Trucker's Convoy

[Michael Hardner]

14 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

How can you be so uncritical?  It’s crystal clear that Fauci benefited from big pharma which has also worked hand in glove with governments to suppress legitimate criticism of vaccines and anti-covid measures.  If you can’t see that basic reality and the critical importance of the questions raised about what the hell was happening throughout the pandemic, I don’t know how you can expect to be taken seriously.  We saw the greatest suppression of our rights in our lifetimes and it lasted two and a half years, resulted in a form of martial law in Canada, and raised important questions about the transparency of our government and healthcare.  Your dismissal of any thoughtful critique of what happened by reducing it to Chuds or other Trudeauesque rhetoric demonstrates why we have culture wars.

I'm open to reading criticism but the dividing line is ... what was the underlying motive for actions taken.

Almost every critical thread I have read has been hyperbolic in that area.  If it's about incompetence then that's fair comment, however we were also dealing with extraordinary circumstances.

 

[Michael Hardner]

@Zeitgeist a good analogy is 9/11.. a topic which formed my opinions on the public sphere to a large degree.

Again, the criticisms were largely tied to nefarious motives rather than a failure of vision prior to the event and tactical errors on the day of.

After awhile, I stopped reading criticisms because they were rehashing the same thing again and again.

[ExFlyer]

14 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

How can you be so uncritical?  It’s crystal clear that Fauci benefited from big pharma which has also worked hand in glove with governments to suppress legitimate criticism of vaccines and anti-covid measures.  If you can’t see that basic reality and the critical importance of the questions raised about what the hell was happening throughout the pandemic, I don’t know how you can expect to be taken seriously.  We saw the greatest suppression of our rights in our lifetimes and it lasted two and a half years, resulted in a form of martial law in Canada, and raised important questions about the transparency of our government and healthcare.  Your dismissal of any thoughtful critique of what happened by reducing it to Chuds or other Trudeauesque rhetoric demonstrates why we have culture wars.

You have been asked and cannot respond because you are espousing mis and dis information. You have no basis for your accusations and cannot back up anything you claim.

You dismiss or deflect or just do not respond so you can keep some dignity but, your claims are false, incorrect and just out and out lies. Don't be embarrassed by lying and not being able to back u those lies, Trumpians and other ultra conservatives on this forum do it all the time LOL I would have hoped that your were intelligent enough not to dispers BS but I guess I was wrong LOL

"You are going to have to provide real documented proof of your allegation. I am sure you will bnot because you cannot.

Not internet tweets or facebook opinion or other opinion but real proof. 'Otherwise, you are just perpetuating the mis and dis information that has become so common these days."

[Michael Hardner]

15 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

 You have no basis for your accusations and cannot back up anything you claim.

In the interest of good faith, I will help out Zeitgeist by contributing a valid question I saw posed: why did public health leaders discount the importance of masks early on.

To my mind, I would conclude that this was indeed dishonest and done for the purpose of preventing a run on masks, which were in short supply for health workers.

Understandable? Sure.

Forgivable? Well, that can be rightly argued either way.

[ExFlyer]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

In the interest of good faith, I will help out Zeitgeist by contributing a valid question I saw posed: why did public health leaders discount the importance of masks early on.

To my mind, I would conclude that this was indeed dishonest and done for the purpose of preventing a run on masks, which were in short supply for health workers.

Understandable? Sure.

Forgivable? Well, that can be rightly argued either way.

I understand the good faith and you may have a valid reason, as that was the situation in Canada, not enough masks. We had  to buy them form China.

My point to Zeitgeist was that he/she never answers with fact, let alone actual articles or cites or proof or anything to what she/he says. He/she delflects an turns away form provide real proof of claims.....like so many others on this forum.

[Dougie93]

12 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Forgivable? Well, that can be rightly argued either way.

it's not a question of forgiveness per se

the problem in Canada is that the political elites are never held responsible for anything

for example the Somalia Affair

where the government illegally administered a drug to the Airborne Regiment

which incited the unit to suffer from psychosis en masse, resulting in catastrophe

the government then launched an "inquiry"

which was simply used as a mechanism to cover up the crimes and protect senior officials from a reckoning

when I was young and naive. I honestly trusted the government

I trusted that public officials were trying to do the right thing

but after Somalia, I could never trust the government again

so I can certainly forgive anybody

who asserts that Canada is not to be trusted when it comes to enforced medical procedures

[Michael Hardner]

4 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

 ...

who asserts that Canada is not to be trusted when it comes to enforced medical procedures

...for sure, but intent matters too.  

Someone pocketing a bribe at the expense of my body is not ok.

[Dougie93]

2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

...for sure, but intent matters too.  

Someone pocketing a bribe at the expense of my body is not ok.

I still took the Covid vaccine

but only because If I hadn't, my wife would have gone completely hysterical

and I am somewhat fatalistic, in that you're never going to see the one coming that gets you

so don't worry about it, worry is a waste of time & energy

none the less, for people who do worry about such things ; I forgive them, more power to them

in terms of the Freedom Convoy, I knew it was a lost cause, I knew it would be crushed in the end

butt that's only because they were getting too close to holding public officials responsible

which of course incited panic in the halls of government

[Michael Hardner]

14 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

 

butt that's only because they were getting too close to holding public officials responsible

 

Well Doug Ford continued his streak of unaccountability when he did zero to stop the Ambassador Bridge blockade.

This from a party that murdered an Indian because he was protesting in a park.

You expect too much.

[Dougie93]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

You expect too much.

only because my infantry brothers have gone over the top to their doom when the whistle blew

without question, nor hesitation, nor even concern for their personal safety

so I know what absolute fealty to one's solemn oaths taken looks like

Ex Coelis

 

[Dougie93]

18 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Well Doug Ford continued his streak of unaccountability when he did zero to stop the Ambassador Bridge blockade.

This from a party that murdered an Indian because he was protesting in a park.

in both cases, the protesters successfully provoked the corrupt & inept political elites to show their fangs

mission accomplished

RIP Dudley George

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

In the interest of good faith, I will help out Zeitgeist by contributing a valid question I saw posed: why did public health leaders discount the importance of masks early on.

To my mind, I would conclude that this was indeed dishonest and done for the purpose of preventing a run on masks, which were in short supply for health workers.

Understandable? Sure.

Forgivable? Well, that can be rightly argued either way.

Well this is amusing - you've argued the more "conspiratorial" side and i'm going to argue the other side    Must be opposite day  

At the risk of getting severely pummeled by goddess or those who've spent more time researching the facts, my understanding (as i recall at the time) was that initially there was confusion as to the nature of transmission.

As near as I can tell originally it was widely believed that it was mostly spread by contact. Any Airborne transmission would be through aerosol droplets which would not stay in the air for any length of time. You are more likely to get contaminated by touching something that someone had coughed on were sneezed on rather than just being in the room with them.

That would make masks actually more dangerous than beneficial. Unless you have special training if the exterior of the mask has been exposed that you can easily contaminate yourself just by taking off the mask. This would have been true if there are original assumptions had been correct. Additionally the mask would have been a little benefit given the circumstance. So it was originally felt that a mask was more likely to cause harm than it was to cause good and wouldn't have been of any benefit whatsoever Beyond a few feet so what was the point. 

Far better to train people to wash their hands with sanitizers every 30 seconds. You'll remember when we went through that phase I'm sure.

They quickly realized that it was a lot more Airborne than they originally thought and suddenly masks became a great idea again. Interestingly the studies that were done showed that while masks made a small difference in confined places by extending the amount of time you had to be exposed before you reached an infectious state, basically masks were useless in 99% of cases anyway.

[WestCanMan]

3 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

it's not a question of forgiveness per se

the problem in Canada is that the political elites are never held responsible for anything

for example the Somalia Affair

where the government illegally administered a drug to the Airborne Regiment

which incited the unit to suffer from psychosis en masse, resulting in catastrophe

the government then launched an "inquiry"

which was simply used as a mechanism to cover up the crimes and protect senior officials from a reckoning

when I was young and naive. I honestly trusted the government

I trusted that public officials were trying to do the right thing

but after Somalia, I could never trust the government again

so I can certainly forgive anybody

who asserts that Canada is not to be trusted when it comes to enforced medical procedures

I never even heard about that drug being administered to them. 

I just found this: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/veteran-mefloquine-somalia-malaria-1.3869580

The 101st was publicly disbanded in disgrace after that, and what % of the Canadian people even know about "mefloquine" and the role it played in that?

Protect the higher-ups, let the grunts fall on their swords. 

I wonder if our Yugo vets were subjected to some similar drug scandal. 

[Goddess]

16 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I never even heard about that drug being administered to them. 

I just found this: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/veteran-mefloquine-somalia-malaria-1.3869580

The 101st was publicly disbanded in disgrace after that, and what % of the Canadian people even know about "mefloquine" and the role it played in that?

Protect the higher-ups, let the grunts fall on their swords. 

I wonder if our Yugo vets were subjected to some similar drug scandal. 

The US military also regularly experiments with its troops and drugs.

The pandemic in the US was not under the direction of the CDC or the FDA or public health entities.

It was under the direction of the DoD.

This came out during the Brooke Jackson Pfizer whistleblower court proceedings.  She whistleblew about the fake trials and lack of safety testing at Ventavia, who Pfizer had supposedly hired to oversee the trials.  In court, Pfizer said they were under the direction of the DoD (and paid handsomely) and that safety testing and trials were NOT part of the contract requirements, therefore they are not accountable for anything. The DoD confirmed this and Pfizer won the case based on this point.

(Jackson's case is being appealed now on other grounds.) 

The trials were a sham, shoddily done just to create the appearance of "safety" for the public. The FDA bowed to the DoD for approval of the injections but it was also just for show. They were going to get FDA approval no matter what.

The military signs waivers to let the gov't experiment on them. 

The public did not.

They were testing compliance, how to make people comply using psychological warfare.

We lost.

So now that the public just handed over their medical rights, and after decades of just experimenting on soldiers, they can experiment on everybody.

It's why they're trying to create another pandemic. Bird flu, monkey pox, Disease X..... It doesn't matter, as long as the public buys it and complies.

 

 

 

 

[WestCanMan]

14 minutes ago, Goddess said:

The US military also regularly experiments with its troops and drugs.

The pandemic in the US was not under the direction of the CDC or the FDA or public health entities.

It was under the direction of the DoD.

This came out during the Brooke Jackson Pfizer whistleblower court proceedings.  She whistleblew about the fake trials and lack of safety testing at Ventavia, who Pfizer had supposedly hired to oversee the trials.  In court, Pfizer said they were under the direction of the DoD (and paid handsomely) and that safety testing and trials were NOT part of the contract requirements, therefore they are not accountable for anything. The DoD confirmed this and Pfizer won the case based on this point.

(Jackson's case is being appealed now on other grounds.) 

The trials were a sham, shoddily done just to create the appearance of "safety" for the public. The FDA bowed to the DoD for approval of the injections but it was also just for show. They were going to get FDA approval no matter what.

The military signs waivers to let the gov't experiment on them. 

The public did not.

They were testing compliance, how to make people comply using psychological warfare.

We lost.

So now that the public just handed over their medical rights, and after decades of just experimenting on soldiers, they can experiment on everybody.

It's why they're trying to create another pandemic. Bird flu, monkey pox, Disease X..... It doesn't matter, as long as the public buys it and complies.

The Tuskegee experiment was far worse than any of this, but this is right up the exact same alley. Trusting the gov't is just as stupid here as it is in Russia. 

[Dougie93]

52 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I never even heard about that drug being administered to them.

well take for example Clayton Matchee

I didn't know him well, but I knew he wasn't a homicidal lunatic

he was a typical regular force married guy

everybody in the infantry is eccentric and everybody is aggressive

but the guy was an Airborne Regiment Master Corporal, which requires you to seriously have your shit together

and his wife, Marj,  says Matchee was having psychotic hallucinations in Canada, in Petawawa, back on leave

so he, along with many other troops in the Regiment,  were being driven psychotic on the ground in Somalia

it's like 2 Commando was forced to take its Mefloquine on Tuesdays

and the troops were so messed up on this stuff, they started calling it "Psycho Tuesdays"

they were having nightmares, hallucinations, the drug can cause hyper paranoia & hyper aggression

hence why it wasn't approved for use on humans,

at the time when the Airborne was being dosed with it, unlawfully

[Dougie93]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

I wonder if our Yugo vets were subjected to some similar drug scandal. 

no

I took all the Yugoslavia vaccines for Op Harmony

and Mefloquine wasn't one of them

Mefloquine is a pill, comes in a four pack like Viagra, so you would know if you were taking it

it's not a one shot, you have to keep taking the pills, once a week

but it's an anti Malaria drug, so it's only proscribed for tropical environments

troops in the Airborne Regiment knew they were taking some experimental malaria drug

and they knew it was making everybody go crazy

but there was nothing they could do about it, since this was being ordered from on high

if you refused to take the pill ?

then you'd be kicked off the tour, sent home to Canada in disgrace

and Paratroopers just ain't going to do that, they are not abandoning the mission, come what may

Edited August 18, 2024 by Dougie93

[WestCanMan]

21 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

hence why it wasn't approved for use on humans,

at the time when the Airborne was being dosed with it, unlawfully

Are you saying that, at the time that drug was being administered to our troops, it was already known to induce psychosis?

It's one thing to administer a drug before proper trials were concluded, and another to do it after it's known to be a dangerous failure. 

Especially when HCQ is cheap and has worked for over half a century.

[Dougie93]

1 minute ago, WestCanMan said:

Are you saying that, at the time that drug was being administered to our troops, it was already known to induce psychosis?

100%

the drug had failed the human trials

because it was shown to induce psychosis in the form of hyper paranoia and hyper aggression

but someone at DND made a deal with the French pharmaceutical company Roche, the manufacturer

to use the Airborne Regiment as lab rats

in a totally illegal by Canadian law unsupervised secret drug trial

then the Airborne Regiment chain of command went crazy

ordering the troops to commit war crimes

to include direct orders to torture prisoners

orders which the troops obeyed, in their psychotic drugged up state

[WestCanMan]

24 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

no

I took all the Yugoslavia vaccines for Op Harmony

and Mefloquine wasn't one of them

Mefloquine is a pill, comes in a four pack like Viagra, so you would know if you were taking it

it's not a one shot, you have to keep taking the pills, once a week

but it's an anti Malaria drug, so it's only proscribed for tropical environments

troops in the Airborne Regiment knew they were taking some experimental malaria drug

and they knew it was making everybody go crazy

but there was nothing they could do about it, since this was being ordered from on high

if you refused to take the pill ?

then you'd be kicked off the tour, sent home to Canada in disgrace

and Paratroopers just ain't going to do that, they are not abandoning the mission, come what may

When I was in basic we all just got a bunch of needles and I don't even know what they all were. 

[Dougie93]

12 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

When I was in basic we all just got a bunch of needles and I don't even know what they all were. 

but that's the thing

the Airborne Regiment troops knew that these pills were not in that category

this was something special that they were having to take, specific to being in Africa

on one level they knew it was making them crazy, in that they were calling it "Psycho Tuesdays"

but they were not noticing that the officers were starting to issue crazy orders therein

like Shidane Arone was not the only case of torture, nor the only murder incited by this drug

prisoners were being tortured in that bunker on multiple occasions for weeks before Shidane Arone was killed

because the CO had ordered them to do it : "rough the prisoners up"

but there was also another murder before Shidane Arone

another Somalia civilian; Ahmed Aruush

the Commando put food and water out to bait the Somalis

then when Ahmed took the bait,  because the Somalis were starving

the Commando ambushed him, springing out of spider holes, then shooting him in the back while he tried to flee

which was crazy in of itself, since this was a Humanitarian Mission to aid the starving Somalis

but see how that works ?

They were all dosed on Mefloquine, so even the officers were hyper paranoid & hyper aggressive in their orders

they couldn't tell that they were all going crazy, because they were all drugged up on this stuff

Edited August 18, 2024 by Dougie93

[Legato]

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

 

As near as I can tell originally it was widely believed that it was mostly spread by contact. Any Airborne transmission would be through aerosol droplets which would not stay in the air for any length of time. You are more likely to get contaminated by touching something that someone had coughed on were sneezed on rather than just being in the room with them.

 

Back during the lockdowns a group of us geriatrics met every couple of days sometimes as little as 4 or as high as 22 for breakfast at someone's house or a hike in the woods just to get out,

One day whist on a hike we were approached by a park warden (uniformed nitwit) and told to put on masks and leave the area immediately.

Nobody moved so he became more aggressive an wanted our names and addresses which caused all of us close in and laugh. He then threatened to call the police so we closed in more. The look of panic on his face was magic.

He hurried away and tripped over a tree root. Made our day.

Went back many more times, never saw the guy again.

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Well Doug Ford continued his streak of unaccountability when he did zero to stop the Ambassador Bridge blockade.

This from a party that murdered an Indian because he was protesting in a park.

You expect too much.

The"party" murdered an Indian???

Michael, Michael, Michael, your dislike of Ford clouds your mind LOL

Edited August 18, 2024 by ExFlyer

[Dougie93]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

It's one thing to administer a drug before proper trials were concluded, and another to do it after it's known to be a dangerous failure.

bear in mind, I have direct experience with the effects of this drug

because my buddy came back on leave from Op Deliverance

and he was completely out of his mind

hyper paranoid, hyper aggressive

we could tell right away there was something seriously wrong with him

but after a few days, he returned to normal

because he didn't take the Mefloquine that week

but then he starts telling us about it, that shit had gone crazy at Camp Pegasus

it was a mad house, troops were going psycho left and right

he said it was spooky, but he himself was hyper paranoid and hyper aggressive,

so the madness had become routine

like the prisoners being tortured in the bunker, they were all screaming, begging for their lives

and everybody in the camp, lying in their bunks, could hear them screaming

"Canada no, please, Canada, no !"

he said it was "Canadian Apocalypse Now"

Edited August 18, 2024 by Dougie93

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

The"party" murdered an Indian???

Michael, Michael, Michael, your dislike of Ford clouds your mind LOL

I suspect he's referring to dudley george, killed during the ippawash incident (sp?) back in 95.  The first nations were protesting in a park, it got violent and in a physical clash with police George was shot by an officer, the officer was later found guilty of criminal negligence 

it would seem mike is going back in time about 30 years to claim that the actions of a police officer who acted inappropriately at a violent protest turned riot (dudley had a stick in his hand and was trying to hit cops at the time) is the same as "the PC gov't planned to murder first nations people".   

Which is of course ridiculous.  

Just the usual left wing dishonesty.