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AOC calls a parent's right to know what's being taught to their kids "fascism"


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2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Sure, but not just that.... teach them how to learn on their own.  Teach them values, history, and how to think on their own.

Do they teach gender ideology history? Like post modern adoption of certain terminologies.

How they came about? The evolution of trans ideology?

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20 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Do you think that they should?

You said they should teach history. Gender ideology has a history behind it. A movement behind it. Heavy handed activism, and lobbying behind it.

If you need to teach kids activism, you need to teach them the good, the bad and the ugly about all that is being taught to them, including trans ideology. Like you said, to allow them to think for themselves. Otherwise, you're coercing them into how to think.

Otherwise, you get woke SJW activists, who are bubbling with rage (along with half a dozen mental health issues), and only understand the talking points that they were taught in school, but have zero common sense, or intellectual ability to interpret what they learned within context or talk outside the box that they have been put in.

You teach activism before common sense and skill sets, and you get this stuff, which is the rage, unfortunately.

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45 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

You said they should teach history. Gender ideology has a history behind it. A movement behind it. Heavy handed activism, and lobbying behind it.

If you need to teach kids activism, you need to teach them the good, the bad and the ugly about all that is being taught to them, including trans ideology. Like you said, to allow them to think for themselves. Otherwise, you're coercing them into how to think.

Otherwise, you get woke SJW activists, who are bubbling with rage (along with half a dozen mental health issues), and only understand the talking points that they were taught in school, but have zero common sense, or intellectual ability to interpret what they learned within context or talk outside the box that they have been put in.

You teach activism before common sense and skill sets, and you get this stuff, which is the rage, unfortunately.

You're talking about things that I didn't post about but ok.

They're not teaching activism, and not teaching anything before anything else.  It all goes together.

 

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10 hours ago, West said:

Thank you for coming around and realizing the far left bs of calling everything they disagree with "fascism" has really dumbed down the debate

Not at all.  It was a post agreeing with the point about openness with regard to the curriculum.

That said, I think pretty much everyone who uses the term fascism, or Nazism, needs to read a few history books.  I haven't read the act in question, but from the news I've read, it sure didn't meet the definition.

 

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3 hours ago, Rebound said:

“Rep. Lauren Boebert, R-Colo., successfully added amendments that would require schools to report when transgender girls join girls’ athletics teams and if trans girls are allowed to use girls’ school restrooms or locker rooms. The bill would also require elementary and middle schools get parents’ consent to change a child’s gender designation, pronouns or name.”

Nothing unreasonable there. Parents should be concerned if boys are using girls restrooms or locker rooms. And of course parental consent should be needed if the teachers decide to change a child's gender, pronouns or name. 

Good on Lauren Boebert.

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2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

It all goes together.

Teaching kids to be activists, to me is teaching concepts most will not have the cognitive ability to truly understand below a certain age.

IE a woke kindergarten teacher I know, who prided themselves on teaching her version of critical race theory.

To her, she focused on drilling into heads that unless you're constantly fighting racism as a white person, that you're just as responsible as prior generations for the damage done by it. 

She would play games with the kids, to make the white kids feel horrible about how much better they have it, over all their multicultural friends. 

She felt pride, when she would see the shattered faces of the white kids, and now could provide them a solution to that immense weight of guilt she had placed onto their shoulders. 

Ironically  you're teaching them that they are inferior. That is precisely the racism that is so called being attacked.

The danger with teaching kids activism isn't the activism. Its the person teaching with an agenda.

My nieces and nephews were taught that everything is racist, and that us being black makes us victims. 

I don't know. Just my opinion. Teach kids to respect one another. Teach them valuable skills. They will do far more with their lives than Twitter activists Twitter or Tik Tok flexing, yet doing nothing.

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On 3/24/2023 at 7:39 AM, West said:

Keep these lefty groomers away from our kids

Perhaps her constituents will have a change of heart once the 14th district has been completely overrun by the same diversity and wokeness that Portland and San Francisco are burdened with. 

Edited by Deluge
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7 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

When I see kids feeling that activism is gluing their hands to expensive paintings to protest petroleum (using you guessed it--glues that are petroleum based), I feel that activism cannot be taught.

Why do you believe real teachers are teaching ^this? Seems like the kind of thing picked up on the interwebz.

The amount of petroleum in an oz of Super Glue is insignificant compared to the amount that's burned as fossil fuels.

 

7 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

You're better off ensuring the youth become productive parts of society.

Progress due to activism has been VERY PRODUCTIVE throughout history.

7 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

In my humble opinion, if a child has more knowledge about being an SJW, than on how to get things done, that parent has failed their child.

Just because you denigrate social justice does not mean it does not produce progress like releasing your people from SLAVERY and Jim Crow.

7 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

The world doesn't owe you a thing.

Actually it does, because equal opportunity is very profitable for "the world."

7 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

Teach children skills. You ironically get AOC, when you teach activism and woke ideologies, vs competence and skills.

AOC is a very effective spokesperson for PROGRESS in most cases, because she usually makes a lot of sense.

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4 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

Do they teach gender ideology history? Like post modern adoption of certain terminologies.

How they came about? The evolution of trans ideology?

Do you know ANYTHING about the stages of physical and mental development of a fetus in the womb?

Most right wingers are completely IGNORANT about those things and so simple minded they just parrot the LIE that there are only 2 genders.

The FACT is mental and physical development are sometimes NOT synchronized.

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3 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

You said they should teach history. Gender ideology has a history behind it. A movement behind it. Heavy handed activism, and lobbying behind it.

If you need to teach kids activism, you need to teach them the good, the bad and the ugly about all that is being taught to them, including trans ideology. Like you said, to allow them to think for themselves. Otherwise, you're coercing them into how to think.

Otherwise, you get woke SJW activists, who are bubbling with rage (along with half a dozen mental health issues), and only understand the talking points that they were taught in school, but have zero common sense, or intellectual ability to interpret what they learned within context or talk outside the box that they have been put in.

You teach activism before common sense and skill sets, and you get this stuff, which is the rage, unfortunately.

It has SCIENCE behind it. Of which you are obviously completely IGNORANT.

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23 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Speaking of education... there's precious little in the way of explanation of what this is online.

Seems like parents must know what the education material is - which is fine.  More charter schools, which seems like a Trojan Horse, is also included.  

Fascist ?  I don't see how.

I still don't understand why school choice advocates somehow believe that Charter Schools are somehow superior to rank and file public schools.

In Florida counties, most charter schools are in the public school system. They follow the same rules. They just have special emphasis. In my county, one Charter School is K-12, and it is mostly based on arts and entertainment. One Charter School is designed for middle and high schoolers as a last chance to graduate. One Charter School is dedicated solely to the handicapped, (everything from simple autism to full blown Downs syndrome. One specialty Charter School is solely dedicated to Pre K, and may be one of the most professional institutions of its kind. I've subbed at all of them.

 

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38 minutes ago, robosmith said:

The amount of petroleum in an oz of Super Glue is insignificant compared to the amount that's burned as fossil fuels.

The irony of it is comical. One should understand the principles you're fighting for, matter more than the tactics.

39 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Just because you denigrate social justice does not mean it does not produce progress like releasing your people from SLAVERY and Jim Crow.

You're comparing such movements, to current movements where people who have zero life experience, call a worthy cause, gluing their hands to expensive art to protest fossil fuels. One is a human rights issue, the other is privilege people not understanding the true scale of how fossil fuels will continue to dominate the world, decades over, simply because poor countries will not have the money nor the infrastructure to adopt such technologies. Likely people who haven't traveled outside of their safe and privileged bubble.

42 minutes ago, robosmith said:

AOC is a very effective spokesperson for PROGRESS in most cases, because she usually makes a lot of sense.

There is very little logic coming from her. Logic to me, is one discussing a problem, and approaching them with pragmatic solutions. What you're describing, is someone playing into culture wars, that are dividing America, and doing nothing. Name me one thing that her talking has done, other than wasting taxpayer dollars.

44 minutes ago, robosmith said:

because equal opportunity is very profitable for "the world."

If I can generate capital, and open a business--I want a world where my effort and expertise will generate me the money I have earned for my effort. Get a higher and better education based on your market needs, get a higher salary.

Equality, is only profitable for those at the top. You clearly haven't been to a socialist country, if you genuinely believe sociology works.

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29 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

Name me 20 genders in the spectrum, without looking.

First YOU TELL ME HOW and WHY the number of genders EXCEED TWO.

If you don't understand the basic SCIENCE of DEVELOPMENT, discussing arbitrary numbers is POINTLESS. 

For INSTANCE, WHY did you CLAIM there are "20 genders"? I've not seen ANY science that suggests that.

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24 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

The irony of it is comical. One should understand the principles you're fighting for, matter more than the tactics.

The "principle" that there are minute amounts of petroleum MEANS NOTHING wrt the world reliance on fossil fuels.

There will ALWAYS be USES for petroleum long after fossil fuels are PHASED OUT as energy sources.

24 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

You're comparing such movements, to current movements where people who have zero life experience, call a worthy cause, gluing their hands to expensive art to protest fossil fuels. One is a human rights issue, the other is privilege people not understanding the true scale of how fossil fuels will continue to dominate the world, decades over, simply because poor countries will not have the money nor the infrastructure to adopt such technologies. Likely people who haven't traveled outside of their safe and privileged bubble.

^Likely people who have ZERO knowledge of what energy production is ACHEIVABLE through INNOVATION when SUBSIDIES for fossil fuels are ENDED.

24 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

There is very little logic coming from her. Logic to me, is one discussing a problem, and approaching them with pragmatic solutions. What you're describing, is someone playing into culture wars, that are dividing America, and doing nothing. Name me one thing that her talking has done, other than wasting taxpayer dollars.

First you name ONE THING she has done which YOU BELIEVE has "wasted taxpayer dollars."

Just because YOU CONSIDER something to be a WASTE could just be your IGNORANCE about what was accomplished.

24 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

If I can generate capital, and open a business--I want a world where my effort and expertise will generate me the money I have earned for my effort. Get a higher and better education based on your market needs, get a higher salary.

So what? AOC is NOT stopping you.

24 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

Equality, is only profitable for those at the top. You clearly haven't been to a socialist country, if you genuinely believe sociology works.

Scandinavian countries with democratic socialism disagree. There is a HUGE difference between "equality" and equal OPPORTUNITY. Did you have opportunity equal to my white privilege? Maybe you did if you  grew up after ACTIVISM quashed Jim Crow in the 1960's.

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6 hours ago, Rebound said:

Fascism in its glory.  
 

In the news this week: Uganda outlawed homosexuality. Punishment for gay sex: The Death Penalty.  Sounds like the MAGA’s belong in Uganda.  

Despicable.  US evangelicals can't get the death penalty for homosexuality in their homeland, so they spend millions to get it enacted in other countries.  Christianity, catching up with Islam.

They and the Ugandans who serve them are arseholes.

https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/uganda-anti-lgbtq-bill-rcna76630

 

 

Edited by bcsapper
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6 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Kind of?   I'm not so interested in quibbling over word meaning.

 

I do think that the trans panic is largely:

-inhumane 

-unprincipled 

-a distraction from worse problems that the public should be discussing 

 

 

I do believe that all definitions of fascism include  organized bigotry based upon national origin, race, and religion, as well as anti-homosexuality.  

In the Nazi concentration camps, Jews wore yellow stars and homosexuals wore pink triangles. 

Edited by Rebound
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3 hours ago, bcsapper said:

That said, I think pretty much everyone who uses the term fascism, or Nazism, needs to read a few history books.  I haven't read the act in question, but from the news I've read, it sure didn't meet the definition.

AOC definitely used it wrong, but it has 7 letters in it so what did we expect?

I partially agree with this part:

Quote

pretty much everyone who uses the term fascism, or Nazism, needs to read a few history books

but I'd change it to "pretty much everyone who opines on the topic of fascism needs to read a few history books".

In this day and age the popular misuses of the term fascism fall into 2 categories: 1) "anything a government did which someone doesn't like is fascism", and 2) "it's only fascism when a government commits genocide". Both are equally wrong. 

When you're using the former, you're just a whiner, but when you're using the latter it's a real problem, because fascism falls way short of violent genocide. It can be a means to achieving it, but the desire to commit genocide isn't a mandatory part of the puzzle if you're trying to determine how far along the fasc-o-meter one is. 

A classic example of #2 is Canada, especially during covid. Just remember that some central themes of fascism are: firm control of the MSM (expand that to social media now), a disregard for individual rights and freedoms, designating specific groups as 'less thans', expressions of an urgent need for everyone to have the exact same beliefs, and punishments for anyone who doesn't comply.

When people noticed that Trudeau's hateful & bigoted speeches, attacks on human rights, attacks on human freedoms, his attacks on specific groups (on both medical and religious grounds), and his control over the MSM and social media were out of control, leftists moved the goalposts back to "He didn't commit genocide, so he isn't a fascist!"

 

Hitler/Trudeau

Freeze the bank accounts of political dissidents/Freedom Convoy supporters

Jews are unclean/the unvaxed are unclean 

Ostracism of Jews/the unvaxed is necessary

MSM control in Canada easily rivals that of Nazi Germany, and social media was overseen by the Trusted News Initiative, or TNI, which CBC is a part of.

The Jews are..../the unvaxed are "very often racists and msogynists" (WTF?)

We absolutely experienced fascism here, but people who went along with fascism in Canada and Germany just called it awesomeness, because from their POV that's what it felt like.

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10 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Ok, there it is... trans panic.

Why is this "panic"?  You're inferring this is unreasonable.  Are there legitimate concerns with these issues?

Should teachers go ahead and allow children in elementary and middle schools to change their gender designation, pronouns or name without parental knowledge or consent.

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