Prime Minister Harper confirms ‘no’ vote on Palestine at UN

[login]

What exactly is trolling? I ask out of genuine curiosity, and a wish to avoid warning points. How come the post you referred to is trolling, and your post here:

is not?

I wasn't being annoying or mean, I was stimulating debate.

Look it up on internet meme's r us.

http://knowyourmeme....ltures/trolling

I'm never out to anger people, I'm all about spreading the love.

Some people just happen to be mental tightwads. They need to come to terms and gain some acumen. They have this us vs. them mindframe that evades the fact I really couldn't care less, and if I'm on a side it is one I havn't actively engaged in. Its just the way it is, live with it, and get a grip and a non-fabricated reality and by fabricated reality I mean one that doesn't represent a reality that is misinformed or nonapplicable to a functioning tommorrow. People who are both retentive and trying to create a world to suit their needs need to gtfo because they are justing ruining it for the real people around here.

I can take dialogue and debate but the other people that tend to harass reasonable people around here resort to character assassination when they realize they are wrong on the issue of discussion. That is where they clearly show themselves as trolls rather than contributors. Hopefully this clears up the issue for you.

Edited November 29, 2012 by login

[bleeding heart]

I actually support the Palestinian's bid for statehood at the UN. I think them trying to achieve their ends through peaceful and legal means is commendable and should be encouraged. In fact, a unilateral Palestinian declaration of statehood and assertion of sovereignty is probably the most likely way towards a two state solution to actually be implemented. And I believe that this step is beneficial for Israel as well. Any attacks (if/when they occur from the West Bank in the future) from a sovereign state can be considered an act of war and responded to appropriately, rather than the ambiguous nature of responding to resistance in an occupied territory.

Hear hear.

[Smallc]

I think Bonam changed my mind.

[bleeding heart]

Bonam's post is so far the star of this particular thread, yes.

[Merlin]

It's important to keep a close on eye on Islamic states and the emerging Islamic states. They are ruled by Sharia Law, the same same Sharia Law that was nearly allowed to pass here in Ontario! There is no freedom in the Sharia States, only stringent laws that lack human compassion. Homosexuals are killed! Women are killed for being raped! The voice of a woman is only worth half of a man's! People choosing to not be a Muslim anymore are killed! We do not need more of these people running states, but less. The people who support the Arabs need to wake up and truly look and see what these people really stand for.

[eyeball]

Bonam's post is so far the star of this particular thread, yes.

It should forwarded to Harper.

[Evening Star]

, the same same Sharia Law that was nearly allowed to pass here in Ontario!

Cite?

[Merlin]

Cite?

Perhaps you are too young to remember but those of us who are old enough will remember the debate of whether or not to allow Sharia Law in Ontario. Sharia Law is dangerous and cannot be allowed to become a part of a normalized part of Canadian life. With Sharia there is no separation of Church and State, the Church becomes the State. We don't need that here. Edited November 29, 2012 by Merlin

[Evening Star]

OK, I can't tell if you're joking anymore. If you are, that was hilarious.

[cybercoma]

I think he was kidding.

[bleeding heart]

The people who support the Arabs need to wake up and truly look and see what these people really stand for.

[Evening Star]

I think he was kidding.

When I typed "I can't tell if you're joking", to be clear, his post still read "those of us who are old enough can still remember when the McGuinty government held a referendum on whether to pass Sharia law in Ontario". Since he has since edited the post, I'm not sure if it was a joke or not. If it was, it was a good one.

[Fletch 27]

Actually, It was the NDP-er,,, Marion Boyd who was the advocate in Ontario FOR SHaria Law..

http://nosharia.blogspot.ca/2005/01/toronto-star-story-on-marion-boyds.html

[Evening Star]

'[C]onclud[ing] that "Muslim principles" should be considered an acceptable method of [out-of-court] religious arbitration" when Catholic or Jewish principles can already be used in similar situations is pretty different from passing Sharia law in Ontario.

Anyway, back to Palestinian statehood.

[Merlin]

'[C]onclud[ing] that "Muslim principles" should be considered an acceptable method of [out-of-court] religious arbitration" when Catholic or Jewish principles can already be used in similar situations is pretty different from passing Sharia law in Ontario.

Anyway, back to Palestinian statehood.

I'm sorry but I do not find the stoning of women, murder of homosexuals and apostates to be acceptable methods of religious arbitration. I view the voice of women to be equal to that of a man's voice. In Sharia Law women are less then men, I cannot support this mindset. We must not allow the Church to become the state anywhere in Canada, we have been separating the two for years now and Sharia will reverse this but instead of Christian precepts Islamic ones will start to take hold in our justice and governmental systems. This is scary and dangerous.

[Evening Star]

The point is that we haven't been separating the two for years. Catholics and Jews could already use religious arbitration to avoid a court battle so it's hard to justify blocking followers of other religions from doing so. (Perhaps you've noticed that Catholic schools get public funding in Ontario?) My preference would be to completely separate church and state altogether, to not make 'religious arbitration' a part of the legal system at all.

[PIK]

History will tell, I think palastine will, be one big terrorist organization, when this is all done. Hamas hezy iran and other arab states will be moving in, the regular palastine life will change little. They will still be used as pawns by the arabs to keep at Israel. This will bring the end to palastine. ever getting a country. And say good bye to the UN.

[jbg]

I actually support the Palestinian's bid for statehood at the UN. I think them trying to achieve their ends through peaceful and legal means is commendable and should be encouraged. In fact, a unilateral Palestinian declaration of statehood and assertion of sovereignty is probably the most likely way towards a two state solution to actually be implemented. And I believe that this step is beneficial for Israel as well. Any attacks (if/when they occur from the West Bank in the future) from a sovereign state can be considered an act of war and responded to appropriately, rather than the ambiguous nature of responding to resistance in an occupied territory.

As I said in a related thread (link):

(I)f they are a "state" then attacks emanating from their "territory" are the "government's" responsibility, an act of war.

Israel handles that kind of activity quite well if it doesn't have its hands tied behind its back; 1967 is an object example.

[Canuckistani]

As I said in a related thread (link):

(I)f they are a "state" then attacks emanating from their "territory" are the "government's" responsibility, an act of war.

Israel handles that kind of activity quite well if it doesn't have its hands tied behind its back; 1967 is an object example.

Absolutely. Move the settlers out, any attacks are an act of war and Israel is free to fight back as deemed necessary.

[Hudson Jones]

Finkelstein:

[scribblet]

It represents my view also.

Why should Israel negotiate with Hamas as it still refuses to recognize the State of Israel. Meshal still wants to continue fighting for one state- Palestine so how can there ever be peace. Why should Canada recognize this as Hamas does not want peace until Israel is gone.

http://topics.nytime...?inline=nyt-per

Why should Israel negotiate with Hamas as it still refuses to recognize the State of Israel. Meshal still wants to continue fighting for one state,- Palestine so how can there ever be peace.

Edited November 29, 2012 by scribblet

[Michael Hardner]

As I said in a related thread (link):

(I)f they are a "state" then attacks emanating from their "territory" are the "government's" responsibility, an act of war.

Israel handles that kind of activity quite well if it doesn't have its hands tied behind its back; 1967 is an object example.

I get this - but how would it be any different than what happens today, in practical terms ?

[Hudson Jones]

It represents my view also.

Why should Israel negotiate with Hamas as it still refuses to recognize the State of Israel. Meshal still wants to continue fighting for one state- Palestine so how can there ever be peace. Why should Canada recognize this as Hamas does not want peace until Israel is gone.

Here is an interview where Meshal tell us where Hamas stands on a number of issues, including the two states. It sounds like you don't really know what Hamas' stance is:

[DogOnPorch]

And we believe this murderous snake why?

[GostHacked]

I actually support the Palestinian's bid for statehood at the UN. I think them trying to achieve their ends through peaceful and legal means is commendable and should be encouraged. In fact, a unilateral Palestinian declaration of statehood and assertion of sovereignty is probably the most likely way towards a two state solution to actually be implemented. And I believe that this step is beneficial for Israel as well. Any attacks (if/when they occur from the West Bank in the future) from a sovereign state can be considered an act of war and responded to appropriately, rather than the ambiguous nature of responding to resistance in an occupied territory.

These are my thoughts as well. If they get statehood then they get all the benefits and drawbacks that come with it. I have also stated that if they attack Israel, that Israel can respond with full rights of the international law. Right now Israel has a huge advantage in which they can essentially attack Gaza/West Bank with impunity for they are occupied territories and not sovereign states. The Palestinians have no recourse, in order to hold Israel accountable for any attack. Now that is going with the notion of Israel attacking first.

With official statehood, Israel will have to reach out to the UN and actually work with it in order to resolve any crisis in the area. Until then Israel controls their fate and their statehood chances.