Conventions and speeches over, it's time for America to decide: can this be the new normal? Should it?

[myata]

Policies, jobs, border security and many others are all important issues for the election. But this question cannot be shrugged off and ignored either: can it be the new normal, and standard of American politics from now and on? Should it be? Where will it lead, and end?

There's nothing normal about one of the candidates. This fact cannot be ignored and forgotten. Can a pathological, sick liar be the leader of a functional and functioning democracy? Can we just forget everything and pretend that nothing happened?

There's no ignoring this question because if we do, it will stay here and will come back with more, and more. If it isn't condemned and dismissed now by the society, it will be the new normal. And then, we would absolutely see more of it, and worse.

Among many issues, the sane America has a choice to make. It will not go away. And it has nothing to do with partisan, ideological or any other lines. It's very simple and entirely present: what is normal, in politics?

[Rebound]

No. It will not be the new normal.

Either we elect Harris and the GOP tries somebody sane next time, or…

We elect Trump, and our Constitutional system is permanently destroyed. Not hyperbole. Even though the Constitution clearly states that the President can be tried for crimes, the Supreme Court ruled that he cannot be.  That is dictatorship, plain and simple. It destroyed Rome and it will destroy America.  

[Nationalist]

1 minute ago, Rebound said:

No. It will not be the new normal.

Either we elect Harris and the GOP tries somebody sane next time, or…

We elect Trump, and our Constitutional system is permanently destroyed. Not hyperbole. Even though the Constitution clearly states that the President can be tried for crimes, the Supreme Court ruled that he cannot be.  That is dictatorship, plain and simple. It destroyed Rome and it will destroy America.  

Lol..."AHHH...TRUMP WILL DESTROY DEMOCRACYYY!!!"

They howl as they ignore their own wide open border, release criminals into society, corrupt the justice system, impose inflation on the people and censor public forums.

Such traitors.

[myata]

There would be consequences for sure, but I wouldn't go into future-guessing, let's keep it simple: can it be the new normal? From now on, and for as long as the democracy lasts?

And then, someone some time will push it a bit further? To where? Where would this path end?

Democracy is not a wishing well. If the reason and responsibility go away; not needed anymore no miracle in the world could keep it going and functioning. Sure the founding fathers knew it just that simple.

Edited August 24 by myata

[Michael Hardner]

20 minutes ago, myata said:

 

Democracy is not a wishing well. If the reason and responsibility go away; not needed anymore no miracle in the world could keep it going and functioning. Sure the founding fathers knew it just that simple.

You, perhaps above all posters, hit the nail on the head consistently here. 

The hatred of Trump is blinding a lot of people to the fact that the Democrats have switched over to his style of electioneering, albeit with modifications. 

The public is gone, replaced by a mass of consumers following influencers. This means that substantive responses to problems will be replaced by popular ones. There will never be a leader who can tell people what they don't want to hear. 

And now that the Democrats have joined this new style of politicking, it's just a matter of time before A crisis arrives that will only be handled by denial.

I would say the best hope is that politically centrist intellectual leaders with common touch rise up to set the agenda for political leaders. 

 

I'm thinking like ... Jordan Peterson except with a brain and heart.

[gatomontes99]

Lmao...these libs don't get it. Trump is the response candidate. There would be no Tro without decades of abuse and insanity from the left. We picked Trump to fight back. The days of white papers and intellectual responses are gone because the only response we get from the left is a visceral emotional hate filled attack. Why should we respond thoughtfullness? You guys don't think, you react. So, yes, you will continue to get Trump like candidates until you stop acting like children.

[Michael Hardner]

18 minutes ago, gatomontes99 said:

  The days of white papers and intellectual responses are gone .

...

That's right.

 

Now you're being called "weird", and it's sticking.

How do you like the Culture War?

 

I don't.

[gatomontes99]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

That's right.

 

Now you're being called "weird", and it's sticking.

How do you like the Culture War?

 

I don't.

Lol, it's so not sticking. DO you actually believe that? Because the rest don't. They stopped using that word when it got turned around on them. From Walz taking the stage like Richard Simmons to purple haired trans nut jobs to Kamala's cackle, the weird stuck to you and so your side dropped it.

Oh look, YouGov did a poll:

Edited August 24 by gatomontes99

[Michael Hardner]

7 minutes ago, gatomontes99 said:

Lol, it's so not sticking. DO you actually believe that? 

I don't know anything for sure, because I don't live there.

 

So I can only assume it's working based on the persistence of use, and the polling.

And I am very disappointed.

[myata]

It was heading that way for a while and now looks like the time of the choice have arrived. It may not be the final one; but surely it's going to be the one that matters and will contribute to the outcome.

Democracy is not a popular show, Romans have learned that and there's nothing new there to revisit. Democracy requires of the citizens reason; the ability of critical thought; responsibility; and always too. Circus democracy will not last because it lacks the foundation: the reason, the responsibility, and the principles.

This is a crossroads and as any challenge of Time it cannot be ignored or shrugged away. There's no point in pretending that it isn't there and nothing much is happening. It won't work because the choice will be made in any case. Either it's condemned and rejected; or it is the new normal. We choose.

And if there's a part of the society that have come to think (or repeat, thoughtlessly) that democracy is overrated; that they would be fine with electing not a democratic leader bound by laws and principles, but a king. First, yes anyone has the right to think what they like and even choose it. But there's a mandatory add-on that has to come with it, no can't be refused: the consequences. See, there's nothing for the king in being elected. He/they may be fine just as they are and "you won't have to vote again". Just think of it (and if that's too much trouble, look). So no that option doesn't exist: you will end up with an emperor and no one will be asking. We get what we invest in, not the dream images and that's exactly as always, no surprises. None of this is dark prophesies, exaggeration, scaring etc all only clear and logical cause to consequence chain. None of this is complicated, so no such escape either. Sure, we knew.

[myata]

"I win or its "rigged"!". Because I say so.This could be the new standard of American politics going forward. Right, as in some third world Bababwe or Mubuzuela. Where's the difference?

The choice is ours.

He didn't take back any of his lies. He never apologized. So he will do it again, and we know it.

Utter rejection or the new normal. No avoiding this choice. Just another election - not really.

[myata]

This is a fat, thick red line here and ignoring it will do nothing to remove it. "It's me or it's rigged": normal politicians in a democracy just don't say that. And then they don't do what one of the candidates have done. Maduros say things like that, and do them. No way it could be normal, in a first world democracy.

Ultra etc. right in Europe, they don't say that: they recognize and understand democracy and he just doesn't. He has no respect for democracy if it wouldn't give him what he craves. There's no way around it, to ignore or misunderstand it.

Just because one party completely failed its responsibility to the people doesn't make it any more normal or legitimate. It's not a normal political candidate, in a democracy. There's nothing normal about that.

And now, it's a done deal, the record. The only question that remains: could this be the new normal?

[Michael Hardner]

We need more Democratization not less.  We need the public to understand things, not just choose based on their tastes.

Advertising has created a culture of narcissists where every dumb choice is sacrosanct.

[myata]

Yes many conversations need to happen if we want to avoid facing this kind of choice over and again. Democracy will not persist without objectivity, reason, responsibility and strong standard of integrity. It is a machine used by grown up citizens to manage their common matters - nothing like a wishing well.

[reason10]

On 8/24/2024 at 9:11 AM, Rebound said:

No. It will not be the new normal.

Either we elect Harris and the GOP tries somebody sane next time, or…

We elect Trump, and our Constitutional system is permanently destroyed. Not hyperbole. Even though the Constitution clearly states that the President can be tried for crimes, the Supreme Court ruled that he cannot be.  That is dictatorship, plain and simple. It destroyed Rome and it will destroy America.  

Unelected Joe wasn't elected by a Democratic process. He got that office due to VOTER FRAUD, the same as if he shot his way into office.

 

LEGALLY ELECTED PRESIDENT TRUMP GAVE THIS COUNTRY THE GREATEST ECONOMY OF ALL TIME AND GAVE THE WORLD peace in the Middle East.

Voter fraud ERASED ALL THAT.

If we do not elect Trump this November, we will not have a country.

[myata]

There you go: "I win or it's "illegal"". Maduros of the world subscribe, happily. And this is why one has to chose now: because democracy cannot tread down this path for much longer. It used to be a topic for the pundits, now moved to our immediate reality.

Edited August 25 by myata

[WestCanMan]

On 8/24/2024 at 5:58 AM, myata said:

Policies, jobs, border security and many others are all important issues for the election.

Great observation. So how well has the US fared under Biden and Kamala? Answer that question like a grown-up.

And remember, she cast the deciding vote to usher in his Build Back Brokeness plan, she was 100% down with his war on domestic energy, she was the "border czar" when the border was turned into Swiss cheese, she was down with all the sanctuary city BS, she was with all the Dem mayor and governors who suddenly started hating illegal immigration when the illegal immigrants weren't just in Texas anymore, and now she's promising to fix everything. BUT SHE BUSTED EVERYTHING. 

She wrecked the border, co-signed ruining the economy, and stood shoulder to shoulder with Joe as he instigated war in Ukraine. And don't get snotty, you know for a fact that NATO in Ukraine is the only reason that war happened. Your only choice in the matter is deciding if you think pushing NATO in Ukraine was worth a major war. 

Quote

But this question cannot be shrugged off and ignored either: can it be the new normal, and standard of American politics from now and on? Should it be? Where will it lead, and end?

So what is the problem with the new normal?

The problem is that the MSM lies 24/7, and cultists like you still believe them every time.

1. Was M Brown really a gentle giant who was worth causing rioting over, and worth the destruction of cities, or was he just a violent criminal who wrestled with a cop and got shot? Correct answer: the M Brown story was just a DEM/CNN NARRATIVE that caused widespread violence and destruction.
2. Was G Floyd really a gentle giant who was just thrown to the ground by a racist cop for no reason and then murdered while he pleaded for his life, or was he just a big dummy who took too much Fentanyl and wrestled with the cops too much and got himself laid down on the ground while cops had good reason not to believe him when said he couldn't breathe? Correct answer: the Floyd story was a DEM/CNN NARRATIVE that caused widespread violence and destruction..
3. Was Rayshard a really swell guy who got shot for no reason? He was so wasted that he passed out drunk at 10:30 pm, the cops were nice as pie for their whole 10-minute encounter, then when he blew .110 he instantly started assaulting cops. He wrestled, punched one in the face, stole a taser, and shot it at a cop's head from 10 feet away. In Georgia a 'taser' is a 'firearm'. 
4. Was Russian collusion real? 
5. Why do no leftists know that the FBI committed crimes unless I prove it to them in painstaking detail? Why didn't the MSM tell you that?
6. Was writing off an NDA illegal? No. Was it illegal when Hillary destroyed subpoenaed evidence, including Blackberries and a server? 100% - those were felony charges that you and I would have served time for, and Gen Flynn served time for less. 

The MSM lies to you all the time, and you're pretending that "TWUMPY IZ A HEWGE PWOBWEM BECUZ HE WIW END DOMOCWISY", but FYI that's just a narrative from the same people who said all the crap above....

The MSM which you adore also pretended Biden was mentally healthy, the Afghan withdrawal was a success, there was no inflation, the economy is just swell, the borders are fine, the laptop was Russian disinformation, saying BSL4 should get you kicked off of social media, vaxes need to be mandatory, it was racist to move illegal immigrants out of Texas and into sanctuary cities, etc, etc, etc. 

Put on some big boy pants myata. Have an honest discussion about the MSM. The MSM is the key to a healthy democracy. Pretending the MSM is just fine is the exact same thing as saying that you want 1-party rule. 

 

 

Honestly, just pretend that there was no GOP anymore, the Dems were the only political party that you were allowed to vote for, and the media was still that dishonest... What would you do? Who could you turn to at that point? 

[User]

On 8/24/2024 at 9:16 AM, Michael Hardner said:

That's right.

 

Now you're being called "weird", and it's sticking.

How do you like the Culture War?

 

I don't.

This is not the culture war. Its just an example for how far our media is in the tank for the left right now as they repeat this nonsense. 

 

2 hours ago, myata said:

Maduros of the world subscribe, happily.

It is the Biden / Harris administration that went about on a mission to appease him... how did that work out?

That is what you support. 

[User]

On 8/24/2024 at 8:51 AM, Michael Hardner said:

I'm thinking like ... Jordan Peterson except with a brain and heart.

Tell me you don't listen to Jordan Peterson with any regularity at all without telling me. 

[Michael Hardner]

15 minutes ago, User said:

Tell me you don't listen to Jordan Peterson with any regularity at all without telling me. 

Last thing I listened to was his thunderously stupid diatribe on Climate Change.

From a guy who rants about accountability and such, he speaks at length on a topic he knows zero about.

He's a charlatan.  And if he wasn't active in  the culture war he'd be insignificant.  As it is, fellow tribesmen love his hectoring tone so they support him.

[Five of swords]

On 8/24/2024 at 8:58 AM, myata said:

Policies, jobs, border security and many others are all important issues for the election. But this question cannot be shrugged off and ignored either: can it be the new normal, and standard of American politics from now and on? Should it be? Where will it lead, and end?

There's nothing normal about one of the candidates. This fact cannot be ignored and forgotten. Can a pathological, sick liar be the leader of a functional and functioning democracy? Can we just forget everything and pretend that nothing happened?

There's no ignoring this question because if we do, it will stay here and will come back with more, and more. If it isn't condemned and dismissed now by the society, it will be the new normal. And then, we would absolutely see more of it, and worse.

Among many issues, the sane America has a choice to make. It will not go away. And it has nothing to do with partisan, ideological or any other lines. It's very simple and entirely present: what is normal, in politics?

So you are aware that liars have always been normal in politics?

[Michael Hardner]

Also... why do I have to listen to someone who I have already heard enough from to know what he's about?

Do you listen to every Nancy Pelosi speech, just in case she started coming up with some good ideas?

Edited August 25 by Michael Hardner

[Nationalist]

5 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

We need more Democratization not less.  We need the public to understand things, not just choose based on their tastes.

Advertising has created a culture of narcissists where every dumb choice is sacrosanct.

No. Poor parenting caused this culture. It's been building since they claimed "greed is good".

[User]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Last thing I listened to was his thunderously stupid diatribe on Climate Change.

From a guy who rants about accountability and such, he speaks at length on a topic he knows zero about.

He's a charlatan.  And if he wasn't active in  the culture war he'd be insignificant.  As it is, fellow tribesmen love his hectoring tone so they support him.

He has had some very intelligent people who are in that field of study on his podcast where they have spoken in depth on the science. 

But, yeah, sure... he knows zero about it. 

It appears your issue is not the culture war, it is just that people fight back. 

[Nationalist]

12 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Last thing I listened to was his thunderously stupid diatribe on Climate Change.

From a guy who rants about accountability and such, he speaks at length on a topic he knows zero about.

He's a charlatan.  And if he wasn't active in  the culture war he'd be insignificant.  As it is, fellow tribesmen love his hectoring tone so they support him.

Climate change is a political tool Mike...and you know it. All the sunk funds on the "crisis" that wasn't.

Better a "charlatan" who produces positive results, than an empty vessel for others to use to produce sh1t.

Edited August 25 by Nationalist