You are ruled by Sharia

[Altai]

1 hour ago, ?Impact said:

 

Certainly there have been historical and cultural differences between men and women, but do those hold true today. Yes, the biological differences do mean women must bear the children but all the responsibilities of working and providing for a family can be indistinguishable in the modern world. Very few jobs require women to go out and plough the filed while they are pregnant, they can work in an office right up until delivery without any complications and return fairly shortly after. There are technology solutions like breast pumps that allow them to address their biological function in those months after work, and even far better social solutions like employer daycare or the father taking care of the children and bringing them to mom for feeding.

Do the above cited verses of the Quran have applicability in the modern world?

 No technological toys nor employer daycares will be able to give a mother's warmness nor affection. So your "modern" World is quite backward when compared to Sharia. 

Edited March 10, 2017 by Altai

[?Impact]

1 minute ago, Altai said:

No technological toys nor employer daycares will be able to give a baby a mother warmness nor affection. So your "modern" World is quite backward when compared to Sharia. 

...and why not dad?

[Altai]

1 hour ago, ?Impact said:

...and why not dad?

Because dads are capable and talented to do things other than babysitting. 

[?Impact]

Just now, Altai said:

Because dads are capable and talented to do things other than babysitting. 

... and so are moms

[Altai]

1 hour ago, ?Impact said:

... and so are moms

Their priority have to be their kids if they want well-trained successful persons of the future and if they want a strong society.

[Michael Hardner]

32 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Jesus did not teach to agree with or accept those who are in opposition to him or his teachings.   

You are mistaken.  The moneychangers and sinners were very much accepted by him.

[Altai]

Now, we have put three different issues on the table. Marriage age, secularism, democracy. All of them are the same in Sharia and in many other non-Muslim countries. (I am just ignoring how un-democratic are the Western countries who claims of being democratic) I am just considering it on the paper, not on practice. 


Women rights would be another comparison subject and we could witness how your countries are backward when compared to Sharia  Actually we partially addressed this issue with the claims of Dailamandashdkjashdkjas whatever his nickname and I tried to give him some explanations about it. 


Feel free to compare any laws of your state with Sharia, for example are you free to drink alcoholic beverages in public in Canada ? 


 

[dialamah]

20 minutes ago, Goddess said:

I resent the constant accusations of racist, islamophobe, hater, etc....If you think for one minute that I am the type of person who would walk up to a woman in hijab and rip it off her head or scream at her

 

I don't think even DoP would do that; it's not something I assume people would do no matter how they appear online.   Those types of people are definitely in the minority.

21 minutes ago, Goddess said:

You don't seem to want accept that what you say Muslims want or think is in any way colored by your own beliefs and experiences, or in fact, could be wrong or outright lies.

 

Of course it is.   Why is my experience judged less valid or not representing Islam at all?  (Not by you, necessarily).

 

22 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Anyone who knows me even a little, would disagree vehemently with your assessment of me.

My assessment of you is that you are generally fair-minded, and that you would not deliberately do anything to cause another person harm or distress.   I do think you have a bias that causes you to accept believe/accept statements which support your view and experience of Muslims - that they are generally not nice people.   

I'll try a different example of my frustration with some of the rhetoric ...

I don't like the niqab or the burka; I think they are ugly and that they do reflect an oppressive patriarchal system.   When this has come up in discussions I have made those statements, but they are ignored if I also say that it is a *valid* choice for some women, and that banning them means some women will not be able to leave their homes at all.   This has resulted in accusing me of supporting misogyny and oppression of women, etc.  

Yet, not one person on 'that side' has suggested how banning the burka/niqab will actually help women escape the intrinsic oppression of their culture and Islam, nor how we would identify and help women who would be confined to their homes in the event that the government instituted a burka/niqab ban in public places.  I've asked multiple times, and that question is entirely ignored.

It's pretty hard to believe that these people are actually interested in "solving a problem" rather than identifying an object of hate.  

To be fair, I keep engaging with you and trying to find common ground because I believe you are genuine in your motives.  I can't say the same for everyone.  

[?Impact]

15 minutes ago, Altai said:

Their priority have to be their kids if they want well-trained successful persons of the future and if they want a strong society.

So you are saying dads are incapable of filling that role?

2 minutes ago, Altai said:

Women rights would be another comparison subject and we could witness how your countries are backward when compared to Sharia

What about dads rights? ...and obligations.

While I see a level of biological discrimination, it seems to me that Sharia pushes that into sexual discrimination that is beyond the biological differences. 

[GostHacked]

25 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

You are mistaken.  The moneychangers and sinners were very much accepted by him.

It is you who is mistaken

Quote

"And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves, And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleansing_of_the_Temple

[GostHacked]

I am not rules by Sharia, I am ruled by corrupt elites who think they are politicians for the people.

[Michael Hardner]

1 minute ago, GostHacked said:

It is you who is mistaken

Sorry I stand corrected.  It was sinners and tax collectors.

[Altai]

1 hour ago, ?Impact said:

So you are saying dads are incapable of filling that role?

What about dads rights? ...and obligations.

While I see a level of biological discrimination, it seems to me that Sharia pushes that into sexual discrimination that is beyond the biological differences. 

Yes they are naturally incapable of filling that role like a mother. 

Dads rights is being well treated by his family. 

There is no such a thing, its your obsessions in the subconscious. If you have such a claim, you have to show evidences. 
 

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, ?Impact said:

There is a difference between testimony under oath and cross examination and stories one tells. I don't accept the 911 truthers, but they sure can spin a yarn.

That being said, we all know that there are countless examples of faulty eyewitness testimony, why should we believe ones that have been recorded 2000 years ago?

This is where you seriously err.  Many of the prophets and apostles who wrote the Bible were martyred for their beliefs.  They obviously were not lying.  If they were eyewitnesses to the miracles and power of God, we better believe them.  When you have a number of witnesses saying the same thing, you don't dismiss them as liars do you, especially when some of them gave their lives for what they believe.

[blackbird]

30 minutes ago, Altai said:

Now, we have put three different issues on the table. Marriage age, secularism, democracy. All of them are the same in Sharia and in many other non-Muslim countries. (I am just ignoring how un-democratic are the Western countries who claims of being democratic) I am just considering it on the paper, not on practice. 


Women rights would be another comparison subject and we could witness how your countries are backward when compared to Sharia  Actually we partially addressed this issue with the claims of Dailamandashdkjashdkjas whatever his nickname and I tried to give him some explanations about it. 


Feel free to compare any laws of your state with Sharia, for example are you free to drink alcoholic beverages in public in Canada ? 


 

Altai,  There is a world of difference between between some Islamic countries which practice Sharia and western democracies.  You have missed a major difference.  It is freedom of religion and freedom of speech.  These are considered as fundamental human rights in democratic countries.  In Islamic countries this is not so.  There is a woman for example in Pakistan who has been sentenced to death for blasphemy.  She was a Muslim who converted to christianity.  How many Islamic republics have a death sentence for Muslims who convert to christianity?  There is no freedom of religion in such countries or freedom of speech.

[?Impact]

17 minutes ago, Altai said:

Yes they are naturally incapable of filling that role like a mother.

I have to disagree with you on that one. Other than the biological function of feeding a baby through the first year or so of life, dads can serve the role of raising children with excellent results. They can comfort them, they can teach them, they can encourage them, they provide security, etc.

[Goddess]

47 minutes ago, dialamah said:

 

I don't like the niqab or the burka; I think they are ugly and that they do reflect an oppressive patriarchal system.   When this has come up in discussions I have made those statements, but they are ignored.

It wasn't ignored by me.  It was refreshing to hear your thoughts on it. 

Yet, not one person on 'that side' has suggested how banning the burka/niqab will actually help women escape the intrinsic oppression of their culture and Islam, nor how we would identify and help women who would be confined to their homes in the event that the government instituted a burka/niqab ban in public places.  I've asked multiple times, and that question is entirely ignored.

This was also not ignored by me.  I didn't agree with the ban, so I have no arguments to support it.

To be fair, I keep engaging with you and trying to find common ground because I believe you are genuine in your motives.  

Ditto.  

 

 

[Altai]

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

Altai,  There is a world of difference between between some Islamic countries which practice Sharia and western democracies.  You have missed a major difference.  It is freedom of religion and freedom of speech.  These are considered as fundamental human rights in democratic countries.  In Islamic countries this is not so.  There is a woman for example in Pakistan who has been sentenced to death for blasphemy.  She was a Muslim who converted to christianity.  How many Islamic republics have a death sentence for Muslims who convert to christianity?  There is no freedom of religion in such countries or freedom of speech.

You show the typical features of a kafir. So you are denying the logic just because of it contradicts with your personal interests.  

[Altai]

1 hour ago, ?Impact said:

I have to disagree with you on that one. Other than the biological function of feeding a baby through the first year or so of life, dads can serve the role of raising children with excellent results. They can comfort them, they can teach them, they can encourage them, they provide security, etc.

Now you started to reject science too just because of you dont want to believe in it to happen in this way. You personally want to be the right side and ignoring anything which contradicts with your claim. 

https://www.babiesonline.com/articles/baby/scienceofmotherslove.asp

http://www.momjunction.com/articles/different-ways-in-which-a-mother-can-influence-child-development_00353010/#gref

[eyeball]

2 hours ago, blackbird said:

God parted the Red Sea so that the children of Israel could cross and escape the Egyptians.

Then why can't God save us from Sharia?  Just who's side is It on anyway?

[Goddess]

37 minutes ago, Altai said:

Now you started to reject science too just because of you dont want to believe in it to happen in this way. You personally want to be the right side and ignoring anything which contradicts with your claim. 

https://www.babiesonline.com/articles/baby/scienceofmotherslove.asp

http://www.momjunction.com/articles/different-ways-in-which-a-mother-can-influence-child-development_00353010/#gref

No one here is disputing that children need their mothers.

The disagreement is that women are more than just "breeders."

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, Altai said:

You show the typical features of a kafir. So you are denying the logic just because of it contradicts with your personal interests.  

Altai,  you are in a state of denial.  Sharia denies freedom of religion and speech in countries where it is imposed.  That's why I asked you if you can give any evidence that the Quran and Sharia is from God.  If it does not come from God, then it must be invented by man.  The Holy Bible as I explained earlier to other people comes from God and the evidence it comes from God is overwhelming.  Many prophets and apostles wrote the bible under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and some of them were martyred for their faith.  People don't die for something that is false.  If you read the first two books of the Bible you will see some big miracles recorded.  The children of Israel were held in slavery by the Eygptians for hundreds of years until God set them free.  There were many miracles that God performed to convince the Eygptian pharoah to let the children of Israel go.  Then God parted the Red Sea and Moses led them through to the promised land.  These were big miracles.  Have you read the Quran?

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

Then why can't God save us from Sharia?  Just who's side is It on anyway?

God is not an it.  In the Bible he is referred to in the masculine gender.  see King James Bible (1611)

"Why can't God save us from Sharia?"  "who's side is it on anyway?"   God is not on a side in that way.  He is calling people in any group and everywhere to be born again.

God uses his word to save people from all sorts of things which are in opposition to him and give them eternal life.  But the gospel of Christ is spread through the preaching of God's Word.  That is the method God chose to spread his Word.  "For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God."  1 Corinthians Ch1 vs 18   "For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe."  1 Corinthians Ch1 vs 21.   KJV 1611

 

Must go out for a few hours.

 

Edited March 11, 2017 by blackbird

[blackbird]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

You are mistaken.  The moneychangers and sinners were very much accepted by him.

I think there is a little misunderstanding as to what I said.  I was referring to the word "tolerance".  Jesus did not teach to agree with or go along with those who opposed him or his teachings.  When you say moneychangers and sinners were very much accepted by him, that is not correct.  Jesus overthrew the tables of the money changers at the temple and condemned making his place of worship a place of money dealing.    Jesus accepted sinners who wanted to repent and follow him as disciples.  He never approved of sins of people.

[Argus]

On 3/9/2017 at 5:12 PM, ?Impact said:

The link between the extremist right wing with a pulpit and the murder of the 6 Muslims in Quebec city is far more solid than any link to M-103. Look to the likes of Marine Le Pen, Donald Trump, and Ezra Levant. 

How many people have they killed?