Liberal senator is pushing new bill S-222 to reduce voting age to 16.

[ExFlyer]

On 6/1/2025 at 11:17 PM, Moonlight Graham said:

Senators shouldn't be introducing bills IMO.

Especially considering they are "appointed" as a politcal favour and until age 72 with no requirement to even attend sessions.

[PIK]

On 6/3/2025 at 8:21 PM, herbie said:

Spoken like someone who had difficulty with school. And mental health checks? You seem more eager to disqualify people from voting. Who's next, people with criminal records, in hospital? How about people who live on reserves?

ArmyGuy, you may have not, but everyone else decided Donald Trump was THE issue. That 20+ point lead didn't disappear because PP wasn't Trudeau. He was the least trusted as a leader. 

The collapse of the NDP put carney in. And if you are in prison, your voting rights should be suspended. And 16 yrs old? Kids today are easily bought, like in 2015.

[herbie]

3 hours ago, PIK said:

And if you are in prison, your voting rights should be suspended.

Why?

[CdnFox]

37 minutes ago, herbie said:

Why?

Because it is Highly Questionable to allow those who have violated the law to elect the lawmakers    

It's a little like putting rapists in charge of a woman's abuse shelter

[User]

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

It's a little like putting rapists in charge of a woman's abuse shelter

Careful... he may not be able to understand why that is wrong either... and want to see that done. 

[WestCanMan]

On 6/1/2025 at 4:25 PM, Army Guy said:

We just reduced the age of voting from 21 to 18 not that long ago, so why is there a push to reduce it to 16...Not sure if 16 is the age where teen agers are interesting in voting or what government is doing on their behalf, most are most concerned about the opposite sex and getting laid, or getting their first drink....

Are the majority of 16 years old , mature enough to vote?

Is it even worth chasing that demographic,what would they campaign on for this generation 

They think that leftist social studies teachers will be able to manipulate them all into voting LPOC.

[I am Groot]

On 6/2/2025 at 8:36 PM, herbie said:

You stated that entirely backwards. WTF does logic have to do with dismissing the idea?

If you're telling me you don't understand logic, I agree that would be entirely consistent with your posting history.

 

Edited Monday at 09:15 PM by I am Groot

[Zeitgeist]

What a dumb bill.  Most 16 year olds don’t have the well enough informed opinions to weigh in seriously on political matters. 

[LinkSoul60]

27 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

What a dumb bill.  Most 16 year olds don’t have the well enough informed opinions to weigh in seriously on political matters. 

Dumb comment....  a 16 year can drive a car, get a job, leave home without parental permission, consent to sexual activity (with someone 14 or older), get married with parental consent or a court order, apply for a passport, and receive medical treatment without parental consent. They can also be held responsible for crimes.  

Politics are so complicated that it's beyond a 16 year olds ability to understand who they believe would be the best leader?  Not likely.....  

 

 

 

[User]

46 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

Dumb comment....  a 16 year can drive a car, get a job, leave home without parental permission, consent to sexual activity (with someone 14 or older), get married with parental consent or a court order, apply for a passport, and receive medical treatment without parental consent. They can also be held responsible for crimes.  

Politics are so complicated that it's beyond a 16 year olds ability to understand who they believe would be the best leader?  Not likely.....  

 

 

 

So, do you also want to reclassify the age of adulthood to 16 then?

Yeah, 16-year-olds can do certain things... but they are not considered adults, as you provided examples saying they need parental consent. 

 

[LinkSoul60]

11 minutes ago, User said:

So, do you also want to reclassify the age of adulthood to 16 then?

Yeah, 16-year-olds can do certain things... but they are not considered adults, as you provided examples saying they need parental consent. 

 

Why...?  The age of majority for "adulthood" varies between either 18 or 19 in Canada, and 21 in the US for drinking.  It's obviously a subjective age number depending on the province or state.

A 16 year old can do as noted, why shouldn't they be able to vote, even if that required parental consent?

[ExFlyer]

On 6/23/2025 at 9:14 AM, PIK said:

The collapse of the NDP put carney in. And if you are in prison, your voting rights should be suspended. And 16 yrs old? Kids today are easily bought, like in 2015.

I think the collapse of Polievere put Carney in. Conservatives got a lot of NDP voters because of their dislike of Trudeau. PP waited too long to pivot away form hos lets beat Trudeau strategy and it cost him.

As for disallowing prisoners to vote, I agree wholeheartedly. You lost freedom and rights if imprisoned...voting is one of them.

16 year olds are pretty wise these days...they know what they can do and get away with.

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, LinkSoul60 said:

Dumb comment....  a 16 year can drive a car, get a job, leave home without parental permission, consent to sexual activity (with someone 14 or older), get married with parental consent or a court order, apply for a passport, and receive medical treatment without parental consent. They can also be held responsible for crimes.  

Politics are so complicated that it's beyond a 16 year olds ability to understand who they believe would be the best leader?  Not likely.....  

 

 

 

Insurers have sky high rates for starting drivers for good reason.  We don’t need more direction from inexperienced activist types.  What’s more, the medical consent at 16 is controversial at best.  The part of the brain responsible for judgement isn’t fully developed until the early 20’s.  Did you like the society kids created in Lord of the Flies?   That’s what you get with more “student voice.”   It will lead to more declarations against Canada for being “settler colonial.” It’s another “way of knowing” that sends us to hell in a hand basket.  

Edited Tuesday at 06:09 PM by Zeitgeist

[User]

4 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

Why...?  The age of majority for "adulthood" varies between either 18 or 19 in Canada, and 21 in the US for drinking.  It's obviously a subjective age number depending on the province or state.

A 16 year old can do as noted, why shouldn't they be able to vote, even if that required parental consent?

You are the one arguing all the ways they are treated like an adult... so they can vote, but you don't think they should be adults?

No, 21 is simply the legal drinking age, 18 is adulthood regardless of that. 

 

[LinkSoul60]

9 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Insurers have sky high rates for starting drivers for good reason.  We don’t need more direction from inexperienced activist types.  What’s more, the medical consent at 16 is controversial at best.  The part of the brain responsible for judgement isn’t fully developed until the early 20’s.  Did you like the society kids created in Lord of the Flies?   That’s what you get with more “student voice.”   It will lead to more declarations against Canada for being “settler colonial.” It’s another “way of knowing” that sends us to hell in a hand basket.  

The part of the brain responsible for judgement isn’t fully developed until the early 20’s - that carries no legal weight. If it did it would absolve a 16 year old of any driving or criminal offence.  It can also be argued that there is a high percentage of adults whose brain hasn't fully developed either.

Did you like the society kids created in Lord of the Flies? - I'm aware of Lord of the Flies, but never watched so can't comment.

It will lead to more declarations against Canada for being “settler colonial.” It’s another “way of knowing” that sends us to hell in a hand basket. - because it doesn't fit your or my narrative of how it could influence one party or another, that's not a valid reason for 16 year olds not being able to vote.

 

[LinkSoul60]

19 minutes ago, User said:

You are the one arguing all the ways they are treated like an adult... so they can vote, but you don't think they should be adults?

No, 21 is simply the legal drinking age, 18 is adulthood regardless of that. 

 

I'm not arguing anything....  I'm simply stating the facts of what a 16 year old can legally do.

Not sure about your household but when our children were 16 years old driving and doing what 16 year olds do, yes we treated them as adults. We also had a lot more anxiety with driving than we would have with them voting....which wouldn't have even registered on the concern scale.

Yes, I commented that 21 in the US was for drinking.  

 

[User]

17 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

that's not a valid reason for 16 year olds not being able to vote.

OK... so why not 12 year olds then?

Why not 6 year olds?

You have not provided a valid reason to let 16 year olds vote. The valid reason is the status quo, which is that voting is reserved for adults because children are still under the care of their parents and they are children. 

 

 

[LinkSoul60]

5 minutes ago, User said:

OK... so why not 12 year olds then?

Why not 6 year olds?

You have not provided a valid reason to let 16 year olds vote. The valid reason is the status quo, which is that voting is reserved for adults because children are still under the care of their parents and they are children. 

 

 

Huh.....  my "valid reasons" are what I said at the very beginning of my post....  a 16 year can drive a car, get a job, leave home without parental permission, consent to sexual activity (with someone 14 or older), get married with parental consent or a court order, apply for a passport, and receive medical treatment without parental consent. They can also be held responsible for crimes.  

Other than "they are not considered to be adults", I've yet to hear your "valid reasons" for why they shouldn't be able to vote.

 

[User]

3 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

Huh.....  my "valid reasons" are what I said at the very beginning of my post....  a 16 year can drive a car, get a job, leave home without parental permission, consent to sexual activity (with someone 14 or older), get married with parental consent or a court order, apply for a passport, and receive medical treatment without parental consent. They can also be held responsible for crimes.  

Other than "they are not considered to be adults", I've yet to hear your "valid reasons" for why they shouldn't be able to vote.

 

Those are not valid reasons; that is just a list of other things a 16-year-old can do. 

 

[LinkSoul60]

Just now, User said:

Those are not valid reasons; that is just a list of other things a 16-year-old can do. 

 

Those other things I list are why we treat them as adults by letting them drive, get a job, get married, travel internationally and be held for a criminal offence, but voting is something that requires far more intellectual aptitude?  Hardly....

So you have no valid reasons to the contrary other than "they are not considered to be adults" and have tapped out.  That's fine....  

[Venandi]

36 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

I'm simply stating the facts of what a 16 year old can legally do.

It might be more instructive to look at what a 16 year old can't do... and why that is.

They can't buy cigarettes, they can't buy alcohol, they can't buy marijuana, they can't get a professional drivers license (CDL), a professional pilot's licence, they can't join the military without parental / guardian authority, they can't be police officers, prison guards, provincial Sheriff Deputies  etc etc.  I think the general consensus on that is because they (generally) aren't deemed to have the level of maturity required.  

Generally (especially these days) I tend to agree with that even though some clearly do but they would have to be considered the exception. I've come across some of these folks teaching basic training to Reservists on SSEAP type summer employment gigs and Air Cadet flying scholarship training. In the world of 16 year olds they really are the exception though... some of them are more mature than their parents.

In order to prevail here (at least with me), you would need to put forward a compelling argument in favour of allowing 16 to become the new age of majority across the board and without exception.

Suggesting that voting requires less maturity than buying a 6 pack is a hard sell. 

Edited Tuesday at 07:21 PM by Venandi

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, LinkSoul60 said:

The part of the brain responsible for judgement isn’t fully developed until the early 20’s - that carries no legal weight. If it did it would absolve a 16 year old of any driving or criminal offence.  It can also be argued that there is a high percentage of adults whose brain hasn't fully developed either.

Did you like the society kids created in Lord of the Flies? - I'm aware of Lord of the Flies, but never watched so can't comment.

It will lead to more declarations against Canada for being “settler colonial.” It’s another “way of knowing” that sends us to hell in a hand basket. - because it doesn't fit your or my narrative of how it could influence one party or another, that's not a valid reason for 16 year olds not being able to vote.

 

The age 18 was selected as the age of adulthood for reasons.  You seem to be from the permissive parenting movement.  Frankly, I don’t have much respect for the political views of the vast majority of 16 year olds because I’ve worked with them in my career and have studied developmental psychology.  Lord of the Flies is a dystopia.  Did you enjoy the school playground as a child?  I wouldn’t wish it on my enemies. 

Edited Tuesday at 07:36 PM by Zeitgeist

[LinkSoul60]

10 minutes ago, Venandi said:

It might be more instructive to look at what a 16 year old can't do... and why that is.

They can't buy cigarettes, they can't buy alcohol, they can't buy marijuana, they can't get a professional drivers license (CDL), a professional pilot's licence, they can't join the military without parental / guardian authority, they can't be police officers, prison guards, provincial Sheriff Deputies  etc etc.  I think the general consensus on that is because they (generally) aren't deemed to have the level of maturity required.  

Generally (especially these days) I tend to agree with that even though some clearly do but they would have to be considered the exception. I've come across some of these folks teaching basic training to Reservists on SSEAP type summer employment gigs and Air Cadet flying scholarship training. In the world of 16 year olds they really are the exception though... some of them are more mature than their parents.

In order to prevail here (at least with me), you would need to put forward a compelling argument in favour of allowing 16 to become the new age of majority across the board and without exception.

Suggesting that voting requires less maturity than buying a 6 pack is a hard sell. 

Valid points and a very good rebuttal 👍

Wouldn't disagree with any of your points except for the last comment....  Casting a political vote has no harmful consequences.  Crushing a 6 pack in short order and getting behind the wheel of vehicle can have life changing consequences.  I'd suggest that far more maturity is required for drinking than it is for being able to vote.

Either way....doubt very much we'll see the age get to 16 any time soon.

 

[LinkSoul60]

8 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

The age 18 was selected as the age of adulthood for reasons.  You seem to be from the permissive parenting movement.  Frankly, I don’t have much respect for the political views of the vast majority of 16 year olds because I’ve worked with them in my career and have studied developmental psychology.  Lord of the Flies is a dystopia.  Did you enjoy the school playground as a child?  I wouldn’t wish it on my enemies. 

You interpreted incorrectly.... we were the complete opposites of permissive parents. There were clear rules and boundaries in our household and the phrase "tough love" would have been fitting.  I can appreciate you don't have much respect for the political views of the 16 year olds you know.  I also don't have much respect for the political views of many same age adults I know but learned long ago....so what, they're no less entitled to an opinion than I am. I'd say that of a 16 year old....mind you with less interaction with that age group now than what you appear to have.  Like most children, I loved the school playground but again have not seen and know little of Lord of the Flies. Like most I hope, I have great deal of empathy for children and adults alike that deal with phycological development and challenges.

[Zeitgeist]

54 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

You interpreted incorrectly.... we were the complete opposites of permissive parents. There were clear rules and boundaries in our household and the phrase "tough love" would have been fitting.  I can appreciate you don't have much respect for the political views of the 16 year olds you know.  I also don't have much respect for the political views of many same age adults I know but learned long ago....so what, they're no less entitled to an opinion than I am. I'd say that of a 16 year old....mind you with less interaction with that age group now than what you appear to have.  Like most children, I loved the school playground but again have not seen and know little of Lord of the Flies. Like most I hope, I have great deal of empathy for children and adults alike that deal with phycological development and challenges.

But you’re not recognizing the importance of learning and experience in the formation of good judgment and wisdom.  You may have worked exceptionally hard to inculcate good citizenship values in your kids, and maybe your kids were outlier 16 year olds who demonstrated the maturity to decide who should lead their country, province, and municipality, but the actuaries who write auto insurance policies look at factual statistics and costs related to accidents for multiple age groups.  They keep young drivers on a short leash (through high insurance costs) because the numbers don’t lie.  I realize operating a vehicle is not the same as voting, but arguably the consequences can be no less dire.

I think of the boneheaded conversations and choices of my friends and myself in high school — and we were among the more successful academically and socially. It’s simply not worth rolling the dice that most kids know what’s best for themselves or the country.

I used to joke that a good classroom teacher doesn’t run the class as a democracy but a benign dictatorship.  Of course, because the kids need mentoring, knowledge and wisdom before they can be unleashed on the workforce. Don’t try to pretend that the apprentice is just as capable as the master.  They’ll become masters in time.

Edited Tuesday at 09:09 PM by Zeitgeist