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The health care system is failing; give us choice.


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5 minutes ago, suds said:

Great. So we're stuck with an expensive mediocre healthcare system with a severe doctor shortage that's only going to get worse.  And there's nothing we can do about it except throw more and more money at it.

Well no - there's always MAID.  I hear that program's running just fine :) 

But other wise yes.  Anyone attempting to fix it would be utterly destroyed politically. 

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1 minute ago, ExFlyer said:

1. Surprised at what?

2. My comment is based on your statement "The biggest problem, imo, is that we don't know how to run services. "

3. My response is that there is only so much social money to go around and unless you take from someone or something, you cannot give to other people or things. Is that wrong?

4. Wait lists are with every organization and company in Canada. I waited for over an hour for CAA insurance and then they said tehy will callback....never did. I waited on Air Canada for so long , I gave up. I expected more from them but, hey, never happens. maybe those people from CRA working from home were actually not "working" and you had to wait for the ones that were?

5. Hospitals are a different issue. Really, when it comes down to it, how can you force doctors to work anywhere or nurses? If they do not like where they work , so be it but that is not the governments fault (provincial governments).  I need ot get regular infusions and go to an office that has 5 to 6 nurses working there. I ask why they are there and they say it is straight  days and do not like shift work. Not a government services fault.

6. The government is managed by the people in the end. They do what you want them to do. You want more, they give you more. until they have nothing to give. You want services, transparency, more services more transparency to the point many workers are just spending time answering complaints and questions and pointing out and to the enormous volumes of manulals and policies. Every department has many many people just responding ot questions and really get nothing moving forward.

7. As for being managed by the economy? Michael, you are a smart guy and you know where that would end.

1. 2. That you say we DO know how to run services.
3. The concept isn't wrong but I don't know that the root of the problem is with that.
4. Maybe.  I never have to wait more than a few minutes for Manulife, CAA auto service, and others.  I suspect some places are managed better than others.
5. Does that explain what has changed ?
6. They also have managers.  Lots of them.
7. Oh, you misunderstood my question.  The government manages the economy NOW, I mean.  Do you want to get rid of that idea ?  Keeping in mind that every government on earth manages their economy.

11 hours ago, suds said:

You, yourself, has stated that government does a poor job at running services. If that's the case, then why not let amazon (for example) take a crack at it? Can it be any worse?? So what's Trudeau's plan other than throwing another $200 billion into healthcare over the next 10 years?

Yes, it can be worse.  The answer is that it would be an obviously ridiculous exercise to embark on a risky experiment with an essential service.

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We must start by doing prevention and preventing food companies from putting salt and sugar everywhere to sell more when we know that in excess these are dangerous products. If we reduce the number of sick everything will go back to normal, food is the basis of health. We need to start by reforming Health Canada and getting rid of those who put people's lives at risk by accepting anything like dangerous drugs and dangerous food.

Dietary Salt Intake Preferences and the Risk of Cardiovascular Disease∗ | Journal of the American College of Cardiology (jacc.org)

Edited by Gaétan
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2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. 2. That you say we DO know how to run services.
3. The concept isn't wrong but I don't know that the root of the problem is with that.
4. Maybe.  I never have to wait more than a few minutes for Manulife, CAA auto service, and others.  I suspect some places are managed better than others.
5. Does that explain what has changed ?
6. They also have managers.  Lots of them.
7. Oh, you misunderstood my question.  The government manages the economy NOW, I mean.  Do you want to get rid of that idea ?  Keeping in mind that every government on earth manages their economy.

Yes, it can be worse.  The answer is that it would be an obviously ridiculous exercise to embark on a risky experiment with an essential service.

 

Not sure what it is that you are trying to say Michael.

I tried to give you my examples of wait times.

Yes, peoples wants and desires have changed and they assume they can do what they want and not understanding the consequences Don't want to work nights and who cares about the people having to stay or visit hospitals at night..

Todays government managers have no one to manage...they are all pretending to be working from home.

The government does not manage the economy, the market manages the economy. We pay more because the vendors charge more because it cost them more. We are an importing country so, if things cost more, it is because where we get things from cost more.

 

Edited by ExFlyer
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22 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

Canada's misguided archaic socialism is the barrier which is causing the choke points in the system

Pure invention, in the capitalism system if you have no money they'll let you die and the capitalism in the health care system may cost less to government when they'll make their budget but it will cost more to you what's so ever, first of all you'll have to get an insurance at high cost. When you are in a socialist system it cost what it cost when you are in a capitalist system it cost what it cost plus the profit that make richer the rich.

Edited by Gaétan
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1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

1. I tried to give you my examples of wait times.

2. Yes, peoples wants and desires have changed and they assume they can do what they want and not understanding the consequences Don't want to work nights and who cares about the people having to stay or visit hospitals at night..

3. Todays government managers have no one to manage...they are all pretending to be working from home.

4. The government does not manage the economy, the market manages the economy.

5. We pay more because the vendors charge more because it cost them more. We are an importing country so, if things cost more, it is because where we get things from cost more.

 

You're a serious poster, but we still might have different perspectives based on experience right?

1. Yes, and I read that.  And I responded in my last post.

2. 3. I agree with the basis for this point, but not necessarily that it's related to wait time increases.

4. Agree , again, generally but the government had a major impact on it.  Or government agencies and operations.

5. What about health, energy, telecom and media?  What about dairy?  Electric Vehicles? There are lots of examples.

Edited by Michael Hardner
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30 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

You're a serious poster, but we still might have different perspectives based on experience right?

....There are lots of examples.

Yes to both. :)

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1 hour ago, Gaétan said:

Pure invention, in the capitalism system if you have no money they'll let you die and the capitalism in the health care system may cost less to government when they'll make their budget but it will cost more to you what's so ever, first of all you'll have to get an insurance at high cost. When you are in a socialist system it cost what it cost when you are in a capitalist system it cost what it cost plus the profit that make richer the rich.

Did the devil tell you all that?  Certainly nothing to do with the Bible.  The Bible teaches the right to own private property is a sacred God-given right.  It is even in the ten commandments, which say thou shalt not steal and thou shalt not covet.   The Bible also says if a man will not work, let him not eat.  So why do you think you have a right to other people's property or wealth? 

 Socialism and Communism is stealing.  It does not respect the right to private property.  Capitalism is the system that best aligns with the right to own private property and therefore with the Bible.  So go get a job and earn an honest living.

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4 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Did the devil tell you all that?  Certainly nothing to do with the Bible.  The Bible teaches the right to own private property is a sacred God-given right.  It is even in the ten commandments, which say thou shalt not steal and thou shalt not covet.   The Bible also says if a man will not work, let him not eat.  So why do you think you have a right to other people's property or wealth? 

 Socialism and Communism is stealing.  It does not respect the right to private property.  Capitalism is the system that best aligns with the right to own private property and therefore with the Bible.  So go get a job and earn an honest living.

The profit is money stolen to your neighbour then people who make profit should be put in prison.

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5 hours ago, Gaétan said:

Pure invention, in the capitalism system if you have no money they'll let you die and the capitalism in the health care system may cost less to government when they'll make their budget but it will cost more to you what's so ever, first of all you'll have to get an insurance at high cost. When you are in a socialist system it cost what it cost when you are in a capitalist system it cost what it cost plus the profit that make richer the rich.

God save the King from the Communist traitors in our midst

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The call centre has to make a profit
The ambulance has to make a profit
The hospital it brings you to has to make a profit
The doctor has to make a profit
The drug company has to make a profit...

5 levels of profit, even if they were limited by law to only 10% means way more than half is going to profits. And we live in a reality where they make Ozempic for $4.97 and sell it for $1000
So do tell me how a public nonprofit system is worse? It isn't the idea, it's the incompetents running it.

Last time I needed my Metformin renewed my Doctor was on holiday. Another at the clinic wrote the scrip. So 6 months late I call for a renewal appointment:

THE COMPUTER SAYS the last one to write the scrip is now MY DOCTOR. Regardless that the other guy's been my Dr for twelve years. The computer SEZ, no one is capable of even thinking it's wrong, thinking someone else may have entered something wrong, of how to correct it or of knowing WHO could correct an error that can't possibly exist because THE COMPUTER SEZ.
Obviously I am the one who's wrong because the new doctor who only moved here last year must have been my doctor all along.
MOF they couldn't book me with my old doctor when I asked as he was in Africa on holidays, even though his wife was sipping tea across the table while I fixed her phone as the receptionist told me that. Africa is right on the other side of my kitchen!
People like that are the reasons our health system is so f*cked up.

No one will think. No one will try. No one will take any responsibility or show any inititiative. And it's spread to everything from your corner store, your workplace, your doctor's office all the way to Parliament.

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The health care system is in a crisis.

"

Over-capacity ERs are dangerous choke points. But hospital challenges go far deeper

Staff shortages, respiratory illnesses pose challenges, alongside long-standing hospital bed capacity crunch

Lauren Pelley · CBC News · Posted: Jan 13, 2024 1:00 AM PST | Last Updated: January 13

Canadian emergency rooms are overflowing while an array of respiratory illnesses — COVID-19 included — keep circulating. And it's happening against a backdrop of behind-the-scenes backlogs that turn frontline ERs into dangerous choke points. (Ryan Remiorz/The Canadian Press)

This story is part of CBC Health's Second Opinion, a weekly analysis of health and medical science news emailed to subscribers on Saturday mornings. If you haven't subscribed yet, you can do that by clicking here.

A newborn with a fever waited five hours to be seen by an emergency physician near Toronto.

Patients were surrounded by garbage and urine as they waited 18 to 20 hours for care at a hospital in Fredericton. 

And in Alberta, Red Deer's long-beleaguered hospital was forced to hang tarps to create makeshift treatment spaces.

Those headlines come from different hospitals and different provinces. But they all point to the same grim problem: Emergency rooms are overflowing while an array of respiratory illnesses — COVID-19 included — keep circulating. And it's happening against a backdrop of behind-the-scenes backlogs that turn front-line ERs into dangerous choke points.

The numbers are staggering. More than 10,000 people are in hospital at once across B.C., the most the province has ever seen, while Quebec grapples with the highest level of patients in its emergency rooms in five years.

In Ottawa, the Queensway Carleton Hospital recently said it was operating at 115 per cent occupancy. By midweek, most Montreal emergency rooms were above full capacity, with some operating at roughly 200 per cent. 

The usual slate of viral threats, from influenza to respiratory syncytial virus, or RSV, make this time of year particularly challenging for hospitals thanks to the ongoing influx of sick patients. Canada's health-care systems are also adapting to a new normal where COVID-19 is now firmly in the mix. 

Ontario hospitals warn of patient surges, long wait times

Why are Quebec's ERs so bad this year? A bunch of reasons, Quebec health minister says

And while federal data suggests COVID-related hospitalizations, ICU admissions and deaths at this point in the pandemic are lower than before, the virus is still infecting thousands of patients in Canadian hospital beds at any given time — putting sustained and added pressure on a system that's already under strain.  "

Over-capacity ERs are dangerous choke points. But hospital challenges go far deeper | CBC News

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, herbie said:

God save us from those who hear voices in their heads and think it's His.

I would not say those who claim to hear voices in their head are hearing God speak to them. Mocking people with that claim is a bit of a stretch.  I have not run into people who claim they hear voices in their head coming from God.  This sounds more like a picture you are trying to paint of people who believe in God.

If you think God doesn't communicate his truth to individuals you are wrong.  If you studied the Bible in sincerity and truth, you would learn God does communicate through his written revelation, the Bible, in English, the King James Bible (1611).   But you should also know there are people who are under the influence and control of the devil.  How else would you explain all the evil going on in the world?

quote

Satan’s power on the earth:
Job 1 also reveals that Satan does enact evil and cause direct harm on the earth. The most well-known and important of his actions on earth occurred in the garden of Eden. Genesis 3 tells of Satan’s temptation of Eve, the “mother of all the living” (v. 20), and her subsequent first sin. It was this act, and that of Eve’s husband Adam, that brought sin into the world, and it is the reason all humankind must be redeemed from sin in order to be with God.

One day, Jesus met a woman who had been “crippled by a spirit for eighteen years” (Luke 13:11). Jesus attributes the infirmity to Satan, who had kept her “bound” (verse 16). Satan’s power was real, but it was easily overcome by our Lord: “He put his hands on her, and immediately she straightened up and praised God” (v. 13). Jesus’ miracle was a clear demonstration of His authority over Satan.

Since his instigation of evil on earth, Satan has been named the “prince,” “god,” or “ruler” of this world (John 14:30; cf. John 12:31; 16:11; 2 Corinthians 4:3-4; Ephesians 2:2; Colossians 1:13). He is the enemy of God and truth (Matthew 13:24-30; 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12), and he does everything he can to tempt individuals (Genesis 3; Luke 22:31; 1 Timothy 3:7) and larger groups of people (1 Thessalonians 3:5; Revelation 2:10). He “leads the whole world astray” (Revelation 12:9). Satan accomplishes this by various means, including appealing to man’s pride (1 Timothy 3:6; 1 Corinthians 4:6), interfering with the transmission of truth (Matthew 13:18-22, 38-39), and placing false believers within the church (1 Timothy 4:1-2; 2 Timothy 3:1-9; Revelation 2:9; 3:9). In John 8:44, Jesus says that Satan “is a liar and the father of it.”

God still grants Satan some authority in this world, which means that his power is not yet completely broken—except in one area: his power of death. Hebrews 2:14-15 says that Jesus came as a man to die in order to “destroy him who holds the power of death – that is, the devil,” a power Satan had held “from the beginning” (John 8:44). The salvation Jesus provides has released us from Satan’s stranglehold. Death has lost its sting (1 Corinthians 15:55).

Satan’s power – the conclusion:
The Bible says that “the whole world is under the control of the evil one” (1 John 5:19), and we must “be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour” (1 Peter 5:8). Yet Christians have a great hope, for Jesus Christ (John 16:33) and our faith in Him (1 John 5:4) have overcome Satan’s evil. “The one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world” (1 John 4:4).   unquote

How much power does Satan possess? | GotQuestions.org

I would add that Communists and Socialists must deny the existence of God in order to get people to follow their ideology.  Why?  Because Communism and Socialism are contrary to what God has taught in his written revelation, the Bible.  The Bible teaches everyone has the right to private property.  Communism and Socialism rejects the right to private property.  Therefore what they fear most is the truth that if they enforce Communism or Socialism, they are rejecting God's word on the sanctity of private property.  That is the real reason they would claim to be atheists and deny the existence of God.  God is a threat to their man-made ideology that steals or confiscates other people's property or wealth.

Edited by blackbird
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28 minutes ago, herbie said:

The call centre has to make a profit
The ambulance has to make a profit
The hospital it brings you to has to make a profit
The doctor has to make a profit
The drug company has to make a profit...

5 levels of profit, even if they were limited by law to only 10% means way more than half is going to profits. And we live in a reality where they make Ozempic for $4.97 and sell it for $1000
So do tell me how a public nonprofit system is worse? It isn't the idea, it's the incompetents running it.

Last time I needed my Metformin renewed my Doctor was on holiday. Another at the clinic wrote the scrip. So 6 months late I call for a renewal appointment:

THE COMPUTER SAYS the last one to write the scrip is now MY DOCTOR. Regardless that the other guy's been my Dr for twelve years. The computer SEZ, no one is capable of even thinking it's wrong, thinking someone else may have entered something wrong, of how to correct it or of knowing WHO could correct an error that can't possibly exist because THE COMPUTER SEZ.
Obviously I am the one who's wrong because the new doctor who only moved here last year must have been my doctor all along.
MOF they couldn't book me with my old doctor when I asked as he was in Africa on holidays, even though his wife was sipping tea across the table while I fixed her phone as the receptionist told me that. Africa is right on the other side of my kitchen!
People like that are the reasons our health system is so f*cked up.

No one will think. No one will try. No one will take any responsibility or show any inititiative. And it's spread to everything from your corner store, your workplace, your doctor's office all the way to Parliament.

They don't have to make profit

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22 minutes ago, blackbird said:

  But you should also know there are people who are under the influence and control of the devil.  How else would you explain all the evil going on in the world?

 

I am a medium and i know the devil and you are under the influence and control of the devil, the devil is YHVH and Satan is another person. You only know what stupid people put in your head, this means you know nothing.

Edited by Gaétan
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1 hour ago, Gaétan said:

It doesn't have to be run by stealers

It isn't.  But hey if you feel that way just don't use a grocery store.  Why would you give your hard earned money to those capitalist pigs  refuse to buy from them at all! 

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3 hours ago, Gaétan said:

They don't have to make profit

Blasphemy!
You're talking about nations that profess to worship the Bible, but it comes second to the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition.

Edited by herbie
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1 minute ago, herbie said:

Blasphemy!
You're talking about nations that claim to worship the Bible, but it comes second to the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition.

You are supposed to talk about health care if you know something about it not a subject that you know nothing about.

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My Mom was Big Nurse. My sister's a nurse. My other one's a lab tech, her daughter's a dietician. Went to college with and dated nurses in the punk era. Set up the computer systems, TV and internet links for clinics and hospitals here and remote reserves. Service computers for all the doctors in town and am friends with a couple of them.
Had an ex with substance and mental issues, a wife with diabetes, asthma and immune issues no one noticed the cancer and she died 3 days after they diagnosed it.
Had a kid with substance issues the OD cuz someone brought the shit into his hospital room. A sister who died from measles before they vaxxed everyone, and another that lost both hands and both feet cuz they diagnosed too slow.
Have to go for blood tests every 6 months at the hospital lab, a block from the doctor's office. In 10 years they've "lost" the results three times. And as I mentioned it takes 6 weeks to book an appt for a month's worth of pills.

No, I don't know anything at all about the medical system. Aside from almost any of the things mentioned would driven one to file for bankruptcy if I'd been born 20 miles south.

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1 hour ago, Gaétan said:

Thanks, you used the right words.

No problem - you were going to hear that no matter what i said so i figured i'd make it easy :) 

I notice you couldn't answer the question tho  Why not just stop giving them your money? Obviously you can get it cheaper elsewhere so why not just do that?

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