cannuck Posted April 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Owly said: A better way is to use a dpa so as not to punish the folks pounding nails in boards. As everyone here except the one who works for SNC has told you repeatedly, those people do not get punished, they get to do the same job except for an honest and hopefully competent employer. The same is true for all of the workers who were on jobs SNC was kicked off from in the past. The senior guys had to go somewhere else, but the trades and professionals simply came back to the exact same job on the same project when the new company walked in. Edited April 5, 2019 by cannuck 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 14 hours ago, Army Guy said: First off no ones job at SNC are at risk, That comes rom the CEO of SNC if you have not been watching the news lately, even if they are charged and convicted, SNC is still entitled to bid and receive contracts through huge loop holes in the new law, such as SNC still holds many DND contracts and if it is a matter of National security SNC is still fair game...There are other reasons and loop holes as well they did not go into a whole lot of detail but hey this law was written by politicians for big business, not lawyers for citizens...so they left lots of loop holes.... Once again they can not leave they HQ , because of some banking agreement they have...So no moving the HQ for quit sometime....That was all a LIBERAL LIE.... SNC-Lavalin themselves threatened the government that if they are charged for corruption they will cut half of the Canadian workforce and move abroad. That's BLACKMAIL. They don't need to move the HQ, just move all other operations abroad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 https://www.cbc.ca/news/investigates/snc-lavalin-ex-ceo-rejects-claim-taxpayer-backed-loans-went-to-bribes-1.5085710 Well I am always suspect of a source that can't be named for they may lose their job (that's it???) But if everything here is true, we need to take down SNC-Lavalin. The corruption seems to be everywhere that they go. Part of their corporate culture while blackmailing the government to continue their terrible business practices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Greene Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) It was one small step that person, and one giant leap for peoplekind Edited April 5, 2019 by Robert Greene 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeitgeist Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 10 hours ago, cannuck said: that is exactly what the criminal prosecution of SNC is all about. BTW: for the Libyan affair alone, they have already been tried and convicted of criminal charges in three countries - thus why they can not bid on any World Bank funded projects for 10 years. Don't have me the bullshit about the employees being innocents. EVERYONE in the whole business knows how corrupt SNC is, so when you choose to work for SNC, Hell's Angels, the Mafia, etc. you know damn well you are working for a criminal organization. If you don't have the sense to walk away, don't expect any sympathy from me. Where the sympathy belongs is to the owners and employees of honest and capable contractors who have lost out to business bought by SNC bribery, kickbacks and fraud. A criminal organization? C’mon. They’re the country’s biggest engineering firm, so of course they’re going to have a higher volume of such incidents than other companies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 Jody Raybould told CTV she never made not revisiting a DPA for SNC-Lavalin a condition of staying in cabinet after she was shuffled. "I have never and would never seek to interfere with the exercise of prosecutorial discretion by the Attorney General of Canada.” As she said this is more of those 'anonymous liberal sources' 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egghead Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 3 hours ago, GostHacked said: SNC-Lavalin themselves threatened the government that if they are charged for corruption they will cut half of the Canadian workforce and move abroad. That's BLACKMAIL. They don't need to move the HQ, just move all other operations abroad. The problem is that no one can draw a clear picture of what operation can be moved abroad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 2 hours ago, Zeitgeist said: A criminal organization? C’mon. They’re the country’s biggest engineering firm, so of course they’re going to have a higher volume of such incidents than other companies. One who's focus on getting and maintaining business has ALWAYS been bribery, kickbacks, fraud, etc. EVERYWHERE they go. THAT is the very definition of a criminal organization. We have encountered the same kind of thing in the US: you pay to play in several markets (particularly NYC and also in military/industrial). The former is the mafia, the latter is the "good old boys club" of the Uniparty. Once you go outside of a single person or a single incedent, you have to organize people to accomplish the act, and that is what moves the whole thing from A crime to organized crime - which of course means a criminal organization - just like SNC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 4 minutes ago, cannuck said: One who's focus on getting and maintaining business has ALWAYS been bribery, kickbacks, fraud, etc. EVERYWHERE they go. THAT is the very definition of a criminal organization. We have encountered the same kind of thing in the US: you pay to play in several markets (particularly NYC and also in military/industrial). The former is the mafia, the latter is the "good old boys club" of the Uniparty. Once you go outside of a single person or a single incedent, you have to organize people to accomplish the act, and that is what moves the whole thing from A crime to organized crime - which of course means a criminal organization - just like SNC. So that's how you do business ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 hour ago, egghead said: The problem is that no one can draw a clear picture of what operation can be moved abroad That is irrelevant with the fact that SNC-Lavalin is blackmailing the Canadian government with the threat of moving operations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 20 minutes ago, cannuck said: One who's focus on getting and maintaining business has ALWAYS been bribery, kickbacks, fraud, etc. EVERYWHERE they go. THAT is the very definition of a criminal organization. We have encountered the same kind of thing in the US: you pay to play in several markets (particularly NYC and also in military/industrial). The former is the mafia, the latter is the "good old boys club" of the Uniparty. Once you go outside of a single person or a single incedent, you have to organize people to accomplish the act, and that is what moves the whole thing from A crime to organized crime - which of course means a criminal organization - just like SNC. SNC-Lavalin operates exactly like a criminal mafia. I could not agree more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) 30 minutes ago, jacee said: So that's how you do business ? That's how SNC does business. That's how and why we lost a very significant business in NYC - I/we do NOT confer benefits on anyone who has not contributed to a transaction materially. Unlike SNC, we (and many other companies) actually play by the rules - the official ones, not the "nudge, nudge, wink, wink" kind that SNC, Power Corp, Bombardier and the LPC seem to favour. Edited April 5, 2019 by cannuck 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 3 hours ago, Zeitgeist said: A criminal organization? C’mon. They’re the country’s biggest engineering firm, so of course they’re going to have a higher volume of such incidents than other companies. What's a few more crimes here and there? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeitgeist Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) A real possible outcome (moving business operations and jobs out of the country) is not a “threat”. Businesses must consider the business climate. If they can’t apply for contracts locally then there is no compelling reason to operate in that location. It certainly makes it harder to justify maintaining head offices there. You may not like it and would prefer that companies employ people without having work to complete, but that’s not how businesses operate. Edited April 5, 2019 by Zeitgeist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egghead Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, GostHacked said: That is irrelevant with the fact that SNC-Lavalin is blackmailing the Canadian government with the threat of moving operations. It is. There are 3 players in this case. Lavalin, PMO, JWR. Lavalin can blackmail and backtrack whatever they want. However, it is a different story when PMO uses the "jobs lose" reason to persuade / intimidate JWR for the DPA. It is becasue they should have due diligence. Edited April 5, 2019 by egghead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realitycheck Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said: A real possible outcome (moving business operations and jobs out of the country) is not a “threat”. Businesses must consider the business climate. If they can’t apply for contracts locally then there is no compelling reason to operate in that location. It certainly makes it harder to justify maintaining head offices there. You may not like it and would prefer that companies employ people without having work to complete, but that’s not how businesses operate. Again, there is zero chance of SNC moving it's HQ or losing any jobs. I understand that facts and reality are difficult for some folks to deal with but... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 17 hours ago, Owly said: So I guess if no jobs were threatened as you seem to think, why would any pressure be put on to save them? Hey this is a liberal thing, they are the ones that cocked it all up, you can't blame this one on harper, this has got Justins name all over it.....How something this simple got blown out of the water is all the liberals fault...Even liberals are saying this matter was not handled very well from the beginning....and here we are today, with this issue that is out of control...the liberals could not of screwed this up this bad if they had actually wanted or planed it to happen this way...Even you can see that.... Lets put some pieces together shall we, This whole SNC thing hit close to home for Justin, he felt the need to do something , " why " because he is a politician thats why...SNC had been lobbing Justin and crew very hard...., SNC was a heavy contributor to Justin campaign fund and they wanted to get a deal done...So they did pressure him... To get to your point the CEO of SNC had said during a media event, that they meaning SNC did not threaten to pull their HQ out of Quebec, and reminded everyone that they had banking contract that would hold the HQ in Quebec for 5 or more years....He also said that NO jobs where threaten....So where did this threat come from, was it made up by the liberals to be used as leverage....maybe , but no one is saying right now....Thats another liberal myth busted... Just in the last couple of days it has come out , even if SNC is convicted they would not be shut out of federal contracts all together....meaning SNC already has some very large contracts with DND, if any national security related contracts came out they would be in the clear to bid on them, there are a couple more examples of contracts that they are the odds on favorite to win even with a ban.....So thats another liberal myth busted.....He also has said even if SNC went else where most their employees are highly sought after , with the business that SNC are in ex employees would be gobbled up by the competition, there would be no net loss of jobs.... Canada is not the only nation to bring up SNC for bad business related charges.... My question to you is this, Do you think that 9000 jobs is worth breaking rule of law for, knowing all the above plus everything else that has happened since the start of this dogs breakfast...….the Justice dept already had gone over SNC case and said it was not eligible for a DPA , Justin and his crew wanted a large contributor to Justins campaign fund to be able to get off of all these charges and should be afforded special consideration cause that was what Justin wanted ....or perhaps the rule of law is only for the common folk....you know the ones that can't bank role some drama teachers run for PM.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owly Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 4 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Hey this is a liberal thing, they are the ones that cocked it all up, you can't blame this one on harper, this has got Justins name all over it.....How something this simple got blown out of the water is all the liberals fault...Even liberals are saying this matter was not handled very well from the beginning....and here we are today, with this issue that is out of control...the liberals could not of screwed this up this bad if they had actually wanted or planed it to happen this way...Even you can see that.... Lets put some pieces together shall we, This whole SNC thing hit close to home for Justin, he felt the need to do something , " why " because he is a politician thats why...SNC had been lobbing Justin and crew very hard...., SNC was a heavy contributor to Justin campaign fund and they wanted to get a deal done...So they did pressure him... To get to your point the CEO of SNC had said during a media event, that they meaning SNC did not threaten to pull their HQ out of Quebec, and reminded everyone that they had banking contract that would hold the HQ in Quebec for 5 or more years....He also said that NO jobs where threaten....So where did this threat come from, was it made up by the liberals to be used as leverage....maybe , but no one is saying right now....Thats another liberal myth busted... Just in the last couple of days it has come out , even if SNC is convicted they would not be shut out of federal contracts all together....meaning SNC already has some very large contracts with DND, if any national security related contracts came out they would be in the clear to bid on them, there are a couple more examples of contracts that they are the odds on favorite to win even with a ban.....So thats another liberal myth busted.....He also has said even if SNC went else where most their employees are highly sought after , with the business that SNC are in ex employees would be gobbled up by the competition, there would be no net loss of jobs.... Canada is not the only nation to bring up SNC for bad business related charges.... My question to you is this, Do you think that 9000 jobs is worth breaking rule of law for, knowing all the above plus everything else that has happened since the start of this dogs breakfast...….the Justice dept already had gone over SNC case and said it was not eligible for a DPA , Justin and his crew wanted a large contributor to Justins campaign fund to be able to get off of all these charges and should be afforded special consideration cause that was what Justin wanted ....or perhaps the rule of law is only for the common folk....you know the ones that can't bank role some drama teachers run for PM.... Once again, a dpa would NOT have gotten the company clear of any charges, it would simply have applied penalties to the people in offices who's actions caused the charges, and not teh people punching a time clock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 6 minutes ago, Owly said: Once again, a dpa would NOT have gotten the company clear of any charges, it would simply have applied penalties to the people in offices who's actions caused the charges, and not teh people punching a time clock. And, once again, the people punching the time clocks can continue to punch the same time clock on the same job, just for an honest employer instead of organized crime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owly Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, cannuck said: And, once again, the people punching the time clocks can continue to punch the same time clock on the same job, just for an honest employer instead of organized crime. Except they might have to move to Libya. I've been there and I wouldn't be in any hurry to return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egghead Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 18 hours ago, Owly said: So at least you seem to understand that jobs were threatened. how many though? BTW, I have a five carat diamond ring worth one hundred thousand, do you want it? Since I ask for one hundred thousand, the diamond must be real. Otherwise, I will not ask for that much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egghead Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 22 minutes ago, Owly said: Except they might have to move to Libya. I've been there and I wouldn't be in any hurry to return. How can they move that job to Libya? The clock is in Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owly Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 minute ago, egghead said: how many though? BTW, I have a five carat diamond ring worth one hundred thousand, do you want it? Since I ask for one hundred thousand, the diamond must be real. Otherwise, I will not ask for that much I already have one of those, but thanks for asking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Owly said: Once again, a dpa would NOT have gotten the company clear of any charges, it would simply have applied penalties to the people in offices who's actions caused the charges, and not teh people punching a time clock. The DPA would mean SNC would face a large fine , and a case closed, still allowed to take on any Canadian contract that is out there, slap on wrist, business as usual...still able to buy off clients with hookers , and large payouts .........not having a DPA means charges will move forward in the courts, with much larger fines and or sentences to those that are guilty, no more hookers or buy outs.........At no time are the people punching the clock going to court or facing charges unless they are guilty of something, there jobs would be secured unless the company collapsed not going to happen.... ....Once again even if SNC is found guilty SNC will NOT be barred for all Canadian contracts.....so tell me again how are regular jobs threaten by this whole thing again...How did SNC fair when they were barred from any WTO contracts did they tell them were pulling out all our workers....moving our HQ....NO they wanted to leave that for their home country which has pretty much supported them with everything including their very being on the planet......Trudeau should have told them , here's your suit case I pack for you , don't let the door hit your in the ass on the way to the airport....good luck in Europe or where ever your going...and called their bluff....but then again SNC CEO's have already refuted all that, there was no moving the HQ or laying of workers, that was a liberal lie..... do you think 9000 jobs is worth breaking the rule of law.... Edited April 5, 2019 by Army Guy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owly Posted April 5, 2019 Report Share Posted April 5, 2019 5 minutes ago, Army Guy said: The DPA would mean SNC would face a large fine , and a case closed....not having a DPA means charges will move forward in the courts, with much larger fines and or sentences to those that are guilty..... The dpa would mean the those that are guilty will be fined and held to account without hurting those who are innocent of the crimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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