cybercoma Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 If "agitation" is the meter stick you're using for detesting an entire group of people, you must be appalled by Canada's corporate world and what they're doing in the Amazon, Africa, and SEA.
Argus Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 I just want to point out that my views about gay and women's right have not changed. If I use that in an argument, it's in amazement that you people can rally around these issues for western people, but seem to care not for those struggling with even harsher circumstances in muslim countries. It's always amusing to see the rank hypocrisy of the progressive set, people who will call those who oppose gay marriage 'extremists' and 'bigots' but then fight tooth and nail to defend foreign cultures which execute homosexuals from any kind of insult or attack. "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 it's quite clear the liberties you've taken with your past favourite ready-go-to Pew Survey... Really? Name them. And it was more than one survey. you know, the survey so critically reviewed for the failures I've outlined several times By you. But you are an advocate of extremist Islam and its spread, so I expect you to do your best to defend it. Just as you put your own spin on the Macdonald-Laurier survey below. Defending Islamism is your raison d'etre, after all. "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 So the rest of the Muslim world is peaceful, without Islamist violence and agitation? And women and homosexuals and religious minorities are respected and given equal rights? Is that what you're saying? How about western violence and agitation? You've heard about the US bombing of Iraq and Afghanistan etc., perhaps?
Argus Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 How about western violence and agitation? You've heard about the US bombing of Iraq and Afghanistan etc., perhaps? I've heard about the US trying to prevent genocide, which I understand you guys on team Islam don't care about as long as it's only brown people dying. But how is that related to the way Muslim countries outside of the middle east treat women, gays and minorities? "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
cybercoma Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 fight tooth and nail to defend foreign cultures which execute homosexuals from any kind of insult or attack.This is not what anyone here has done, ever. This is your ridiculous caricature of someone who doesn't exist. It's intellectually lazy and avoids actually engaging in the arguments people make. You constantly come in here and pretend that all of these slights are made against you by "progressives," then you post rancid garbage like this and get a complete pass on it. Maybe someone you don't have blocked will encourage you to pull your head out of the sunless crevice that it's so firmly wedged in.
On Guard for Thee Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 This is not what anyone here has done, ever. This is your ridiculous caricature of someone who doesn't exist. It's intellectually lazy and avoids actually engaging in the arguments people make. You constantly come in here and pretend that all of these slights are made against you by "progressives," then you post rancid garbage like this and get a complete pass on it. Maybe someone you don't have blocked will encourage you to pull your head out of the sunless crevice that it's so firmly wedged in. Perhaps a proper Merriam Webster definition of the word "hypocrisy" would help.
waldo Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Really? Name them. And it was more than one survey. already done so in the posted reply you, apparently, don't have the intellectual honesty to actually quote in it's entirety. . By you. But you are an advocate of extremist Islam and its spread, so I expect you to do your best to defend it. Just as you put your own spin on the Macdonald-Laurier survey below. Defending Islamism is your raison d'etre, after all. and here we realize the depths you will sleaze into. No where have I been an advocate for, as you say, extremist Islam - no where. Clearly, your unsubstantiated lashing out/attack is a result of having yet another of your grandiose survey gems... busted, busted real good! .
On Guard for Thee Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 I've heard about the US trying to prevent genocide, which I understand you guys on team Islam don't care about as long as it's only brown people dying. But how is that related to the way Muslim countries outside of the middle east treat women, gays and minorities? You think bombing those two countries was to stop genocide? You've been listening to Faux, Fox news too much perhaps.
Army Guy Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 You know not even all Muslim countries recognize Sharia Law as the law of the land, right? There's a million Muslims in Canada, don't you suppose if Sharia was going to become law here they would have enough Muslims to back it if every Muslim here believed that it should take precedence over Canadian law? These fears you people have are completely unfounded and show a stunning disregard for the fact that we are protecting Muslims from OTHER Muslims. Yet, there are way too damn many people here who can't get it through their heads that Islam itself and Muslims the,selves are not the problem. Now pay attention, the zealots and radicals are a problem. And that includes the knuckle dragging, bed sheet wearing, flathand saluting variety we claim as our own. Yes I know that not all Muslims recognize Sharia law or practice it...What is your point.......That is not what I said, apparently you missed that.... my point was Not all Muslims are happy in Canada, and a lot of them are having issues adjusting to our nation, it's moral values, our culture, etc etc ....And the Khadr family are not the only ones, as you so quickly pointed out......I on the other hand pointed out there has already been conversations in various media outlets on these topics, including the introduction of Sharia law, and many other topics at hand....Why do you think these conversations were even started......do they show concern, or distaste for our culture, or they just trying to improve our culture in some way.... In those conversations they have spoken "they are not happy", they want change..........I also know that we have had this same conversation in Canada before, over and over again, and we have agree to try it out, the example I am thinking off is Native law, which has been approved in some native communities....SO while you and YOUR people have come down hard and said we had that conversation and it is over, done with....and yet their is an example looking right in our face....nothing is done , nothing is written in stone..... No where did I say I was hiding in my closet because I was afraid of the big bad Muslim and they were going to take over...force shiara law on all us folks....that was you voicing your opinion.... Rather I pointed out that they are trying to change our culture, rather than adapt to it, it also points to they are not happy here....Why can't you see that point.....Why because it does not fit into your agenda.....of putting labels on everyone.... but you can't see that because in your mind.... I have already been labeled.....as one of those "YOU PEOPLE" and our fears....or so you say,..... I guess in this country one can not have concerns....as they only fit in the fear category....one can not debate , or run the risk of being a racist.....one can only shut the f*** up and take it all with a smile....whats the point of even having a forum to discuss things if we are going to be force feed our very own thoughts and opinions..... you continue to rant that our concerns , your fears are unfounded, and disregard any facts presented by turn the other cheek crowd..... and yet You and your People refuse to see or take into account what is happening already in Europe....why in Europe because they have been dealing with this a lot longer than we have....and everyone of those European countires are facing THE VERY SAME issues", but here in Canada we sweep those issues aside, that kind of shit does not happen here EH....We know how to do things right eh.....we'll figure it all out later eh...after hockey season eh....pass me my beer eh SO the problem here has to be looked at from all angles, INCLUDING the MUSLIM side of the house for this to work for ALL Canadians....not just YOUR people.....there is a problem and it is not just MY people or so your quote goes....That was not done, we watch a few videos, seen some pictures and jumped right in without any thought or plan.....just an election promise....and now problems are arising , the same issues as what the Europeans are facing.....imagine that.....we all ignore the military solution, we fail to address the problem which is conflict in the middle east, failed on the diplomatic side, military side and now the resettlement side.....Those should be the topic of debate....instead we do what we do best finger point, call everyone names , put them into holes such as racists......Good job.... And while the west is up to it's neck in stirring the pot, and screwing things up....it takes two to do this dance....and Muslim people are the other partner....They need to stand up and take their share of the blame as well, they need to be part of the solution......SO ya everyone is the problem.... For your part Cyber, you can step down from your white horse.....if it is protecting Muslims from other muslims then we have an issue, why just Syrians, when every Islamic country is in some sort of turmoil do we race to protect those people as well .....was that racist sorry....And how do we do that.....you have been a critic of the military option, the other options are not working either.....do we accept them all....or like eyeball says let them sort out their own problems.....tells us oh great white leader of men.....what is the solution ..... We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
eyeball Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 (edited) What a stupid topic. There is no more "phobia" attached to Islam or Muslims than there is to the supposed LBG "Homophobia".I agree, it's more accurate to call it bigoted racism. Edited February 1, 2016 by eyeball A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Guest Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 I agree, it's more accurate to call it bigoted racism. Do you mean really awful things done by some people to some other people who are different from them, or do you mean the people who notice and call attention to it?
Rue Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Eye you again in response 3286 equate what you think is unfair discussion as to Islamic society as something you want to call bigoted racism. To start with bigoted being used to describe racism is redundant. Secondly, Islam is a religion not a race. Thanks for that contribution eye. You show you don't know the difference between race and religion or what racism means. Better still you still cling to the word racism. You need to get out. Race as a subjective construct is something the Nazis and racists cling to. The rest of us have moved on realizing there is no such thing as a race-it was just a word people used in the past to describe secondary characteristics as to skin colour, nose shape and hair texture. I appreciate though that you can't move past it and need to trot it out to try shout down that which you disagree with.
Rue Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Attempting to suggest Western society is no better than Muslim society infers we can't criticize Islamic values or its societies has been tried now many times on this thread as a response to avoid dealing with the criticism against Islam raised. Its an interesting defense because like crying racism or islamophobia it is an exercise to justify avoiding responding to the criticism. More to the point it is illogical to suggest because Western societies have problems it prevents us from criticizing Islamic societies with problems, particularly when those of us who criticize Islamic societies use the same standard with our own societies. I have yet to see anyone point out where a person criticizing Islam, does not hold the West to the same standards. They can't. Who do they wish to drag in the mud, Kimmy, BC Sapper, Argus, Shady, etc. Who? Point out one post where any of these people said Western society was beyond approach. What crap. It is precisely because we in the West have transcended where Islamic societies are today, we criticize them. We moved past where they are and we have a right to say that and say, no we will not be dragged down by archaic , bigoted, sexist, extremist, intolerant thought processes as promulgated in Islamic societies and their political structures which do not separate state from religion. As for the pathetic attempt to trot out some Queens subordinate to males, an assassinated women Prime Minister and two past Prime Ministers of non Middle East nations to suggest Islamic societies treat women as equals well it speaks for itself. Its a bloody joke.
GostHacked Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Yes, because politicians never try to suck up to ethnic groups... Trudeau said that if a Grit government is elected on Oct. 19, it would double the number of applications for parents and grandparents that could be submitted each year to 10,000. The Conservatives capped the number at 5,000 in 2013, saying that the number of older immigrants allowed into Canada must be limited because of the burden they place on the health-care system and other social security programs. http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-election-2015-trudeau-immigration-reform-1.3243302 Then you need to take our politicians to task for allowing it instead of bitching at Muslims for wanting it.
Hal 9000 Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 Just an amusing anecdote I was thinking about; I had this co-worker back in the 90's - a white dude (haven't seen him in nearly 20 years), he made no secret that in his opinion women (especially western women) were less than men, were there for sexual favours, cooking, cleaning and nothing more. He even told women this, girlfriends etc, and he always had women hanging off him. He would tell people quite seriously about how good the impending muslim takeover was gonna be because they'd clean up the feminists and bring the world back to the man. I can only make an educated guess that he'd be Ok with the removal of homosexuals too. When I see women defending the muslim immigration to Canada, I think about that dude and what he must be thinking right now. The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Shady Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 I agree, it's more accurate to call it bigoted racism. Is there such thing as unbigoted racism?
eyeball Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 (edited) Do you mean really awful things done by some people to some other people who are different from them, or do you mean the people who notice and call attention to it? I mean people who revel in hog-calling attention to it. Calls - grunting - may be used to calm pigs while they feed. Wiki And where were these people when it was being pointed out years ago that catastrophe, including a tsunami of human beings fleeing it, would be the result of forever militarily interfering in the region? Listening to similarly soothing grunts while pigging back the crap that was used to justify that interference. In their styes with all their backing They don't care what goes on around In their eyes there's something lacking What they need's a damn good whacking "Piggies" THE BEATLES Edited February 2, 2016 by eyeball A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
eyeball Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 Is there such thing as unbigoted racism? I've heard mention of some sort of racism born of fuzzy-headed bleeding-hearted good intentions. A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
eyeball Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 Thanks for that contribution eye. You show you don't know the difference between race and religion or what racism means. I know the difference I just don't give a crap because it's so meaningless. A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Guest Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 I mean people who revel in hog-calling attention to it. And where were these people when it was being pointed out years ago that catastrophe, including a tsunami of human beings fleeing it, would be the result of forever militarily interfering in the region? Listening to similarly soothing grunts while pigging back the crap that was used to justify that interference. Not the people doing the actual child burning, then? Me, I hate them most.
eyeball Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 Not the people doing the actual child burning, then? Them too. Me, I hate them most. I hate them as much. A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
waldo Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 It was an obvious conclusion. If you had anything of substance left you'd have gone with that rather than continuing to harp on a missing link several pages back. no - I continued substantive input by reinforcing the false impression you were giving that you had actually been complete/unbiased in your actual most selective and self-serving quoting from that article that no one actually had an opportunity to read/confirm from... cause a linked reference wasn't provided. . How all of this relates back to Canada is a question I asked weeks ago in this thread: why do we assume things will turn out differently in Canada than they are turning out in Western Europe? When we see the difficulties other liberal democracies are having with Muslims, why do we assume we won't see the same effects here? you mean like the difficulties you portend in your dropping a 'crime stat' for North African 'asylum seekers'... one you conveniently didn't elaborate on in terms of the types of criminality involved, in terms of the related social dynamics at play (like not being able to legally work), in terms of the demographic nature of those 'asylum seekers', in terms of the legitimacy of the 'asylum seeker' designations in the first place, etc.. Like that difficulty you presume to leverage upon? This is no different than what you tried to do with "rapeRunningRampant", vis-a-vis the profiled New Years day incident: you take a stat (or the initial absence of any data/stat) and you ramp that up to imply "be wary of the bad Muslim man"... and you do so with the broadest of brush. And when you're called on this, you get all indignant that some might question your most selective words/statements/data selection (or lack thereof). Pointing out the relative numbers of criminals/criminality in relation to the, for example, single country/2015 year of 1.1 million total asylum seekers, had you resorting to labeling me as/with, "making a case for the criminals", "an intent to dismiss", "deceit by omission", etc.. Yes, quite clearly, you didn't like your sweeping brush being tethered on any level. your wording, "difficulty with Muslims" is indicative of your broad brush. I've turned/flipped several of your questions back on you in past posts; I'll do the same here: why do you assume we will see the same effects (your isolated, selective and self-serving profiled effects) here? Cause the targeted refugees, (some of them, most of them), are Muslims? .
On Guard for Thee Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 Just an amusing anecdote I was thinking about; I had this co-worker back in the 90's - a white dude (haven't seen him in nearly 20 years), he made no secret that in his opinion women (especially western women) were less than men, were there for sexual favours, cooking, cleaning and nothing more. He even told women this, girlfriends etc, and he always had women hanging off him. He would tell people quite seriously about how good the impending muslim takeover was gonna be because they'd clean up the feminists and bring the world back to the man. I can only make an educated guess that he'd be Ok with the removal of homosexuals too. When I see women defending the muslim immigration to Canada, I think about that dude and what he must be thinking right now. Is there a punchline in there somewhere?
Rue Posted February 2, 2016 Report Posted February 2, 2016 Post 3298 from Waldo is ironic. He engages in broad brushing and generalized stereotyping of any criticism of Islamic society to accuse those who criticize Islamic society as lacking in credibiltty because they broad brush and sterotype Muslim society. Yes Sir, it sure is credible.
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