Burn a Qu'ran Day.

[capricorn]

They wanted to stop the Qu'ran burning because they were afraid that fundamentalist Islamists would immediately start rioting and harming people.

After all, that's EXACTLY what happened in Denmark! They even killed a few nuns!

It's all part of the protest against people accusing Islam of being violent.

Fear of riots and killings is the absolute reason world leaders condemned burning the Koran.

ISAF said two people were hurt in the protests. However, the deputy governor of the province said thousands of people turned out, one protester was killed and three wounded.

Asked for his reaction to the Afghan casualties, Jones said it was "absolutely terrible" but said he is not to blame.

"We're pointing the finger at the wrong person," Jones said. "I haven't even done anything. I think it reveals ... the violence in Islam. Just the mere mentioning of it, just the threat, causes them to kill people, to protest, to say they are going to kill the president. I think it is quite obvious that what we are saying is definitely, definitely true."

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/09/10/florida.quran.burning.imam/?hpt=T2

Jones is right. Just mentioning burning the Koran catapults radical Islamists into a frenzy.

[capricorn]

What is it about Islam, and/or Muslims that make them so radical?

I thought Muslims taking control of our institutions and populating the West is how we would become Islamafied. I suppose some of them are pissed that we're not being Islamafied fast enough for their liking.

[Sir Bandelot]

I agree wth AW. If we don't burn the Koran, the terrorists win!

But Patreua and Obama said, if we do burn the Koran, the terrorists win. Did this whole craziness create a win-win situation for the terrorists?

[Guest American Woman]

But Patreua and Obama said, if we do burn the Koran, the terrorists win. Did this whole craziness create a win-win situation for the terrorists?

One can only hope, eh?

[Pliny]

no... anyone (like you) who continues to conflate extremist elements with Muslims at large... is a bigot.

Waldo, really! C'mon now. We know we can expect some violence from extremist Muslims and not just some temper tantrum act like a book burning. Who keeps making excuses for this violence and supporting the Muslim views, like building a mosque at ground zero? Why far left Liberals do; who, curiously enough, are mostly atheistic/non-religious individuals who demoralize religion at every other opportunity. At what other time do they cry for religious freedom than when Muslims are slighted. Meanwhile out of the other side of their mouth they decry the display of a Nativity scene or the hanging of the ten commandments in a court room. They fill forum cites with degrading and demoralizing intent for anyone believing in a God.

You're just hypocrites. The same goes for your emulation of other races. You be hepin' dose po' folk and dose inigrants gibin' dem an ejumacation and dey lubs you fo' it. Ya' know some o' dem can eben be doctorin' and lawyerin'. As long as dey keeps ritin' like dis ebryting goin' be ohh-kay.

how many lost lives were Muslims... there are varying counts out there (pick one). How many of those lost lives weren't even American... but don't let that stop you from leveraging them to appease your 'sensitivities'.

You're forgetting the 100,000 or so that died under Saddam. You're forgetting the honour killings, the stonings, and the oppression of women. The oppression of other religions.

Let's keep it real though, Waldo. Muslims themselves live in fear of those extremists and know they can't speak out without being beheaded. What about the billion plus Muslims who are peaceful, Waldo? The ones just waiting to breathe a sigh of relief that they cannot be oppressed like in the US of A. The ones that live there are mostly peaceful. We can see that, Waldo. We know they aren't just lying in wait to take over the government and install sharia law. Why does every slight of a Muslim send you into a frenzy, Waldo? Why the pretense of protecting the opiate of the masses when in fact you cringe at the thought of someone believing in a God or an Allah?

Why, Waldo? Why? You have no sympathy for religious nut-jobs. Like all of those Republican tea party whackos. Why the clear differentiation between the few extremist Muslims and the vast majority of peaceful ones? Why is the same consideration not given to right-wing Christians, Waldo?

But all those questions are, for me, rhetorical, Waldo. I don't buy your disingenuous crap.

that's one of them there extremist types... you know, the ones you continue to conflate with Muslims at large. Try Google... there were many counter 'demonstrations of peaceful prayer/reflection' planned by Muslim groups to coincide with the planned Quran burning. Don't let that stop you from cherry-picking your extremist examples.

How endearing! But the condescension is unnecessary. As much as you like to think you are talking to children here, Waldo or "them there right-wing nut-job types", they deserve a little more consideration and respect like you so feign for poor and minority groups.

Tell me you didn't notice any disrespect of "them there people" though, Waldo?

[Sir Bandelot]

One can only hope, eh?

Maybe you hope that, but I think it shows that acts of foolishness by emotional people on both sides of this issue only leads to a win for the bad guys. Because they don't want peace between muslims and non-muslims, so anything that inflames the public against muslims actually works for them. The radicals are having a field day with this.

That's why the media made matters even worse. By hyping up all this BS about the preacher, who's just another fringe looney like we've seen before, like flag burners or bible burners but they don't get much attention, they gave him a megaphone.

Edited September 10, 2010 by Sir Bandelot

[Guest American Woman]

Maybe you hope that, but I think it shows that acts of foolishness by emotional people on both sides of this issue only leads to a win for the bad guys.

Nope. It's not what I think. Clearly it's what you think. No one can say what you do and feel any differently. It doesn't matter what you say. This is what it all comes down to. Your posts speak for themselves.

[Shady]

like flag burners or bible burners but they don't get much attention, they gave him a megaphone.

Yes, they don't get as much attention. Because people that might be opposed or offended by the burning of the flag or the bible, don't resort to violence and death threats. It's not news if nobody cares.

[Sir Bandelot]

Nope. It's not what I think. Clearly it's what you think. No one can say what you do and feel any differently. It doesn't matter what you say. This is what it all comes down to. Your posts speak for themselves.

As do yours. Since it is exactly what you said, verbatim, I can only assume you mean it. As for me I have never said such a thing, even in jest. That's why it's so hard to figure you out.

[g_bambino]

Maybe you hope that, but I think it shows that acts of foolishness by emotional people on both sides of this issue only leads to a win for the bad guys.

Listening to the BBC's reporting on this story this morning I couldn't help but feel a little ashamed of the amount of attention the West - my culture - has been paying to what has quickly descended into farce. It's on, it's off, the pastor got the cultural centre/mosque moved, he didn't, he's going to New York, he's not, it's on again, signs from god, the apologists, the red necks, the international media clamouring over itself to get a scoop about a nobody pastor of a nothing church (they clearly didn't learn their lesson after Balloon Boy!)... It's kind of taken on a weird, surreal quality where the story has actually become the quest for a story.

[c/e]

--------------

Added later:

It would seem I'm not the only one with this impression:

That's a lot of fuss about, literally, nothing - the Koran burning hasn't happened. So what are they angry about? The "Koran Burning" - the mere idea of it. That has happened, of course - it's been all over the news.

Why? Well, obviously, it's a big deal... But all they're talking about is themselves: the news is that everyone is talking about the news which is that everyone is talking about...

No-one would have cared about that, because the only people who'd have known about it would have been the participants. Muslims wouldn't have cared, because they would never have heard about it. "Someone You've Never Heard Of Does Something" - not much of a headline.

But as soon as it became news, it was news... If something's on CNN, it's news, by definition. Clever, eh?

Neuroskeptic, pointed out by the National Post

Clever, in a kind of sad way.

Edited September 10, 2010 by g_bambino

[eyeball]

It's kind of taken on a weird, surreal quality where the story has actually become the quest for a story.

[c/e]

These have been weird surreal times for years now. The stage for this spectacle was set decades ago...the lid from Pandora's Box has long since been torn off it's hinges and thrown away...Humpty-Dumpty is dead...

No matter what the pastor does at this point it's really hard for me to imagine other people elsewhere won't be burning Qu'rans and probably Bibles too when the appointed hour cometh. It's like waiting for the arrival of Y2K.

I suspect You-tube and other video-hosting sites will be under a lot of pressure from every-which direction when people post recordings of burnings online.

[naomiglover]

I'm sure there is a "Saudi Woman" or an "Egyptian Woman" spewing bigotry and intolerance in other parts of the world. I'm sure they're using a story like Joe the pastor wanting to burn the Koran to stereotype all Americans as hateful enemies of Islam.

[DogOnPorch]

I'm sure there is a "Saudi Woman" or an "Egyptian Woman" spewing bigotry and intolerance in other parts of the world. I'm sure they're using a story like Joe the pastor wanting to burn the Koran to stereotype all Americans as hateful enemies of Islam.

So how is the Grand Mufti, anyways? Must be pretty old by now.

[GostHacked]

I'm sure there is a "Saudi Woman" or an "Egyptian Woman" spewing bigotry and intolerance in other parts of the world. I'm sure they're using a story like Joe the pastor wanting to burn the Koran to stereotype all Americans as hateful enemies of Islam.

A good Saudi woman knows to keep her trap shut and her ankles covered.

[Shady]

Here's some delicious hypocrisy.

Christians in Gaza Fear for Their Lives as Muslims Burn Bibles and Destroy Crosses

Father Musalam additionally told The Jerusalem Post that the Muslim gunmen used rocket-propeled grenades (RPGs) to blow through the doors of the church and school, before burning Bibles and destroying every cross they could get their hands on.

AP

Edited September 10, 2010 by Shady

[scribblet]

Amazing isn't it, where where the angry Christian mobs demanding death to Muslims - hmmm there weren't any. Tolerance is supposed to be a two way street, but you wouldn't know it.

[eyeball]

Amazing isn't it, where where the angry Christian mobs demanding death to Muslims - hmmm there weren't any. Tolerance is supposed to be a two way street, but you wouldn't know it.

It is, and intolerance is simply a crossroad.

It's just one little Christian sect that's being so intolerant for the moment, Wahhabists used to be a pretty insignificant bunch too.

[naomiglover]

Here's some delicious hypocrisy.

Shady.

You have an excellent username, as it describes you quite well.

I looked at your link to "AP", which was actually a link to some kind of blog. To give you credit, there was a supposed quote from an AP source. However, that led to a blank page.

I did some search about the catholic priest, Father Manuel Musallam and found an article about looting and vandalism on a convent in Gaza. Here is part of the article:

“A group of unknown people attacked, burnt and looted the nuns’ building. They destroyed everything inside and stole the computers,” Father Manuel said. “They then invade the chapel, broke the furniture, burnt the sacred images and holy books. They threw the Sacred Species to the ground and destroyed everything on their path: beds, chairs, tables, curtains, shooting at the walls and setting them on fire.

Then he says:

We don’t know who the thugs were because they came at night when the sisters were not present.”

http://www.asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=9601&size=A

Here is a part that you're probably not going to like. That's if your attention span has allowed you to come this far in the post:

Father Manuel is reluctant to talk about persecution. Instead, he said that “our relations with the Muslims are not only good, they are excellent. I don’t think what happened came from a direct order from Hamas or Fatah. In the past when the Church had difficulties, they came to our defence—for example, when there were demonstrations against the Muhammad cartoons or after the Pope’s speech in Regensburg.”

As proof he said that “just this morning at least a hundred people, both Christian and Muslim, came to see me. Even Palestinian Authority Chairman Mahmoud Abbas phoned me from Ramallah to express friendship and his strong condemnation.”

“The whole Gaza community is close to us. Two Hamas minister came to visit the convent and the school run by the sisters and promised to repair all the damage. Some religious sheikhs also came today. Whoever did it was armed. The doors of the convent were knocked open with mortars. It shows how barbaric they and their attempt to make troubles between Christians and Muslims are.”

You realize what you are doing here Shady? You are relaying misinformation and trying to create something that's not there. This makes you a liar and a bad person.

I feel sorry for you and people like you.

[M.Dancer]

You realize what you are doing here Shady? You are relaying misinformation and trying to create something that's not there. This makes you a liar and a bad person.

I feel sorry for you and people like you.

He never claimed the orders came from Hamas...nice deflection...

[naomiglover]

He never claimed the orders came from Hamas...nice deflection...

I am not surprised that you are coming to the rescue of someone who posts misinformation.

He quoted and linked to a post that tries to show that Christians are persecuted in Gaza. The priest that has been quoted, has repeatedly said otherwise in regards to Christians living in Gaza.

Here is more information that I have found on Christians in Gaza:

http://www.culturalcatholic.com/ChristianGaza.htm

In regards to a bookseller's murder who happened to be Christian:

Father Manuel Musallam, the senior Roman Catholic priest in Gaza, doubts the attack was religiously motivated.

“Rami was not only Christian,” the priest explained. “He was Palestinian. Violent acts against Christians are not a phenomenon unique to Gaza.”

Immediately upon hearing of what he described as a “murderous crime,” Ismail Haniyeh, Palestine’s elected prime minister, ordered the Ministry of Interior to dispatch an investigative committee to “urgently look into the matter.”

“We are all one people who suffer together for the sake of freedom, independence, and restoration of our inalienable citizenship rights,” Haniyeh said publicly. “We are waging a single struggle and refuse to allow any party to tamper with or manipulate this historical relationship [between Muslims and Christians].”

This is all uncomfortable information for you too, Dancer:

“My life is normal, and I’ve never felt oppressed,” said Ali Al Jeldah, a 17-year-old Christian student attending Holy Family School. “Being Muslim or Christian is never an issue,” he emphasized, adding, “I have many Muslim friends. We hang out and study together with no differences at all.”

Lelias Ali, a 16-year-old Muslim who attends Holy Family School, agrees. “We have a unity of struggle, a unity of aim to live under the same circumstances,” she stated. “This land is for both of us, and being a Christian or Muslim should not separate us.”

Asked if Christians in Gaza are being harassed by Hamas or the Palestinian police, all the students agreed that this is not the case.

Here is more information that creates a problem with your narratives:

When asked about Western media reports that Gaza’s Christians are considering emigrating because of Islamic oppression, Father Musallam sighed. “If Christians emigrate, it’s not because of Muslims,” he emphasized. “It is because we suffer from the Israeli siege. We seek a life of freedom, a life different from the life of dogs that we are currently forced to live.”

[Guest American Woman]

I find this interesting: A Muslim group successfully petitioned to stop a Bible bonfire in Johannesburg that was intended as a response to the now-cancelled Quran burning in Florida.

A South African court on Friday blocked a Muslim activist’s planned "Bible burning day," meant as a response to the now-cancelled Quran burning in Florida.

Several Muslims in Johannesburg, where the event was set to take place, launched an 11th hour interdict in the High Court to stop Mohammed Vawda from setting a Bible bonfire on Sept. 11. They argued that such an event would be divisive and an insult to all religions.

After a 40-minute hearing in the South Gauteng High Court, Judge Sita Kolbe agreed and banned the event.

Good for them. Not that I agree with banning such burnings, but since they object to burning the Koran, it's good to see that they not only applied the same principle to others, but acted on their convictions.

[naomiglover]

Good for them. Not that I agree with banning such burnings, but since they object to burning the Koran, it's good to see that they not only applied the same principle to others, but acted on their convictions.

But you still wouldn't want them to build a Muslim Cultural Centre near Ground Zero.

[Shady]

Yes, Naomi, Christians are having a great time!

After murder, Gaza’s Christians keep low profile

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip — Gaza's tiny Christian community is keeping a low profile during Christmas this year, traumatized by the killing of a prominent activist after the Islamic Hamas group's takeover of the coastal territory.

Link

Gaza's Christian bookseller killed

The manager of Gaza's only Christian bookshop, who was abducted on Saturday by suspected Muslim extremists, was found dead yesterday. Medical officials said Rami Ayyad, 31, had been shot and stabbed. He was the father of two small children and his wife is pregnant with their third.

He is reported to have received several death threats since his Protestant bible shop was fire bombed six months ago, destroying shelves of books and pamphlets. He told friends that bearded men in a car stalked him and looked at him strangely after he locked up on Thursday

Link

Yep, sounds like fun.

[Guest American Woman]

But you still wouldn't want them to build a Muslim Cultural Centre near Ground Zero.

Good for you taking a positive post and finding a way to make a negative response. If anyone could do that, it would be you, and you did it to perfection.

And you're wrong. As usual.

[nicky10013]

Good for you taking a positive post and finding a way to make a negative response. If anyone could do that, it would be you, and you did it to perfection.

And you're wrong. As usual.

The question is a pertinent one. You're still opposed to the project, no? How could she be wrong if that's all she was saying?