Trudeau proposes Canadian Renters' Bill of Rights to ease housing crunch

[CdnFox]

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/trudeau-housing-renters-bill-of-rights

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau announced his plan for a new Canadian Renters’ Bill of Rights Wednesday to help young people get a foothold in the housing market.

His proposed plan contains three main items:

• Renters would know a unit’s rental price history to bargain appropriately
• Creating a federal legal aid fund to help renters right bad-faith evictions
• Making credit bureaus take rent payments into account when calculating someone’s credit score, in an effort to help them qualify for a mortgage

Trudeau made the announcement ahead of the 2024 federal budget from East Vancouver, the most expensive city in the country for renters.

 

So. This is how desperate and useless he is.

THis is a provincial matter and all provinces already have their own residential tenanacy boards and laws to protect renters, and they are extensive.

knowing what the last guy paid is USELESS. 

Creating a legal aid fund that landlords KNOW will be abused to attack them just  reduces the number of rental units out there. Only the largest cutthroat rental companies with big legal budgets will bother - more of the smaller investors which until recently made up the majority of renters will get out of that market and rents will go even higher.

People are not failing to get a mortgage because their credit scores are bad - they can't get a mortgage because the cost of a downpayment and a mortgage is through the roof.  And I would bet that making your rent report any late payments to the credit bureau will hurt far more than it helps.

I hope the ndp realizes what a disaster this is and smartens them up.

[Moonlight Graham]

Demand and thus rent and housing prices would drop with fewer immigrants and foreign residents annually.   They keep beating around the root of the problem.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Demand and thus rent and housing prices would drop with fewer immigrants and foreign residents annually.   They keep beating around the root of the problem.

For the short term that would significantly ease the problem.

In time inventory would adjust and the problem would creep up again but during that time gov'ts can find ways to encourage developers to build more homes and for more landlords to return to the market to provide more spaces. And that also drops housing purchase prices (or holds them while salaries go up over time) so you get a win win - more people can buy, which frees up rentals and there's more places to buy and rent which keeps competition fair.

But yes - they're just beating around the bush.

[Michael Hardner]

4 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Demand and thus rent and housing prices would drop with fewer immigrants and foreign residents annually.   They keep beating around the root of the problem.

I actually agree with the CDN Fox except on the legal fund, which I just see as a big nothing that won't do anything.

I don't think Poilievre has said he'll drastically lower immigration either by the way.

The thing I see from this is that they're aware that there's a big problem.  To fix it, though, they have to impact the revenue of a significant part of the economy.

[QuebecOverCanada]

The Pareto principle states that for many outcomes, roughly 80% of consequences come from 20% of causes (the "vital few").

Immigration is causing 80% of the consequences on the housing market. It has to be reduced immediately or else nothing is going to happen.

[CdnFox]

9 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

 

I don't think Poilievre has said he'll drastically lower immigration either by the way.

Depends what you mean by 'drastically' i guess but he's said he will "match it to housing construction' and infrastructure - in other words keep it in line with how much housing we're producing.

While he's not going to give a specific number (and in fact doesn't even use the word "reduce") for political reasons, given everything else he's said and number's he's pointed to he's pretty clearly looking to reduce it back to more like 250 - 300 k per year.  Which is about half what it is this year.  So that's pretty substantial.

[QuebecOverCanada]

8 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

250 - 300 k per year.  Which is about half what it is this year

We're actually on our way to 1.2m this year.

Yes, canadian immigration levels are actually this suicidal.

[ExFlyer]

Yup, more rights for renters = less rental units will be built.

Bottom line is if landlords cannot recover costs then why bother building.

[Michael Hardner]

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

Bottom line is if landlords cannot recover costs then why bother building.

The corollary is that if prices need to be reduced in real terms, then an industry needs to be impacted.

 

Because the costs to be recovered include purchase costs.

[ExFlyer]

51 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

The corollary is that if prices need to be reduced in real terms, then an industry needs to be impacted.

 

Because the costs to be recovered include purchase costs.

Not sure what that means.

Whatever it costs to purchase and finance and pay taxes and expenses need to be recovered by the landlord. If you give more rights to renters then there will be no incentive to become or stay a landlord. There should also be a landlord bill of rights as well.

Then again, we can become full tilt communist and the government owns everything and we own nothing  and we pay the government for everything and the government decides what you can have and everyone has the same rights.

 

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, QuebecOverCanada said:

The Pareto principle states that for many outcomes, roughly 80% of consequences come from 20% of causes (the "vital few").

Immigration is causing 80% of the consequences on the housing market. It has to be reduced immediately or else nothing is going to happen.

There was rental issues long before this recent immigration crisis.

Rent freezes have been around for along time .

Cost of living has increased dramatically and that includes labour costs, building material for construction as well as renovations and repairs. If the landlord has to pay, so does the renter. If owners have to pay for renovations or repairs to their house is anyone going to subsidize them?? Is there a homeowners bill of rights??

[blackbird]

Canada is a post national state.  That is the problem.  Canada has stopped believing it is a sovereign nation and now belongs to the U.N.  Billions of dollars of our tax money goes to fund and support the third world.  The message is out there that Canada is very generous and will support you.  Any immigrant or illegal migrant is free to come to Canada and receive government support.  No wonder they come in massive numbers from the third world.  Who wouldn't?  The word is out that Canada will support you.

Edited March 28, 2024 by blackbird

[Michael Hardner]

7 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Not sure what that means.

Whatever it costs to purchase and finance and pay taxes and expenses need to be recovered by the landlord. If you give more rights to renters then there will be no incentive to become or stay a landlord. There should also be a landlord bill of rights as well.

Then again, we can become full tilt communist and the government owns everything and we own nothing  and we pay the government for everything and the government decides what you can have and everyone has the same rights.

 

The problem isn't that housing costs are going up. The problem is that they are too high.

So all the landlords who are buying buildings in this expensive environment need to increase or maintain rents or lose money. In other words, for them to recover costs means renters have to pay high rent.

 

The market can't continue to increase revenue, because people can't pay. Therefore, the incentive to build is going to decrease anyway.

The people who made their money recovered their costs and did well. Some of them even sold and cashed out.

Also known as a bubble

[ExFlyer]

23 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

The problem isn't that housing costs are going up. The problem is that they are too high.

So all the landlords who are buying buildings in this expensive environment need to increase or maintain rents or lose money. In other words, for them to recover costs means renters have to pay high rent.

 

The market can't continue to increase revenue, because people can't pay. Therefore, the incentive to build is going to decrease anyway.

The people who made their money recovered their costs and did well. Some of them even sold and cashed out.

Also known as a bubble

But that is the problem, costs are going up. To build and  maintain, costs are up. I am pretty sure they won't go down and if they do, it won't be by much.

 

Yes, we are in a bubble. The covid crisis drove housing prices up unreasonably. There were outrageous price bidding wars and people were still willing to buy. The remnants of that are with us. In my area developers are planning and there are long lines of folks awaiting for the doors to the sales offices to open for homes that will not be built for 2 years.....and they are expensive. 

All those on here whining about no one has money and costs are too high and interest rates are too high have me wondering is if they see the number of folks that seem to have money to buy and out bid for these homes?

I do feel sorry for the folks that way overpaid for some homes and now have to pay higher interest rates and the actual price of the home is back to reality. Are we going to see a crash like the US had?

Just last night on the news they showed a house that was outbid for $3.1 million 3 years ago and the house next door, exactly the same was up for sale for $2.1 million. Should the person that bought at 3.1 just walk away? That is what they did in the US. I am sure that all over Ontario (and maybe other places too) there are many situations like that.

[Michael Hardner]

33 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

1. But that is the problem, costs are going up. To build and  maintain, costs are up. I am pretty sure they won't go down and if they do, it won't be by much.

2. All those on here whining about no one has money and costs are too high and interest rates are too high have me wondering is if they see the number of folks that seem to have money to buy and out bid for these homes?

 

1. Is the problem level or velocity?

2. WHO ARE THEY 

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. Is the problem level or velocity?

2. WHO ARE THEY 

1. Both

2. I shall not name names because, well, you know what the outcome would be LOL

[CdnFox]

Just now, ExFlyer said:

 

2. I shall not name names because, well, you know what the outcome would be LOL

I think he meant "who are the people who have money to out bid for homes"  you 1diot

And they are not the average working person any more that's for sure. More and more they are investment groups (who then rent them out at rates too high for the average person) or they're people who's parents left them a huge amount of cash or a house, or they are very wealthy people.

So when you bullshit and whine about how people here claim the average folks don't have money (which is true) and you offer the fact that homes still sell as proof you're just demonstrating your lack of understanding.

ANd here's what to watch for:

20 years ago most people could afford decent shelter and/or to buy a home.

By 2019 that had climbed tremendously - now a much smallery percent of people could afford a decent place without serious financial strain and the rest could not - and would not be able to consider  buying.

https://rates.ca/resources/44-percent-of-canadians-overspend-on-rent

So what people do is never leave home - or pile a bunch of people into a space to live.  But the number who COULD afford their own place goes down.

And that will continue to be the case.  with fewer and fewer people being able to afford to have a place of their own or buy a place.

https://thoughtleadership.rbc.com/high-rates-and-prices-make-it-less-affordable-to-own-a-home-in-canada/

 

So the people who are buying are not the 'average 'person or the average couple.  People are living with their family or crammed with friends or more frequently in "trudeau town" tent or trailer cities.

[Michael Hardner]

26 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

1. Both

2. I shall not name names because, well, you know what the outcome would be LOL

1. I think that existing cost levels are a tough problem. You can do things to stop prices from going up further. But they have to come down

2. 🤔

[herbie]

Knowing what the last guy paid will help enrage you. Give the 3 month notice. Paint the apartment, charge the next one $500 a month more. Claim mortgages have gone up when you haven't renewed it. Give tenants more than legal rent increases, 3 mo notice for reno's described above if they squawk. Charge new tenants $500 more.
List it on AirBNB as you'll get 5X the returns.

No, lets all deny this happens, and scream even louder that it isn't common. Landlords are landlords to make housing for you. not to make money, right?

As for the last point, it is somewhat ridiculous to consider your cable bill and hydro but not rental payments compiling a credit score. The only point provinces like BC don't already have in place.

As per usual the only real gripe boils down to be Trudeau proposing it as his idea rather than someone else.

[Michael Hardner]

2 minutes ago, herbie said:

.

No, lets all deny this happens, and scream even louder that it isn't common.  

 

I think most people know that this is happening. Are you saying that if people get more angry, it'll be helpful?

[herbie]

Well it will be if they're like most board members and get outraged over anything that helps someone else.

[ExFlyer]

45 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

I think he meant "who are the people who have money to out bid for homes"  you 1diot

And they are not the average working person any more that's for sure. More and more they are investment groups (who then rent them out at rates too high for the average person) or they're people who's parents left them a huge amount of cash or a house, or they are very wealthy people.

So when you bullshit and whine about how people here claim the average folks don't have money (which is true) and you offer the fact that homes still sell as proof you're just demonstrating your lack of understanding.

ANd here's what to watch for:

20 years ago most people could afford decent shelter and/or to buy a home.

By 2019 that had climbed tremendously - now a much smallery percent of people could afford a decent place without serious financial strain and the rest could not - and would not be able to consider  buying.

https://rates.ca/resources/44-percent-of-canadians-overspend-on-rent

So what people do is never leave home - or pile a bunch of people into a space to live.  But the number who COULD afford their own place goes down.

And that will continue to be the case.  with fewer and fewer people being able to afford to have a place of their own or buy a place.

https://thoughtleadership.rbc.com/high-rates-and-prices-make-it-less-affordable-to-own-a-home-in-canada/

 

So the people who are buying are not the 'average 'person or the average couple.  People are living with their family or crammed with friends or more frequently in "trudeau town" tent or trailer cities.

The only 1diot in this discussion is you. So, suck it up buttercup LOL

It is true that the demographic of people able to outbid for homes has shifted, with more investment groups, inheritors of wealth, and wealthy individuals driving the market. The increasing unaffordability of housing has pushed more average working people into difficult living situations like overcrowding or homelessness. The trend suggests a future where fewer individuals will have the means to own a home, signaling a troubling imbalance in the housing market.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, herbie said:

Knowing what the last guy paid will help enrage you. Give the 3 month notice. Paint the apartment, charge the next one $500 a month more. Claim mortgages have gone up when you haven't renewed it. Give tenants more than legal rent increases, 3 mo notice for reno's described above if they squawk. Charge new tenants $500 more.
List it on AirBNB as you'll get 5X the returns.

 

Yeah - so how does this law help? As long as there's not enough places it's meaningless.

"Hey - you're charging me 500 dollars more than the last guy"  "So? He was here a long time and i did a bunch of renos since then - i got 10 other guys coming to look at it in an hour, eff off.

Quote

As per usual the only real gripe boils down to be Trudeau proposing it as his idea rather than someone else.

As per usual you're ignoring the very real issues with it and are just angry people don't like twinkle-toes anymore.

[Army Guy]

5 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

Not sure what that means.

Whatever it costs to purchase and finance and pay taxes and expenses need to be recovered by the landlord. If you give more rights to renters then there will be no incentive to become or stay a landlord. There should also be a landlord bill of rights as well.

Then again, we can become full tilt communist and the government owns everything and we own nothing  and we pay the government for everything and the government decides what you can have and everyone has the same rights.

 

I agree IF this was the case, that being said investing into rental properties is still a very, very lucrative business opportunity, with people more than ever getting into the market, there is tons of room before it negatively impacts owners bottom dollar to where they are losing money...And now with government dollars and grants available to everyone it would be hard not to get into the market...even low income rental housing is making huge profits... Not sure exactly what justin new policies are, or how they will effect the owner, or renter, but i'm pretty sure it is like all the other liberal policies are not going to accomplish much, in solving the rental pricing issue or give voters a leg up...I'm hoping i'm wrong...but history shows other wise.

[Army Guy]

2 hours ago, herbie said:

Knowing what the last guy paid will help enrage you. Give the 3 month notice. Paint the apartment, charge the next one $500 a month more. Claim mortgages have gone up when you haven't renewed it. Give tenants more than legal rent increases, 3 mo notice for reno's described above if they squawk. Charge new tenants $500 more.
List it on AirBNB as you'll get 5X the returns.

No, lets all deny this happens, and scream even louder that it isn't common. Landlords are landlords to make housing for you. not to make money, right?

As for the last point, it is somewhat ridiculous to consider your cable bill and hydro but not rental payments compiling a credit score. The only point provinces like BC don't already have in place.

As per usual the only real gripe boils down to be Trudeau proposing it as his idea rather than someone else.

Your right this does happen, but is it common as you say perhaps a source could be provided..., but before we all start dancing around the fire and celebrating that justin saved us..., lets take a look for a second, yes renters will now have access to legal representation...We all had that right forever, for legal representation so nothing new there...My question about this is this, are the government paying legal fees for this endeavor ? becasue most rental complexes are owned by people with deep pockets and slick lawyers... ... another factor is this, given the state of our courts getting this in front of a judge is going to take a while, most likely years.....nothing in the announcement that addresses this.

Perhaps it should strengthen rental control policies.  

I agree paying your rent should count towards your credit score, considering some rent is as expensive as a mortgage...