Not respecting his freedom of speech? The hypocrisy with being cool with him pounding another into a bloody pulp, but being offended by him pushes things too far?

3 hours ago, Hodad said:

not the bully picking on already marginalized and vulnerable groups. 

He's picking on the ideology they are pushing. Nothing he said wasn't factual about the trans community.

Can a man give birth? Questions like this are how far down the sewer this movement has put itself.

Countless genders? You can choose your gender, and routinely change your mind about it, like it was an outfit?

And its annoyed more people are losing respect for it?

They are the minority (the trans community), but their voice is amplified into being the majority. 

Not only are they heavily backed financially, they also are politically and throughout the media.

They can as a result (activists), brutally shut someone down. 

Also, those who are most vulnerable  are homeless or in communities like the black community which are used by activists to paint a picture, but aren't in any way shape or form supported by these movements.

Standing up to something that powerful (the ideology), takes balls. Not being a woman. Sorry.

[Michael Hardner]

10 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

I will respect someone not afraid not to hold their tongue...

I feel that it's more the case that this person has no control over their own ego.  He couldn't let a reporter get a question out about his views, and had to go after the reporter personally for asking him about a controversial statement that implied parenting causes gayness.

Clearly, you have some kind of hurt inside you, to make you identify with bullies like this - who go after gay people.  Maybe it's because you are, admittedly, LGBTQ+ ?  Not sure.  It makes me sad though.

So much damage and anger in the public sphere right now.  So much emotionality...

[Perspektiv]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

He couldn't let a reporter get a question out about his views

He is there to promote a fight. 

You clearly know nothing about the industry. After a weight cut to be fit to fight, fighters will be testy and insanely depleted and its not a good idea to deliberately poke the bear.

Thats how you get an irate Tyson in his prime needing to be held back from a reporter, telling him he would "f*** you until you love me, f****t" and with a "courageous" reporter being rather quiet afterwards. 

Controversy sells. You think the above rant hurt Tyson? People felt he was a loose cannon. Now they knew it.

Being nice is not advisable, if you want to be rich in the fight business. 

Connor McGregor talked about everything from people's children, their religion and it seemed like nothing was off limits to him, to get under your skin and get you to fight emotionally vs technically.

Or from going from this, to this for Colby Covington, after being told he would be cut for being too boring a fighter. 

With his rant, Strickland skyrocketed the PPV buys, netting him at least 1.5 million for his 25 minutes of work.

The reporter is there to ask questions about the fight. He tried to push his woke agenda, got chewed up, and whined to the UFC president, and further got put in his place about freedom of speech which this sport truly stands by. 

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

about a controversial statement that implied parenting causes gayness.

He's ignorant. He literally says everything that he thinks. He's clearly not all there. Does an interview with a woman telling her how nice her t**s are. 

The issue, is the reporter expecting an apology from such a guy.

I grew up in the hood. Transness doesn't exist in this environment. You approach a dude looking like one on some flirtatious shit, you may get shot or stabbed.

I grew up around extreme levels of ignorance and a lack of education for many surrounding me.

To feel entitled to watch people beat each other senseless, but not to be offended by what they say, is being out of touch.

The UFC does not control what its fighters say. Freedom of speech. 

If you want sponsorships, you are best to watch what you say, but he is making millions so isn't fussed about it.

4 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

make you identify with bullies like this - who go after gay people. 

The only thing I identify with, is that I don't hold my tongue for anyone. I will respect this.

Beauty of freedom. You're free to love it, hate it, or whatever.

 

[TreeBeard]

On 1/22/2024 at 11:09 AM, Hodad said:

Yes, not solely because it hurts people's feelings, but also because it is purely negative. There is no upside. It's not meant to be a helpful hard truth. It's cruel for the sake of being cruel about an attribute which cannot even be controlled or changed. Much like denigrating people because of skin color.

 

It’s also a lie.  No one chooses to be gay.  

Clearly this clown would be a failure as a parent even if his child were straight. 
 

[Perspektiv]

50 minutes ago, TreeBeard said:

Clearly this clown would be a failure as a parent even if his child were straight. 

See, that's how freedom of speech works.

He is free to question men who wear dresses wanting to be called women, just like you're free to question me, or him as parents. 

Some people will want to whine about it, and cancel everything.

Others will accept you can't control how others feel about you.

I think Raquel Pennington is truly the courageous one here.

She had to sit next to him during his rant, as an openly gay woman fighting in the UFC. A sport that is hard enough to get into as it is.

She was within her rights to whine about it demanding his cancellation, but chose to make it clear that his views don't affect her, but speak volumes about him to think her being gay was a choice. She took the high road, but respected his freedom of speech, all while teaching him a lesson in class.

 

[CdnFox]

7 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Clearly, you have some kind of hurt inside you, to make you identify with bullies like this

As usual - "I believe in free speech"  "Oh well you must be a bad and broken person then"

[Perspektiv]

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

"Oh well you must be a bad and broken person then"

Technically we are all broken people.

You don't make it through life without surface and internal damage along the way. Life is rough. Much more for some, than others.

Unless of course, you lived in a bubble or a glass house.

I can't stand people who pander to others. Kind of like that reporter, going to ESPN, to Scotiabank and then having a meltdown because nobody was canceling Sean.

He was trying to force Sean into an apology and it fell flat on its face. 

Watch ballet, if you don't want to see offensive stuff. Combat sports aren't for you if you're easily triggered.

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, Perspektiv said:

Technically we are all broken people.

You don't make it through life without surface and internal damage along the way. Life is rough. Much more for some, than others.

That's not 'broken' tho, that's just 'in need of maintenance'   Most of us are still functional.

Quote

Unless of course, you lived in a bubble or a glass house.

The urge to throw a stone at you is overwhelming right now. (ok maybe i'm a LITTLE broken,,,, )
 

Quote

 

I can't stand people who pander to others. Kind of like that reporter, going to ESPN, to Scotiabank and then having a meltdown because nobody was canceling Sean.

He was trying to force Sean into an apology and it fell flat on its face. 

Watch ballet, if you don't want to see offensive stuff. Combat sports aren't for you if you're easily triggered.

 

Yeah - we're in agreement there.

[Perspektiv]

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

That's not 'broken' tho, that's just 'in need of maintenance'

Isn't that the man code equivalent of a stripper just doing the job to put herself through college?

Plot twist. She's 44.

 

[CdnFox]

2 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

Isn't that the man code equivalent of a stripper just doing the job to put herself through college?

Plot twist. She's 44.

 

what the hell kind of discount strip clubs are you going to these days?!?!?

[Perspektiv]

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

what the hell kind of discount strip clubs are you going to these days?!?!?

I don't do strip clubs. Never understood the allure of paying for what I can get for free.

Now karaoke, and we're talking! 

But back to the thread.

I feel hate speech is now so vaguely defined, that it almost loses its meaning at times.

IE I insist on calling a woman a biological woman vs Cis--to some, this would be deliberately hurtful speech, even though to me, am being matter of fact, and non malicious.

I have been told it was a form of hate speech, somehow.

If the bar is set that low, to me free speech and hate speech is just fine mingling together.

Now if you want to look at something actually serious, like doing the Hitler salute at a Jewish Hanukkah celebration, to me this crosses a line where you no longer can shield yourself. Mind you, that is because that's harassment.

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, Perspektiv said:

I don't do strip clubs. Never understood the allure of paying for what I can get for free.

Now karaoke, and we're talking! 

But back to the thread.

I feel hate speech is now so vaguely defined, that it almost loses its meaning at times.

IE I insist on calling a woman a biological woman vs Cis--to some, this would be deliberately hurtful speech, even though to me, am being matter of fact, and non malicious.

I have been told it was a form of hate speech, somehow.

If the bar is set that low, to me free speech and hate speech is just fine mingling together.

Now if you want to look at something actually serious, like doing the Hitler salute at a Jewish Hanukkah celebration, to me this crosses a line where you no longer can shield yourself. Mind you, that is because that's harassment.

The definition of hate speech has definitely undergone some serious feature-creep in the last few years.

It used to mean speech specifically calling for hatred of a group in a fashion that promotes violence or illegal activity.

Now it's just if you offend someone who's on the right list of people not to offend. 

Which devalues it and eventually there's a backlash

[eyeball]

On 1/23/2024 at 12:49 PM, Hodad said:

That is the point of communication after all: to be understood. 

At least the people of Babel tried to cooperate. They'd be shaking their heads in complete bewilderment at us.

[Hodad]

On 1/23/2024 at 7:34 PM, Perspektiv said:

Standing up for what you believe in, does. 

I will respect someone not afraid not to hold their tongue, and having the backbone to stand behind their beliefs, and their principles. 

Also, what is transphobic about stating the fact that women don't have penises?

His star power skyrocketed after the rant, so either many feel the same, or they respect him for not backing down to a reporter for trying to shame and bullying him into compliance.

Many sided with Sean. He has made his views clear. The reporter goaded him, and got roasted for it.

He was clearly backing him into a series of corners, trying to force an apology from him, and failed miserably. 

He was trying to back a person who fights for a living,  and has a huge gun arsenal, into a corner thinking he would cower to his will.

Sean toyed with him, and gained the respect of many, including myself.

How so? For being brittle? Not respecting his freedom of speech? The hypocrisy with being cool with him pounding another into a bloody pulp, but being offended by him pushes things too far?

He's picking on the ideology they are pushing. Nothing he said wasn't factual about the trans community.

Can a man give birth? Questions like this are how far down the sewer this movement has put itself.

Countless genders? You can choose your gender, and routinely change your mind about it, like it was an outfit?

And its annoyed more people are losing respect for it?

They are the minority (the trans community), but their voice is amplified into being the majority. 

Not only are they heavily backed financially, they also are politically and throughout the media.

They can as a result (activists), brutally shut someone down. 

Also, those who are most vulnerable  are homeless or in communities like the black community which are used by activists to paint a picture, but aren't in any way shape or form supported by these movements.

Standing up to something that powerful (the ideology), takes balls. Not being a woman. Sorry.

I don't know why you're bringing trans people into this, but the point remains the same. 

I can't imagine why you would respect someone for saying or doing cruel things. It makes zero sense. 

Would you respect someone who shouted racial slurs and denigration at you? Is that a stand up guy?

Should we celebrate and cheer him on, or tell him it's not okay?

 

[Perspektiv]

4 hours ago, Hodad said:

I don't know why you're bringing trans people into this, but the point remains the same.

Strickland's rant, was mostly about trans ideology. 

This raised some of the ire, along with his gay statements which were far milder in comparison.

4 hours ago, Hodad said:

I can't imagine why you would respect someone for saying or doing cruel things.

I don't respect the cruel things. I respect his ability to constantly speak from the heart, and on what is on his mind.

Most would be petrified, but getting your face and mother's face kicked in by an alcoholic father kind of have a way of beating you into the ground, or fighting back. He eventually chose the latter, late in his teens.

He also almost died in a motorcycle crash. He has no business fighting, but made a life decision to embrace the things that he feared most. Never looked back. He has a chip on his shoulder, but he embodies never giving up on yourself. 

I can't help but respect that.

I am told I don't have a filter. I keep my stuff a bit more PG on this website. 

I prefer people who are blunt and tell it like it is.

4 hours ago, Hodad said:

Would you respect someone who shouted racial slurs and denigration at you?

I was friends with someone who made n****r jokes to me once he got comfortable. I found some of them funny, not lost on their context. 

His parents were racists, but they eventually dropped their guards seeing all black people aren't criminals or violent.

He introduced me to his skinhead friends. I still remember walking into one of their homes and their shocked look as I saw all his Nazi, confederate and white supremacy memorabilia. 

Needless to say, they felt comfortable with me, so were open about what they despised about Black people. Racial minorities. Of course, always "no offense" to me.

We related, because I was raised to hate white people.

"They took from us/they will take from us" was a common theme we related to.

I will look at the reasoning behind the slurs before I react to them.

Strickland was pressured and goaded, so he responded. The news outlet wanted to paint him in a certain way. They deliberately left out his clarifications otherwise, as a means to pressure the UFC into shutting it down. It was disingenuous,  so failed miserably.

4 hours ago, Hodad said:

Should we celebrate and cheer him on, or tell him it's not okay?

I will cheer him on. You can tell him it's not okay.

Reality is he isn't a millionaire because of his political views. He's an insanely talented MMA fighter, who can effortlessly choke you out, knock you out or submit you. This is all people watching him will care about.

As long as he is great at his job, he will have fans.

 

[Michael Hardner]

18 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

1. He is there to promote a fight. 

2. Being nice is not advisable, if you want to be rich in the fight business. 

3. The only thing I identify with, is that I don't hold my tongue for anyone. I will respect this.

4. Beauty of freedom. You're free to love it, hate it, or whatever.

 

1. Well then he did a sh1tty job.  The clip is all I know if him, and I think his sports league is for 1diots.

2. That's stup1d.  Using your brain is required in life, that's the end of the story.

3. You appear to hate your own LGBTQ status.  Have you ever had therapy?

4. Nope.  You are a moralist, so you have to accept when others moralize against your behaviour elsewise you are a hypocrite.

An unexamined life is not worth living.

 

[Perspektiv]

46 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Well then he did a sh1tty job. 

Did he? That clip skyrocketed Paperview buys for his main event fight. His base pay for the fight was 500 000$. He stood to walk away at least 1.5 million richer, last time I checked, based on PPV buys.

You clearly don't know a thing about the fight business or combat sports. Controversy sells.

49 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

The clip is all I know if him

Exactly. Consider the fight sold.

So the unintended consequence. The journalist tried to cancel him, didn't do his homework and it backfired driving up Strickland's numbers.

53 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I think his sports league is for 1diots

Pure opinion, considering a significant amount of UFC fighters are highly educated. 

You don't master multiple disciplines with a very low IQ.

I personally did boxing and tried Judo. There is an immense amount of technique and years needed to master each craft.

You're just annoyed that someone hurt your feelings and won't apologize or re-word things to your liking.

56 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

That's stup1d

Tell that to Connor McGregor, to Floyd Mayweather. Mohammed Ali. I could go on, with combat sport legends. Being nice isn't advisable. Being likeable to the fans, is.

Again. Purely opinion. Of the richest in the fight business, the common point is that many aren't nice.

But what isn't seen behind the veneer of promoting the fight, is that they treat their fans like gold.

Also, the irony of your statement in that fans can easily tell Strickland being "in character", or talking on a serious and deep level.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

You appear to hate your own LGBTQ status

Am proud to be asexual. I wouldn't mention it if I wasn't. I don't like the direction this group is moving in. I don't like some of the ideologies they are peddling. 

I really don't like that they can't get their shit together, and come down to a consensus on a name or acronym to use that sticks for like a generation before constantly changing it.

Like I said. I speak freely. I deal with the potential consequences after.

I am not afraid to lay in the bed that I made for myself.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

Have you ever had therapy?

For respecting people who don't hold their tongues? Am confused.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

so you have to accept when others moralize against your behaviour

Oh I do. I also hope you understand people can do the same to you, and pick apart your faulty logic.

Its a double edged sword. We disagree vehemently on several things, and I don't see anything wrong with that.

I don't mind the heat or the kitchen. In fact, the more controversial the subject the happier I will be debating it.

[Michael Hardner]

14 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

1. That clip skyrocketed Paperview buys for his main event fight.

2. I personally did boxing and tried Judo. There is an immense amount of technique and years needed to master each craft.

3. You're just annoyed that someone hurt your feelings and won't apologize or re-word things to your liking.

4. Am proud to be asexual. I wouldn't mention it if I wasn't. I don't like the direction this group is moving in. I don't like some of the ideologies they are peddling.  I really don't like that they can't get their shit together, and come down to a consensus on a name or acronym to use that sticks for like a generation before constantly changing it.

5. Like I said. I speak freely. I deal with the potential consequences after. I am not afraid to lay in the bed that I made for myself.

6. I don't see anything wrong with that.

7. I don't mind the heat or the kitchen. In fact, the more controversial the subject the happier I will be debating it.

1. There's no way to prove such a thing, unless you have some kind of internal metrics on links to the ticket page which you do not.  Then again, for the guy who is always right and never concedes a point, what does that matter ?

2.  Why would I give a sh1t about your hobbies ?  It's irrelevant.

3. You're the one who deals in the currency of emotionality.  This clip is about a doltish bully expressing outraged at merely being asked about his opinions and you glom on to it exactly because of the inert anger, as far as I can guess.  What else is to be admired on this person pushing his opinion on others (something you profess to be against by the way) is anyone's guess.  Hypocrisy and refusal to concede a point, again.

4.  So.... the therapy question ?  Asexuals have been said to be THE most marginalized of the LGBTQ+ community.  That must have an impact on ones' perspective.  

5.  If you had ever admitted you were wrong or conceded a point, I would believe that you 'deal with' the consequences or 'lay in the bed'.  You don't.  You are typical of the problem with our society today: everything is about you, except when it's about failings when it's about everyone else.  I'm an atheist but I mourn one thing about the decline of the religion, which is the ascendence of the ideology of selfishness which is typified in your posts.  

6. Have you ever conceded that you are wrong or changed your views on here ?  No.

7. Debating includes listening, which you don't do.  You spew out opinions and stand on your hypocrisy which includes decrying people who moralize and yet moralizing all the while.  Your opinions aren't controversial, disturbing or shocking in the least.  They're typical.  I am just sad that an intelligent person is so set in their ways, because it's a loss.

"The" public was based on the idea that people would actually listen and change their opinions, but you're a son of TV Cable News shows... I hope the next generation is better at this.

[Perspektiv]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

There's no way to prove such a thing

PPV buys pre and post comments are a rather accurate way to determine whether and how much a fighter "moves the needle".

Another accurate way, is to look at how much a fighter's name is Googled.

His "needle" skyrocketed, after those comments, pushing him past superstar Connor McGregor.

Those statistics are there for everyone to see. Gate for a fight, PPV buys, bonuses. What cannot be seen, is exactly what percentage of the buys the main event received.

Something in that week bumped those sales immensely and suddenly. Who knows, but my best guess based on data is thst it was that. Just a hunch.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

It's irrelevant.

Very relevant. Those disciplines are hard to learn. You clearly never tried one, or you would know.

You equated MMA to a low IQ. Which is negated by the sheer volume of highly educated fighters. Mastery takes a lifetime. Many fighters have mastered 2 to 3 or more disciplines.

Its nothing like boxing where many fighters have little to no education.

You're conflating your opinion for fact.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

This clip is about a doltish bully expressing outraged at merely being asked about his opinions

During a fight promotion. The reporter refused to drop it, so was clearly adamant he would get a soundbite. It is out of touch, and insane he would have expected a different result, considering Strickland doesn't hide who he is.

He stands by his beliefs and his fight style is similar, in that he doesn't back down from adversity most men would fold from.

Its the latter that I respect.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

Asexuals have been said to be THE most marginalized of the LGBTQ+ community.  

I have no shame in it. My sexuality doesn't define me. I see it like skin color or being born poor.

I was born under heavy adversity (under heavy complications to boot). It just made me a scrappy person who isn't afraid to carry the weight of the world on my back. I know what being rock bottom and having nothing feels like, which contributed heavily to my nature of living like I could die tomorrow (making the most of every moment) and having nothing to lose.

You can feel how you wish about it. The beauty of free speech.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

You don't. 

You use manipulative and deceptive debate tactics and get butt hurt when people adjust their debating with you based on it. You have been called on it by plenty of posters, to boot. Maybe its a problem.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

You are typical of the problem with our society today

I think many posters would disagree with you on that  whether they like me or not. 

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

Debating includes listening

To you this translates to agreeing to your wording and to what you're saying. 

To me, listening is taking something into consideration. Humbling oneself to something they may not know. Am still free to disagree with you.

Not sure where that goes against it.

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

because it's a loss.

To you in a debate with them. Suck it up.

[Michael Hardner]

2 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

1. PPV buys pre and post comments are a rather accurate way to determine whether and how much a fighter "moves the needle". Another accurate way, is to look at how much a fighter's name is Googled.....  Just a hunch.

2. Very relevant. Those disciplines are hard to learn. You clearly never tried one, or you would know.  You equated MMA to a low IQ.

3. I have no shame in it. My sexuality doesn't define me. I see it like skin color or being born poor. I was born under heavy adversity (under heavy complications to boot). It just made me a scrappy person who isn't afraid to carry the weight of the world on my back. I know what being rock bottom and having nothing feels like, which contributed heavily to my nature of living like I could die tomorrow (making the most of every moment) and having nothing to lose.

4. You use manipulative and deceptive debate tactics and get butt hurt when people adjust their debating with you based on it.

5. You have been called on it by plenty of posters, to boot. Maybe its a problem.

6. I think many posters would disagree with you on that  whether they like me or not. 

7. To you this translates to agreeing to your wording and to what you're saying. 

8.To me, listening is taking something into consideration. Humbling oneself to something they may not know. Am still free to disagree with you.  Not sure where that goes against it.

9. To you in a debate with them. Suck it up.

1. None of that shows a causal chain.  But you don't care about convincing me anyway.
2. It's only relevant to an egomaniac who thinks the world cares about his entertainments.  I don't.    I don't care if this UFC guy trains for 5 minutes or 5 years.  I didn't equate MMA to low IQ, you inferred that.  I said that this guy is doltish, that's all.  Man you talk about fighting a lot...
3.  Good for you, sincerely.  Good for you on all of it.  You still haven't answered the therapy question, though, which is telling.  You don't need to.  I will stop asking at this point.
4.  A manipulative tactic is to tell people what is going on in their heads.  It's called gaslighting.  "Butt hurt" is not in my vocabulary when I speak to you.  What I do have is plenty of curiosity, which makes me ask questions about you that I don't do of other posters.  I have to fight the inclination to make assumptions about you - which is something you do not fight at all.
5. My technique is my own.  If you have a problem with my facts then please address that.  I'm not going to change what you see as technique because you don't like it.  I will go to the root of the principles at play in any discussion, and for you it's ambiguous to the point of hypocrisy.  Your key attribute is rejecting moralism while moralizing as strong as anyone to my mind.
6. I never said I didn't like you.  You're inferring again.  I should say that I don't like you or dislike you.  I enjoy your posts, which is as much as we get on a board like this.
7. Incorrect.  I merely ask you to agree with your own opinions and live up to your statements about yourself.  You "lay in your bed" or whatever.  But you run away when I point out any inconsistencies, such as you openly saying you refuse to do some action to help a social problem while decrying social problems that you disagree with.  That's hypocrisy and rather than respond you shrug.  That's the moral decay of consumerism I would say.
8. Indeed a good definition.  You seem to think that I *dislike* you and yet I compliment your points and agree with many of them.  I guess you don't see that, not sure why.  Maybe the tough life you described makes you see the world as allies and enemies only?
9. I hardly ever debate on here.  I usually discuss, which is a different type of activity. 

[Deluge]

22 hours ago, TreeBeard said:

It’s also a lie.  No one chooses to be gay.  

Clearly this clown would be a failure as a parent even if his child were straight. 
 

You're full of shit. Lots of people choose to be gay. Somewhere, someplace, some scumbag got the idea out that NOT being a typical heterosexual is preferable, and it took. It ties in with the absurd gender fluidity argument, anti-patriarchy and white hate. 

GOOD parents typically lead successful marriages and teach their sons and daughters traditional values. Everyone else should probably be thrown in the slammer.

[Perspektiv]

26 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

But you don't care about convincing me anyway.

I don't need to convince you. The statistics speak for themselves. You can ignore them if you wish.

27 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I don't

The UFC sold for over 5 billion dollars (US). Those numbers show there are millions of people who love combat sports, and care little how you feel about it.

30 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I said that this guy is doltish

In your opinion. 

31 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

A manipulative tactic is to tell people what is going on in their heads. 

2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

So.... the therapy question ?  Asexuals have been said to be THE most marginalized of the LGBTQ+ community.  That must have an impact on ones' perspective.  

 

37 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

You "lay in your bed" or whatever.

You feel its about conceding to a disagreement in the heat of a debate. I haven't bent the knee to you. 

50 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

My technique is my own.

Many have called you out on it.

51 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I never said I didn't like you.

Debating isn't about liking people. It's about making a strong case for your opinion. 

People here could wish me to get hit by a car for all I care for. If they debate well, we will discuss and how seriously we debate will signal the level of respect I have for them.

52 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Maybe the tough life you described makes you see the world as allies and enemies only?

Not really, you have shown sheisty debate tactics. 

Has nothing to do with my childhood. My childhood just makes me more resilient and determined.

56 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I usually discuss

I discuss with my wife. Meaning both humble themselves to listening. No judgment. Just tough subjects being broached.

When you try to force your hand, you're actually debating. You try to character assassinate someone then get butt hurt at their return fire and play victim you're being hypocritical.