Liberals and New Democrats reach a deal on pharmacare

[herbie]

Sorry to throw water on your parade:

The federal Liberal government and the NDP have come to an agreement on pharmacare, clearing the way for the two parties to continue operating under the confidence-and-supply agreement that has helped keep the government in power over the past two years.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/liberals-ndp-pharmacare-deal-1.7123952

 

[Guest]

Nice.

[Army Guy]

It is nice, but lacks any real details like who qualifies, how much will it cost, or is it another coc* up like the Day care program....

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Army Guy said:

It is nice, but lacks any real details like who qualifies, how much will it cost, or is it another coc* up like the Day care program....

It's taken decades to get this far. Leaving it to Liberals on their own would have added decades more. Of course Conservatives with probably throw it out.

So... Knowing how long it takes to get things done in Canada. 10 years ago would have been the time to start talking about a wealth tax. I'd suggest voting NDP to ensure minority governments and the possibility of future agreements that might eventually lead to one.

[Moonlight Graham]

Our health care systems are broken and provinces are cutting back on ER doctors because they can't afford them and they're throwing tens of billions at pharmacare.   It doesn't make sense.

[blackbird]

I can't see how this is going to work.  The government is already in debt at least ten billion I believe.  

There is no such as just taxing the wealthy as the NDP keeps repeating.  If they try that, they will just scare away investment.  The government is already struggling to get companies to invest in Canada because of the red tape, regulations and taxes.  An airline company is now closing down because of the excessive regulations, fees, and taxes.

Government just can't "tax the wealthy" without dire consequences.  I doubt Singh even has a clue where the money would come from for a pharmacare program.  It can't just be shoved onto the debt either because interest has to be paid on debt which takes money away from other government programs.

Also provinces would be asked to pay for the pharmacare program because health care is primarily a provincial responsibility.  Some provinces are already billions of dollars in debt and they have no interest in raising taxes when people are already struggling to pay the rent or mortgages and many can't afford a home or groceries.  The money is just not there for an expensive pharmacare program.

So there is no answer as to how pharmacare could be paid for.  It may take a massive tax increase which would go over like a lead balloon.

Edited February 24, 2024 by blackbird

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

It's taken decades to get this far. Leaving it to Liberals on their own would have added decades more. Of course Conservatives with probably throw it out.

So... Knowing how long it takes to get things done in Canada. 10 years ago would have been the time to start talking about a wealth tax. I'd suggest voting NDP to ensure minority governments and the possibility of future agreements that might eventually lead to one.

Money is no object in your mind I guess.

[Legato]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

I'd suggest voting NDP to ensure minority governments and the possibility of future agreements that might eventually lead to one.

Why would anyone have the desire to go back to Ray Days.

NDP like to spend everyone else's money until they get unceremoniously kicked out.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

Money is no object in your mind I guess.

Actually money is amongst the most important things in the world.

[CdnFox]

This isnt just about money - most of the provinces had pharmacare already and so it's kind of a mess to untangle that. 

We'll see how it goes - they screwed up dental and daycare, hopefully this will work a little better.

But it probably means no election till well into 2025 at least which is too bad.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Legato said:

Why would anyone have the desire to go back to Ray Days.

I was thinking more along the lines of Singh - he's the only Parliamentarian who's actually gotten anything done the last 10 years.

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

I was thinking more along the lines of Singh - he's the only Parliamentarian who's actually gotten anything done the last 10 years.

He didn't get anything done. Justin got everything done, good or bad. Jagmeet simply enabled him.  Justin did it all and bought jagmeet for a cheap price (an already failed dental program, an already failed daycare program, and a pharmacy program that's likely to fail that simply replaces what provinces had already).

In exchange jagmeet agreed to let justin do every single bad thing justin has done. 

If you pay someone to fix your door and for payment he burns your house down you didn't achieve much.

Justin on the other hand managed to double the entire debt that was racked up by all prime ministers before him (working on tripling it), has made housing unaffordable for a huge hunk of the population, spread massive amounts of hatred and division (which jaggers happily participated in) created massive inflation and somehow turned the public against immigration and climate change policy while driving down the quality of life for all.

If by 'got things done' you mean that, sure jaggers played a large role in it all.  Justin was the one who did it tho.

[eyeball]

8 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

In exchange jagmeet agreed to let justin do every single bad thing justin has done. 

Or stood by and let Trudeau hang himself.

In the meantime Canada has Dental-care and Pharma-care. None of these were on the table going into Trudeau's regime but they are going out. 👍

Good for Canada.

[CdnFox]

8 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Or stood by and let Trudeau hang himself.

Nope - voted with him and kept him in power.  Sadly - that was the deal.  He was required to support him and allow him to do all the other things as well.

Quote

In the meantime Canada has Dental-care and Pharma-care. 

We had that already. Most provinces had their own programs.

Quote

Good for Canada.

Nope. If you give someone a dollar but take 10 from them. you can't say "but i gave you a dollar so that's good for you!!" without looking at the 10 dollars they took.

I mean the nazi's brought in some positive public health reforms. But overall.... still bad for germany   you can't take one thing in isolation.

 

[eyeball]

2 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

I mean the nazi's brought in some positive public health reforms. But overall....

...Nazis...

LMAO!

 

[herbie]

5 hours ago, Legato said:

Why would anyone have the desire to go back to Ray Days.

Cuz the horrors of those days exist only in the minds of the most stubborn Conservatives. Kept him in, you'd have already saved multi-billions you've shelled out to private car insurance. Possibly had at least some say in your gas & hydro rates. Etc etc etc etc etc etc.

4 hours ago, eyeball said:

Actually money is amongst the most important things in the world.

That's why these guys think providing services with it is just horrid.
More tax breaks for billionaires are needed!
Getting something for your tax money is soshulist!

 

[CdnFox]

8 hours ago, eyeball said:

...Nazis...

LMAO!

 

LMAO seems to be code for you that means "Oh crap i can't deny that everything he just said is true!!!!!!"  That's the only time you use it  

Sorry punkin - your two heros jaggers and justin worked together to do some pretty aweful things to canada.  And doing one or two half assed things that didnt' really need doing in a way that has already failed does not make up for all the bad things. Canada is a worse place today because of justin trudeau and Jagmeet .  "JJ" screwed the younger people over pretty good, which is why theyre leaving the libs and the dips in buckets.

Edited February 25, 2024 by CdnFox

[Legato]

10 hours ago, herbie said:

Cuz the horrors of those days exist only in the minds of the most stubborn Conservatives. Kept him in, you'd have already saved multi-billions you've shelled out to private car insurance. Possibly had at least some say in your gas & hydro rates. Etc etc etc etc etc etc.

That's an extremely large would have never happened dose of wishful thinking.

 

[Guest]

18 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

 It doesn't make sense.

If you can put yourself in Trudeau's shoes, it absolutely does.

 

[Nationalist]

I'm not opposed to this, as long as we're not printing funny-money to pay for it?

[Guest]

21 hours ago, Army Guy said:

It is nice, but lacks any real details like who qualifies, how much will it cost, or is it another coc* up like the Day care program....

That's the whole point, isn't it? Hard to virtue signal, when telling people they will be paying through the nose for the government expenses.

Easier to point the opposition as cost cutting brutes, and you as the savior of society.

Kind of like if I quoted you on products and you saw a shipping rate at the bottom, vs me simply imbed that into your price and telling you how much you saved and how good this is for our industry.

[eyeball]

6 hours ago, CdnFox said:

LMAO seems to be code for you that means "Oh crap i can't deny that everything he just said is true!!!!!!"

Nazis...I guess that's code for seriously is it?

Bwahahaha!!

[Moonbox]

23 hours ago, eyeball said:

I'd suggest voting NDP to ensure minority governments and the possibility of future agreements that might eventually lead to one.

Not with that leader at the helm.  Would be like voting out dumb to get dumber.  

Edited February 25, 2024 by Moonbox

[eyeball]

35 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Not with that leader at the helm.  Would be like voting out dumb to get dumber.  

I'm strictly voting in hopes of a minority and I could care less if its with Conservatives or Liberals. I know its going to one or the other and they're both right-wing from where I'm sitting.

I'd certainly prefer an old-school labour-oriented NDP leader like Ed Broadbent. Definitely someone more willing to push for wealth taxes and putting the Conservatives and Liberals in the position of either having to argue against them...or embrace them.

A 1% tax on anything after $10 million, 2% on anything after $50 million and 3% on anything after $100 million seems quite reasonable and in line with what other countries are considering. Although I'd probably double these tax rates myself if for no other reason than as a starting point from which to negotiate.  Like our consideration of Dental/Pharma-care we're quite a ways behind our peers in the topic of wealth taxes.

Edited February 25, 2024 by eyeball

[Moonbox]

What's most likely to happen is that the NDP and the Libs will split, and the CPC will get their easy majority.  Jaghmeet Singh is a cinderblock anchored to the NDP, and whatever accomplishments he figures he can brag about with pharma and dental, he's still a lousy public speaker, he's still wearing a turban, and he still spent the last number of years propping up the Liberal government.