drummindiver Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 Yes thank you. You could have linked to it in the first place when you made the claim. Not much detail on the methodology though and on how far back such ratings go. Reputation takes a long time to build and can be destroyed very quickly so I don't see evidence that this favouable result lies solely with Harper. Lol. He'd been in office ten years. Who should it rely upon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 You would have had issue no matter whom I quoted, thus I quoted a known leftist establishment. And I didn't link to it earlier, as it has been linked and discussed on numerous occasions. Clearly, as it didn't jive with your stance, you took no notice. As I don't read every single thread or post here I did not see it. I asked for a cite and you provided it so no big deal. No need to be rude about this. Not sure why/how asking for a cite is anything more than asking for a cite to lead to further discussion. Do you have anything substantive to say about my reply? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 Lol. He'd been in office ten years. Who should it rely upon? Reputation is built up after decades, if not centuries, for something that is as long lasting as a country. So it would be built on all that has come before, the attitudes of Canadians, and how people in those G8 countries view Canada based on various personal experiences and/or reputation/bias. It really is just an opinion survey so it is not like it means anything more than this faction of people approve slightly more of Canada as opposed to these other countries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 As I don't read every single thread or post here I did not see it. I asked for a cite and you provided it so no big deal. No need to be rude about this. Not sure why/how asking for a cite is anything more than asking for a cite to lead to further discussion. Do you have anything substantive to say about my reply? Harper has/had been in office for a long time...long enough that results from this are indicative of the job he had done. Number 1 3 of the 4 last years. Number 2 in 2014. Clearly, he must have done something right. My intention wasn't rudeness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) Reputation is built on more than government and biases are built up over many decades so I disagree. Edited November 15, 2015 by msj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 Reputation is built on more than government and biases are built up over many decades so I disagree. So, if we are thought ill of it's Harper's fault? If we are thought well of it's nothing to do with Harper? Sorry, you can't have it both ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 So, if we are thought ill of it's Harper's fault? If we are thought well of it's nothing to do with Harper? Sorry, you can't have it both ways. Show me where I stated this and we can discuss it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeferMadness Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 it matters that the last government was right, and the new one, along with people like you, were always obviously wrong. So, why don't you tell me how wonderful the last government made things? Or are you claiming that the attack in Paris is a result of Trudeau announcing he intended to withdraw the F18's? If what you're doing isn't working, smart people try something different. Especially when there was no logic that went into the initial actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 I see, so the article must be untrue and you must be correct. Well, im completely convinced. Of course anything is possible, you could be right, but in lieu of any evidence to that affect I will probably believe the report over your theories and at the same time wonder at the ease of which some of you delude yourselves in order to make the world fit your point of view. Yes, its being reported that a Syrian passport was found near the body of one of the attackers. The question is really - was it a fake passport, was it someone's passport that was stolen, did it even belong to the dead body nearby? Maybe it did or maybe it didn't. Why are you so eager to believe that the presence of a the passport proves anything about the body nearby or about Syrian refugees in general? Have you no sense of skepticism, especially about media-reported 'facts'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpankyMcFarland Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) ..and all the evidence of what ISIS was doing wasn't evidence enough of the evidence, He was voted in on withdrawing from Syria. Now it's ok because things changed? How in hell did they change? Burning ppl alive in cages wasn't enough for him or you? You need to calm down. What we say here matters not one jot. The Canadian air strikes are a trivial matter in time and place. Let's remember the old conservative idea that it is quite easy to do more harm than good, as Dubya showed us all too clearly. Supporting the Kurds sounds a lot more sensible to me. They are going to be in that part of the world long after we have given up and gone home. Edited November 15, 2015 by SpankyMcFarland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpankyMcFarland Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 ..and all the evidence of what ISIS was doing wasn't evidence enough of the evidence, He was voted in on withdrawing from Syria. Now it's ok because things changed? How in hell did they change? Burning ppl alive in cages wasn't enough for him or you? The thing is, you are going to denounce him whether he changes policy or not. I am not a spokesperson for the Liberal Party BTW so please don't assume I agree with JT on everything he does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 Show me where I stated this and we can discuss it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted November 15, 2015 Report Share Posted November 15, 2015 The thing is, you are going to denounce him whether he changes policy or not. I am not a spokesperson for the Liberal Party BTW so please don't assume I agree with JT on everything he does. So, I am trying to be hopeful with Trudeau. He fails, Canada fails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 So, any quotes of me stating the straw man made up by drummindriver yet? Anyone, anyone? Buehler? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 This last incident in Paris should not have an effect on policy or strategy. A major terrorist attack has been anticipated in Europe for years - it was only a matter of time. Why no outrage over those 226 Russians killed in that airplane? It looks to me like the Trudeau strategy is to extricate Canada from active war action in the Middle East before the USA decides to start on another Vietnam and Afghanistan. This withdrawal will be cover for when those American et al boots go on the ground and the body bags start coming home. Get those airplanes back here ASAP. Looks like the American hawks are planning another invasion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
69cat Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 The Paris attacks should have no change on Liberal policies. ISIS has been well know for three years and its existence goes back further, and there are numerous other such groups - the Liberal party has not received any new information since the campaign that warrants a policy change. The CPC was cautious on refugee claims and the Liberals have told us this was only fear mongering. Nothing has changed here either. The Syrian involvement Canada can do without if it follows the US plan, if Canada follows the Russian plan then we should commit more. I dont know what targets were being hit by Canadian forces previously, i could beleive they were truely ISIS or other targets but i would guess they were of a US agenda intended to facilitate removal of another legitimate government. The quickest and simplest solution is Russian where in the goal is to restore the legitimate government and then let the people decide. Anyone taking up arms against such goal is clearly identified as the enemy and our planes can hit them with authority. John Kerry was on tv stating the US will work together with Russia to restore a working government. I wish that will come true but i expect there will come a difference of opinion on what entities will be allowed to form that government and so a stalemate will result. The most direct solution still comes from Russia. Therefore our jets in Syria is really the only issue that has seen a significant change of events in recent days stemming from John Kerry statements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notca Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 The thing is, you are going to denounce him whether he changes policy or not. I am not a spokesperson for the Liberal Party BTW so please don't assume I agree with JT on everything he does. I would not denounce him if he were man enough to back off a bit and admit that perhaps he has bitten off more than he can chew. Taking a bit of 'sober second thought' would show him to have some character. Rushing ahead with plans that are beginning to look dubious is not a wise move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpankyMcFarland Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 I would not denounce him if he were man enough to back off a bit and admit that perhaps he has bitten off more than he can chew. Taking a bit of 'sober second thought' would show him to have some character. Rushing ahead with plans that are beginning to look dubious is not a wise move. I hope he changes his mind too but I know the thanks he'll get from the Conservative attack machine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 Well, he tweeted on Friday, prior to his tweet about the Paris attacks (i.e. so the letters were obviously written before the attacks) this link: Ministerial Mandate Letters . Interestingly the one to McCallum states: Lead government-wide efforts to resettle 25,000 refugees from Syria in the coming months. Hmmm, "in the coming months." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overthere Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 Not a peep from Trudeau on the Paris situation, beyond a blithe and incoherent ramble when leaving Canada for Turkey on Friday. He has spoken about our commitment to take more refugees, though I expect world leaders already knew about that. They knew from the Chretien regime not to expect our military to do anythinhg much to aid their allies. He has left poor muppet Dion out to dry, chattering on ludicrously about how Canada is 'supporting France strongly' with words of sympathy, accompanied by providing training to Kurds and sending more blankets to the few civilians left. It took me until now to realize that he is waiting for the polls in Canada to tell him what to say and do. He knows his timing was brutal in beaking off about withdrawing the CF 18s. Now he has to figure out if actual events matter more than election promises. Best to do it the Liberal way- see which way the wind blows at home, then drift in that direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) This is his 1st real test as a leader and he better make it right. I am sure he is pissed. I can just imagine he was thinking how this trip was going to be all about him and maybe get the meeting named change to The Trudeau Meetings. And then all the fawning he would be expecting, but then this. And then his 1st speech is a campaign speech from the election. I can see other leaders just shaking there heads at Canada for electing this kid. So it is time, is he a leader or just along for the ride. We need to end this madness now. This could get very embarrassing. Edited November 16, 2015 by PIK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hitops Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) Trudeau Sr had principles, much as I would not agree with many of them. Trudeau Jr. does not, he believes whatever is popular sentiment in the moment. He stands for nothing. That is not necessarily always bad, for example in this case he might actually make the right move and re-commit to Syria or even reduce/stop the refugee influx. Will have to see. Edited November 16, 2015 by hitops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 I am reminded of the sexist joke about the old bull and the young bull. The young bull wants to rush down and have his way with the one cow. The old bull tells him to relax, if we take our time we can have them all. Trudeau, so far, has made promises like the young bull. He gets in and continues to act like a young bull as he quickly announces the withdrawal of our jets from the region. Then he acts like the old bull: leaves the jets in place, doesn't panic react (at least not yet) about the attacks in Paris, doesn't indicate change yet to the refugees although we all missed the change as announced in his ministerial letter I posted back on page 3. We will see, but so far the kid is doing alright and I'm glad he is not making quick knee jerk decisions when he has the ability to back them up with authority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 So, any quotes of me stating the straw man made up by drummindriver yet? Anyone, anyone? Buehler? I built a straw man? Cool. Didn't know I had that technology. You do realize, "you can't have it both ways" is not exclusive? It's inclusive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted November 16, 2015 Report Share Posted November 16, 2015 MSJ, that is his advisors saying that not trudeau. We have a government ran by advisors, not the leader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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