Hamas Attacks Israel

[BeaverFever]

On 12/27/2023 at 9:27 PM, Nationalist said:

Meh... @BeaverFever lives in an alternate reality. Too many afternoons watching The View.

Israel has opened the door to all sorts of nonsense. They may well wind up on the losing end of this. They had their chance and now they're just another cause for nerds to whine about.

'It so cruel!'

Israel may well now have the 2-state solution choked down their throats.

Lol the Putin supporter speaks up. Tooany afternoons watching Sputnik.
 

Putin may be the cruelest dictator alive, Israel can’t hold a candle to his record of atrocities. And  he supports Hamas to boot. 

[BeaverFever]

On 12/27/2023 at 9:43 PM, CdnFox said:

I don't think they particularly hate the 2 state solution.  They were involved with negotiations to that effect for some time, and it was hamas's presence and their refusal to accept any solution that had israel still in existence that really ended that.

I don’t think that’s entirely accurate

The last time an Israeli PM entertained even a step towards a 2-state solution was Yitzhak Rabin who was then. assassinated by rightwing anti-peace Israelis. Soon afterwards the hardline anti -peace Likud party came to power and has pretty much been in power ever since.  Netanyahu has been a regular feature of that party dating back to before Rabin’s assassination. Netanyahu and Likud have never expressed any openness to a 2-state solution that I can recall amd their coalition governments court extremist groups who not only refuse a Palestinian state, but want full annexation of the occupied Palestinian territories (without granting Palestinians citizenship of course). 
 

The Hamas takeover of Gaza from the moderate and secular Palestinian Authority is widely believed to have been supported by anti-peace Israelis in order to divide the 2 Palestinian territories between 2 competing factions,  while using the militant and Islamist Hamas as an excuse to stall peace talks. The anti-peace Israelis believed that Palestinians could be contained in their respective territories without having to make any peace deals through occasional military incursions and bombing campaigns which they referred to as “mowing the grass”. 
 

In fact Netanyahu has long been publicly blamed for Rabin’s assassination due to his inflammatory rhetoric about Rabin leading up to the assassination. And by some strange coincidence just 2 weeks before the October 7 attacks Netanyahu publicly announced he would boycott the annual national memorial of Rabin’s assassination (which also occurs every October) with some vague claim claim that it was too political. It was the first time any PM has not attended the event since the 1995 assassination. It’s almost as if he had some premonition that by October it would be “time to be cruel” and not time to honour an Israeli leader assassinated for his peacemaking achievements.   I’m not saying there was any conspiracy behind Oct7 but at the very least it sure was an excellent opportunity for the most extreme hard-right anti-peace government Israel has ever seen, the same way 9-11 was an excellent opportunity for the war hawks in the Bush admin to execute their plan to invade Iraq, which they had been publicly promoting for many years by then 

As further evidence of Israel’s lack of interest in peace, consider Netanyahu’s current Minister of National Security. Itamar Ben Gvir is a lifelong settler,Jewish Supremacist extremist, provocateur, and leader of a fringe party literally called “Jewish Power”.   He had a long track record of violent anti-Arab hate speech, promoting anti-Arab terrorism and he even kept a poster in his office of an Israeli settler terrorist gunman who killed and wounded ~150 Muslim worshippers in a single attack.  He has been described by Israelis as what a Jewish fascist would actually look like. More than once   In fact many times.  Netanyahu allowed his extremist party to join his coalition and made him Minister of National Security- an obviously top job that speaks to how much Netanyahu supports him and also the worst job anyone could possibly give to a hardline pro-violence bigoted extremist   It was surely another strange coincidence that Israel’s national security under Gvir massively failed on Oct 7, not only failing to detect and prevent the attack plot but also failing to effectively respond in a timely manner. Israel is known for many things but poor national security is not one of them. The opposite in fact. Again I’m not saying conspiracy it could be the guy is just an unqualified boob who never should have been in charge of anything so important but as the say “never let a good tragedy go to waste”

Edited December 29, 2023 by BeaverFever

[sharkman]

On 12/24/2023 at 8:56 PM, BeaverFever said:

As a Putin supporter, can you explain why Putin become close with Hamas and openly allies itself with Iran, the state sponsor of Hamas?

I am not a Putin supporter.  But the Russian people should be allowed to live in peace and not be menaced by NATO as they have for the last decade or more.  Iran needs to get bombed into oblivion by Israel, hopefully it will happen before Iran gets and launches nukes.  Biden keeps giving them billions after Obama gave them billions to fund Hamas and build said nukes.  The narrative that suggests they are using over 600 billion for humane efforts only is propaganda, unfortunately. 

I am sorry to say that many news sources today have become corrupt just as most politicians are corrupt.  Putin, Zelensky, Trudeau, Biden, and so many others.  Any news source that champions that nazi Zelensky should be not trusted, as should any that defends Putin.

[CdnFox]

4 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

Nice try.

So you couldn't answer that   As usual - it took all of 4 seconds to prove you were completely full of crap

Quote

Which war are you thinking of where a political leader called for cruelty or described their aide as being deliberately cruel or said cruelty was a good thing?  

I've never made any claim that any of that has happened ever.  But - seeing as YOU raised it, pretty much all of them. Go see truman's discussion of the war esp after he dropped the bomb.

Or perhaps robert e lee's comments about how cruel war is would suit you better?

Sherman said war IS cruelty and people have to harden their hearts.

How about dwight e? I hate war as only a soldier who has lived it can, only as one who has seen its brutality, its stupidity.

 

Quote

NOBODY who supports a war describes it as cruel or unavoidable civilian casualties as cruel. 

They all do.  Everybody knows that war is horrible and cruel.  They accept that it's NECESSARY sometimes but they all think it's bad.

Once again you're wrong across the board.   you're a total 1diot but at least you're a thorough 1diot  

[marcus]

Are people still defending Israel?

Israelis didn't get to where they are without decades of conditioning. 

Israel's society is ill. I mean, who wants to defend this racist, psychopathic society? It's no wonder why more and more Jews not living in Israel are speaking out against Israel.

Who here supports this?

Age restricted:

 

[CdnFox]

10 minutes ago, marcus said:

Are people still defending Israel?

 

Are people still trying to defend terrorists with mindless blather about conditioning and such? Oh - never mind.

[marcus]

Just now, CdnFox said:

Are people still trying to defend terrorists with mindless blather about conditioning and such? Oh - never mind.

A societal sickness, rooted in decades of Israeli racism and Jewish supremacy, has exploded into the open after October 7, as Israelis of all walks of life took to social media to mock the suffering of Palestinians, flaunt war crimes, and clamor for genocide. Have a look at Max Blumenthal (self-hating Jew) report on the Israeli societal sickness. 

[Nationalist]

7 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

Lol the Putin supporter speaks up. Tooany afternoons watching Sputnik.
 

Putin may be the cruelest dictator alive, Israel can’t hold a candle to his record of atrocities. And  he supports Hamas to boot. 

Oh Beave...you're such a loser.

Every time you post, you convince readers that you live a lie. That reality is just too harsh for you.

How does it feel to watch everything you want to believe, shot down in flames?

[CdnFox]

5 hours ago, marcus said:

A societal sickness, rooted in decades of Israeli racism and Jewish supremacy, has exploded into the open after October 7,

So October 7th showed the world that it's the ISRAELI'S who are sick and twisted.  Not the people who smashed through a border and deliberately went around slaughtering civilians,  driving nails into women's private parts and burning babies.  Not those guys.  It's the Israelis. That's your argument?  You're gonna stick with that?

 

 

[marcus]

39 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

So October 7th showed the world that it's the ISRAELI'S who are sick and twisted.  Not the people who smashed through a border and deliberately went around slaughtering civilians,  driving nails into women's private parts and burning babies.  Not those guys.  It's the Israelis. That's your argument?  You're gonna stick with that?

 

 

First of all, Hamas should be tried for whatever they did on October 7th. One thing we do know is that no one has shown proof of any of the above (burning babies and nails). Feel free to share actual proof though.

Second, look at the video of Israelis showing their psychopathic tendencies. It's a sick culture. If you think their reaction is normal, then you're not right in the head either.

[eyeball]

On 12/12/2023 at 1:48 PM, Army Guy said:

Canada sent back a ship full of Jews back to Nazi Germany to be slaughter in death camps, 

Canada also produced a plan for Israel on how to colonize, oppress and subjugate Palestinians.

Edited December 29, 2023 by eyeball

[Legato]

56 minutes ago, marcus said:

First of all, Hamas should be tried for whatever they did on October 7th. One thing we do know is that no one has shown proof of any of the above (burning babies and nails). Feel free to share actual proof though.

Second, look at the video of Israelis showing their psychopathic tendencies. It's a sick culture. If you think their reaction is normal, then you're not right in the head either.

That line alone indicates that you must be terribly uninformed.

The information was all over the internet weeks ago and has now been removed for humanitarian reasons.

[marcus]

27 minutes ago, Legato said:

That line alone indicates that you must be terribly uninformed.

The information was all over the internet weeks ago and has now been removed for humanitarian reasons.

You think Israel would hesitate to show proof, if there was actual proof?

Stop championing fake news.

 

[Legato]

34 minutes ago, marcus said:

You think Israel would hesitate to show proof, if there was actual proof?

Stop championing fake news.

 

The proof has been shown to many people.

I'm not going to argue over something that was plainly obvious. 

Believe what you wish.

[Army Guy]

1 hour ago, marcus said:

First of all, Hamas should be tried for whatever they did on October 7th. One thing we do know is that no one has shown proof of any of the above (burning babies and nails). Feel free to share actual proof though.

Second, look at the video of Israelis showing their psychopathic tendencies. It's a sick culture. If you think their reaction is normal, then you're not right in the head either.

How is it that you support Hamas and it's people but don't support their message...I mean it has been their message all along, it has not changed, they teach it in their classrooms, on their media radio and TV, it is in their faces 24 and 7... That message is to wipe Israel off the planet... That message has been posted on here atleast a thousand of times, with all kinds of Valid sources, and yet you refuse to believe them but eager to believe anything anti Israel...

Your not even aware of the censorship standards of our own media, standards that will not allow graphic pictures or video to be aired...if it can't be aired then it must be false...is that what it is going to take pictures of babies that were shot then burned...they do exist those very pictures were shown to the western media...all that wanted to have a look...or maybe its just you and your sick sense of what is right and wrong...

Wonder if Hamas took pictures of the 20,000 dead mostly women and children, becasue the Israelis only have bombs' that kill them and not military age males...thats what your asking us to believe...lets all shed some tears for terrorist's....

Hey it is the thing to do today, take to the streets and show support for a culture that thinks killing Jews is as normal as eating kraft dinner, that supporting terrorism is the cool thing to do....how does a person shoot an infant, or children in front of their parents, then phone their mother to give her the good news, like he was a hero, they are the same people that danced in the streets after 9/11, or when the marines were blown up in Lebanon.......and Jews are sick...

Your not going to have to worry about anything soon enough, in a few months time most of Gaza will be in rubble, hamas will go down in the history books as dogs that were hunted down..., and Palestine people will be free out of the yokes of terrorists... free to have their own state back...

[Army Guy]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

Canada also produced a plan for Israel on how to colonize, oppress and subjugate Palestinians.

Canada is not a nation with any credibility on this topic, or any other for that matter..., we have no room to talk, look how we treat our own indigenous population, and still talking about reconciliation, some couple hundred years later...Jews are the most prosecuted people on the planet...way before they got their own state...

[marcus]

51 minutes ago, Legato said:

The proof has been shown to many people.

I'm not going to argue over something that was plainly obvious. 

Believe what you wish.

To who?

Where?

Lots was said. Most of it has been backtracked by the Israeli government itself, after no proof was shown. But not after impressionable people like yourself was duped by the lies.

See the video above for proof of just some of the lies.

40 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

How is it that you support Hamas and it's people but don't support their message...I mean it has been their message all along, it has not changed, they teach it in their classrooms, on their media radio and TV, it is in their faces 24 and 7... That message is to wipe Israel off the planet... That message has been posted on here atleast a thousand of times, with all kinds of Valid sources, and yet you refuse to believe them but eager to believe anything anti Israel...

Your not even aware of the censorship standards of our own media, standards that will not allow graphic pictures or video to be aired...if it can't be aired then it must be false...is that what it is going to take pictures of babies that were shot then burned...they do exist those very pictures were shown to the western media...all that wanted to have a look...or maybe its just you and your sick sense of what is right and wrong...

Wonder if Hamas took pictures of the 20,000 dead mostly women and children, becasue the Israelis only have bombs' that kill them and not military age males...thats what your asking us to believe...lets all shed some tears for terrorist's....

Hey it is the thing to do today, take to the streets and show support for a culture that thinks killing Jews is as normal as eating kraft dinner, that supporting terrorism is the cool thing to do....how does a person shoot an infant, or children in front of their parents, then phone their mother to give her the good news, like he was a hero, they are the same people that danced in the streets after 9/11, or when the marines were blown up in Lebanon.......and Jews are sick...

Your not going to have to worry about anything soon enough, in a few months time most of Gaza will be in rubble, hamas will go down in the history books as dogs that were hunted down..., and Palestine people will be free out of the yokes of terrorists... free to have their own state back...

Who said I support Hamas?

Just because I support Palestinian people and their right to defend themselves, it doesn't mean that I support Hamas or their tactics.

Do you support the IDF and their tactics?

[eyeball]

33 minutes ago, Legato said:

That line alone indicates that you must be terribly uninformed.

The information was all over the internet weeks ago and has now been removed for humanitarian reasons.

Information is not evidence.  It certainly doesn't help that we live in a day and age where proving a negative is an increasingly respectable request

Even in normal times, roughly 80% of sexual offence cases in Israel are closed every year because prosecutors see insufficient evidence, justice ministry data show. Prosecuting the Oct. 7 cases will require a different approach.

If prosecutions in Israel prove challenging, the International Criminal Court (ICC) in The Hague was set up to prosecute those responsible for war crimes. It has already said it has jurisdiction over atrocity crimes committed by Palestinians on Israeli territory that day.

"Normally the Israeli Defence Force, the Israel government, would say 'we have no dealings with the ICC,'" Geert-Jan Knoops, lead defence counsel at the tribunal, told Reuters.

"But this is going beyond any imagination. I think Israel has the interest to provide the evidence to the ICC prosecutor and for the Oct. 7 events."

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/accounts-sexual-violence-hamas-attack-mount-justice-is-remote-israels-victims-2023-12-05/

[Legato]

4 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Information is not evidence.  It certainly doesn't help that we live in a day and age where proving a negative is an increasingly respectable request

Even in normal times, roughly 80% of sexual offence cases in Israel are closed every year because prosecutors see insufficient evidence, justice ministry data show. Prosecuting the Oct. 7 cases will require a different approach.

If prosecutions in Israel prove challenging, the International Criminal Court (ICC) in The Hague was set up to prosecute those responsible for war crimes. It has already said it has jurisdiction over atrocity crimes committed by Palestinians on Israeli territory that day.

"Normally the Israeli Defence Force, the Israel government, would say 'we have no dealings with the ICC,'" Geert-Jan Knoops, lead defence counsel at the tribunal, told Reuters.

"But this is going beyond any imagination. I think Israel has the interest to provide the evidence to the ICC prosecutor and for the Oct. 7 events."

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/accounts-sexual-violence-hamas-attack-mount-justice-is-remote-israels-victims-2023-12-05/

Information which provided evidence.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Army Guy said:

Canada is not a nation with any credibility on this topic, or any other for that matter...we have no room to talk, look how we treat our own indigenous population, and still talking about reconciliation, some couple hundred years later...Jews are the most prosecuted people on the planet...way before they got their own state...

But how about the credibility of ordinary Canadians?  How about that of Canada's 1st Nation's?

ASSEMBLY OF FIRST NATIONS RECOGNIZES PALESTINIANS AS INDIGENOUS PEOPLE, BACKS PERMANENT GAZA CEASEFIRE

https://canadatalksisraelpalestine.ca/2023/12/22/assembly-of-first-nations-recognizes-palestinians-as-indigenous-people-backs-permanent-gaza-ceasefire/

Is it safe to say my suggestion that 1st Nations leaders from Canada should be amongst intermediaries tasked with negotiating peace between Palestine and Israel goes over like a lead balloon with you?

[eyeball]

14 minutes ago, Legato said:

Information which provided evidence.

Sure but until such time as the evidence is properly examined and processed impartially it's still just information.  In this day and age of mistrust the absence of faith in impartiality itself is actually encouraged and cultivated.  This seems like an extremely dangerous development on a planet as heavily armed with nuclear weapons as it is.

I'm reminded of the question Jody Foster's character in the movie Contact would like to have asked of advanced aliens; "How did you do it, how did you survive your species adolescence"?

Without willful stupidity guiding it would be my guess.

 

 

[CdnFox]

4 hours ago, marcus said:

First of all, Hamas should be tried for whatever they did on October 7th.

You mean the gov't of Gaza.  They are. That's what's happening right now.
 

Quote

One thing we do know is that no one has shown proof of any of the above (burning babies and nails).

We know that they did in fact do exactly that.  Rather than make it a death porn thing for freaks who support hamas and debase the people further (how would you feel about pictures of your mother with nails driven into her vagina on the internet with people comenting?)  they chose to show it to a large number of media and politicians from around the world along with supporting docs and testimony.

But awwww how cute - you've made it to the 'denier'  stage   Not the first time the jews have seen that either i guess.

[marcus]

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

You mean the gov't of Gaza.  They are. That's what's happening right now.
 

We know that they did in fact do exactly that.  Rather than make it a death porn thing for freaks who support hamas and debase the people further (how would you feel about pictures of your mother with nails driven into her vagina on the internet with people comenting?)  they chose to show it to a large number of media and politicians from around the world along with supporting docs and testimony.

But awwww how cute - you've made it to the 'denier'  stage   Not the first time the jews have seen that either i guess.

Do you support IDF's actions against Gaza?

[CdnFox]

6 minutes ago, marcus said:

Do you support IDF's actions against Gaza?

I don't know that I'm aware of all of the idf's actions in Gaza. So it may be that it turns out that there are some that I disapprove of at some point. But having said that I absolutely support their right to self-defense, they're right to go into the area and do whatever is necessary to remove the threat even if that means killing a lot of innocent people if hamas wants to hide behind them. That is the consequence of war. Hamas can stop this at any time by surrendering and if it cared about its people it would

[marcus]

There are two types of Israeli supporters:

1) Those who may not be fully informed and believe a narrative that portrays Israel as a victim defending itself against perceived threats.

2) Those who are well aware that Israel is a colonialist, racist, genocidal apartheid state with parallels to Apartheid South Africa. Despite this awareness, they actively support Israel and deliberately spread misinformation. This group knowingly engages in deception, contributing to a distorted understanding of the situation. Their actions is driven by racist motivations.

Which one are you @CdnFox?