How much refugees are costing us

Dougie93 · November 21, 2019

2 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

I would have kept the Saudi vehicle deal. It was done. Saudi's would just get it from another country like the USA or Russia and we'd be out money and jobs. If we stop trading with regimes with poor human rights records we'd have to stop trading will virtually all developing countries which is most of the world.

Canada hasn't cancelled the contract, Canada is still shipping the LAVs to the Saudis.

The Saudi's however have stopped payments, they are apparently $3.4 billion in arrears.

Canada is so desperate to keep the deal, which is the largest military export contract in Canadian history by far, that Ottawa is still delivering even when not getting paid.

Moonlight Graham · November 21, 2019

7 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

Canada hasn't cancelled the contract, Canada is still shipping the LAVs to the Saudis.

The Saudi's however have stopped payments, they are apparently $3.4 billion in arrears.

Canada is so desperate to keep the deal, which is the largest military export contract in Canadian history by far, that Ottawa is still delivering even when not getting paid.

Saudis are clearing effing with us. Trudeau gov has totally botched our relationship with them. Carrots and sticks.

Dougie93 · November 21, 2019

1 minute ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Saudis are clearing effing with us. Trudeau gov has totally botched our relationship with them. Carrots and sticks.

Indeed. Thing is, that plant in London is the only source of armored vehicles for the Canadian Army. If that plant closes, Canada will have to buy offshore.

Canada buys so little for the Canadian Forces, it needs to find foreign contracts to keep the plant open.

The whole point is to save the plant long term, so it will be there for when Canada finally replaces its LAVs someday.

Yzermandius19 · November 21, 2019

11 hours ago, Argus said:

Trump doesn't have the brains to play checkers, nor the ability to read the instructions to find out nor the attention span to have someone explain it to him.

Then why does he keep winning? Luck alone cannot account for all of the winning, no one is that lucky.

jacee · November 21, 2019

54 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Then why does he keep winning? Luck alone cannot account for all of the winning, no one is that lucky.

Winning what?

He's being impeached. Lol

Yzermandius19 · November 21, 2019

28 minutes ago, jacee said:

Winning what?

He's being impeached. Lol

Impeachment is backfiring on Democrats, just as it backfired on the Republicans when they impeached Clinton, that's what I call winning.

He won the 2016 election, and he's going to win the 2020 election, yet apparently him being a lucky idiot explains that? Nah luck alone cannot account for that, skill has to be involved, no one is that lucky, luck can only account for so much of his success, nowhere near all of it.

Trump being mistaken for a lucky idiot is a big part of why the Democrats keep losing, they keep assuming his luck will run out, but it's not just luck, so they play right into his hands thinking he's just being dumb, even when he's not, due to wishful thinking.

Chronically underestimating Trump is not a good idea, especially if you are his political opponent, pro tip.

Edited November 21, 2019 by Yzermandius19

Charles Anthony · November 21, 2019

Folks,

Stay on topic.

eyeball · November 21, 2019

21 hours ago, Shady said:

You just said they should have invaded Saudi Arabia?

Not in the context of advocacy though.

Quote

Acts of war don't get pursued in court.

Acts of war are committed by nations not a bunch of guys.

Argus · November 26, 2019

Shockingly (I''m sure) a study done by a group of researchers at Princeton university has discovered the generosity of a state's social benefits have a profound impact on how many third world migrants show up at its door claiming asylum. As I have previously suggested about those showing up in Canada, when we make it so easy for them they then call home and tell everyone to come along. The only way to discourage the flood is to make it much less pleasant.

https://gatesofvienna.net/2019/11/welfare-acts-as-a-magnet-for-migrants-who-knew/

jacee · November 26, 2019

18 hours ago, Argus said:

Shockingly (I''m sure) a study done by a group of researchers at Princeton university has discovered the generosity of a state's social benefits have a profound impact on how many third world migrants show up at its door claiming asylum. As I have previously suggested about those showing up in Canada, when we make it so easy for them they then call home and tell everyone to come along. The only way to discourage the flood is to make it much less pleasant.

https://gatesofvienna.net/2019/11/welfare-acts-as-a-magnet-for-migrants-who-knew/

There is no "flood". Canada was built by successive waves of refugees, and will continue to be.

And there is not really much cost to us either: Employment earnings and paying taxes make up the arrival costs fairly quickly.

Canada does have a problem with paranoid and psychically disturbed white supremacists who catastrophize to rationalize their irrational fears. Childhood trauma is considered a contributing factor to that, but many other people choose more constructive outlets for such psychological disturbances:

It's a choice.

Edited November 26, 2019 by jacee

Argus · November 26, 2019

1 hour ago, jacee said:

There is no "flood". Canada was built by successive waves of refugees, and will continue to be.

Canada was built by successive waves of immigrants who came here and worked hard - because they had no choice. And they integrated because they had no choice. Their old homeland was a world away and there were no social services. The situation now is completely different.

Quote

And there is not really much cost to us either: Employment earnings and paying taxes make up the arrival costs fairly quickly.

You're lying. I've already posted cites earlier in this thread which show otherwise. The cost to us is many billions of dollars every year. Even when refugees do start to work they rarely rise above minimum wage because they lack the language, education and job skills to do so. Which means they never pay taxes.

I don't blame them, of course, for trying to come here. I blame the Marxist left in Canada who hate this country and hate everything about the West, and want to turn it into a third world hotel without any vestiges of western values, traditions or culture. Without them the migrants would quickly be sent home again and that would discourage others from coming.

Edited November 26, 2019 by Argus

jacee · November 26, 2019

37 minutes ago, Argus said:

1) Canada was built by successive waves of immigrants who came here and worked hard - because they had no choice. And they integrated because they had no choice. Their old homeland was a world away and there were no social services. The situation now is completely different.

2) You're lying. I've already posted cites earlier in this thread which show otherwise. The cost to us is many billions of dollars every year. Even when refugees do start to work they rarely rise above minimum wage because they lack the language, education and job skills to do so. Which means they never pay taxes.

3) I don't blame them, of course, for trying to come here. I blame the Marxist left in Canada who hate this country and hate everything about the West, and want to turn it into a third world hotel without any vestiges of western values, traditions or culture. Without them the migrants would quickly be sent home again and that would discourage others from coming.

1&3: So you simply don't agree with having income supports for people in difficulty at all? No welfare, no disability, no old age security, etc? I guess you'd be much happier in a different country then, as Canadians have chosen to support each other through difficult times and circumstances. Life expectancies improved by 20 years in the 20th century, and no doubt many early refugees were more likely to die young too. Your glorification of past refugees is a crock. I know that what you mean is they were white. Lol

2) No, you did not provide valid data, and I pointed that out to you before: You provided 2016 census data on Syrian refugees who arrived in 2015&2016: Many had just arrived by census day, so that's not a valid indication of their employment status. In fact, it's a very positive outlook that 25% of them were already employed within a few months of arrival. And you would need to provide evidence to support your other claims about income too.

There is no rational basis for your spite against refugees, Argus, and no matter how you twist the data to suit your prejudice, you and I both know that it's nothing to do with refugees per se: You are simply a white supremacist.

Edited November 26, 2019 by jacee

Argus · November 26, 2019

2 minutes ago, jacee said:

1&3: So you simply don't agree with having income supports for people in difficulty at all? No welfare, no disability, no old age security, etc? I guess you'd be happier in a different country, then.

I don't think it's in my country's interest to have foreigners coming here, putting up their feet, and thrusting out their palms for handouts.

2 minutes ago, jacee said:

2) No, you did not provide valid data, and I pointed that out to you before: You provided 2016 census data on Syrian refugees who arrived in 2015&2016: Many had just arrived by census day, so that's not a valid indication of their employment status. In fact, it's a very positive outlook that 25% of them were already employed within a few months of arrival.

I provided multiple cites, including on refugee earnings of a variety of different source country refugees over long periods.

2 minutes ago, jacee said:

There is no rational basis for your hatred of refugees, Argus,

I don't hate refugees. I hate people like you.

jacee · November 26, 2019

14 minutes ago, Argus said:

1) I don't think it's in my country's interest to have foreigners coming here, putting up their feet, and thrusting out their palms for handouts.

1) I provided multiple cites, including on refugee earnings of a variety of different source country refugees over long periods.

3)I don't hate refugees. I hate people like you.

1 You have not provided any evidence that they do, just paranoid ramblings.

2 No you didn't. I challenged you on your claims about Syrian refugees before, and you provided nothing else.

3 Well, I'll take that as a compliment. Being a thorn in the side of a white supremacist is ok with me. Lol

Michael Hardner · November 26, 2019

22 minutes ago, jacee said:

You have not provided any evidence that they do, just paranoid ramblings.

Keep in mind that the rightista logician ( :huh: ) will claim to embrace logic and facts, until such point as you point out the deficiencies in their logic, their data, or their terms.

"Foreigners" coming here to get handouts ? Is that why refugees flee war ? Is that how sponsored immigrants come here ?

Argus · November 26, 2019

23 minutes ago, jacee said:

1 You have not provided any evidence that they do, just paranoid ramblings.

There were four different cites in the first post alone. Not my fault you're not bright enough to find them.

23 minutes ago, jacee said:

3 Well, I'll take that as a compliment. Being a thorn in the side of a white supremacist is ok with me. Lol

I would side with white supremacists rather than people like you.

Argus · November 26, 2019

Just now, Michael Hardner said:

Keep in mind that the rightista logician ( ) will claim to embrace logic and facts, until such point as you point out the deficiencies in their logic, their data, or their terms.

I've provided cites from numerous sources. Not my fault ignorant bigots of the Left refuse to acknowledge the obvious. To you people all that matters is race. You see everything and judge everything according to skin colour. All your decisions and judgements are rendered in that context, with a sliding scale that exempts non-whites from equal judgement because, at heart, you don't believe it fair to judge them as equals.

Just now, Michael Hardner said:

"Foreigners" coming here to get handouts ?

Yes, as the study at Princeton showed. If you didn't have such a short attention span you might have read it. But given your closed mind, cites which contradict you might cause you too much stress.

jacee · November 26, 2019

3 minutes ago, Argus said:

1 There were four different cites in the first post alone. Not my fault you're not bright enough to find them.

2 I would side with white supremacists rather than people like you.

1 Hunh?

2 Yes, I know you do.

Cannucklehead · November 26, 2019

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/refugees/canada-role.html

Under the Resettlement Assistance Program, the Government of Canada or Province of Quebec helps government-assisted refugees with essential services and income support once they are in Canada. This helps them to settle.

The refugee gets this income support for up to one year or until they can support themselves, whichever comes first. Canada provides Resettlement Assistance Program income support to eligible clients who cannot pay for their own basic needs.

:mellow:

jacee · November 26, 2019

1 minute ago, Argus said:

I've provided cites from numerous sources. Not my fault ignorant bigots of the Left refuse to acknowledge the obvious. To you people all that matters is race. You see everything and judge everything according to skin colour. All your decisions and judgements are rendered in that context, with a sliding scale that exempts non-whites from equal judgement because, at heart, you don't believe it fair to judge them as equals.

Yes, as the study at Princeton showed. If you didn't have such a short attention span you might have read it. But given your closed mind, cites which contradict you might cause you too much stress.

1 No you didn't ... because you can't.

2 Princeton is in Canada? Lol

scribblet · November 28, 2019

Refugees and asylum seekers are costing us plenty, almost 400 million

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/irregular-migrants-on-track-to-cost-canada-almost-400-million-watchdog-says-1.4197552

a billion over 3 years https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-ottawa-on-pace-to-spend-400-million-next-year-on-border-crossings/

They also end up receiving more in benefits because generally they have more children.

https://business.financialpost.com/opinion/setting-the-record-straight-on-the-benefits-and-heavy-costs-of-immigration-to-canada

When we combined our estimates of taxes paid and benefits received we found that the average recent immigrant in Canada imposes a fiscal burden of $5,300 annually.