The Wuhan lab leak conspiracy theory now a likely reality

[blackbird]

"Unrestricted Warfare is the People’s Liberation Army manual for asymmetric warfare and the waging of war, strategically and tactically, using weapons not limited to bullets, bombs, missiles, and artillery shells. The two PLA officers who advocated the strategy set forth in the following pages argue that modern warfare, in ways not too dissimilar from Sun Tzu’s Art of War, is about impeding the enemy’s ability to wage war and to defend itself against a barrage of attacks against its economy, its civil institutions, its governmental structures, and its actual belief system. This is not a manual for achieving an overnight victory. Rather, it is a recipe for a slow but inexorable assault on an enemy’s institutions, often without the enemy’s knowledge that it is even being attacked. As Sun Tzu once wrote, “If one party is at war with another, and the other party does not realize it is at war, the party who knows it is at war almost always has the advantage and usually wins.” And this is the strategy set forth in Unrestricted Warfare: waging a war on an adversary with methods so covert at first and seemingly so benign that the party being attacked does not realize it’s being attacked.

Qiao, Liang . Unrestricted Warfare: China's Master Plan to Destroy America . Shadow Lawn Press. Kindle Edition. "

Available on Amazon

[myata]

The buzz people who can't tell the difference between vibrations in their brain and the reality and just babble it out like that would make them real won't be of any help in establishing the truth.

Of the three pieces of the puzzle:

1) the research was technically possible;

2) it was formulated and considered;

3) it was actually happening

two are confirmed so it's down to the last one. And if it was, sure a huge effort would have gone into eliminating all records given the scale of the consequences. Still, some traces could remain.

If the last piece is determined as plausible, the coincidence of place and time; and the absence of evidence for the alternative would make it by far more grounded hypothesis.

Edited June 7 by myata

[WestCanMan]

11 hours ago, eyeball said:

So how exactly did Fauci do his job?

He didn't. 

He funded GoF research on the covid virus, then pretended that the only likely source was the wetmarket.

Get to P1 ffs. You've had 3 years now. 

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The first thing a real investigator would do is establish the perpetrator was actually at the scene of the crime in China.

Who said he's a real investigator? Why was he investigating what appears to be his own crime?

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If you're implying he dispatched an operative(s) then who is he/she/they?

If you recall correctly, the Chinese gov't said "You can look for evidence over there, and nowhere else", so that's where they looked. 

The coronavirus is everywhere on the planet. It's in your cousin's bathroom right now. If investigators could only look there, they'd say "We found out where covid is!"

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The only other perpetrators identified so far in the plan to kill millions for billions are Fauci the murderer himself and the 5 or 6 psyop guys goddess presumably has evidence of that made it all possible by psyching out the planet.

I never said 'for sure it was a plan'. It's still possible that they were just doing research and it got out. 

But it looks more and more like it was a plan. The sheer amount of lying and cover-ups is insane. 

[blackbird]

We are also witnessing attacks on government websites by foreign powers.  This is the new frontier the west is facing.  They are actually being attacked on many fronts: political, information technology, AI, communications technology, biological, and media.  At the same time the attackers want to keep from being clearly identified and therefore they would use the education institutions, social media, and  mainstream media as tools to influence.  It is all part of the new world order and the desire to re-arrange the pieces to create a new superpower.  The 21st century will be different from the 20th century.

Bible-believers can understand this easier than the rest of the world because we are warned in the Bible and are aware anything is possible.

"11  Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12  For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."  Ephesians 6: 11, 12 KJV

 

Edited June 7 by blackbird

[blackbird]

"

Wars and Rumors of Wars

Jesus himself foretold the prevalence of wars and rumors of wars as signs of the end times. In Matthew 24:6-7 (KJV), He warns that nations will rise against each other, indicating a rise in conflicts and tensions.

This prophecy highlights the turbulent nature of the last days, where violence and strife will become more widespread. The world will witness the unsettling reality of nations engaging in warfare and the unsettling rumors of potential conflicts on the horizon.

“And ye shall hear of wars and rumors of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.”

“For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.”

Jesus’s words serve as a cautionary reminder to stay steadfast and not be overwhelmed by fear or anxiety when witnessing these signs of the end times. Instead, it is a call to deepen our faith and seek solace in Him, trusting that His plan will ultimately prevail."
 

9 Things The Bible Says About Last Days Peace – What to Know (scripturalthinking.com)

[CdnFox]

5 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

You have shown shit all. Only thing shown is reinforce your conspiracy club presidency LOL

 

I've shown a tonne.  A canadian expert. A us team of experts.  And the fbi. 

Sorry - they're all fully qualified to say and they say "wuhon lab is most likely source '. 

But i love that you think you're smarter than all of those people   ROFLMAO!!! Kid you're not' smarter than the paperboy who delivered the news never mind those people  

The vastly most likely source was the lab, there's a tonne of evidence pointing to that, all of the experts agree,  you should learn to follow the science   

[impartialobserver]

On 6/4/2024 at 11:24 AM, West said:

https://nationalpost.com/news/canadian-scientist-explains-covid-lab-escape-theory

Canadian scientist explains how it likely escaped a lab

This type of stuff would've gotten you threatened and deplatformed from social media a few years ago

It may have on this forum but I read thousands of comments on facebook, youtube, liberalforum.org, and liberalforum.net that stated similar opinions. 

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

His standard is "It could be this or this, but it will officially be considered the least likely of the two unless the most likely option is proven conclusively."

As long as it supports his echo chamber beliefs. Absolutely.

 

Quote

 

The two contending theories are:

1. a "covid" virus is known to have existed in a lab, because it's on record that they created it and what kinds of tests they did with it, and it escaped. Three of the earliest recorded infections are also known to have occurred there. That virus caused the pandemic. The guy who funded the research said that the virus didn't come from there, but common sense says it came from there. 
2. a second, identical covid virus may have been organically created in nature by a very complicated set of coincidences, and by another strange coincidence, 3 people from the Wuhan lab were among the very first people infected. AND... the guy who funded the research in the lab said that the virus didn't come from the lab.

 

The first story makes sense: The covid virus that was already in existence got out and infected people in the lab, it spread from there.

The second story relies on a lot of unlikely coincidences:

1. natural mutations produced an identical virus to the one in the lab, with the exact same furin cleavage site no less
2. it occurred in that one wetmarket out of 400 wetmarkets that sell exotic species,
3. all of the intermediary species that were required to connect the dots between bat and human were at that one wetmarket
4. and the first recorded infections just randomly happened to be some people who worked in the lab.

 

Yes, but it doesn't even stop there. The covid virus has some of the biological markers and 'shape' that are precisely what the lab was intending to add to their starter virus to see the effect. It might as well be a signature.  It could theoretically appear in nature but again - it's a one in a million chance for that and  a 1 in 1 chance if it escaped from the lab. 

1.  

[myata]

Maybe this needs to be recorded here, all in the public domain and since a long time. As it would be very unlikely that officially recorded work with an identical to Covid agent was conducted anywhere on this planet before the pandemic, one has to make their decision based on the balance of likelihoods. All cited facts are from referenced reputable sources.

FCS = Furin Cleavage Site, a specific genetic sequence in particular in human epithelial cells.

WIV = Wuhan Institute of Virology

The timeline

- First work on enhancing coronavirus with FCS began in 2006 (SARS1 + FCS). By early 2010s the technology was well known.

- 2013: WIV (group of Dr. Shi) discovered corona-like RaTG13 virus in bats. It shares over 96% of genome with SARS-Cov. It isolates and published part of the genome. (sd)

- 2016-2019: WIV conducts research on corona-like viruses, including gain of function including with FCS:

"In 2019, researchers in China inserted a four amino acid furin cleavage site into Infectious Bronchitis coronavirus that affects poultry. WIV also received funding from PRC government agencies for research examining the spillover potential of SARS-related coronaviruses".

"The WIV was later terminated as a sub-grantee by the National Institutes of Health (NIH) for failing to produce its laboratory notes and other records relating to these other experiments" (sc)

"As part of a thorough inquiry, they (WHO investigators) must have a full accounting of why the WIV altered and then removed online records of its work with RaTG13 and other viruses". (sd)

- "By the time the pandemic broke out, her team had created a total of a dozen or so chimeric viruses by swapping WIV1’s spike with its counterpart from newly identified sequences of bat coronaviruses, only a handful of which could infect human cells in a petri dish"

"None of the chimeras created in Shi’s labs was closely related to SARS-CoV-2, and therefore, none could have been the cause of the pandemic" (mit).

sc: Senate Report on origins of Covid, 2022

sd: State Department report on WIV

mit: MIT Technology review, Dr Shi, 2022

The last statement in (mit) seem to contradict the possibility of this work to SARS-Cov but it's not an objective independent assessment rather a statement of WIV.

In summary:

- work with agents like RaTG13 with proximity to Covid: yes, long time

- gain of function research including with human-like FCS: yes, considerable time

- construction of artificial "chimerical" agents: yes

- additionally, while the full difference between RaTG13 and Covid is significant (over a thousand of nucleotide bases), those in the key areas of the spike protein and FCS count only several dozen. This is entirely feasible in a lab.

- China destroyed or attempted to the records related to work with RaTG13.

Short of a physical smoking gun that is, an official report and/or sequence of the artificial strain (five years on?) how easy would it be to find more specific evidence pointing to the lab origin?

[eyeball]

12 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Okay, point out where anybody suggested that he personally released the virus.

Goddess when she suggested it was just Fauci and a handful of psyop experts plus she called him a murderer. Marjorie Taylor Greene says he should be charged with mass murder following Fauci's grilling by Congress.

I guess Goddess is still just wasting all her evidence and efforts on us. I suggested she give it to someone important enough to see it gets into the appropriate hands that could actually put it to better use, like MTG for example 

Oh well it is what it is.

[eyeball]

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

He didn't. 

He funded GoF research on the covid virus

So you say there were more than just 5 or 6 guys involved?

And how many do you think it was?

You people seem like you're all over the map with how many people were involved with the murder of millions for billions. Apparently it's anywhere from a small handful to thousands, perhaps 10's of thousands when you go global with it.

Maybe you guys should PM each other and get your stories straight.

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

Goddess when she suggested it was just Fauci and a handful of psyop experts plus she called him a murderer.

Can't see anything where she said he personally released the virus.  And someone's actions can be murder even if they don't actually kill the people involved personally.  If i hand you the gun and then you kill someone and i cover up my role in it then by US law i'm considered a murderer as well as an example. 

Quote

Marjorie Taylor Greene says he should be charged with mass murder following Fauci's grilling by Congress.

And she may or may not be right, but I don't think she suggesting that he personally went around and personally infected each one of those people. It's probably more likely that she is suggesting that his actions led to their deaths. I assume you're not suggesting that the FBI should investigate where he was on the night of each one of those deaths

 

Quote

I guess Goddess is still just wasting all her evidence and efforts on us. I suggested she give it to someone important enough to see it gets into the appropriate hands that could actually put it to better use, like MTG for example 

You mean like perhaps a senate hearing committee? Hmmm.

You know, whenever you are wrong and you realize it you've got this weird "tell" Of digging yourself deeper and deeper and becoming more and more silly.

The evidence that we have at this time is that that lab was the source of the leak. They're also appears to be ample evidence that fauci played a role in that lab being funded and then hid information that may have been important after the fact. There is no doubt that he gave false advice during the covid crisis for whatever reason.

His guilt or culpability will have to be worked out over time by the official authorities and of course public opinion. But pretending that somehow none of this happened or that the FBI screwed up by not seeing if he was at Wuhan at that time his childish.

 

3 minutes ago, eyeball said:

So you say there were more than just 5 or 6 guys involved?

And how many do you think it was?

You people seem like you're all over the map with how many people were involved with the murder of millions for billions. Apparently it's anywhere from a small handful to thousands, perhaps 10's of thousands when you go global with it.

Maybe you guys should PM each other and get your stories straight.

Nobody's all over the map about anything. The only thing that's all over the map is your dribble as you foam at the mouth desperate to look for any sort of plausible argument that will make the facts not be the facts.

Like I said, whenever you know you're wrong your arguments get sillier and sillier as people beat you over the head with the facts.

[ExFlyer]

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

I've shown a tonne.  A canadian expert. A us team of experts.  And the fbi. 

Sorry - they're all fully qualified to say and they say "wuhon lab is most likely source '. 

But i love that you think you're smarter than all of those people   ROFLMAO!!! Kid you're not' smarter than the paperboy who delivered the news never mind those people  The vastly most likely source was the lab, there's a tonne of evidence pointing to that, all of the experts agree,  you should learn to follow the science  

Bullshit. Again, you have shown nothing,

A theory, a hypothesis....like you regularly produce. Worth nothing without proof....real proof, not your conspiracy proof LOL

I ain't smarter, i just accept real proof, not BS from a blowhard like you LOL

As for being smarter, I truly hope you don't think you are smarter than the average kindergartner? They make shit up all the time too LOL

[myata]

40 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Worth nothing without proof....real proof, not your conspiracy proof LOL

If this isn't about "LOL" but a serious question (even given the cost), then these would be the logical possibilities:

a. Confident evidence emerges for the natural origin hypothesis. None has been presented so far that would match the characteristic of the case.

b. Confident evidence is presented for the lab origin. For example, a whistleblower who could testify that work on a Covid precursor with gain of function was indeed conducted in the Wuhan lab. Maybe some samples, would be invaluable to understand how this was developing.

Short of these two the chance of which is diminishing with each day that passes, the next one is:

c. Strong circumstantial evidence, either way. There's nothing wrong with it. Not all events have written records by intent or fact and many were solved still.

In this case, there's quite a body of circumstantial evidence pointing to WIV (as cited); while there isn't any such evidence for the natural origin by the combination of most of the characteristics in one species. Wouldn't it be strange, think of it? if the agent emerged naturally in the place where there were no vaccines, remedies or quarantines, where is it? Why couldn't we find it? And if it doesn't survive or cannot survive in the nature how did it come to exist?

And then, there's circumstantial observation of the correlation: should it be the natural origin, then it happening at the same time and in the same geographical place with the cited events has to be a random coincidence. So the hypothesis for which there isn't a strong evidence will need a rare coincidence, plain luck only to stay afloat.

On the balance of the weights of the indirect evidence that tips the scale toward artificial origin. Will we ever know for certain? Anybody's guess.

Edited June 7 by myata

[Legato]

On 6/6/2024 at 1:11 PM, ExFlyer said:

 third point is that the lab in Wuhan was not capable of containing an airborne virus as infectious as the one that started the pandemic."

 

Correct. That's why it escaped.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

Bullshit. Again, you have shown nothing,

 

Liar.

In fact it is you who has produced nothing, I have given you all the data that is necessary to reach a reasonable conclusion

But like a typical ignorant lefty you stick your fingers in your ears and repetitively repeat a lie with your eyes closed hoping that somehow the truth will go away.

It won't. The evidence overwhelmingly points to the Wuhan lab as being the source of the pandemic. Medical experts agree. Law enforcement agencies agree. The governments have accepted it. You sticking your head in the sand and crying about it won't change the facts

Edited June 7 by CdnFox

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, Legato said:

Correct. That's why it escaped.

Personally I don't think it was an accident.  My belief is based on the book I mentioned in postings above,  Unrestricted Warfare... etc.

[ExFlyer]

48 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Liar.

 

The one and only liar on these forums is you.

Face it, you are a loser of monumental proportions.

Facts and quotes are provided to you and you twist them to suit your lying narrative.

You are a complete liar and loser, all in one package

[ExFlyer]

2 hours ago, myata said:

If this isn't about "LOL" but a serious question (even given the cost), .....

 

On the balance of the weights of the indirect evidence that tips the scale toward artificial origin. Will we ever know for certain? Anybody's guess.

Look, the topic is an editorial (or guest essay as the paper calls it) by someone that theorizes and has a "hypothesis".

It is all conjecture with no evidence for accuracy.

As soon as anything COVIS +D is brought up, a half dozen covid conspiracy theorists (like you) show up and try to make what she wrote about some sort of factual scientific document. It was and is not. It is hypothesis.

It is a serious question but there are no facts. Making something or a lot out of someones theory is foolish and demeans your credibility.

So , your last sentence, "Will we ever know for certain? Anybody's guess." is very accurate... At this time, it is a guess.

 

 

 

 

[WestCanMan]

5 hours ago, eyeball said:

So you say there were more than just 5 or 6 guys involved?

And how many do you think it was?

You people seem like you're all over the map with how many people were involved with the murder of millions for billions. Apparently it's anywhere from a small handful to thousands, perhaps 10's of thousands when you go global with it

.The murder of billions? Even if you consider 1.1 billion to be in the billions, with an 's', it wasn't even a moon-cast shadow of that number ffs. Grab a clue, buddy.

FYI it wasn't even millions that really died "of" covid. People who were close to death died 'a bit sooner with covid'. 

Young healthy people didn't die of covid either, but they did die from the pseudovaxes.

Quote

Maybe you guys should PM each other and get your stories straight.

Leftard cultists have the benefit of all getting the exact same messages from every single member of TNI, and they are never exposed to any inconvenient truths, so you guys are always in lock step.

Conservatives don't have a central messaging system, and the truths that are out there are obscured by social media members who are part of TNI: FB, Google, etc..., so it's a collective effort to gather reliable facts and stats.  

Sometimes I might have different info or opinions from Cdn, goddess, nationalist, etc, but I don't really care, because we're all at least trying to get some real information and pass it along. 

My patience for people who are still just regurgitating CNN/CTV/CBC drivel has run out. 

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

The one and only liar on these forums is you.

Oh look, once again his only response is to copy what others have said to him. Yawn.  I guess drinking all that cough syrup really DOES Dull the mind  Anyway perhaps we can have your status updated to  "easily confused parrot". 

 

Considering that the rest of your post is just your usual complete mental breakdown I take it you can't come up with any evidence that refutes the stated position of all of those experts?

Hardly a surprise. Follow the science, lefty. The lab was by far and away the most likely source of the outbreak. I know it hurts your feelings to be looking like an !diot again but honestly if you would just do your research beforehand we wouldn't have to go through this.

Edited June 7 by CdnFox

[ExFlyer]

5 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Oh look, once again his only response i......

 

Considering that the rest of your post is just .......

Hardly a surprise.....

Boo Hoo, whining and crying because you lost again...hey whadaya expect from King loser? Ya got nuthin but whine. LOL

Gibberish from the loser....again

[WestCanMan]

6 hours ago, eyeball said:

Marjorie Taylor Greene says he should be charged with mass murder following Fauci's grilling by Congress.

Marjorie Taylor Greene was correct.

If Fauci gets the death penalty, I'll do it for free. 

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

Boo Hoo, whining and crying because you lost again...hey whadaya expect from King loser? Ya got nuthin but whine.

Holy shit kid    looks like i broke your brain good this time LOLOL!!!!!  Well i guess the usual melt down was to be expected, and i'm sure you'll hissy fit for a bit as you always do when you realize you once again look dumb.  I'll go put some popcorn on  🍿🍿🍿

Edited June 8 by CdnFox

[myata]

13 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

It is all conjecture with no evidence for accuracy.

No: there's some to solid circumstantial evidence favoring one hypothesis without much for the alternative one. This is the objective state of the matter as we speak.

To produce an analog of Covid virus artificially, these main pieces would be needed:

know-how; technology and the constituents; and formulated objective. All three were present exactly at the point and time where it originated. Covid-like original agent, specific manipulation that makes it highly transmissible in humans, production of hybrid agents: all confirmed. It would take a rarest of the chance to turn out to be only a random coincidence.

So: beyond reasonable doubt? Maybe not. Balance of likelihoods: I don't see how and why not.

And for a reflection, if its more than LOL and you would like to find out and understand more: one of the studies indicated that the increased mortality of Covid can be caused by a mysterious coincidence of a certain sequence in the Covid spike protein and that in the human epithelial cell. It can make human antibodies attack healthy cells not just those with the virus (i.e., cause autoimmune response), causing excessive damage to organs, including lungs. If we ever get the final answer shouldn't that count too?