ExFlyer Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 37 minutes ago, eyeball said: So put indians back in their place? Good luck with that especially on the basis of vote/taxpayer fed upness. I can't think of a better gauntlet to throw down in front of fed up activists. Nope, never said that anywhere or any time. Only ever said, treat them like any other Canadian. No activism at all, just fair Canadian treatment. They had 156 years to integrate but chose instead to suck of your teat You should take some time and effort and improve your reading comprehension. Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
CdnFox Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 40 minutes ago, eyeball said: So put indians back in their place? Good luck with that especially on the basis of vote/taxpayer fed upness. I can't think of a better gauntlet to throw down in front of fed up activists. Activism works for as long as the public tolerates it. Trudeau's already established that if somebody gets out of line or has an illegal bouncy castle then it's perfectly acceptable to bring down the emergencies act upon them. Pass a law or two making it an act of terrorism to block infrastructure, so in a few other things, and then all of a sudden activism becomes Less Fun It works right now because the public has a lot of sympathy and tolerance. But as we've seen people are already getting sick of the whole woke routine and more and more people are realizing that the problems are not a result of the first nations past but if they're unwillingness to deal with the presents coupled with the fact that some of their own people are using them as a cash cow. And as people become less tolerant, they will get away with less and less. 2 Quote
eyeball Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 7 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: No activism at all, just fair Canadian treatment Just like us, with governments of their own. 9 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: They had 156 years to integrate but chose instead to suck of your teat Canadians have had as much time or more to make and settle treaties but chose to be tits about it instead. Indigenous peoples don't want your withered old things in their faces any more than you do. 13 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: You should take some time and effort and improve your reading comprehension. You should take some time and effort to improve your opinions on this issue. Go examine some modern treaties for example. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
ExFlyer Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 (edited) 17 hours ago, eyeball said: Just like us, with governments of their own. Canadians have had as much time or more to make and settle treaties but chose to be tits about it instead. Indigenous peoples don't want your withered old things in their faces any more than you do. You should take some time and effort to improve your opinions on this issue. Go examine some modern treaties for example. No, they should have one government, just like us. Indigenous have had time to get on board , like all Canadians, refugees, immigrants etc but, they chose to suck on your teat. Indigenous do not get any "withered old things", they get cold hard cash and anything they want, as they do and have for the past 156 years. They have land, mineral and water rights, free houses, free infrastructure and a welfare cheque every month and...do not have to pay any taxes for any of the free support. I do not need to improve my opinions...I see and know how much the indigenous squeeze out of Canadian taxpayers. Gotta stick with facts, not opinions. LOL Edited October 14 by ExFlyer Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
eyeball Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 2 hours ago, ExFlyer said: No, they have one government, just like us. We have multiple governments, just like them. 2 hours ago, ExFlyer said: Indigenous do not get any "withered old things", they get cold hard cash and anything they want, as they do and have for the past 156 years. Just like us. Before that we just stole what we wanted. 2 hours ago, ExFlyer said: They have land, mineral and water rights, free houses, free infrastructure and a welfare cheque every month and...do not have to pay any taxes for any of the free support. Again, just like us. 2 hours ago, ExFlyer said: I do not need to improve my opinions...I see and know how much the indigenous squeeze out of Canadian taxpayers. Gotta stick with facts, not opinions. LOL Maybe you need a more effective way of governing yourself in your region. Revolution and reform often coalesce around indigenous aspirations. Get in line. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
herbie Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 7 hours ago, Zeitgeist said: Fake, reckless, weak, and dishonest. You refuse to see or address reality. Oh, and you deflect responsibility by blaming people who call BS on your nonsense. I am rubber you are glue! I know you are but what am I? The only response the typical pseudo-conservative can come up with. I live among them, dealt with them commercially, socially and politically and in family. so "I" must be the liar and ignorant of the subject. Get back in your concrete box and pray your elevator doesn't break Mr. Expert. 4 hours ago, ExFlyer said: They have all the opportinities to live as the rest of Canadians Most of them have and do. But you forget, that was what we promised them - that they don't have to. And know why many of us opposed Meech Lake? It recognized Quebec as a 'distinct society' and ignored the real distinct society completely. Didn't even register in the f*cking politicians minds... Quote
CdnFox Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 6 hours ago, eyeball said: Just like us, with governments of their own. Canadians have had as much time or more to make and settle treaties but chose to be tits about it instead. Bullshit. The first nations tends to want to have their cake and still eat it. They want government support but they don't want any strings attached. They are the ones holding the process up. And frankly they've got everything they need to make a good life for themselves without treaties. There's no excuse 3 hours ago, herbie said: I am rubber you are glue! I know you are but what am I? With that kind of bull crap answer to legitimate question? You're a lefty 1 Quote
ExFlyer Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 13 hours ago, eyeball said: We have multiple governments, just like them. Just like us. Before that we just stole what we wanted. Again, just like us. Maybe you need a more effective way of governing yourself in your region. Revolution and reform often coalesce around indigenous aspirations. Get in line. Huh? Multiple governments?? We have one federal government that provides them with cheques. So you agree, they are Canadians and should get what all other Canadians get...and no more. Glad you finally saw the light and realize they are a self inflicted welfare society. Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
ExFlyer Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 (edited) 13 hours ago, herbie said: I am rubber you are glue! I know you are but what am I? The only response the typical pseudo-conservative can come up with. I live among them, dealt with them commercially, socially and politically and in family. so "I" must be the liar and ignorant of the subject. Get back in your concrete box and pray your elevator doesn't break Mr. Expert. Most of them have and do. But you forget, that was what we promised them - that they don't have to. And know why many of us opposed Meech Lake? It recognized Quebec as a 'distinct society' and ignored the real distinct society completely. Didn't even register in the f*cking politicians minds... I have never "lived" among them but have had the fortune or misfortune of having had to be with them on many occasions. In their communities, reserves or whatever you want to call them to make them sound palatable, they are at best, slums. With a very few exceptions, almost all "bands" are 100% reliant on government handouts. Just one example is the band between Sydney BC and Victoria. Looks nice along the highway which dissects the land but get off the highway and the houses look derelict with busted windows trashy unkempt and run down. The properties look like junkyards and dumps. I can name more but it would take too long. No one is calling you a liar, just suspect of what you deem is correct or non dependant on government handouts. Are you a recipient or do you live of their welfare? What we "promised" them, they get. Their interpretation of the "promises" is what is at issue. I do not believe that our forefathers ever had the intention of subsidizing them for 156 years and on. I agree, give them the land (they already have tens of thousands of sq kms of land) ...and cut them off all moneys. Sort of like, shit and get off the pot. Edited October 14 by ExFlyer 1 Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
herbie Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 Oh FFS you keep screaming about how they're dependent on govt funding while opposing settlements that would allow them to earn revenue from resource extraction on their own territory. Complaining about arrangements to hire their own people to work in them as discrimination against YOU.... The current obligations were laid out a hundred years before you were even born and protected in the Constitution, so f*cking deal with it. Get on with it and help to make it work equitably, which is what reconciliation is all about. Admitting to a botched past and trying to fix things. Quote
ExFlyer Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 (edited) 16 hours ago, herbie said: Oh FFS you keep screaming about how they're dependent on govt funding while opposing settlements that would allow them to earn revenue from resource extraction on their own territory. Complaining about arrangements to hire their own people to work in them as discrimination against YOU.... The current obligations were laid out a hundred years before you were even born and protected in the Constitution, so f*cking deal with it. Get on with it and help to make it work equitably, which is what reconciliation is all about. Admitting to a botched past and trying to fix things. Screaming? Who is screaming except you?? LOL Au Contraire....I am all full for the settlements and that they own the resources on them , which is how it is now. Now, the issue is management of those resources...they are not doing it. LOL Take the land that was given and use it and get off the taxpayer teat. Stand up and be a real citizen, a real society and no tthe financial burden they have become. Yup, the obligations were 156 years ago (maybe even more?). Time for them to shit and get off the dole and do things on their own...if they even can??. I do not have to deal with it, it is what it is and the indigenous have the hate, scorn , discrimination and reputation they have all as result of their own actions (or inactions). Yes, the indigenous certainly have to admit to a botched past and become better, but why bother...they get everything for free and are what they are...a teat sucking welfare society. You cant tell me that the indigenous want to go back to live like they did before we ,the taxpayers , started to take care of and coddle them?? We, todays taxpayer. do not owe the indigenous a thing yet we give them everything they need to live like tax paying citizens...for free. Give them back the land , cut them off and see how long they will revert to old ways...in teepees and hunting and fishing for sustenance or become productive members of 21st century society. Suck it up Herbie...seems to me you are living off the teat suckers and are happy about it LOL Edited October 15 by ExFlyer Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
Zeitgeist Posted October 19 Report Posted October 19 (edited) This article nicely encapsulates the truth that Canadians have been told not to acknowledge. Canada’s free speech laws are weak. The Liberal government has misrepresented the country and damaged Canada’s reputation in likely irreversible ways. Canada is becoming a country of subservient unquestioning people who don’t demand truth and and free speech from their government. https://www.wsj.com/opinion/canadas-unproven-mass-grave-scandal-free-speech-law-history-50e13231?reflink=mobilewebshare_permalink Edited October 19 by Zeitgeist Quote
Zeitgeist Posted October 19 Report Posted October 19 (edited) On 10/14/2024 at 4:05 PM, herbie said: Oh FFS you keep screaming about how they're dependent on govt funding while opposing settlements that would allow them to earn revenue from resource extraction on their own territory. Complaining about arrangements to hire their own people to work in them as discrimination against YOU.... The current obligations were laid out a hundred years before you were even born and protected in the Constitution, so f*cking deal with it. Get on with it and help to make it work equitably, which is what reconciliation is all about. Admitting to a botched past and trying to fix things. Read the article I provided. Demand from Indigenous for Residential Schools outstripped supply. About one third of status Indians attended Residential Schools, which got better academic results than day schools, often due to improved attendance. Many Indigenous children didn’t attend school at all. I think there’s another, truer story about these schools to be told that we simply won’t be allowed to hear in Canada, especially if questioning the narrative is banned in Canada, due to its weak speech rights. Canadians have been hustled with the government’s blessing. Edited October 19 by Zeitgeist 1 Quote
herbie Posted October 19 Report Posted October 19 14 hours ago, Zeitgeist said: Many Indigenous children didn’t attend school at all What utter bullshit. One step beyond denialism, trying to defend residential schools in 2024. Brainwashed by the lies they fed we others while they ran hidden away from the truth. 1 Quote
eyeball Posted October 19 Report Posted October 19 On 10/14/2024 at 2:33 PM, ExFlyer said: Give them back the land , cut them off and see how long they will revert to old ways...in teepees and hunting and fishing for sustenance or become productive members of 21st century society. Do you imagine by back-to-the-land rights and getting off the teat means going back to teepees and dugouts? While they're exercising them Canada could manage them using the technology they had available at the time of first contact. When 1st Nations around here exercise these rights they use hoe-chuckers and gillnetters just like anyone else. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
ExFlyer Posted October 19 Report Posted October 19 8 minutes ago, eyeball said: Do you imagine by back-to-the-land rights and getting off the teat means going back to teepees and dugouts? While they're exercising them Canada could manage them using the technology they had available at the time of first contact. When 1st Nations around here exercise these rights they use hoe-chuckers and gillnetters just like anyone else. Nope, I imagine they can do what they want. Live in a tipi (spelling make you happy LOL) or build and maintain their own house with money they made and paid taxes on. Huh? but they will have to follow the laws too... as they are enforced to other Canadians. No special terms or conditions or dispositions. Off the teat on on their own.... Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
Zeitgeist Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 (edited) 7 hours ago, herbie said: What utter bullshit. One step beyond denialism, trying to defend residential schools in 2024. Brainwashed by the lies they fed we others while they ran hidden away from the truth. You’re the brainwashed purveyor of lies. Wake up. Honest, reputable journalists are giving honest accounts. Yes there were abuses. There were abuses in virtually all schools. Talk to your parents and grandparents. Trying to make the Indigenous out to be more noble than the settlers who are still coming is nothing more than a hustle. Colonialism had positive and negative impacts, but only an utter fool would choose to live without modern advances in health and public education, which have raised living standards and life expectancies very significantly for Indigenous. Indigenous contributed too to this advancement. There was loss and suppression of culture in Canada in the past, and many attempts at preserving ways of life through unhealthy forms of subsidy and welfare, all well-meaning and failed and largely maintained today by Indigenous, because benefits come with Indian status. Land claims are going through the courts, which is fair. What isn’t fair is disparaging and suppressing the achievements and good work of generations of Canadians who built one of the most successful countries in the world. Those successes are being undone by ideological fools who are burning down historic churches and stripping the cultural identities from the institutions that were founded by “settler” cultures. Edited October 20 by Zeitgeist 2 Quote
CdnFox Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 6 hours ago, herbie said: What utter bullshit. One step beyond denialism, trying to defend residential schools in 2024. Brainwashed by the lies they fed we others while they ran hidden away from the truth. He told the truth you know. That would make you the denier not him. Anybody who denies the truth or tries to silence another for saying it is the brainwashed scumbag who needs to be dealt with, not the person who spoke the truth. 1 Quote
herbie Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 (edited) Local urbanites in their concrete boxes that couldn't tell an indigenous person from an ethnic Asian, let alone know any, expressing opinions based on the lies that were fed to them. Apologizing for residential schools all the while denying that's what they're doing. Denying children were forcibly taken from their families to these schools against both their and their parent's will. Denying one of the main objects of 'education' was erasure of their culture. Despicable. I suppose you would be okay to forcibly take 'home schooled' kids away from their parents and board them at public schools today? Of course not. But you can't even say "sorry' as it happened yesterday. Too 'woke' for you to express regret. Edited October 20 by herbie Quote
ExFlyer Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 12 minutes ago, herbie said: Local urbanites in their concrete boxes that couldn't tell an indigenous person from an ethnic Asian, let alone know any, expressing opinions based on the lies that were fed to them. Apologizing for residential schools all the while denying that's what they're doing. Denying children were forcibly taken from their families to these schools against both their and their parent's will. Denying one of the main objects of 'education' was erasure of their culture. Despicable. I suppose you would be okay to forcibly take 'home schooled' kids away from their parents and board them at public schools today? Of course not. But you can't even say "sorry' as it happened yesterday. Too 'woke' for you to express regret. Time to move on Herbie. The trials and tribulations that today indigenous suffer are of their own doing. The past is the past. They have been very much compensated. Canada has said sorry to them more often than to any other group and certainly given them more money and freebies than any other group in Canadian history. Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
herbie Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 1 minute ago, ExFlyer said: The trials and tribulations that today indigenous suffer are of their own doing. As usual, entirely backwards. We did it to them. Quote
ExFlyer Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 3 minutes ago, herbie said: As usual, entirely backwards. We did it to them. Face it Dude....they cannot get off the trough. Welfare society and until they become upstanding productive citizens, they will always be bums. They are what they have made of themselves , fully dependant on handouts. They have had 1, 2 3 hundred years to get over themselves. Quote Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.
CdnFox Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 15 minutes ago, herbie said: Local urbanites in their concrete boxes that couldn't tell an indigenous person from an ethnic Asian, Sure they could. The successful one is the asian Quote Apologizing for residential schools all the while denying that's what they're doing. Apologizing for the legitimate things that were done wrong while dismissing the lies about the things that never happened Quote Denying children were forcibly taken from their families to these schools against both their and their parent's will. Insanely rare if it ever happened at all. For most of the time it wasn't even mandatory to attend those schools, and I've heard a very few cases where it was ever enforced and somebody went in and took someone's child away. Whereas you maintain the lie that every single first nations person had this happen to them Quote Denying one of the main objects of 'education' was erasure of their culture. And it wasn't, there's no shame in denying your lies. If it was intended to erase their culture they wouldn't have let them go back home on the summer breaks or immediately as soon as school was finished. Quote Despicable. Promoting over exaggerations and lies in order to perpetuate a victim culture? Agreed Quote I suppose you would be okay to forcibly take 'home schooled' kids away from their parents and board them at public schools today? Of course not. Most were not okay with it then. Did you forget that mandatory attendance at schools applied to all people and all immigrants, not just first nations? Quote But you can't even say "sorry' as it happened yesterday. Too 'woke' for you to express regret. Like I said. People could be very sorry about the legitimate things that happened that either had a bad end regardless of good intentions or should never have happened in the first place and yet still call out the lies. If we want to get to the real meat in it, The first nations demanded that there would be access to education. And in negotiating with the British for Independence a commitment was made to provide that education. So pretending that the education was some sort of evil underhanded attempt to attack first nations people is stupid. But the government turned over its duty to educate first nations people to the existing christian educational churches because it was cheap and easy. And then they turn their backs on the whole thing and did not even bother to ensure that it was being done properly and that no harm was coming to the first nations cultures or peoples and that no abuses were taking place. For that we should be sorry. Not for sending them to school, that's something they wanted. Not for assimilation or integration, those are things that happen to this very day and for a good reason. But because they took a duty of care and basically dropped it on someone else who fumbled it without taking the time and energy to be responsible, that was wrong. As far as saying sorry goes, if you mean sorry in the sense of I'm really sorry that this happened to Your ancestors and it shouldn't have, then fine. If you mean sorry in the sense of I personally, who was neither alive nor whose family lived in Canada when these decisions were made, feel regret for some bloody reason and Personally owe you something" Then no. Eff that. Your problems are your own problems today, fix them and build a life for yourself and stop whining 1 Quote
Zeitgeist Posted October 20 Report Posted October 20 2 hours ago, herbie said: Local urbanites in their concrete boxes that couldn't tell an indigenous person from an ethnic Asian, let alone know any, expressing opinions based on the lies that were fed to them. Apologizing for residential schools all the while denying that's what they're doing. Denying children were forcibly taken from their families to these schools against both their and their parent's will. Denying one of the main objects of 'education' was erasure of their culture. Despicable. I suppose you would be okay to forcibly take 'home schooled' kids away from their parents and board them at public schools today? Of course not. But you can't even say "sorry' as it happened yesterday. Too 'woke' for you to express regret. Ha ha, it’s exactly your radical Marxist identity politics mentality that led the charge to create residential schools, because you think you know how the world works and that you should tell everyone how to live. Start by understanding your culture and context. Know thyself as the Oracle at Delphi said, before you pretend to know what the truth is. You’re dangerous because you’re both zealous and ignorant. I can tell that you don’t know much about Canadian history. If you did, you wouldn’t be so impressionable and sold on the ideological anti-settler nonsense of the past few years. You remind me of the Maoist cultural revolutionaries and the twits chanting “From the river to the sea” at universities. Know the past before you comment on what must be done. 1 Quote
herbie Posted October 21 Report Posted October 21 19 hours ago, Zeitgeist said: it’s exactly your radical Marxist identity politics mentality Oh FFS show us how politically ignorant your really are. Parrot rightwing dog whistles and buzzwords in ad hominem attacks as you can't even defend your own position. WTF does reconciliation have to do with Marxism or even any political philosophy? What? What is it really? That you're a selfish jerk jealous of anything someone else gets that you don't? That you're an outright bigot that hates natives? OR a wishful dreamer like Flyer who thinks that if you have a group with nothing and give them nothing they'll miraculously 'pull themselves up by their bootstraps' and become middle class? As if they should've saved up off welfare cheques and invested in Tesla and BitCoin? 2 Quote
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