North Korea Muzzles Sony

[BubberMiley]

The LA police for one. Their chief was on the news saying as much.

If there is advance notice of an attack and they still choose to go forward, there would be serious liability issues if something happened. Just because there is no intelligence of a credible threat doesn't mean there isn't a risk. The movie industry recognized their responsibility in ensuring to the best of their ability a safe environment for their customers and acted accordingly.

[Wilber]

If there is advance notice of an attack and they still choose to go forward, there would be serious liability issues if something happened. Just because there is no intelligence of a credible threat doesn't mean there isn't a risk. The movie industry recognized their responsibility in ensuring to the best of their ability a safe environment for their customers and acted accordingly.

There is risk to everything, including going to a theater. Just ask those people watching Dark Knight in Colorado a couple of years ago. Should it have been pulled as well? If the police had thought the risk was unacceptable, they would have said so and you can be sure Sony would have stated that as an excuse for pulling th movie.

[BubberMiley]

There is risk to everything, including going to a theater. Just ask those people watching Dark Knight in Colorado a couple of years ago. Should it have been pulled as well?

There was no advance warning of that attack.

So if there was no risk of negative repercussions from releasing the film, why do you suppose they decided to do that?

While you're answering that question, I'm still dying to know why you thought the biker analogy failed.

[Wilber]

I already have explained why your biker analogy failed. I can't help it if you don't understand.

Regarding the present situation, it's done now but no one should be under the impression that we haven't just lost another piece of our freedoms to terrorism, in this case cyber terrorism. I'm not a big fan of Gingrich but I think he has a good point when he says we have just lost the first battle of the cyber war.

[BubberMiley]

I already have explained why your biker analogy failed. I can't help it if you don't understand.

Okay, you ignored the first question and misrepresented your response to the biker analogy. You explained nothing. You said:

As you clearly can't comprehend the difference between insulting a group of bikers in a parking lot and an editorial written about their activities or a movie that is a parody of them, I guess there is no point in going further.

That response reminds of an expression my dad would use when he didn't know the answer to my question: "If you don't know, I'm not going to tell you." The only other response you gave was the following:

We are not speaking of individuals in a parking lot but a despot using terror to restrict what you can say. This is not about playground bullies.

Yes, they are different; that's how analogies work. But you don't explain why the analogy fails. You just go on about how it's different and then make insults about my comprehension.

Use your words. Tell me why it's different. Is it because international relations are more complicated than individual relations? Is it because a lot of money was invested in the movie and people's livelihoods depend on it? I'm genuinely curious.

Edited December 19, 2014 by BubberMiley

[Black Dog]

Holy crap, let me get this straight. You go through EIGHT YEARS OF MY POSTS TRYING TO FIND CONTRADICTIONS?

Well, there's a really easy-to-use search function. Look at all the things your learning about the board this week!

[Shady]

Holy crap, let me get this straight. You go through EIGHT YEARS OF MY POSTS TRYING TO FIND CONTRADICTIONS?

That's what you call desperation!

[Big Guy]

This reminds me of terrorism for profit. In 1982, somebody wrote the makers of Tylenol that if they did not pay $1 million, he/she would put poison into their over the counter drug bottles. They were ignored and a few people died from ingesting cyanide which had been placed into Tylenol pill containers in Chicago. It cost the company $millions to pull all their products. The extortionist was located ( I think) and it led to all pill containers being made tamper proof. Some good comes of everything.

Terrorism works.

[Wilber]

This reminds me of terrorism for profit. In 1982, somebody wrote the makers of Tylenol that if they did not pay $1 million, he/she would put poison into their over the counter drug bottles. They were ignored and a few people died from ingesting cyanide which had been placed into Tylenol pill containers in Chicago. It cost the company $millions to pull all their products. The extortionist was located ( I think) and it led to all pill containers being made tamper proof. Some good comes of everything.

Terrorism works.

Taking actions to prevent it is not the same as giving in to it. Tylenol changed their packaging, they did not stop selling selling Tylenol. Airlines did not stop flying after 9/11. Security measures were changed.

[Big Guy]

I do not disagree with you. But terrorism works.

What if some cyber terrorists declared that they are injecting poison into some fresh chicken and chicken parts in a certain food chain. Would you go out to purchase chicken for your family from that food chain to prove that you will not be cowed?

[Wilber]

I do not disagree with you. But terrorism works.

What if some cyber terrorists declared that they are injecting poison into some fresh chicken and chicken parts in a certain food chain. Would you go out to purchase chicken for your family from that food chain to prove that you will not be cowed?

No chickens have been poisoned. Would you stop eating chicken because of some anonymous threat on the internet that some chickens might be poisoned somewhere in the world?

[Big Guy]

There are all kinds of chickens that have been poisoned somewhere in the world. I fail to understand your point. There have been plenty of examples where a particular animal (mad cow for example) was identified with a problem and the bottom fell, out of the world market for that commodity.

Please provide another example where you would go out of your way and possibly endanger your family to prove that you will not be cowed. I submit that you would not endanger your family but you would avoid a possible danger in proportion to the odds of being hurt or effected by a terrorist threat.

Would you take your family to a football game in Toronto where al-Qaeda had warned that they would bomb during the game?

[Wilber]

There are all kinds of chickens that have been poisoned somewhere in the world. I fail to understand your point. There have been plenty of examples where a particular animal (mad cow for example) was identified with a problem and the bottom fell, out of the world market for that commodity.

Please provide another example where you would go out of your way and possibly endanger your family to prove that you will not be cowed. I submit that you would not endanger your family but you would avoid a possible danger in proportion to the odds of being hurt or effected by a terrorist threat.

Would you take your family to a football game in Toronto where al-Qaeda had warned that they would bomb during the game?

All these guys have done so far is hack a computer. Slipping some poison in a chicken is not the same thing as attacking a theater which would likely be a suicide mission. Stick to the subject at hand and stop dreaming stuff up. I have already said several times that I would make a point of going to this movie. My family is grown and makes their own decisions but I would not try to disuade them if they wanted to go.

[Big Guy]

It appears that we are locked into our positions. Thanks for taking the time to dialogue. Talk to you soon on another issue.

[Wilber]

It appears we are. I look forward to it. Cheers.

[WestCoastRunner]

Seems the POTUS and Sony management are having a 'slight disagreement'. It will be interesting to hear if the Obama Administration responds to Sony's latest.

We know that Sony's decision to pull out was purely for business decisions and had nothing to do with NK's pressure. It was actually the Cinemas who caved.

I heard a good interview on CBC radio today with a President of a Film Festival here in Canada. His biggest concern is for 'future' film productions and that they could possibly be compromised. Will film makers have second thoughts about producing documentaries about China, NK, Russia and other countries that should have the light shone on their underbelly behaviours? Will they take the risk of investing millions into these productions?

[On Guard for Thee]

Seems the POTUS and Sony management are having a 'slight disagreement'. It will be interesting to hear if the Obama Administration responds to Sony's latest.

We know that Sony's decision to pull out was purely for business decisions and had nothing to do with NK's pressure. It was actually the Cinemas who caved.

I heard a good interview on CBC radio today with a President of a Film Festival here in Canada. His biggest concern is for 'future' film productions and that they could possibly be compromised. Will film makers have second thoughts about producing documentaries about China, NK, Russia and other countries that should have the light shone on their underbelly behaviours? Will they take the risk of investing millions into these productions?

And I may have heard the same CBC program were there was also an interview which cast doubts on whether NK even has the wherewithal to have carried out this attack. In any case I would be ticked if Sony or whoever allowed the concept of freedom of speech to be plucked away just like that. I suspect there is more here than meets they eye and that we will see the movie after the Xmas season.

[Michael Hardner]

And I may have heard the same CBC program were there was also an interview which cast doubts on whether NK even has the wherewithal to have carried out this attack.

Of course they don't. They have paid somebody to do that - isn't that just common sense ?

I assumed that this is what we mean when we say NK is behind the attacks but maybe I'm being presumptuous here ?

[Wilber]

NK doesn't have the wherewithal to carry out this attack but some kid in his mother's basement does? I'm supposed to take that seriously?

[Michael Hardner]

NK doesn't have the wherewithal to carry out this attack but some kid in his mother's basement does? I'm supposed to take that seriously?

That kid is what powers Anonymous and hacker groups everywhere fyi.

[sharkman]

Well that's what I was assuming anyway(NK not doing the hacking directly), one rumour is Chinese hackers are involved. Or perhaps NK is having the hacking done out of country to provide some plausible deniability. They could be trading nuclear technology for the attack since they have so little money.

Edited December 20, 2014 by sharkman

[Topaz]

Outside of N. America, who are its enemy? China, S. Korea ???? Who would want to see a war between the US and N. Korea???

[Wilber]

Well that's what I was assuming anyway(NK not doing the hacking directly), one rumour is Chinese hackers are involved. Or perhaps NK is having the hacking done out of country to provide some plausible deniability. They could be trading nuclear technology for the attack since they have so little money.

A trademark of hacking is that it takes very little money to be very effectve.

[WestCoastRunner]

Dr. Evil on NK and Sony and a nice little dig at GOP (on SNL)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8sgisCFP1E

[Big Guy]

I think this attempt at intimidation by North Korea is going to backfire. Already there are suggestions as how to throw the NK threats back at them. You don't poke the Russian Bear and you never rap the beak of the American Eagle.

I believe that "The Interview" will be the most watched movie in 2015.

We have a few surprises coming.