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The Queen kicks the bucket


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10 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

Well in none of those VERY RARE (and also mostly old) cases did the Canadian LG or GG call Buckingham palace for direction.  Which proves that even if an office of GG/LG is required we don’t need to it to be associated with the British monarchy 


I would prefer to get rid of the monarchy altogether but I doubt that would be possible in Canada for a long time to come, mainly because of our constitutional gridlock. 


If GGs are granted such reserve powers as a check on the executive, to be used very rarely as you point out, they should still be seen as impartial and more than mere servants of the PM. To achieve that, we need a new process of selecting them. A secret ballot of MPs (or MLAs for LGs) might be one way to do this. Not exactly the most pressing problem the country faces, I’ll grant you. 

Edited by SpankyMcFarland
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7 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:


I would prefer to get rid of the monarchy altogether but I doubt that would be possible in Canada

it's not possible in Canada

to become a republic, Canada would have to be dissolved

a new constitution would have to be written

the basis of all Canadian constitutional law is the Treaty of Paris 1763

that would have to be replaced with some other claim to these lands

what that would be, is not clear

particularly when the Government of Canada itself has stated

that Canada is an inherently "racist" institution responsible for "genocide"

what would be the point of upholding a state which indicts itself for Crimes Against Humanity ?

Nazi Germany had to be erased, then replaced by the Americans & Soviets

Edited by Dougie93
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44 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

called me out for what ?

it's no crime to be a republican in Canada

vive le Quebec libre

 

42 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

in terms of the King

I.......was forced to abdicate for far less

 

27 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

bear in mind, the British Crown is not an absolute monarchy and .....

Bottom line is you were a fanboy of the queen, not royalty ? And certainly not Canadian.

So, whatever else you have to say has no applicability here in Canada.

Oh and me, I am not a monarchist in any way.

Edited by ExFlyer
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2 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Bottom line is you were a fanboy of the queen, not royalty ? And certainly not Canadian.

So, whatever else you have to say has no applicability here in Canada.

Oh and me, I am not a monarchist in any way.

I am a Briton

when we have a good monarch, we defend & uphold them

when we have a bad monarch, we overthrow & replace them

Canada, to wit Parliamentary Supremacy,  was born on the banks of the Boyne river on 1 July 1690

when the Ulster Scots deposed the King by force of arms

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again, the Crown of Canada itself has stated by official decree

that Canada is an inherently "racist" institution responsible for "genocide"

that is obviously a pathetic state of affairs, which should not be defended nor upheld

conversely, if the Crown is lying, simply saying this to pander to Bolsheviks

that is also a pathetic state of affairs which should not be defended nor upheld

either way, Canada is ignominious at this point, by the decrees of its own Crown

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45 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

again, the Crown of Canada itself has stated by official decree

that Canada is an inherently "racist" institution responsible for "genocide"

that is obviously a pathetic state of affairs, which should not be defended nor upheld

conversely, if the Crown is lying, simply saying this to pander to Bolsheviks

that is also a pathetic state of affairs which should not be defended nor upheld

either way, Canada is ignominious at this point, by the decrees of its own Crown

No more ignominious than the US, UK, or any league of Indigenous groups.  There are few truly egalitarian societies.  They tend to be small and oppressed by cultural norms that would drive any outsider crazy.

Canada is a noble idea based on responsible government and revision as opposed to revolution.  If you’re loyal to the Crown you’re loyal to the constitutional monarchy. The current human being occupying that seat is not perfect but merely plays a carefully choreographed role. The blood monarch (as opposed to the appointed GG) brings with it the idea of the symbolic state family.  The Americans desperately try to create that with the First Lady.  We saw it with the Kennedys.  However, mixing the ceremonial/symbolic with the political, as in the US, doesn’t work well because it fetishizes politicians and they soon leave office.  The monarch never leaves. There’s something incredibly powerful about walking through Kingston or Halifax or Toronto and seeing the GR or VR imprimaturs of the past.  It creates a sense of stability and continuity, like a family cottage that never gets sold.

 I think we’d feel a sense of real loss if we gave up the monarchy, especially if the alternative is the vision of Chinese totalitarianism sympathizer and UN toady Prime Ministers.

Canada maintains herself best in between massive US influence, British democratic institutions, and the cosmopolitan outward-looking 3rd option that Pierre Trudeau championed.  I think if any of those forces gets too powerful in Canada, the rationale for the Canadian nation state dwindles.

We seem quite trapped by the international focus under Justin Trudeau.  The multiculturalism designed to keep ethno-nationalism in check, especially in Quebec, has lapsed into Post-National State, a kind of China-inspired, globally run tax jurisdiction without tradition or accountability to Canadian citizens and the Charter.

The country is off balance.  If we forget our roots and fail to value the hard work of past generations to build what we have, it will be destroyed by corrupt and/or ill-informed ideologues.  That’s what cancel culture is all about.  There is much worth preserving in Canada.  

Edited by Zeitgeist
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48 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

I am a Briton

when we have a good monarch, we defend & uphold them

when we have a bad monarch, we overthrow & replace them

....

 

37 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

again, the Crown of Canada itself has stated by official decree

that Canada is ......

Yeah, right LOL

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Spare me your woke whine about privilege. Anyone who lives in the West in this day and age is privileged

I'm a 6 foot tall white man from Canada of course I'm privileged but to compare the British royal family to any normal person from the west is just ridiculous 

who took on a job with enormous responsibilities

enormous responsibility? What are you on about? It's someone with unlimited resources an entire team of handlers, completely controlled public outings and a position that is purely ceremonial.  The high school student with a part time job at McDonald's has exponentially more "responsibility"

 

yelling insults

sir all I said is she was a rich inbread,  that's just factual.  You're the only one throwing around insults. 

 

is you're a nobody with no accomplishments in life and nobody cares about.And your jealousy lies in the fact that when you die nobody is going to take notice or give a damn.

I have a great life, you should work on yours because your projection is pretty severe 

Edited by SkyHigh
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3 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

when the Ulster Scots deposed the King by force of arms

Bit of a stretch in that claim. Only half of William’s force was British, let alone Ulster Scots. Aughrim was the decisive battle and William was supported by the Pope in his endeavours. 

Edited by SpankyMcFarland
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2 hours ago, SkyHigh said:

who took on a job with enormous responsibilities

enormous responsibility? What are you on about? It's someone with unlimited resources an entire team of handlers, completely controlled public outings and a position that is purely ceremonial.  The high school student with a part time job at McDonald's has exponentially more "responsibility"

You ought to have pride enough not to expose your complete lack of knowledge on subjects under discussion. All you seem to understand is that, unlike you, they have a great deal of money. But lots of people are wealthy. There are literally thousands of billionaires. What responsibilities do they have? They can do what they want, when they want, or not do anything at all.

The Queen's schedule is legendary, and filled with all manner of tasks few would have much interest in doing. Prior to her health fading the woman worked long hours day in and day out in her role as Sovereign. If she wasn't opening bridges or attending the launch of warships she was presiding over parliament or visiting the sick in hospitals or going to funerals or celebratory masses. Do you have any idea how many public speeches the woman has had to give in her life? How many places she's had to visit - and not as a tourist, but on official business with a busy schedule? Is cutting the ribbon on a new subway and then giving a speech your idea of a great time?

When not out and about she'd be home dealing with and answering her mail, or going through the special boxes containing documents she had to look over and approve, such as bills passed by parliament. Or she'd have lunches or meetings with bishops, charity workers, foreign ambassadors, or the prime minister, as examples. She has to be extremely careful of what she says, of course, always on her guard to stay apolitical.

 

2 hours ago, SkyHigh said:

sir all I said is she was a rich inbread,  that's just factual. 

Is it? She lived a healthy life to the age of 96. Her husband died at 99. her mother lived to 103. Poor blood there, I suppose?

2 hours ago, SkyHigh said:

I have a great life, you should work on yours because your projection is pretty severe 

Awfully bitter towards a strange woman you know little about for someone happy in their life.

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42 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

 

42 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

There are literally thousands of billionaires.

How many have their face on our currency? The answer is none

I'm certainly no cheerleader for people like besos or gates,  but they like many others actually built something to earn their wealth 

42 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

The Queen's schedule is legendary,

Yes she was a busy lady, and by what I know seemed to represent herself with pose and class, but having to meet people and give speeches written by others is not real responsibility, again unlimited resources, an enormous staff and handlers making sure everything is presented how they want.I think a whole lot of people could fill that role.

 

42 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

She lived a healthy life

And? Are you honestly arguing that the British royal family don't share many  common descendents? Weren't Charles and Diana cousins ? Now who should have some pride not to expose themselves?

 

42 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

All you seem to understand is that, unlike you, they have a great deal of money

Is that all I understand? I obviously don't have that kind of money, but I've worked hard to have more than I'll ever need to be happy, so sorry no jealously here. 

 

42 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Awfully bitter

You're the one taking personal shots at me sir, so calling me bitter is just more projection on your part, you should see someone about that

All I said is I don't understand the hoopla over some lady born into privilege that has zero relevance to today's society, the veterinarian that died in Québec recently is and should be more important than the British royal family yet I doubt the 24 hour news channels show her funeral 

 

Edited by SkyHigh
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Strange how strong the connection between Canada and the British momarchy really is. After all, culturally speaking Canada and the UK are far more apart from each other than the UK and Australia/New Zealand are even though Canada is geographically closer to the UK than those two southern hemisphere countries.

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47 minutes ago, -TSS- said:

Strange how strong the connection between Canada and the British momarchy really is. After all, culturally speaking Canada and the UK are far more apart from each other than the UK and Australia/New Zealand are even though Canada is geographically closer to the UK than those two southern hemisphere countries.


I think it reflects a greater insecurity around identity in Canadian anglophones compared to Australasians. We live beside a superpower, speak their language and sound very like them, eat the same food and watch the same sports. The monarchy is something that makes us seem less American. We are not all that familiar with Britain and we certainly don’t sound like them but we need the Crown more than people on the other side of the earth who play cricket and rugby.  

Edited by SpankyMcFarland
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1 hour ago, SkyHigh said:

Yes she was a busy lady, and by what I know seemed to represent herself with pose and class, but having to meet people and give speeches written by others is not real responsibility, again unlimited resources, an enormous staff and handlers making sure everything is presented how they want.I think a whole lot of people could fill that role.

Again, you're failing to understand the purpose and value of the monarch and the royals. Especially in these times of political division, the Queen, as the head of state, served as a constant, reassuring reminder in everyone's lives. A non-political national leader everyone could unite behind. And don't discount her influence behind the scenes because every politician who has spoken of her, including Harper, Mulroney, Clark and Chretien, as well as past British PMs have spoken of her enormous store of knowledge, experience, intelligence and diplomatic ability. They could ask her advice and know that it would be good and that she could keep a confidence. The royals have long served as roving ambassadors for the UK, as well, soothing troubled waters around the world as they deal with foreign leaders in a casual way more formal government ambassadors can't.

You say a lot of people could fill that role. Could they fill it to the extent you have foreign governments dropping their flags to half mast when they died? Would the president of France and chancellor of Germany have their national flags at half mast as they lament her death? I've seen no such international unanimity at the death of any international leader.

 

1 hour ago, SkyHigh said:

You're the one taking personal shots at me sir, so calling me bitter is just more projection on your part, you should see someone about that

All I said is I don't understand the hoopla over some lady born into privilege that has zero relevance to today's society, the veterinarian that died in Québec recently is and should be more important than the British royal family yet I doubt the 24 hour news channels show her funeral 

Is the vet going to have a million people at their funeral? I suspect the Queen had a hell of a lot of relevance to those people, not to mention the hundreds of millions who will be watching the live coverage at home. That she has no relevance to you is beside the point. And taking silly shots at someone who IS very relevant to a lot of people for no better reason than to sneer at them is not the mark of a happy guy.\

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15 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

So why don’t you pay reparations if you think it was so bad and feel such responsibility for it?   Many things happened that weren’t “good” by today’s standards, including the wars and abuses of Indigenous groups towards one another before European contact.

Don't know what you are talking about now.  You want to weasel your way out somehow.

The uncomfortable truth is those indigenous peoples were wiped out with all measures possible so the invaders can take possession of land and resources. Taking kids from their mothers against their mothers will cannot be good under any system and any ideological excuse.  And the monarchy must have known about it.

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2 hours ago, cougar said:

Don't know what you are talking about now.  You want to weasel your way out somehow.

The uncomfortable truth is those indigenous peoples were wiped out with all measures possible so the invaders can take possession of land and resources. Taking kids from their mothers against their mothers will cannot be good under any system and any ideological excuse.  And the monarchy must have known about it.

You live on a pretty nice spread.  I wonder what territory and treaty it falls under.

You don’t understand how brainwashed you are and how self-destructive the language you’ve been fed is towards your own well-being.  Don’t forget that there’s no protection of property in Canada’s weak constitution, so the foolish rhetoric that you spew totally out of context can be used against you.  What do you think the land acknowledgments are really about? Why was it important to get the Pope to use the word genocide?  Your naïveté is staggering.  

Edited by Zeitgeist
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If I were British I would support keeping the monarchy but if I were Canadian, Australian etc I think I would prefer some boring and meaningless President if he or she is from my own country. 

However, I don't think this is a huge issue which people think about all the time. 

On the other hand, even if a President is just a nominal leader he or she is some retired politician and politicians tend to be divisive and even despised. 

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22 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

I am a Briton

when we have a good monarch, we defend & uphold them

when we have a bad monarch, we overthrow & replace them

Canada, to wit Parliamentary Supremacy,  was born on the banks of the Boyne river on 1 July 1690

when the Ulster Scots deposed the King by force of arms

When did you do that??

Canada was born??? What a load of baloney, battle of the boyne?? LOL

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11 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

 Don’t forget that there’s no protection of property in Canada’s weak constitution, so the foolish rhetoric that you spew totally out of context can be used against you. 

I was talking about the "good" of taking kids away from their mothers; you continue to BS me now with the |protection of property under the constitution"

You have nothing else to say, just stop posting.

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I was listening to the TV-commentary and I wonder is it just a question of differences between languages but how the commentary was about the Queen leaving Balmoral for the last time and the Queen making a journey across the country. 

I guess that doesn't sound strange in English but in my language if you speak like that about a dead person doing things it just sounds hilarious. 

 

Edited by -TSS-
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8 minutes ago, -TSS- said:

I was listening to the TV-commentary and I wonder is it just a question of differences between languages but how the commentary was about the Queen leaving Balmoral for the last time and the Queen making a journey across the country. 

I guess that doesn't sound strange in English but in my language if you speak like that about a dead person doing things it just sounds hilarious. 

 

It feels like the movie, “Weekend at Bernie’s”.

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