Guest Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, eyeball said: Everyone should care when anyone hurts someone else but Islam is just an idea - it's not a person and people are not it. It's not the Force. The people doing the hurting get to decide that, not you or I. I'm sure you wouldn't give all ideologies a pass. Why give that one a pass? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 Just now, bcsapper said: The people doing the hurting get to decide that, not you or I. I'm sure you wouldn't give all ideologies a pass. Why give that one a pass? What pass? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, eyeball said: What pass? "but Islam is just an idea". So was Nazism, but we still blamed Nazis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 15 minutes ago, bcsapper said: "but Islam is just an idea". So was Nazism, but we still blamed Nazis. Point still stands, it's people who make Nazism what it is not the other way around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, eyeball said: Point still stands, it's people who make Nazism what it is not the other way around. It's people who make Islam what it is too. An ideology is what it is. One can pay attention or not, depending on how lunatic one is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 22 minutes ago, bcsapper said: It's people who make Islam what it is too. An ideology is what it is. One can pay attention or not, depending on how lunatic one is. Islam is a religion not an ideology. What matters is whether one is an asshole. As well as making Islam into something it isn't you see a lot of assholes also using Islam to make people into something they're not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 6 hours ago, bcsapper said: "but Islam is just an idea". So was Nazism, but we still blamed Nazis. Ridiculous to equate them. We don't blame conservatives for Naziism so we shouldn't blame moderate Muslims for Islamist terrorism. How about a "This week in Conservatism" thread with examples of assholes putting up swastikas etc. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said: Ridiculous to equate them. We don't blame conservatives for Naziism so we shouldn't blame moderate Muslims for Islamist terrorism. How about a "This week in Conservatism" thread with examples of assholes putting up swastikas etc. ? National Socialism...it's in the name. Nazis are just socialists with a national agenda rather than international. The Conservatives in 1930s Germany was the Weimar Government. Islam and Nazism saw eye to eye on numerous things during WW2...or have you conveniently forgotten that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 4 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: 1. National Socialism...it's in the name. Nazis are just socialists with a national agenda rather than international. 2. Islam and Nazism saw eye to eye on numerous things during WW2...or have you conveniently forgotten that? 1. This is stupid and has been debunked numerous time. Pointing to their name ignores their ultranationalist and racist policies, the lighter form of which are in right-wing parties everywhere. If it will calm your alt-right nerves, let's say we don't blame Andrew Scheer for the Quebec Mosque shooting, although it was egged on by his friends at The Rebel. 2. The Nazis saw themselves as Christian... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: 1. This is stupid and has been debunked numerous time. Pointing to their name ignores their ultranationalist and racist policies, the lighter form of which are in right-wing parties everywhere. If it will calm your alt-right nerves, let's say we don't blame Andrew Scheer for the Quebec Mosque shooting, although it was egged on by his friends at The Rebel. 2. The Nazis saw themselves as Christian... National Socialism...it's in the name. Big government controlling every aspect of one's life...you can pretend that's Conservatism. Nazis and Islam worked together during WW2. You can also pretend that it didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 Nazism only worked because conservatives voted them into power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 Meanwhile...in Indonesia...that hallmark of Islamic moderation.... -------------------------------------- A middle aged Indonesian woman, who has been identified by her initials SM, has been charged with blasphemy for bringing her dog into a mosque in Bogor and setting it loose, despite the police’s mental health assessment unearthing her long history of mental illness. Yesterday evening, a day after the incident, police said that they had found that SM was first diagnosed with schizophrenia in 2013. Since then, she had been treated by several psychiatrists — all of whom corroborated her diagnosis with the police — but they say she only intermittently took her medication and often didn’t show up to therapy. This morning, the Bogor Police announced that SM has been charged with blasphemy. “Based on the evidence of five witness testimonies and a video of the incident, matched by the clothes and shoes SM wore when she entered the mosque… SM is now a suspect,” Bogor Police Spokeswoman Ita Puspita Lena wrote in a statement, as picked up by Detik. SM was charged with violating Article 156A of the Blasphemy Law, which carries a potential penalty of five years in prison, for expressing in public an insult towards a recognized religion in Indonesia…. https://coconuts.co/jakarta/news/police-say-woman-who-took-dog-into-mosque-schizophrenic-still-charge-her-with-blasphemy/ Taking a dog into a mosque...that monster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 1 minute ago, eyeball said: Nazism only worked because conservatives voted them into power. Nope. Conservatives voted DNVP or Centre Party. They lost. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_1933_German_federal_election Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 That's right. the Nazis only tallied 43.9 percent of the vote, well short of a majority. They needed the votes of their coalition partner, the German National People's Party (DNVP), for a bare working majority in the Reichstag. Without conservatives Hitler would have been a nobody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 1 minute ago, eyeball said: That's right. Without conservatives Hitler would have been a nobody. Doubtful they were actually Conservatives since the DNVP was a amalgamation of numerous groups...many not Conservative in any fashion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: Doubtful they were actually Conservatives since the DNVP was a amalgamation of numerous groups...many not Conservative in any fashion. Hitler must have won their hearts and minds when his Stormtroopers attacked Communists, leftists, socialists and trade unionists just before the election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 Just now, eyeball said: Hitler must have won their hearts and minds when his Stormtroopers attacked Communists, leftists, socialists and trade unionists just before the election. Hitler attracted the Antisemites in the DNVP to join the Nazis...of which there were MANY. Hitler was much keener on sticking it to the Jews than the DNVP could ever hope to be. Something Islam admired in Hitler, as well....attracted a bit of...heh...support there, too. Members of the 13th SS division at prayer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 8 hours ago, eyeball said: Islam is a religion not an ideology. What matters is whether one is an asshole. As well as making Islam into something it isn't you see a lot of assholes also using Islam to make people into something they're not. Islam is a religion and an ideology. Islam is full of arseholes making their own choices based on their ideology. It's not being an arsehole to point such out. It might be to deny such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: Ridiculous to equate them. We don't blame conservatives for Naziism so we shouldn't blame moderate Muslims for Islamist terrorism. How about a "This week in Conservatism" thread with examples of assholes putting up swastikas etc. ? Wait, conservatives? You could play first base for a poorly fielding baseball team. Why did you do that? And as for blaming moderate Muslims for Islamist terrorism, that's the oldest deflection in the book. One doesn't do that and one doesn't have to. Edited July 4, 2019 by bcsapper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 28 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Meanwhile...in Indonesia...that hallmark of Islamic moderation.... -------------------------------------- A middle aged Indonesian woman, who has been identified by her initials SM, has been charged with blasphemy for bringing her dog into a mosque in Bogor and setting it loose, despite the police’s mental health assessment unearthing her long history of mental illness. Yesterday evening, a day after the incident, police said that they had found that SM was first diagnosed with schizophrenia in 2013. Since then, she had been treated by several psychiatrists — all of whom corroborated her diagnosis with the police — but they say she only intermittently took her medication and often didn’t show up to therapy. This morning, the Bogor Police announced that SM has been charged with blasphemy. “Based on the evidence of five witness testimonies and a video of the incident, matched by the clothes and shoes SM wore when she entered the mosque… SM is now a suspect,” Bogor Police Spokeswoman Ita Puspita Lena wrote in a statement, as picked up by Detik. SM was charged with violating Article 156A of the Blasphemy Law, which carries a potential penalty of five years in prison, for expressing in public an insult towards a recognized religion in Indonesia…. https://coconuts.co/jakarta/news/police-say-woman-who-took-dog-into-mosque-schizophrenic-still-charge-her-with-blasphemy/ Taking a dog into a mosque...that monster. Best get her into custody before some Muslims who are not terrorists catch up with her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 10 hours ago, eyeball said: Everyone should care when anyone hurts someone else but Islam is just an idea - it's not a person and people are not it. It's not the Force. But it is a Force - and not for good, as it's actions and violence across the world tell us so. As for attacks on police stations et al, they are happening whether some people don't care to admit it or not, here's a recent one. “A police station in the Eure attacked by youths shouting ‘Allah Akbar ' http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/un-commissariat-de-l-eure-attaque-par-des-jeunes-aux-cris-d-allah-akbar-20190628?redirect_premium foiled again. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7203505/Terror-plot-targeting-Sydney-churches-police-stations-foiled.html this guy says he will strike again https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6484095/Afghan-asylum-seeker-stabbed-two-American-tourists-says-strike-again.html another plot foiled https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-47677657 and on it goes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 34 minutes ago, bcsapper said: And as for blaming moderate Muslims for Islamist terrorism, that's the oldest deflection in the book. One doesn't do that and one doesn't have to. You are sensible, even if sloppy with words sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 12 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: You are sensible, even if sloppy with words sometimes. I always thought it was everyone else who didn't speak English properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 2 hours ago, bcsapper said: Best get her into custody before some Muslims who are not terrorists catch up with her. Pretty hard to get behind a religious belief system that hates animals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 1 hour ago, bcsapper said: I always thought it was everyone else who didn't speak English properly. A blatant attempt at division. You're the reasonable one...ie...you still can get aboard the "Non-Muslims who Serve Islam" train and enjoy the Halal continental breakfast. Unlike the deplorables... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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