eyeball Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 12 minutes ago, Army Guy said: The question remains why have they not done so? I repeat... 3 hours ago, eyeball said: Domestic political considerations - cold feet. Politicians are more concerned about agitating the growing numbers of Putin's right wing apologists and supporters. There are enough now that elections hang in the balance. ... Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Army Guy Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 1 hour ago, User said: Taken back? Is that a Freudian slip there? We have already had this dumb argument with you many times already. My eyes are open just fine. Yes it is...a misprint Russia has taken more ground than a few meters, if you look from the time we had this convo, until now there are KM's of russian ground taken...if you look a the Kursk region they have taken back kms of land. Look at a map it's all there in black and white....i don't like it more than you do, but Russia is advancing, regardless of the cost...and on the ukrainian side it has a cost as well...both sides are low on every resource...men, equipment and ammo...and despite all of this Russia is continuing to throw men and equipment away like it was made of paper...just for those few meters.. as you call it... Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Army Guy Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 (edited) 26 minutes ago, eyeball said: I repeat... I agree cold feet by some NATO countries and NATO it self. Don't fool yourself if you think elections are going to influence putin's plans...Putin will remain in power as long as he produces a victory, if he does not he will be taken for a walk in the woods, and put down...then the next guy will take over, wash, rinse , then repeat over and over again... Edited October 13 by Army Guy Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Videospirit Posted October 13 Report Posted October 13 1 hour ago, Army Guy said: Yes it is...a misprint Russia has taken more ground than a few meters, if you look from the time we had this convo, until now there are KM's of russian ground taken...if you look a the Kursk region they have taken back kms of land. Look at a map it's all there in black and white....i don't like it more than you do, but Russia is advancing, regardless of the cost...and on the ukrainian side it has a cost as well...both sides are low on every resource...men, equipment and ammo...and despite all of this Russia is continuing to throw men and equipment away like it was made of paper...just for those few meters.. as you call it... https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60506682 Not sure where you're getting your information from. The 2022 map and 2024 map are almost identical. Russia gained a tiny little almost insignificant bit along the eastern front that is less than the Kursk occupation in total(Russia's gains practically unnoticeable on the map), and while Ukraine drove russia out of a large area of Kursk, they didn't stick around to hold all that ground, they've only held the territory where they dug in and haven't lost much ground in Kursk they actually occupied since the incursion started. Quote
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 4 hours ago, User said: Here you go again @Army Guy, another comment for you to ignore. This time, he insists that Russia be a part of NATO. It's not the first time he has made this dumb comment. I didn't insist. I expressed my opinion. I know you know the difference... Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 22 minutes ago, Nationalist said: I didn't insist. I expressed my opinion. I know you know the difference... An opinion is not contradictory to you insisting. For crying out loud, now you are going to play this cowardly it is just my opinion game too. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 2 hours ago, Army Guy said: Look at a map it's all there in black and white.... Yes, again, we have had this dumb discussion with you many times. I have looked at the map. At this rate, Russia will make it maybe halfway to Kyiv in about 100 years. 3 hours ago, Army Guy said: Russia will never be part of NATO...i'm not even sure that is a request of putins, this is the first i'm hearing of it... You literally ignored the entire point of calling out this comment. It was the absurdity of Nationalist expecting Russia to be a part of NATO. Do I really need to spell the stupidity of that out to you? Like, why does NATO exist? This is the 3rd comment I have called out to you now, showing you the stupidity of what Nationalist is saying on this subject and you just keep ignoring it. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 3 hours ago, Army Guy said: I'm not mocking you...i asked if you had read the article , yes it is a year old but it's main story line is still relevant today...many of their points have been brought up by Nationalist...does that make the author a russian cheer leader... Yeah, this is mocking my calling Nationalist a Russian cheerleader... when he literally was a Russian cheerleader. You wont honestly look at what Nationalist said, so you drag up something else. Your arguments are just smoke and mirrors, man. Be obtuse and obfuscate with your head stuck in the ground, ignoring what is inconvenient. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
Videospirit Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 10 hours ago, User said: Here you go again @Army Guy, another comment for you to ignore. This time, he insists that Russia be a part of NATO. It's not the first time he has made this dumb comment. It's not the best example to use of Nationalist's Simping for Russia. Plenty of people believe in the notion that Russia invaded Ukraine because they were afraid Ukraine would join NATO, and that Russia considers NATO their enemy. His comment about Russia joining NATO was just his personal stance that Russia might calm down about NATO expansion if they were a member of NATO. Although if true that Russia invaded Ukraine to keep it from joining NATO, it just proves that Ukraine really needed to join NATO because that isn't any justification to invade Ukraine, much less to annex the territory, and Russia really is a threat to their neighbor's sovereignty that needs to be resisted. It's also not accurate at all. Russia isn't scared of having NATO on its border, it already has NATO on its border. It doesn't give a shit about It's border with NATO expanding now that FInland has joined either. Putin has always wanted to annex Ukraine. Ukraine joining NATO would destroy his ambitions of annexing Ukraine, so the risk of it may have caused him to invade Ukraine to prevent his dream of annexing Ukraine from being ruined, but the goal has always been to annex Ukraine. Putin would never accept both Ukraine and Russia joining NATO, because than he wouldn't be able to annex Ukraine. So while it's a wrong belief, it's not one that proves he's a Russian simp like him saying they're just invading Ukraine to bring Democracy to the Russians in Ukraine was. Plenty of people have an ignorant understanding of Russia's motives because western journalists toss around this idea that Putin is scared of NATO being on its border. 1 Quote
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 10 hours ago, User said: An opinion is not contradictory to you insisting. For crying out loud, now you are going to play this cowardly it is just my opinion game too. Cowardly? User...we're all expressing opinions. You're just being irrational now. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 10 hours ago, User said: Yes, again, we have had this dumb discussion with you many times. I have looked at the map. At this rate, Russia will make it maybe halfway to Kyiv in about 100 years. You literally ignored the entire point of calling out this comment. It was the absurdity of Nationalist expecting Russia to be a part of NATO. Do I really need to spell the stupidity of that out to you? Like, why does NATO exist? This is the 3rd comment I have called out to you now, showing you the stupidity of what Nationalist is saying on this subject and you just keep ignoring it. 1. You assume Russia wants to take all of Ukraine. 2. Russia has suggested NATO membership in the past and met with a wall of resistance. Yet that would resolve a lot of issues. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 10 hours ago, User said: Yeah, this is mocking my calling Nationalist a Russian cheerleader... when he literally was a Russian cheerleader. You wont honestly look at what Nationalist said, so you drag up something else. Your arguments are just smoke and mirrors, man. Be obtuse and obfuscate with your head stuck in the ground, ignoring what is inconvenient. You sure got a hard-on for Russia. Did a Russian shoot your dog in the past or something? Are you Ukrainian maybe? Russia has not been a threat to Western Europe or America for going on 40 years now. Hell they have been providing energy to much of Europe for years. Yet, scuttle one rather insignificant country's entry to NATO, and you're ready to blow up the planet. Just what is it with you? Do you feel naked without an evil Soviet Russia to hate? I mean really now...you've taken logic, chewed it up and spit it out over this. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: Cowardly? User...we're all expressing opinions. You're just being irrational now. Yes, cowardly. You guys offer this "It's just my opinion" schtick to avoid any accountability for your assertions' stupidity. 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: Russia has not been a threat to Western Europe or America for going on 40 years now. Here you go again @Army Guy, another absurd comment supporting Russia for you to ignore. Do you think Russia has been no threat to Western Europe or America for going on 40 years now? Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: 1. You assume Russia wants to take all of Ukraine. No more than you assume they don't. The difference is that the evidence shows they do. Once again, you ignore their invasion and the initial invasion push. But please, tell us, exactly where will Russia stop their invasion at? What do you base this on? 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: 2. Russia has suggested NATO membership in the past and met with a wall of resistance. Yet that would resolve a lot of issues. We have had this id1otic discussion before. NATO exists to oppose Russian aggression. Russia is little more than a 2 1/2 world dictatorship with a bunch of Nuclear weapons that works against our endeavors around the globe. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 15 minutes ago, User said: Yes, cowardly. You guys offer this "It's just my opinion" schtick to avoid any accountability for your assertions' stupidity. Here you go again @Army Guy, another absurd comment supporting Russia for you to ignore. Do you think Russia has been no threat to Western Europe or America for going on 40 years now? It is my opinion. Yours is different. Are you over there fighting? Or are you the coward here? Ok...aside from the nuke threats recently over the level of NATO involvement, when has Russia threatened Europe since the Soviet Union fell? Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 11 minutes ago, Nationalist said: It is my opinion. Yours is different. Are you over there fighting? Or are you the coward here? What exactly are you saying is just your opinion here? If you assert a thing of fact, then it is not just a matter of it is just your opinion and mine is different, as if we were discussing our favorite flavors of ice cream. The cowardly game you are playing is like this: You assert 2+3=5, I say, no it is 4. Then you and @Army Guy are like, well, it is just our opinion man to run and hide from being wrong. 13 minutes ago, Nationalist said: Ok...aside from the nuke threats recently over the level of NATO involvement, when has Russia threatened Europe since the Soviet Union fell? We have had this discussion before. Why do you have to play dumb? Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 (edited) 1 hour ago, User said: No more than you assume they don't. The difference is that the evidence shows they do. Once again, you ignore their invasion and the initial invasion push. But please, tell us, exactly where will Russia stop their invasion at? What do you base this on? We have had this id1otic discussion before. NATO exists to oppose Russian aggression. Russia is little more than a 2 1/2 world dictatorship with a bunch of Nuclear weapons that works against our endeavors around the globe. Here's Russians negotiating position. https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/14/europe/putin-conditions-peace-talks-ukraine-intl/index.html As we know, negotiations may involve compromises on both sides. Do you see complete conquering of all Ukraine in there? No. I don't ignore squat. I don't know why the Russians decided to leave Kiev alone. They had the city trapped. Maybe...they never wanted to rule all Ukraine? Or maybe they didn't have a good plan and simply failed to take Kiev. They did withdraw from that area just as the original peace negotiations were taking place though...make of that what you please. NATO was formed to oppose "Soviet aggression". The "Soveit Union" died decades ago. NATO is now nothing but a military industrial cash cow. Edited October 14 by Nationalist Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 9 minutes ago, Nationalist said: As we know, negotiations may involve compromises on both sides. Do you see complete conquering of all Ukraine in there? No. This is his absurd condition only AFTER he failed to conquer Ukraine. Once again, you clearly didn't read an article you sourced or are just so incredibly dishonest you ignored what it said: "While these conditions are more maximalist than those Putin has hinted at before, they represent Russia’s failure to achieve its original war aims, when Moscow believed it could capture Kyiv in days and the rest of Ukraine in weeks. " 10 minutes ago, Nationalist said: I don't ignore squat. Yes, you just did, in the article you sourced. You also ignored what others thought of this offer, oh gee, big surprise, you believe Putin over others here. Who would have thought you would be taking the side of Putin here? "Ukrainian and certain Western officials have repeatedly warned that Putin intends to settle for nothing less than Kyiv’s total defeat, and that any truce or peace talks are merely a guise to allow Russia’s troops to regroup and launch a fresh and fiercer offensive in the future." 13 minutes ago, Nationalist said: I don't know why the Russians decided to leave Kiev alone. They did not decide to leave it alone, they tried to invade and conquer it on day one and failed. They were stretched too thin, beaten back, and defeated. 15 minutes ago, Nationalist said: As we know, negotiations may involve compromises on both sides. He wants Ukraine to give up even more territory than Russia has now. To completely abandon any notion of joining NATO, to demilitarize... that is not a compromise, that is an absurdly gross demand and so much for your previous lies about Ukraine being independent. Why, it is almost like you are a liar and just say anything. 16 minutes ago, Nationalist said: NATO was formed to oppose "Soviet aggression". The "Soveit Union" died decades ago. NATO is now nothing but a military industrial cash cow. The collapse of the Soviet Union did not end the threat of Russia or their tactics or clearly their expansionist goals... the absolute dishonest stupidity of your position here as you push this while Russia is in full scale invasion of Ukraine. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 1 hour ago, User said: What exactly are you saying is just your opinion here? If you assert a thing of fact, then it is not just a matter of it is just your opinion and mine is different, as if we were discussing our favorite flavors of ice cream. The cowardly game you are playing is like this: You assert 2+3=5, I say, no it is 4. Then you and @Army Guy are like, well, it is just our opinion man to run and hide from being wrong. We have had this discussion before. Why do you have to play dumb? Neither of us KNOWS how this war will end. Thus we are "opining" about the outcome. What facts we do know, we've already hashed over till the hash is burnt. BTW...2+3 does equal 5. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 2 minutes ago, Nationalist said: Neither of us KNOWS how this war will end. Thus we are "opining" about the outcome. You are not opining on the outcome; you are asserting Russia's goals and constantly contradicting yourself in the process. You assert things as factual when they are not. You push phony Russian propaganda that is not true. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
Nationalist Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 4 minutes ago, User said: You are not opining on the outcome; you are asserting Russia's goals and constantly contradicting yourself in the process. You assert things as factual when they are not. You push phony Russian propaganda that is not true. Only if you can't see reality through your flag... Your attitude is contradictory because you're not there fighting, and your position that NATO and Ukraine had no part in starting this, is childishly simplistic. Do not get involved in diplomacy please. That would not end well. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 36 minutes ago, Nationalist said: Your attitude is contradictory because you're not there fighting, and your position that NATO and Ukraine had no part in starting this, is childishly simplistic. Here you go again @Army Guy, another post for you to ignore. Here he is blaming NATO and Ukraine for Russia invading. 37 minutes ago, Nationalist said: Do not get involved in diplomacy please. That would not end well. Diplomacy? LOL You are here cheering on a Russian invasion, defending it, and pushing the propaganda to support it. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
Army Guy Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 (edited) 17 hours ago, Videospirit said: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60506682 Not sure where you're getting your information from. The 2022 map and 2024 map are almost identical. Russia gained a tiny little almost insignificant bit along the eastern front that is less than the Kursk occupation in total(Russia's gains practically unnoticeable on the map), and while Ukraine drove russia out of a large area of Kursk, they didn't stick around to hold all that ground, they've only held the territory where they dug in and haven't lost much ground in Kursk they actually occupied since the incursion started. My info comes from the media, just like yours....And it sure looks like that, but the scale of maps is what is important...when you zoom out to outer space it does not look like much, Standard military map is 1 over 50,000 each grid square is 1km wide, 1 km high.... Have you looked at your source, just take a look on the map with Pokrovsk and Toretsk on it it shows recent gains measured in KM. you might want to also take a look at the map showing Addiivka from 5 oct to 13 may....gains there also measured in KM's infact more than 20 kms Note today those gains are even father than your map suggests...BBC is a good source they update their maps on a daily basis start tracking the losses or gains and you'll find out everything is not coming up roses for Ukraine.... As for Kursk map....take a look at this one....and tell me Ukraine is not losing ground. Then tell me what is the cost that Ukraine has incurred....in men and equipment... https://www.newsweek.com/russia-redeploys-50000-troops-kursk-counter-offensive-ukraine-1967493 https://www.newsweek.com/russia-redeploys-50000-troops-kursk-counter-offensive-ukraine-1967493 Edited October 14 by Army Guy Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
User Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 11 minutes ago, Army Guy said: As for Kursk map....take a look at this one....and tell me Ukraine is not losing ground. Amazing. Two months ago, this was going to be a huge cost to Ukraine. It was not going to change anything. It was just a temporary moral booster. It was short-lived, completely forgotten in a few months and a waste of time and lives. Now, here we are into the 3rd month of the Kursk invasion, and Russia has had to deploy 50,000 troops off their other fronts to barely start taking any land back from Ukraine. Quote LOL, when people have to tell you they are ignoring you... From Robosmith: "IGNORE AWARDED DUE TO WORTHLESS POSTS. BYE."
Army Guy Posted October 14 Report Posted October 14 16 hours ago, User said: Yes, again, we have had this dumb discussion with you many times. I have looked at the map. At this rate, Russia will make it maybe halfway to Kyiv in about 100 years. You literally ignored the entire point of calling out this comment. It was the absurdity of Nationalist expecting Russia to be a part of NATO. Do I really need to spell the stupidity of that out to you? Like, why does NATO exist? This is the 3rd comment I have called out to you now, showing you the stupidity of what Nationalist is saying on this subject and you just keep ignoring it. Yes, because to you, talking about actual events on the ground in ukraine is dumb....the fact that most of their gains at measured in KM's not meters....is you not understanding a lot of things like urban warfare, mechanized warfare , this entire conflict....Ukraine can not possible match manpower pool, resources, or equipment pools...So sooner or later with out MORE NATO support, Ukraine is going to collapse....Thats another fact you refuse to believe....Thats not cheering on Russia thats telling the truth... How many times do i need to say it....Nationalist is a big boy he owns what he posts, take it up with him.....I'm not his keeper, neither are you... I still do not believe he is a Russian cheerleader.... Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
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